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View Poll Results: Psycho-Pass - Episode 14 Rating | |||
Perfect 10 | 30 | 40.54% | |
9 out of 10 : Excellent | 34 | 45.95% | |
8 out of 10 : Very Good | 7 | 9.46% | |
7 out of 10 : Good | 1 | 1.35% | |
6 out of 10 : Average | 2 | 2.70% | |
5 out of 10 : Below Average | 0 | 0% | |
4 out of 10 : Poor | 0 | 0% | |
3 out of 10 : Bad | 0 | 0% | |
2 out of 10 : Very Bad | 0 | 0% | |
1 out of 10 : Painful | 0 | 0% | |
Voters: 74. You may not vote on this poll |
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2013-01-27, 22:11 | Link #121 |
Senior Member
Author
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It depends on how Sybil was initially sold to the public.
If Sybil was initially sold as this flawless, "Silver Bullet" system that will make the perfect society (and hence this is why we can tolerate its obvious downsides), then Qilin is correct. If Sybil was initially sold as this imperfect but helpful system that will make a better society (like, say, the modern education system including post-secondary), then Anh_Minh is correct. I get the impression that Sybil was sold in the flawless, "Silver Bullet" way. One can argue that this might not have been the best way to go about it, but once you do, you're committed to it. There's no turning back once you've made society think that this system is perfect and that's precisely why it should be supported. This is especially true when that system has been in place for two decades. It would be like "The Party" of Orwell's 1984 admitting "Well, actually, Big Brother can be wrong sometimes. We should support him because he's usually right." There's real doubts that this will fly after you've whipped people up into viewing the system as perfect for decades.
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2013-01-28, 01:09 | Link #122 | |
SIBYL salesman
Join Date: Feb 2011
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The problem with the crowd is that since they can no longer think of any criminal thoughts, they cannot comprehend that a crime is taking place, especially since the Sybil system has (for most part) removed all crime before it happens (whether that's a good thing or a bad thing is up to your own opinion). In a weird way, I am reminded of the movie The Invention of Lying. Anyway, they obviously trust Sybil enough that if it's not sending out any warning signs (as in, a murder is taking place), then nothing is considered wrong. They weren't thinking someone else might have called the police, they didn't consider anything wrong at all since they've lived in such a safe environment for such a long time. It really brings back the point of only 'lawful' criminals can fight unlawful criminals, since the rest of society can no longer think of such a thing (or removed early on, etc). |
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2013-01-28, 02:05 | Link #123 | |||||
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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2013-01-28, 05:26 | Link #124 | ||||
Romanticist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Age: 33
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As you note, if that belief in the security that the system provides is proven to be a sham, the society would disintegrate and crumble due to the loss of trust in the social contract, and that remains to be the worst case scenario that everyone is trying to avoid. I don't see the problem with my reasoning here. I'd agree with your ideas on governance if this was anything but an authoritarian state. The way things stand, the power of this authoritarian state hinges on the people's unwavering trust in it.
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2013-01-28, 11:57 | Link #126 | |||||
Disputatio exaro nex
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Turkey
Age: 41
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However the show presented this as a case of dingo vs dodo, when it wasn't exactly that. The extreme feeling of safety and incomprehension would just reduce the chances of intervention but not eliminate it completely by itself. The thing is that there are so many people out there that's already deadened with no Sybil to talk of, so that examples like the ones I wrote above can happen. When there's such facts, I find it highly contradictory to see this many people on the Net that act like anyone could tackle a psychopath with a hammer and just shift all blame to a fictitious plot element. |
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2013-01-28, 15:09 | Link #127 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
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I guess some details are just missing... |
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2013-01-28, 17:17 | Link #128 | ||
Romanticist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Age: 33
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The thing about using a real gun is that it's no different from giving up on the system, and very few people want to make that leap. Especially in a society where the majority grew up under the influence and guidance of Sybil, many can no longer imagine life without it. Quote:
I'm curious though, how would such remote incidents even serve as a gap in the system in the first place? All they have to do is point their Dominators at random people until they find someone with a high crime coefficient.
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2013-01-28, 19:12 | Link #129 | ||
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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What I'm saying is, it would be perfectly possible to base a society around Sibyl, and reap most or all of the benefits, without demanding such absolute trust you have to cripple your ability to deal with violent freaks. |
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2013-01-28, 19:22 | Link #130 | |
Romanticist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Age: 33
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And what I'm saying is that it is much too late for such a transition given the current state of affairs. I'm not denying that it's possible for things to not have gone this far, but at this point, it's no longer a feasible option.
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2013-01-28, 21:46 | Link #131 | ||
Disputatio exaro nex
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Turkey
Age: 41
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Makishima has already threw a wrench in the system and that trunkload of masks will be enough to topple the ministry if all they have is dominators in its defense. If we're to believe the OP, our guys will use firearms later on anyway. I guess it'll be a do or die situation before our guys come to their senses. You can't save face if somebody is melting it. Quote:
Yeah well, you can't really do that. Just recall the incident in the factory. You can't really pull a dominator on everyone till you find the guy. |
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2013-01-28, 21:49 | Link #132 |
Waiting for more taiyuki!
Join Date: Jan 2004
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Nowadays, there's Caller ID. So when you make that phone call, they have your cell number and then they proceed to get the rest of your contact info. Being anonymous when making an emergency call is a thing of the past now. It also means you're on Sibyl's hit list now too.
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2013-01-28, 21:55 | Link #133 | |
Me at work
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Is there even a police emergency number in this future?
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2013-01-29, 00:15 | Link #134 |
cho~ kakkoii
Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: 3rd Planet
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Few months ago, I helped out a guy who was trying to push his pick-up truck after it died in the middle of the bridge. I was tired after a 12-hour shift, and I was going to be another motorist who was going to go around the guy and keep on moving. For some reason, I decided to pull up behind his truck, put my flasher on, and was going to help him push his truck to the nearest shoulder. When I approached him, he was panicking badly as the traffic behind him slowly started to pile up. Turns out he was running low on gas and thought he could make it to the gas station before he ran out. So I gave him a gallon worth of gas from my fuel-can I usually carry just in case. All in all, it took about 4-5 minutes worth of time, but I still felt pretty good about it as I was the only one who didn't go around his truck that day.
After watching this episode, I just had to ask myself if I saw something as gruesome as someone getting killed in the middle of the road with a hammer, would I have stopped to intervene in anyway? The answer is: no, I probably wouldn't have stopped. I would be fearful for my own safety. I would have called the police, but it still probably wouldn't be enough considering the person who is dying would benefit the most with an immediate intervention. The conundrum here is am I a bad person if my failure to take immediate action cost someone his/her life because I fear for my own safety? Regardless of whatever I decide to do, whether I'm driving away or stopping to help, I am making a choice. I would have made that choice after fully understanding the situation that was unfolding before my eyes. Obviously the most disturbing thing about that murder was how everyone (except one guy) appeared not to understand what was taking place. It's like trying to distinguish accent and dialect shortly after being introduced to a new language. They didn't need to make any choice. But then... I just had to wonder how could that be? The Sybil System isn't without problem. The very existence of the Enforcers is the proof. So then, why those witnesses didn't feel horror, fear, nauseous, and etc? When the male pharmacist was stabbed, the female didn't start panicking immediately. She was startled by the loud noise when the killer slammed the male on the table and then she started panicking once it set in something amiss here. All our emotions are primal and innate. Our survival instinct are honed based on those set of emotions. So what surprised me that how any of those people didn't appear to feel any kind of emotion. They can't be desensitized, or unable to feel those extreme emotions. There has been enough episodes to hammer the point in (no pun intended) that even under the system, people are still able to retain those primal and innate emotions we are born with even though the system is designed to actively suppress extreme set of emotions. Then why those people didn't react in any way? Was this just mere plot device to make a point against the Sybil System? If that's the case then it instantaneously makes this episode the weakest one of all thus far which went against the established order and understanding of the very nature of this world. While we are all fascinated with Makishima and how his mental make up allows him to circumvent the very nature of the system, we probably aren't giving Akane her due credit. She is managing her Crime Coefficient and Psycho Pass in a rather interesting way too. Like most people, as the show pointed out several time thus far, Akane shouldn't have been able to manage her PP, and CC. In fact, they all feared her CC would be compromised when she agreed for that vivid reenactment/re-living of her memories. And yet, there she is, able to suppress all those extreme emotions as a result of her traumatic experience which lead Sybil System to render unfavorable verdict against anyone. Were all those people who witnessed that murder shared similar trait to Akane who knew how to control their emotions? I don't believe so. While I don't think Akane isn't unique in her mindset, her type of mental make-up still should be rare. Akane is the fruit of the intended design of this system, but I don't think the system has run its course long enough to turn more and more people like Akane. As far as we understand, Sybil System has been in place no longer than 2-4 decades. That's not enough time to turn up product like Akane in a frequent basis. So once again plot device comes to mind to explain this curious reaction of the crowd. But then the reaction of the victim herself when he took out the hammer suggested she was starting to grasp that she was in danger. So why those people didn't react to what was transpiring in front of them. My own conclusion is that I should wait for more episodes before I can make up my mind. I also hope sincerely this wasn't just a cheap way to make a point against the system in a simple shock-and-awe fashion. There were few very hard to miss Tarantino movie like exaggeration in at least couple of the violence. I also find it hard to believe that if someone is dying in these streets for any non-violent reason those bots would just come to gauge that person's distress level. Surely there would be some kind of medical override to intervene to keep someone from dying? I also can't accept the ascribed explanation that these people didn't feel anything or react negatively because they are too used to peace. It was pointed out in the episode how the stress level in the surrounding vicinity immediately went up when the video of the killing surfaced, so I would rather like to think that even if murder was an alien concept for those people, they just wouldn't go home and wouldn't think about it later even for a second. Finally, I have to say that as I watched this episode, I immediately thought about the mass killing incident in Norway and couldn't help but wonder how that event will shape the people of that country in the coming years. Norway is probably one of the safest place to live in the planet as far as crime goes. Btw, Makishima was reading something interesting, wasn't he? Very much looking forward to how this series is going to shape up from here on. |
2013-01-29, 01:29 | Link #135 |
Disputatio exaro nex
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Turkey
Age: 41
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In fact, the crowd was still reacting to the killing, that's how Kougami was able to figure out how the mask works. The copied person's coefficient was making spikes as the blows landed. Also there's the fact that whole area stress increased rapidly to warrant investigation.
As for Akane, she was getting to a good point as a character but then ep11 happened with its idiot ball ex machina. She was sacrificed by the author vs the character who had absolute plot armor at that point and was sacrificed so Makishima would look like a badass manipulator while she looked like a complete weakling. I doubt that the author would be able to recover her prestige even if he wanted this late in the story. Merely maintaining a carefree state isn't cool by itself, people won't cheer for it. They will cheer for the guy who bashes skulls in with baseball bats 1vs3 even if he eats babies alive after this point, as they're doing. |
2013-01-29, 02:09 | Link #136 | ||
Romanticist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Age: 33
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I'm fairly certain that our protagonists will resort to firearms eventually, but calling characters stupid for not doing so immediately seems a bit shortsighted in my opinion. Quote:
Yes, the system is growing obsolete thanks to Makishima's interference, but it is completely understandable that most would be reluctant to let go of the system so suddenly.
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2013-01-29, 02:50 | Link #137 |
Kamen Rider Muppeteer
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Unknown
Age: 40
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I'm not saying the current Sibyl system is "ideal". However, I don't see how it's "obviously flawed" when the only actual flaw that can be called an actual flaw happened two episodes ago, with no one knowing about it beforehand.
And I'm just getting annoyed by people blaming a lifeless objects for the actions of people. Just because people are too retarded to think for themselves doesn't mean they don't have any responsibility. It's their own fault for being so retarded. |
2013-01-29, 10:41 | Link #138 | |||
今宵の虎徹は血に飢えている
Join Date: Jan 2009
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To change it would require such drastic changes to its use, the cymatic scan is just reduced to a mere tool, the way polygraphs are today Quote:
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Last edited by Cosmic Eagle; 2013-01-29 at 11:14. |
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2013-01-29, 11:03 | Link #139 | |
今宵の虎徹は血に飢えている
Join Date: Jan 2009
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2013-01-29, 12:40 | Link #140 | |||
Disputatio exaro nex
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Turkey
Age: 41
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If they really want to keep on with the dominators, they could ask for bypassing the minimum threshold to use stun gun mode. See masked guys or Makishima? Just stun them. Nobody sees them using firearms, everyone's cool. Quote:
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