Fan service: Good or bad?

[animeboy12]

personally, though I'd like to see anyones opinion of the fanservice kodomo no jikan because I think the type of fanservice a show has is also an issue.

[4Tran]

It seems this thread is confined to just the titillation variety of fanservice as opposed to the other variants. In that case, I'm sort of indifferent to it, but I think that there should be a distinction drawn between clever applications of fanservice and dumb applications (panty flash ad nauseam, guy falls on girl's chest, etc.). The former are a lot more entertaining, but a lot more rare as well. I wouldn't be surprised if those who hate fanservice lack expose to that variety. The textbook model for clever fanservice is Touka Gettan, and I wish that every anime creator out there took lessons from it.

The issue of whether fanservice makes a show bad is sort of interesting, but the conclusion seem to be pretty obvious as well. Unless it's bad enough viscerally to turn people away from the show, it's not going to be a factor making a show poor. Even if a production uses fanservice in an attempt to shore up bad writing, it's still not the fanservice that's at fault; it'd be the bad writing. By a similar token, the amount of fanservice a show has barely has any effect on how good it is. Using Touka Gettan as an example again, there aren't a whole lot of shows with more fanservice, but there aren't a whole lot of shows with more depth either. As a creative device, I can't see how fanservice is any worse than a great many other devices.

[0utf0xZer0]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

The textbook model for clever fanservice is Touka Gettan, and I wish that every anime creator out there took lessons from it.

I remember finding the episodes of Touka Gettan I watched a bit slow, but I sometimes wonder about giving it another shot. Either way some of the fanservice in the show was, as you say, wonderful. One of the scenes in episode 3 was a definite "whoa" moment for me.

Great post, BTW. I think you managed to say a number of things I tried to say in a much more concise manner.

[Hakuoro917]

I'm okay with mild/medium fan service but Ikkitousen kind of fan service is going too overboard. Note: (Coming From A Guy) I Dropped that anime for the first 6 episodes because the too much fan service made me sick.

[LeoXiao]

I think the whole thing depends on what fanservice means (simply having all the main characters be hot could be considered fanservice). I don't like it when you get the feeling that the animator is showing the girl's panties for no apparent reason, but I know that it gets added in here and there and I don't have a problem with it since it isn't unpleasant and it happens in real life (you know when you're at school and there's a girl pointed towards you at the right angle...), so it's not unrealistic.

[Vexx]

Originally Posted by LeoXiao

I think the whole thing depends on what fanservice means (simply having all the main characters be hot could be considered fanservice). I don't like it when you get the feeling that the animator is showing the girl's panties for no apparent reason, but I know that it gets added in here and there and I don't have a problem with it since it isn't unpleasant and it happens in real life (you know when you're at school and there's a girl pointed towards you at the right angle...), so it's not unrealistic.

Strike Witches was a series I loved; characters, storyline, plot thematics ... but I got really tired of camera angles that shoved clinical examinations of panty crotches in my face. Silly yes... but it was annoying. Once in a while... yeah, yeah, okay then there's some novelty - but it did seem like every battle was inundated with them -- surprised the Neuro didn't just get their neural circuits fried from that.
Sad thing is that I have some friends who are alternate history and ww2 buffs ... but I also know they're fairly conservative and unlikely to last past the first few incoming crotches. The bath scenes were much less annoying in comparision .. context helps.

[0utf0xZer0]

Originally Posted by Vexx

Strike Witches was a series I loved; characters, storyline, plot thematics ... but I got really tired of camera angles that shoved clinical examinations of panty crotches in my face. Silly yes... but it was annoying. Once in a while... yeah, yeah, okay then there's some novelty - but it did seem like every battle was inundated with them -- surprised the Neuro didn't just get their neural circuits fried from that.
Sad thing is that I have some friends who are alternate history and ww2 buffs ... but I also know they're fairly conservative and unlikely to last past the first few incoming crotches. The bath scenes were much less annoying in comparision .. context helps.

Ah, I always forget about this one, and it's the one thing I do truly hate about fanservice: the missed opportunities for sharing. Strike Witches is especially bad for that: crotch shots plus loli-enough art to sometimes confuse even my highly attuned ability to differentiate loli from mere DFC. (I suppose there's probably a racial variation factor at play, but I kept thinking Miyafuji looked younger than Sonya, when she's not.)

Actually, for someone who spends so much time arguing the difference between loli and DFC, I'm surprisingly cautious about showing people shows like Moon Phase - which is both pretty light on the actual fanservice and the series that got me into anime in the first place.

I'm still planning to try and get my dad to watch Spice and Wolf, though... at least he's not the type to get worked up over a little tasteful nudity.

[kk2extreme]

how about non-ecchi fan service, something like certain popular character appear in some new anime/manga

Spoiler for some example:

haruhi appears in lucky star

im totally fine with that as long as i know what the references are.

[Vexx]

Originally Posted by 0utf0xZer0

Actually, for someone who spends so much time arguing the difference between loli and DFC, I'm surprisingly cautious about showing people shows like Moon Phase - which is both pretty light on the actual fanservice and the series that got me into anime in the first place.

I'm still planning to try and get my dad to watch Spice and Wolf, though... at least he's not the type to get worked up over a little tasteful nudity.

Moon Phase only has a couple of embarrassing episodes in the middle (mostly Kaoru, the arranged-fiancee nonsense). The early nudity (bath) is just very vampirish. But yeah.... those middle episodes :P
Spice & Wolf OTOH, I'd show absolutely anyone. Its medieval fantasy and in context.

As far "cultural reference" fanservice (like haruhi in LS), I don't mind it unless it is the substance of the joke itself... years from now no one may have a clue about Haruhi so if the joke depended on that it fails. If its a reference that is simply part of a funny moment (like the scene where Jin walks into the L*S karaoke booth), its okay because you don't need to know about L*S - you just assume he's so distracted he walked into the wrong booth. Same with much of Paniponidash (one of the most densely packed reference comedies I've ever seen) .. much of the humor does not require knowledge of the reference -- its just bloody Monty Python Japanese style. Absurd. I dare say most American viewers of Monty Python missed half the skewers and reference jokes yet found the series hilarious.

[C.A.]

I think this thread is mainly against Gainax bounce and pantsu, I don't think most people have problems with most other forms of fanservice. Why? lol

Mecha ownage and epicness is known as mecha fanservice or mecha porn.

Bishounen have existed as fanservice for the girls for ages.

For those who like seeing blood and gore, its a form of fanservice. You can start calling Hellsing a fanservice anime.

[Zippicus]

Personally I think subtle fanservice is great, it can do quite a bit to add to the mood of a series. The more blatant it is the less appealing it is to me and I find myself tuning it out. I think it's because when it's subtle it's more realistic and when it's all in your face it seems forced.

[Vexx]

Aye, ... remember the movie "The Truman Show" and its skewering of product-placement methods? Subtle makes it fun... like easter egg hunting.

[animeboy12]

Originally Posted by C.A.

I think this thread is mainly against Gainax bounce and pantsu, I don't think most people have problems with most other forms of fanservice. Why? lol

Mecha ownage and epicness is known as mecha fanservice or mecha porn.

Bishounen have existed as fanservice for the girls for ages.

For those who like seeing blood and gore, its a form of fanservice. You can start calling Hellsing a fanservice anime.

I think the reason why people don't like Gainax bouncing is because it requires a large breasted character, which most anime fans are against

yea, it's weird when gratuitous violence=mature but gratuitous sexual content= for immature people.

[Vexx]

Actually many of us find gratuitous violence immature as well....

... and "most" anime fans prefer a large variety of breastsizes based on the wide variety of sizes in most anime.

[BetoJR]

I, personally have no real problem with fanservice - or with violence, mind you. But I'm very conscious about what I would let my 3-year old daughter watch, tho.

To most self-aware people (which, granted, can't really be a moniker applied to most "anime fans"), it's really a matter of choice, I guess.

[Lord Uiruu]

ARE YOU SERIOUS!? It is obviously GOOD!

[Triple_R]

Outside of dramatic or serious moments, I don't mind it. I don't mind it in a serious anime, but if it's going to be there, I prefer it to be during a comedic relief/slice of life episode or moment.

What I really don't like is when it comes up during gripping fights. This is my number one complaint against Negima! Akamatsu can put together some great fights... but he ruins a lot of them with distracting fanservice.

[Narona]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

What I really don't like is when it comes up during gripping fights. This is my number one complaint against Negima! Akamatsu can put together some great fights... but he ruins a lot of them with distracting fanservice.

Don't forget when Akamatsu does 100% fanservice (in this case i mean Panties fanservice and such) chapters like a recent one .

That's one of my main reproach in Negima, too much fan service. And a good part is useless and could be avoided.

[animeboy12]

Originally Posted by Vexx

Actually many of us find gratuitous violence immature as well....

... and "most" anime fans prefer a large variety of breastsizes based on the wide variety of sizes in most anime.

What I meant to say was that people are far more tolerant of violence than sexual content.

As far as breast size, people are more vocal on hating it on forums forums

I wonder though say you did get a heavy fanservice anime like negima, removed the fanservice scene and moved the camera positions would it be a better anime because of that?

[Lyreleaf]

I'm cool with it in small doses, but once the fanservice starts to reach epic levels, I seriously have to question what the point of it is. How is showing an excessive amount of pantie shots relevant to the plot?