Fate/stay night Heaven's Feel Movie Discussion Thread

[Nayrael]

I have no doubts that they will expand on Rin a bit. We are talking about the same people who make an entire filler episode about Chibi Rin in FZ

[Raziel1991]

Originally Posted by Nayrael

I have no doubts that they will expand on Rin a bit. We are talking about the same people who make an entire filler episode about Chibi Rin in FZ

Yeah it is highly possible they do that if we take into account ufotables Rin fetish. In my opinion if they want to expand something, it should be Archers backstory, because after all, all key events of the route are defined by Archer so its important to understand his character and past. I do think the VN did a good job with explaining Archers situation but still if they add original content I personally think it should be to expand on Archer.

[chaos_alfa]

Originally Posted by Nayrael

I have no doubts that they will expand on Rin a bit. We are talking about the same people who make an entire filler episode about Chibi Rin in FZ

Originally Posted by Raziel1991

Yeah it is highly possible they do that if we take into account ufotables Rin fetish. In my opinion if they want to expand something, it should be Archers backstory, because after all key events of the route are defined by Archer so its important to understand his character and past. I do think the VN did a good job with explaining Archers situation but still if they add original content I personally think it should be to expand on Archer.

I wouldn't call that episode filler. It was also in the light novel, they did change the fate of her kidnapped friend.

[Raziel1991]

Originally Posted by chaos_alfa

I wouldn't call that episode filler. It was also in the light novel, they did change the fate of her kidnapped friend.

The fact it was in the light novel doesnt mean it was actually relevant for the main plot.

[LoveYouSaber]

Hindsight is 20/20, but thinking back now, there were two hints that they would be going for UBW for the upcoming anime.

1. They said they wanted to develop Shirou properly as a main character (He gets massive development in UBW)

2. Ufotable had Rin fetish as seen in FZ...

[Lorhand]

3. Urobuchi said they would adapt UBW.

[Raziel1991]

Im glad they did decide to adapt UBW. UBW!Shirou is my favourite version of Shirou and Archer is my favourite character in the visual novel. I always thought UBW was the route that was the least likely to be adapted by ufotable, Im glad I was wrong.

[Akogareru]

I would think it's obvious why they chose not to adapt the Fate route and why it wouldn't work well. F/Z Saber and Fate Saber is a complete 180. They want to keep Saber's badass warrior persona, and that isn't happening with Fate Shirou around (though I do prefer Saber's gentler side).

[kenshinstyle]

Actually, the japanese cares more about Fate Saber rather than zero with her "badass warrior" persona. It's only the fate/0 only watchers from the west that didn't play the VN that obviously prefer zero saber. So I don't think that's the reason they chose not to adapt Fate.

As said before, it's most probably they want to portray shirou properly that they chose UBW since it is his and archer route, rather than Fate which is more or less Saber-only route.

[Cherry_Lover]

Originally Posted by Raziel1991

Adding stuff about Sakura however makes no sense, mainly because it does not fit with the themes of the Unlimited Blade Works route no matter how you spin it. And the fact she is Rins little sister or their relationship does not really matter since those who have read the UBW route should know that its Archers story, its certainly not Rins story despite her being the heroine of the route. In my opinion adding Sakura stuff here would just feel like putting an out of place filler.

How does Sakura being Rin's sister not "fit with the themes of the route"? Further, people coming into it from Zero will know about Sakura's situation, and will feel unsatisfied if it is just ignored entirely.

Originally Posted by Nayrael

I have no doubts that they will expand on Rin a bit. We are talking about the same people who make an entire filler episode about Chibi Rin in FZ

It's kind-of hard for them to expand on Rin more than UBW already does, though, aside from by adding stuff about Sakura. UBW is still Rin's route, and most of the development that is left out of it is left out because it would be a HF spoiler.

Originally Posted by Raziel1991

In my opinion if they want to expand something, it should be Archers backstory, because after all, all key events of the route are defined by Archer so its important to understand his character and past. I do think the VN did a good job with explaining Archers situation but still if they add original content I personally think it should be to expand on Archer.

Honestly, I think that adding a significant portion on Archer's backstory is unlikely. Nasu seems to prefer keeping it somewhat unclear in detail, and covering what really happened in his timeline properly would involve almost an entire separate series.

Originally Posted by chaos_alfa

I wouldn't call that episode filler. It was also in the light novel, they did change the fate of her kidnapped friend.

It was in the LN, yes, but they expanded it significantly. I think that that was at least partially out of necessity, though, because they couldn't cut it out (it's required to allow Kariya to meet with Aoi) and they couldn't fit it in as part of an episode between two other events.

[Raziel1991]

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

How does Sakura being Rin's sister not "fit with the themes of the route"? Further, people coming into it from Zero will know about Sakura's situation, and will feel unsatisfied if it is just ignored entirely.



Honestly, I think that adding a significant portion on Archer's backstory is unlikely. Nasu seems to prefer keeping it somewhat unclear in detail, and covering what really happened in his timeline properly would involve almost an entire separate series.

1. I think I already explained that the UBW route is Archer´s and Shirou´s story, not Rin´s. She is obviously the heroine of the route but that does not mean UBW is her story. You see, as we all know the main core of UBW´s story is the conflict between Archer´s way of thinking and Shirou´s way thinking. Adding Saber´s backstory in an UBW adaption would make sense as long as they are careful it doesnt intrude the main part of the story. Why? Because the problems of Archer and Saber are similar in nature, in fact, the VN itself stated that Saber saw in the UBW route Archer as her very own mirror image which is why it would add something meaningful to the main story. But adding the problems of Sakura in the Matou family does not really add anything to the conflict between Archer and Shirou in any way which is why I said it would feel like an out of place filler. As for the Fate/Zero thing, I dont see what´s the problem. Fate/Zero only viewers can get the resolution of Sakura´s story in ufotable´s Heavens Feel movie(s) adaption later on.

2. You are correct about this, Nasu does want to keep Archer´s past vague and it´s highly unlikely they add original content in the anime to expand his story, however my point was that it would actually be an addition that adds something meaningful to the story since after all, this is an UBW adaption. He and Shirou are the center of UBW´s story.

[GreyZone]

The only ways I can think of right now to include Sakura in UBW are the following:

1. Sakura's story gets "resolved" by her death and by extension Zouken could also be killed off
2. Shinji (who felt like nothing more than a personified plot device in this route) is somehow replaced by Sakura in the end (i.e. Rin saves Sakura instead of Shinji). Because of the grail growing out of her, Zouken worms are somehow eliminated as well

[scyllus]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

The only ways I can think of right now to include Sakura in UBW are the following:

1. Sakura's story gets "resolved" by her death and by extension Zouken could also be killed off
2. Shinji (who felt like nothing more than a personified plot device in this route) is somehow replaced by Sakura in the end (i.e. Rin saves Sakura instead of Shinji). Because of the grail growing out of her, Zouken worms are somehow eliminated as well

These are not bad propositions at all.
On 1. You could move Rin's investigation of Matou household into UBW. Why isn't it ever questioned how could Shinji summon Rider in the first place? You could include her contacting Kotomine to help her get rid of Zouken, or just let Archer or Rin rip him to shreds, while giving Sakura a "false" saving, making UBW true a little easier to swallow(because rin had no way of knowing the heart worm secret).Having Sakura die just to make sure Zouken is really dead requires the knowledge of the entire HF route, and on it's own it just...well for me sadism:P
2. The second could work, but Sakura is the same as Illya.She arleady has a part of grail inside her, so forcing Illya's heart into her won't result into a cute shinji grail-kun.You would have to ommit the whole incomplete grail bussines, making ubw climax more like Fate one. I am not against it, but it would require major rework, and really alters the plot (Kotomine has no reason to appear in Einsbern mansion, killing Illya is stupid etc)

[mirakura]

Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover

How does Sakura being Rin's sister not "fit with the themes of the route"? Further, people coming into it from Zero will know about Sakura's situation, and will feel unsatisfied if it is just ignored entirely.

So how exactly do you think Sakura will fit into UBW, example, what scenes? You can't say they have to fit her in with out saying how

[GreyZone]

Originally Posted by mirakura

So how exactly do you think Sakura will fit into UBW, example, what scenes? You can't say they have to fit her in with out saying how

Read my post above:

Originally Posted by GreyZone

The only ways I can think of right now to include Sakura in UBW are the following:

1. Sakura's story gets "resolved" by her death and by extension Zouken could also be killed off
2. Shinji (who felt like nothing more than a personified plot device in this route) is somehow replaced by Sakura in the end (i.e. Rin saves Sakura instead of Shinji). Because of the grail growing out of her, Zouken worms are somehow eliminated as well

As scyllus pointed out, those ways have their weaknesses, but still, you got your examples.

[mirakura]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

Read my post above:



As scyllus pointed out, those ways have their weaknesses, but still, you got your examples.

Yeah, good ideas, but they change the plot to a degree. Also, it was at Cherry Lover, don't think I missed out what you said, but scyllus already dealt with them.

[GreyZone]

I doubt Cherry_Lover would like Method 1, but it would still be a way, to ADD it to the story (i.e. "original scenes by Nasu"), without CHANGING the existing one.

Method 2 would change the story though, that is true, but considering how Shinji felt almost non-existent here and Rin saving him somehow felt.... underwhelming? It could maybe work somehow, but maybe not... urgh my head.

[Tenchi Hou Take]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

I doubt Cherry_Lover would like Method 1, but it would still be a way, to ADD it to the story (i.e. "original scenes by Nasu"), without CHANGING the existing one.

Method 2 would change the story though, that is true, but considering how Shinji felt almost non-existent here and Rin saving him somehow felt.... underwhelming? It could maybe work somehow, but maybe not... urgh my head.

Non existent... the dude tried to rape her, it was pretty much a better person moment more than anything to do with Shinji's character.

[mirakura]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

Method 2 would change the story though, that is true, but considering how Shinji felt almost non-existent here and Rin saving him somehow felt.... underwhelming? It could maybe work somehow, but maybe not... urgh my head.

Yeah, I was screaming at the screen when she decided to save him...she almost risked her life, so much for a genius(jokes)

[GreyZone]

Originally Posted by Tenchi Hou Take

Non existent... the dude tried to rape her, it was pretty much a better person moment more than anything to do with Shinji's character.

When I read that scene in the VN, not even for one second did I think that Shinji was a "threat". In my mind he was the buttmonkey of the series already... I mean on first glance everyone saw Shirou as an incompetent Magican noob. However Shinji was even worse. He was not even a magican at all, got stomped by Shirou and would probably easily lose against every other master as well. Not to mention that Shirou, aside from at least being a magus at all, was also physically stronger than him. It burned the impression into my head that "no matter what Shinji tries, he will, in 100% of all cases, always fail".

And that was even BEFORE I read HF, which was the "finishing move" for him (in my mind).