[Game] Umineko - Spoilers, Theories, Interpretations

[theacefrehley]

Originally Posted by Rattan

Question...

Was it stated specifically that original Beatrice died from Beatrice2's birth?
If not, then there's a chance that she died from the child from 19 years ago instead right?

It's pretty much implied she died giving birth

Game quote:
「出産が、うまく行かなかったそうで……。お気の毒なことです。」
＜南條

'It seems the childbirth didn't go well...unfortunately'

Unless we are being tricked here somehow

[Rattan]

Originally Posted by theacefrehley

It's pretty much implied she died giving birth

Game quote:
「出産が、うまく行かなかったそうで……。お気の毒なことです。」
<南條

'It seems the childbirth didn't go well...unfortunately'

Unless we are being tricked here somehow

Ah, so was it from bea-2's birth or the other child's birth? I'm sorry heh.

[Oliver]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

Why odd? Kinzo begun losing it since Beatrice Castiglioni died. He deluded himself into believing Beatrice2 was her reincarnation, but that Beatrice2 died which means in his eyes that Beatrice escaped him again. He only had that last hope, Beatrice3, but she also died. At that point Kinzo lost it completely.

[...]

I don't see the relevance of this point. We are not taking advantage of a "I wouldn't put it past Kinzo" to support a devil's proof. There are enough of evidences on Rosa's story's side, this is far beyond the level of a devil's proof.

You can say that Kinzo is insane, and then you say that you aren't using it to support a Devil's Proof? Really?

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

this sort of connection makes no sense. The story of the maid that fell from the stairs is recent and she was only injured. The maid that fell from the cliff is very old, no mention was ever made about this maid being disrespectful toward Beatrice and she didn't get an injury, she died.

Shannon says it happened before she started working in Ep1. Then a later retelling in Ep5 says it happened after the portrait was put up. In both cases the story of the servant who fell down the stairs is otherwise the same.

So which episode do I think I should believe?

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

With this you don't deny Rosa and Beatrice2 encounter itself but how they encountered. However why would Rosa lie about that? And how would she be able to play with Beatrice2 in several occasions without anyone noticing that she gone missing?

Kumasawa went with her.

Why would Rosa lie about that? puhleease

[Judoh]

There is also how Natsuhi is certain Kinzo and her (Rosa was on a field trip with her friends she says) were the only people on the island the day the servant and the baby fell from the cliff. So Natsuhi clearly wouldn't think the stories connect.

Unless I'm missing something...??

[Jan-Poo]

Originally Posted by LyricalAura

In the forest of Rokkenjima, a hidden mansion called Kuwadorian exists. Those two actually had a conversation like that in this place. This is the world of 1967.
Furthermore, while I expect Ryuukishi to be lazy about characters, I don't expect him to be lazy about backgrounds, which means the conversation took place in spring or summer. I also don't expect him to use his lazy character art to disguise important aspects of the characters' appearance, and the manga and the anime both agreed that she didn't look pregnant.

Surely you are aware that pregnancy is visibly evident only in the few last months. That conversation could have happened any time. Before the pregnancy, during the pregnancy and after the pregnancy. There's only about a 4 month time span where you would definitely need to show a baby bump.

Originally Posted by LyricalAura

It seems to me that I'm questioning a small part of EP7 that Yasu's backstory isn't particularly dependent on.

Small you say?
Lion's world is said to be the result of Natsuhi accepting the baby from Kinzo. This looks like a very important detail to me.

And from Yasu's world it isn't so much different either. Genji narrates the whole story of how he rescued Yasu after she fell from the cliff and the same story is repeated when Yasu solves the epitaph. Not to mention it is hinted again in the flashback where Yasu screams she's furniture.

[Jan-Poo]

Originally Posted by Oliver

You can say that Kinzo is insane, and then you say that you aren't using it to support a Devil's Proof? Really?

You need a devil's proof to claim that people can be mad?

Originally Posted by Oliver

Shannon says it happened before she started working in Ep1. Then a later retelling in Ep5 says it happened after the portrait was put up. In both cases the story of the servant who fell down the stairs is otherwise the same.

So which episode do I think I should believe?

One of the two stories about the maid that fell from the stairs is wrong, but how exactly this shows a connection with the maid that fell with the baby?

The only similarity is that a maid fell down. Everything else is different.

Originally Posted by Oliver

Kumasawa went with her.

Why would Rosa lie about that? puhleease

Let me clarify this. Why would Rosa lie about this in 1986?
She says she killed Beatrice, basically telling that she is a murderer. Why would she have a problem telling that she met Beatrice several times? Was that a crime worse than murder?

[Oliver]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

You need a devil's proof to claim that people can be mad?

When it's Kinzo, yes. His madness is used to excuse so many things otherwise that I can't honestly accept it as an argument at all.

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

The only similarity is that a maid fell down. Everything else is different.

Same as with the Rosa story and Natsuhi story. The only similarity is that someone fell down the cliff. Everything else is different.

So why are they at all connected? Mind you, nothing stops Yasu from thinking she's that baby. She doesn't have to be right.

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

Let me clarify this. Why would Rosa lie about this in 1986?
She says she killed Beatrice, basically telling that she is a murderer. Why would she have a problem telling that she met Beatrice several times? Was that a crime worse than murder?

Yes. Because that would mean explaining how she really got to Kuwadorian, which was through the underground passage.

My current guess under investigation is that Rosa is the initiator of the epitaph solution party, which kind of fails if Rosa gives away she knows the solution.

[Renall]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

Surely you are aware that pregnancy is visibly evident only in the few last months. That conversation could have happened any time. Before the pregnancy, during the pregnancy and after the pregnancy. There's only about a 4 month time span where you would definitely need to show a baby bump.

A coworker of mine was showing for about 6 months, pretty obviously, before giving birth in early August. I wouldn't say it's quite so non-obvious, especially with that kinda dress.

But that's irrelevant. The main issue is that she really doesn't act like the sort of person who would have been recently or presently pregnant, nor does she seem to have any meaningful reaction which would suggest awareness of any baby. When Rosa is like "let's go!" where is the "but what about my baby?" If the baby's not there at all (because it was already taken), did she know? Did she care? Her behavior is just very strange for anyone who is or was ever a mother.

[Jan-Poo]

Originally Posted by Oliver

When it's Kinzo, yes. His madness is used to excuse so many things otherwise that I can't honestly accept it as an argument at all.

Well I can't say I agree here. The madness idea has been abused, certainly, but this is no reason to deny that madness exists and expect a perfectly normal behavior from a man that clearly doesn't show a normal behavior.

Originally Posted by Oliver

Same as with the Rosa story and Natsuhi story. The only similarity is that someone fell down the cliff. Everything else is different.

So why are they at all connected? Mind you, nothing stops Yasu from thinking she's that baby. She doesn't have to be right.

So many wrong things here.
Rosa's and natsuhi's stories are not the same story of course they don't need to have similarities
the connection is something that was stated in Ep7quite clearly.
Yasu is not the only one who thinks she's that baby. Will also thinks it.

Originally Posted by Oliver

Yes. Because that would mean explaining how she really got to Kuwadorian, which was through the underground passage.

My current guess under investigation is that Rosa is the initiator of the epitaph solution party, which kind of fails if Rosa gives away she knows the solution.

Quite impossible. If Rosa knew how to open the entrance to that tunnel she would have used that chance to solve the epitaph and become the new heir many years before, even before Yasu. You'd have to write as lies a lot of stuff about Rosa to explain why she didn't use that chance. Starting from her extreme need of money.

Originally Posted by Renall

But that's irrelevant. The main issue is that she really doesn't act like the sort of person who would have been recently or presently pregnant, nor does she seem to have any meaningful reaction which would suggest awareness of any baby. When Rosa is like "let's go!" where is the "but what about my baby?" If the baby's not there at all (because it was already taken), did she know? Did she care? Her behavior is just very strange for anyone who is or was ever a mother.

I addressed this issue earlier. It is possible that Beatrice refused the baby.

[Oliver]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

So many wrong things here.
Rosa's and natsuhi's stories are not the same story of course they don't need to have similarities
the connection is something that was stated in Ep7quite clearly.
Yasu is not the only one who thinks she's that baby. Will also thinks it.

Stated by... whom? Will? So just because he thinks something, he can't be wrong?

Back in the day, when Ep5 was fresh, I actually saw the stairs story used to support the Natsuhi story. You just said they are not related.

There is Word of God that the mystery is solvable with the first four episodes. Please produce evidence from episodes 1-4 allowing us to infer the existence of Baby-19 at all. As the stairs story is not connected, you can't use it as a hint.

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

Quite impossible. If Rosa knew how to open the entrance to that tunnel she would have used that chance to solve the epitaph and become the new heir many years before, even before Yasu. You'd have to write as lies a lot of stuff about Rosa to explain why she didn't use that chance. Starting from her extreme need of money.

Does Rosa ever express the desire to be the heir? Is her need for money anywhere that extreme as that of the other siblings?...
...ah, well, whatever, if saying 'investigating' somehow missed your ears, I guess I'll go back to thinking on my own.

[musouka]

Originally Posted by Oliver

Please produce evidence from episodes 1-4 allowing us to infer the existence of Baby-19 at all.

Kinzo's behavior. It was pretty damn obvious that he thought Beatrice's soul could be transferred from body to body and that he had done it more than once. The game sets it up for you to think about how there could be another Beatrice if that one died, and the obvious conclusion is that there was a descendant from that Beatrice.

Admittedly, my friend and I didn't think in terms of blood relations. We thought of Kinzo picking up kids from Fukuin, but the same basic premise is easy to discern.

[LyricalAura]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

Quite impossible. If Rosa knew how to open the entrance to that tunnel she would have used that chance to solve the epitaph and become the new heir many years before, even before Yasu. You'd have to write as lies a lot of stuff about Rosa to explain why she didn't use that chance. Starting from her extreme need of money.

Kyrie advanced a theory at one point (EP4?) that the letter writer didn't have enough leverage to just come forward and claim the money themselves, so they were trying to use its location as a bargaining chip. Rosa doesn't have much authority among the siblings, and if she announced she'd found the gold, there's a good chance it would just be taken away from her. It's actually in her best interests to make sure someone else finds it with her help so they can support her claim. That lines up with her behavior in EP3, where she dropped a critical hint to Eva and then showed up at the gold right behind her.

[Judoh]

Well if Rosa doesn't have the same feelings as the siblings and she knows about it we can add another sin to the list. Pride. That would mean she looks down on her older siblings for scavenging for money and dragging her into ganging up on Krauss when she figured out this riddle a long time ago.

But that also might mean we have to remove greed from the list.

Note that: Besides Kumasawa Rosa also (is the only other person if IIRC) is mentioned to take notes on the epitaph [ep1]. And it's Maria who copied it down for her.

[Used Can]

In order for Rosa to have found the gold by 1967, I think that'd mean she'd have been able to use Kinzo's passcode in the chapel, since, as far as we know, that's the only passage available to reach the gold and Kuwadorian. Back then, there was no epitaph, so we'd have to assume she was playing around the chapel and by one huge coincidence she did the whole thing, or she's some sort of super-genius that just solved the whole puzzle because she's that awesome. None of these are particularly credible, in my opinion.

As for the story of the servant who had an accident, it was brought up only twice, I believe. The first time it was brought up by Shannon during EP1, and she said that just before she began working, a servant who spoke badly of Beatrice fell down the stairs and ended up with a "serious injury" in his/her back, which prevented him/her from working (and thus had to quit). The second time it was brought up by George, during his conversation with Shannon in EP2, and he simply said he had heard about a servant who had an accident, because he/she had spoken poorly of Beatrice. For all we know, both events could be the same.

By the way, I found this, quite possibly interesting passage in EP4:

Spoiler for ST'd for length:

............Maria onee-chan's way of thinking really is unusual.

According to her, from the beginning, a witch had resided in that place called a school.
No, she says that anywhere that a lot of people gather will most certainly have a witch residing there.

The witch tries to steal the students' souls through death by disease or accidents.
Apparently, she sometimes also corrupts the souls, leading them down that path of evil.

She says that an angel came, not content to let that happen.

"......And the angel, she tried to finish off that witch. But the witch was powerful, and the fight took seven days and seven nights, but even then, it still wasn't finished. The tired out witch asked for a truce, and proposed this."

"I've heard this before. ......Until now, I have made half of the students in the class become sick or injured. But in exchange, I have protected the remaining half of the students from sickness and injury. Therefore, if one member of the class becomes a sacrifice to me and is made into the 'bullied kid', I shall protect all of the other students from sickness and injury, .........wasn't it?"

"Uu-. The angel thought about it. Compared to half the class meeting with misfortune, having only one person be unfortunate would be much better. Then, the witch said that she would protect the safety of all the other students, using her powerful magic."

"If there are 40 students in a class, ......and the 20 victims are shrunk down to 1, then 19 people are saved. ......It actually is a reasonable proposition."

I wonder if this fairy tale has some kind of motif.
If it's a creation of Maria onee-chan, a nine year old girl, that would be pretty impressive.

"The angel decided to accept that proposal. So, through the single sacrifice, 19 people were saved.

......So Maria's role is important. The witch is protecting 19 people."

"......Because we become sacrifices? .........Well, I don't remember ever being thanked by those 19 people."

...Maria onee-chan's idea was too compassionate.

The misfortune of my and her situations are very similar. ......And yet, maybe you could say that because of a small difference in our way of thinking, there's a difference in how peaceful our hearts are.

[Judoh]

Yeah that's an interesting one. There are lot of nuggets of truth in episode 4.

One thing to notice in that passage is that the number of bullies in the class is 19. So the theme continues.

This is one of the scenes I thought was interesting in that episode. And it's long enough and the topic is deep enough that I couldn't help, but think it was a huge clue.

Spoiler for lots of space:

Amakusa: "Going to read on the deck? You'll damage your book."

Amakusa apparently thought that since I was clutching Maria onee-chan's diary under my arm.
I'd been reading it half asleep, which was why I had come back up still clutching it.

Amakusa: "How's it going? Think you'll be able to find the truth of Rokkenjima from Maria-san's diary?"

Ange: ".........Who knows. No matter how much I investigate what happened on that island, it won't make for anything more than a theory. There's no truth written in the message bottle or Onee-chan's diary, just a fairy tale with a witch walking around. ......I'm stuck."

Amakusa:"Looks like you've got nothing to look forward to except questioning those involved on Niijima."

Ange: "I imagine the Witch Hunters have showered them with questions over and over, so I'm pretty sure I won't find any new facts."

Amakusa: "Hehhaha...! So even though your hopes are that low, you're willing to spend a half-day trip on a boat to go to Niijima anyway! You really are fickle."

Ange: ".........It's like a journey of self-satisfaction, so that I can say 'I investigated'. I'm not so naive as to seriously think that the truth of 12 years ago will be revealed."

Amakusa: "When you've finished with your self-satisfaction, what do you plan to do?

Ange:"Who knows. Haven't thought of it. .........I'll go to Niijima, ask some people who were involved. ...Then, after going to Rokkenjima in the end and leaving some flowers, my journey will be over."

*some narration about Bernkastel and the journey to Nijjima *

Ange: I don't seriously believe that this journey will change anything.
.....It's even up to me when to end this journey. It's up to me to choose where the final destination is. `In the end, this journey is only for my self-satisfaction......

Amakusa:"............Self-satisfaction, is it. It sounds bad when you say it, but I think that's actually what life is all about."

Ange: "......Heh. If that's the answer you've reached after hovering over the line between life and death in the mercenary business, that's probably pretty deep."

Amakusa"Don't take it so lightly. What I'm trying to say is that the only one who can acknowledge you in this world is you yourself."

Amakusa continued stretching as he spoke. In a mortifyingly brisk way.
Hearing it told to me as though from a teacher made me instinctively want to resist, but what he was saying was extremely sensible.

Ange:......That may be true.

Ange: People work hard when they want to be acknowledged by someone. ......In most cases, that someone is their parents. Children learn how to work hard because they want to be praised by their parents. .........Although that's why I never learned.

Amakusa:"Sorry, that's not what I intended when I spoke.

Amakusa:......What I want to say is that self-satisfaction is usually alright.No matter who praises you, it's meaningless unless you can accept that. ......Turning it around, even if no one praises you, that doesn't matter as long as you can accept it."

Ange:".........Self-satisfaction and aspirations contradict each other, so we're usually taught that the former is bad. Your argument seems somehow fresh, Amakusa."

Amakusa:"The anguish of the human world comes when you want someone to acknowledge you, but you don't know what it is you should be striving for. I had a time like that too. I wanted someone to acknowledge me, but I didn't know what I wanted them to acknowledge about me. And since I didn't know what to strive for or how far I should go to be acknowledged by someone, I did a lot of crazy things."

Ange:"And the answer you reached, ......was self-satisfaction?"

Amakusa: "It sounds bad, but that's how it is. Rich is the one who is content with what they are, they say."

Amakusa: .........If I live my life believing that this is enough, that's not something to be nagged over and criticized by others. It's the same for your life, and for this journey. No one has any right to criticize you other than you yourself, Ange-san."

Amakusa: You are the only one who determines the meaning and results of your journey, Ange-san. If it's been a meaningful journey for you, then that's more than enough."

Ange:"...........................I'd thought you were a guy who liked to talk nonsense, but you really do say some weird things every once in a while. I'll bet you think saying things like that every now and then will get you popular."

Amakusa:"You must be joking.That's not what I had in mind when I said it.

.........It looks like you want to be alone.I'll head over to see the boat captain.Please, take your time."

It seemed Amakusa had decided I was in a bad mood.......Although I didn't feel that way myself.

Or he might have finished a set of stretches and wanted to cool off in the shade.
The sea winds were strong, but not enough to cool the rays of the sun.

Amakusa disappeared.

Only I remained.

Ange:".........Self-satisfaction is life itself, he says."

Mammon:"That's just boring. Life is nothing without greed."
I noticed that Mammon had suddenly appeared, her abundant hair fluttering over by the prow of the ship.

Ange:"It's true that a life of greed would be fun. But unlike you, humans have a limited life-span. If greed remains for eternity, that means that a person has desires even in the last moment before they die. Having desires means that there's something they want. Something they don't have, some way they aren't complete.......I'm sure it's tough to die when you can't think of your life as being fulfilled. So I'm sure self-satisfaction is necessary."

Mammon:".........I see. Because of the existence of a life span, you have to find a common ground there? All of my masters had very long life spans, so I've never thought of it."

Ange:"I wonder if humans live so that they can be satisfied. ......If so, unselfishly is probably the easiest way to live. ...I see, I understand why greed is one of the seven deadly sins."

Mammon:"*giggle*. Your praise honors me."

Apparently that counted as praise in Mammon's eyes. She turned and gave a graceful bow.

Mammon:"Ange-sama. Do humans live so that they can be satisfied at the moment of their death?"

Ange:"......Wouldn't it be pretty tough if you were unsatisfied about something at the moment of your death?"

Mammon:"If so, then humans live only so that they can meet a satisfied death.They live so that they can have a better death. They live so that they can die."

............This kid's saying something pretty incredible.
...I see, as I'd expect from a demon stake.

However, that might be the truth.Humans suffer because they aren't satisfied, and live only to be satisfied.
In other words, that might be the same as a desire to die while satisfied.

Ange: "I can't counter that. ......People live in order to be satisfied.And they hope to die while still satisfied. So, not knowing how to make yourself become satisfied is very tough."

Mammon:"What can they do to become satisfied?In a human's life."

Ange:".........Being acknowledged. Hearing 'you are happy'."

Mammon:"If it doesn't matter who acknowledges them, then I will do so."

Ange:"Yes, there's that. .........People don't know who they should have acknowledge them."

Mammon: "So, searching for that person to acknowledge them is the journey of life?Hmmmm."

"It sounds strange. Whether you're acknowledged or not, it supposedly doesn't change your circumstances. ......And yet, if you are acknowledged you will be satisfied, while if you aren't then you won't. ...It's almost like the blue bird.......Because you can't notice the blue bird even though it's already in the cage, you have to go out on a journey searching everywhere."`

Mammon:"What the heck. Kyahhahaha.Human lives sure are stupid."

Ange:"That's right. Amakusa said something really good. "

Ange: ......Rich is the one who is content with what they are...was it? I don't know where that proverb came from, but it has a deep meaning. ......In short, if you won't be satisfied enough unless someone acknowledges you, that's the same as not acknowledging yourself. ......The ultimate in self-fulfillment is acknowledging yourself."

Mammon:"That's right. Because if you can become aware that you are fully satisfied, there's no need to be acknowledged by anyone. Just by taking notice of the small things, the humans' foolish journey of life can be ended easily. You can spend the rest of your life playing and having a good time A human's life is so ridiculous, kyahhahahaha!"

Mammon's choice of words was bad, but it was surely the truth.

If most of a human's life is a journey where they wish that someone would acknowledge them, so that they could achieve a satisfied death...

.........Then when they realize that the person to acknowledge them is not someone else, but they themselves, that pointless journey can end.

Humans who have ended that journey can probably spend the rest of their lives as they wish with their chests stuck out.

......How sublime, how praiseworthy would that be.

Ange:"You know, it seems Amakusa's on pretty bad terms with his parents. ......That makes sense. He's in the kind of trade that'd have proper parents wanting to make him wash his hands of it."

Mammon:"Isn't that alright though? As long as it's fun for the person in question."

Ange:".........Exactly.That's what it comes down to in the end. Criticism of yourself as you're observed by others doesn't matter. If your existence is firmly acknowledged by you yourself, that's enough. ......If you can live with confidence in yourself, surely you can accept any kind of lifestyle.I'm sure Amakusa will eventually eat a stray bullet on the battlefield and get seriously injured. ...He might even die. But I don't think Amakusa thinks that's unreasonable. I'm sure he'd cackle about how that's also part of life."

Mammon: "What a great way to live. I'm enchanted."

"......Pitiful humans who aren't acknowledged by themselves...wander about searching for that their whole lives, and without anything being accepted, they do nothing but grumble and die while still unsatisfied.......How pitiful. Compared to people whose lives drag on without any purpose, Amakusa is more likely to eventually die by the roadside, but I think he's much more noble for living his life with his chest stuck out."

Mammon: "Aren't the winners in life those who achieve enlightenment? If they can do that even a little sooner, they'll be able to live that much more of their life effectively."

.........With Mammon's words,......I finally accepted a certain fact.

*After that it goes on to talk about Maria*

[Used Can]

Yeah, I was also thinking about that too, and it reminded me of a part from Lambda's Diary TIP, in which she said that the girl who aspired to be a witch wasn't asking Lambda to recognise her as a witch, because she already was one. However, she thought it'd be better if a fellow witch would acknowledge as such.

What I wonder is, what sort of recognition does Beato/Yasu/Lion wants from Battler?

[TehChron]

Originally Posted by Used Can

Yeah, I was also thinking about that too, and it reminded me of a part from Lambda's Diary TIP, in which she said that the girl who aspired to be a witch wasn't asking Lambda to recognise her as a witch, because she already was one. However, she thought it'd be better if a fellow witch would acknowledge as such.

What I wonder is, what sort of recognition does Beato/Yasu/Lion wants from Battler?

"I am here, won't you acknowledge that I am?" or something to that effect, I'd think. If Amakusa is future-Battler or something similar, it'd be pretty interesting to see how his life wound up to cause him to take that attitude on.

If Battler survived, has he acknowledged himself? Or does he not, due to the fact he survived?

The entire situation surrounding Battler if he did survive is pretty deep. But we know that ultimately Beatrice wanted Battler to acknowledge her, recognize her...But does he? Is she still waiting for him even at the very end?

Some questions simply arent a part of the mystery, but are part of the story nonetheless.

[cmos]

Originally Posted by Oliver

Please produce evidence from episodes 1-4 allowing us to infer the existence of Baby-19 at all. As the stairs story is not connected, you can't use it as a hint.

Relatives frequently speculate about it. Especially in ep2, when the mysterious guest had appeared, they theorized that she may be an illegitimate child of Kinzo from his mistress.
Jessica in prologue about the portrait: "It's Beatrice-sama. ......Nobody knows her background. Could she be Grandfather's mistress from long ago? ......Maybe her descendants will unexpectedly appear and tell us to return the gold we were granted or something, right?"

Relatives:
"That kind of thing doesn't matter. ...The problem is what happens if that woman starts calling herself Beatrice, if she starts calling herself the manager of Father's assets."
"Or, ...maybe she plans to call herself his mistress's daughter, and demand that the inheritance be distributed to her. ...Either way, an outrageous joker has been slipped into the deck. .........Did Nii-san call her? ...Or did Father...?"

"I told you to be silent! I've been in this mansion with Father the whole time, and I haven't heard about this once. .........At best, all we can guess is that Father's hidden mistress of several decades ago had a hidden child, ......and Father searched her out and called her today. ...Is that what you want to say?"

[Judoh]

For Beatrice candidates. Other then generic craziness of wanting to be praised for being a murderer...

What I thought at first was that Beato wanted to be acknowledged as a person by Battler. But with Yasu/Shannon/Lion/whatever that doesn't make as much sense as the Lambda acknowledging a witch thing.

Because with Kanon for example all he would need to do to be acknowledged as "human" or as a "person" would be to talk to Jessica and have her give him the guarantee that he's human. He could get that guarantee from her in seconds and she often does make it around him.

As we've been shown though it's much more complicated than just that...

With Jessica though Battler not seeing Jessica as a girl is one conclusion, but it would just be a rehashing the Keiichi's sin against Mion in Higurashi.

I think it could apply to Shannon and George's relationship though. There being a Romeo and Juliet metaphor so early in the series and all. However not many here think that's a strong enough motive. So I haven't tried to elaborate on that.

[Used Can]

I think this should also tie with the whole deal about furniture being able to attain humanity with love. During the scene Judoh posted from EP4, Ange mentioned there are things people desire, which they cannot feel complete unless they receive. In EP6 we had this same issue with the Love Duel.

So, we have two things here, which are apparently related:
1. Being recognised
2. Receiving love

Now, it'd bring into question why would Yasu want to be recognised by Battler when George and Jessica already do so (i.e. as Shannon and Kanon respectively - assuming Shaknontrice is true)? If I can make a quick assumption then Yasu/Lion doesn't want to be seen as Shannon and/or Kanon, but as who (s)he really is. This is where the whole "without love it cannot be seen plays out" (well, one of the many instances in which it does), because if Battler can see this whole story through a love bias, then perhaps he can piece together several things - beginning from what an "Endless Witch" is, and how Beatrice the Endless was born and why. Now, why Battler? Why not present himself/herself as (s)he really is to George, Jessica or someone else, I don't know. Perhaps, after going through all of his/her internal conflict, all Yasu/Lion had was his/her promise with Battler. So, those feelings remained.