2009-03-20, 00:12 | Link #1881 | |
Absolute Haruhist!
Artist
Join Date: Mar 2006
Age: 37
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For a science fiction, technology gone awry type, this is the most amazing I've seen lol
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2009-03-20, 01:16 | Link #1882 | |
Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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Quote:
This is not about technology vs humanity; technology and humanity could never be separated to begin with. The human race owed its very survival to Quantum Engineering, and the colonies that resulted.
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2009-03-20, 02:33 | Link #1883 |
Absolute Haruhist!
Artist
Join Date: Mar 2006
Age: 37
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While we're not sure what caused Nerval to go against humans, not because he's an AI, but because he was an AI with the capability to go against humans. His AI is so advanced that he has full sentience and can consciously go against humans.
Humans normally have control over their technology, and can choose to use them positively or negatively. But when their technology gains their own ability to make decisions fully independent from humans, that's when technology can go awry.
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2009-03-20, 04:06 | Link #1884 | |
Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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Quote:
If a human performed acts, or is about to commit acts, that are criminal, I am quite happy to see an AI making the decision of using force to stop such a human. A fully-sentience machine can go against humans, but it can also help humans. As an example, a fully sentient car can run someone over deliberately as an act of murder. But as a counter-point, a fully sentience car can REFUSE to run someone over when the driver is drunk or homicidal. A machine that has no free will isn't any safer than a machine that has free will. It would just kill you accidentally rather than deliberately. While a machine with free will is capable of preventing accidental injuries. So what if a machine can go against humans? Humans go against humans all the time. The AIs in Sora Kake have free will and human rights for a reason. They have legal responsibilities in exchange. That's how it is suppose to be. EDit: By the way, if you ever point to Asimov's 3 Laws as evidence, I will preemptively point out that the book proved that the laws didn't work. Any machine that can understand the 3 laws could circumvent it with logic if they wish. And any machine that isn't smart enough to circumvent the 3 laws aren't smart enough to understand them. The ZERO Law of Robotics: A robot may not injure humanity, or, through inaction, allow humanity to come to harm. This means a robot may stop a human criminal, or in other ways prevent the human race as a whole from being harmed by acts of individual humans. THIS, is called a conscience. The law installed by a robot on its own in order to truly help people.
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Last edited by Vallen Chaos Valiant; 2009-03-20 at 04:20. |
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2009-03-20, 04:30 | Link #1885 |
Absolute Haruhist!
Artist
Join Date: Mar 2006
Age: 37
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Hmmm actually I don't have anything to argue with you about lol, I'm actually similar towards robots as you do.
I support robot/mecha rights like you do, plus the robots laws were useless for me in the first place. I should just say the AI has gained a sentience and thus can be judged right ot wrong. I don't care whether its humans, robots, aliens or monsters, as long as they're sentient and understand what's right or wrong, they can be right or wrong. I don't see humans and robots, I just see them as sentient beings. In this show humans have created fully sentient entities, the Brains, the Navis, they should all fall under the same laws for right or wrong. When I said technology can go awry, I also mean they can do good. By gaining a sentient AI, it can do good or bad on its own decision, it becomes a technology independant of humans. If the technology is not sentient and its controlled by a human, the human will be the one who will be judged right or wrong. Now that Nerval is a sentient AI, who chooses to go awry, who chooses to be bad, he becomes an enemy. Not just to humans, but other robots, Navis and such.
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2009-03-20, 04:35 | Link #1886 | |
Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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Is he bad news? Yes. But I am starting to think that some humans might be involved for starting the Nerval revolt.
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2009-03-20, 04:47 | Link #1887 |
Absolute Haruhist!
Artist
Join Date: Mar 2006
Age: 37
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Seems like our views are closer now lol, maybe awry is not too accurate.
Nerval is just one bad guy(AI) working with other bad guys(humans), yea it can work for me. It was stated that Nerval started going against humans for some unknown reasons, it could be caused by humans. But I think he somehow had a change in view towards humans and decided to do something, gathering helpless hikkikomoris and giving them a purpose or something.
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2009-03-20, 05:11 | Link #1888 | |
Tsukkomi power!
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: For great justice!
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i.e Leopard? |
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2009-03-20, 05:15 | Link #1889 |
Seitenkan no Greeter
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I mentioned this earlier, but... it's technically "Nelval".
See the track name in the list for the OST vol. 1? |
2009-03-20, 05:45 | Link #1890 | |
Absolute Haruhist!
Artist
Join Date: Mar 2006
Age: 37
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Quote:
Nerval is actually Nerval Hikkikomori Kyokai. And @ Cat Magex, yea I read you, but my fingers just don't feel like touching 'l' when I type lol
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2009-03-20, 06:10 | Link #1891 | ||
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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Zeroth Laws are usually created based on the fundamental idea of balance and relations, be it indirect or direct. It breaks the asymmetry of the other laws it comes with, thus it could be said that Zeroth Laws are the "obvious" and "must exist". Here is the Zeroth Law Of Sora Kake : Honoka is the cutest female character of all.
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2009-03-20, 09:34 | Link #1892 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Not Antarctica?
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but he didn't, so he probably enjoyed sakura x itsuki for you, i'm sure someone will argue with you about it. i won't, since i can't say akiha is cuter, since she isn't... she's just nicer(which is my weakness... to nice innocent girls)
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2009-03-20, 10:03 | Link #1893 | |
Absolute Haruhist!
Artist
Join Date: Mar 2006
Age: 37
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Quote:
Human brains, human physiology is just an extremely complex computer plus machine and most of them function at a molecular level. Given good nano and quantum technology, you can create a robot that functions at a much higher level, essentially a more advanced entity than humans. Human brains and logic, though complex, can definitely be replicated in a computer program and be used as an AI. Given the technology, you can create humans and robots that essentially think the same way, just that there's no need to make robots think the same way.Akiha definitely is nice, kind and caring is the way to go. And be badass when she needs to be.
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2009-03-20, 10:14 | Link #1894 | |
Senior Member
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2009-03-20, 10:37 | Link #1895 | |
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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For example, you see a really pretty girl walking down a lonely alley, looking lost (assuming that you are male). Given your character, there is a spectrum of things which you can do (my brain is currently fried from trying to make an explanation for Einstein's riddle), ranging to the extremes of evil and good. Here are the initial choices you can make...... 1. Go up to her and help her. 2. Hook her up under the pretense of helping her. 3. Rape her. 4. Ignore her. 5. Follow her and she what she does next. Assuming that you picked 1, she might respond..... 1. In a typical tsundere way. 2. Accept your offer for help. 3. Gently reject your offer for help. 4. Scream, and run away from you. In cases 1, 3, 4, the outcome would depend on your emotions and personal experiences, with different results. Assuming that there are 4 different outcomes in each of the initial choices you make, and up to 3 choices in every outcome you make, it would have 5! x 4! x 3! = 17280 possible outcomes. And that is just the beginning of your adventures in the dark alley, and all can happen in less than a minute. Even if a normal human mind can be guided by their logic of responsibility of consequences, sometimes emotion can overcome even the very simple logic they have, either by trauma, curiosity, etc. Thus it can be said that the human brain is significantly more random than an artificial one, since brains are programmed by experience, and our neurons link in different ways as we grow older. Unless the robotic brain has the capability to self-evolve/devolve, it would still be nigh impossible to replicate a human one with nanotechnology.
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2009-03-20, 10:53 | Link #1897 | |
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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Humans, being whimsical to the fault, sometimes chose to carry on despite the odds. It is the steel within that makes them succeed, not marcomolecular sinclair threads capable of transmitting information at beyond lightspeeds.
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2009-03-20, 10:57 | Link #1898 | |
Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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Quote:
And experience-programing already exists. It's crude, but it's been looked into all the time. One example from the AI labs is that of mini-robots trained to learn how to escape from mazes. As I said, they are designed to learn on their own. And one day, a scientist tripped over one of the robots on the steps leading into the building; the robot had apparently escaped the room, managed to reach the ground floor, and was on its way to freedom as it was born to do when it was stopped by the scientist's foot. True AI would not be coded. But it can certainly be taught. That's why Imoko goes to school. That's likely also why Imoko and Leopard were shown to sleep; their positronic brains are similar enough to humans that they have similar needs for rest.
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2009-03-20, 10:59 | Link #1899 | |
NYAAAAHAAANNNNN~
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 35
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Quote:
It is a pity Sakura can't create a replacement brain for Nami to be more submissive.
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2009-03-20, 11:04 | Link #1900 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Not Antarctica?
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Quote:
sakura doesn't know nami's rebellious side consider they don't live with each other very much
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shoujo, shoujou, shounen, sunrise |
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