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Old 2022-04-16, 17:30   Link #61
Ghostfriendly
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LG-MAX 2.o View Post
Interestingly, ads in which real men appear half-naked or characters from teen series like Free are very well accepted by the community.

If this is indecent/obscene/something on the level of a sexual act, then Japanese schoolgirls should urgently start wearing clothes that cover the entire body.
I shouldn't need to explain the real life context of female objectivation based on exaggerated physical traits that makes Free etc very different from Tawara etc. Ignoring the purpose, associations and associated trashy fanservice anime of the illustration is disingenuous.

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Originally Posted by Infinite Zenith View Post
There is nothing wrong with that ad, of course, and Anime News Network is known for their performative activism. The author of that particular ANN article also has a history of stirring the pot previously, and lacks the credentials to write anything of merit regarding the topic anyways.
In the context of an anime dedicated to dehumanising women, yes, the ad is objectionable. Writing objectively about a noteworthy topic is more worthwhile than carping at such a person. The ANN article really reminded me that there are sensible people thinking about these things.
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Old 2022-04-16, 17:37   Link #62
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Anime News Network, "objective", "sensible" and "noteworthy" in the same sentence is probably the finest joke I've heard all year. That particular site specialises in sensationalism of irrelevant and trite matters. They said nothing informative in that article; it's a minimum-effort translation to incite outrage for the sake of a few pennies of advertising revenue and will not accomplish much in the way of anything tangible, but then again, that's what ANN and most of their writers are known for. In fact, that particular author is one of the key architects in another controversy that saw a voice actor land in hot water over non-existent allegations. I'm not arguing for or against what you're saying per se, but if you want to make a case worth considering, bring primary sources and review articles from a reputable source, like a journal.
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Old 2022-04-16, 18:01   Link #63
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I shouldn't need to explain the real life context of female objectivation based on exaggerated physical traits that makes Free etc very different from Tawara etc. Ignoring the purpose, associations and associated trashy fanservice anime of the illustration is disingenuous.
Of course that explanations are needed, if not, they are just accusations based on personal beliefs. Do you mean to say that people who don't problematize the image and just see an ad of a pretty schoolgirl are wrong?

Why exactly?

the image does not make reference to the content of the manga and much less emphasizes the physical characteristics of the protagonist that characterize the fanservise.

Quote:
Anime News Network, "objective", "sensible" and "noteworthy" in the same sentence is probably the finest joke I've heard all year. That particular site specialises in sensationalism of irrelevant and trite matters. They said nothing informative in that article; it's a minimum-effort attempt to incite outrage for the sake of a few pennies of advertising revenue and will not accomplish much in the way of anything tangible, but then again, that's what ANN and most of their writers are known for. I'm not aruing for or against what you're saying per se, but if you want to make a case worth considering, bring primary sources and review articles from a reputable source, like a journal.
The demand for the manga has increased on amazon and bookwalker is the most searched free title. I don't know what the paper will do in the future, but the series is now nationally known.
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Old 2022-04-16, 18:11   Link #64
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Originally Posted by LG-MAX 2.o View Post
The demand for the manga has increased on amazon and bookwalker is the most searched free title. I don't know what the paper will do in the future, but the series is now nationally known.
In other words, the Streisand Effect has kicked in. I think at some point, ANN is going to need to staff themselves with people who can actually think, because if their objective is to shut down things they personally object to, writing angry articles about it and amplifying exposure will only backfire. They could, alternatively, take a leaf from our pages and simply, you know, not get outraged at things?
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Old 2022-04-16, 18:28   Link #65
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Originally Posted by Infinite Zenith View Post
In other words, the Streisand Effect has kicked in. I think at some point, ANN is going to need to staff themselves with people who can actually think, because if their objective is to shut down things they personally object to, writing angry articles about it and amplifying exposure will only backfire. They could, alternatively, take a leaf from our pages and simply, you know, not get outraged at things?
A curiosity that ANN didn't mention is that there was a survey with 100 female high school students and 80% didn't see anything wrong with the ad.
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Old 2022-04-16, 18:32   Link #66
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It's a classic tactic, of course. Only mention one side and make it seem like the world agrees with them.
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Old 2022-04-19, 08:29   Link #67
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Originally Posted by Infinite Zenith View Post
It's a classic tactic, of course. Only mention one side and make it seem like the world agrees with them.
https://news.biglobe.ne.jp/trend/041...631586428.html

Here it says that several sites "coincidentally" put the first volume of the series for free.
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Old 2022-04-19, 10:11   Link #68
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Originally Posted by LG-MAX 2.o View Post
Interestingly, ads in which real men appear half-naked or characters from teen series like Free are very well accepted by the community.
To be fair, I remember Free has a lot of criticism from male audience. When the first trailer was release, many men complained that Kyoani realize that kind of series.

That said, men don't care about the sexualization of male bodies so much. However, they care and have complained a lot about fanservice suits that "threaten" masculinity and have gotten these censored:

Spoiler for Image:
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Old 2022-04-19, 15:25   Link #69
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If this is the incident where UN ladies from New York, a shithole nowadays, complained about tawawa on an newspaper ad, make note that most Japanese are in objection against it. This is a clear overreach of American sensibilities and tbe UN, an organization that is no stranger to rape and pedophilia cases, has no right to force nor protest the freedom of expression. Americans have lost touch with their freedoms honestly like how free speech was eroded. Free speech, which they state isnt free from consequences, is protected from consequences via freedom of expression but they will never mention this fact.
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Old 2022-04-19, 16:36   Link #70
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Originally Posted by BladeMancer View Post
Americans have lost touch with their freedoms honestly like how free speech was eroded. Free speech, which they state isnt free from consequences, is protected from consequences via freedom of expression but they will never mention this fact.
Well... no, this is not true. If you're referring to the United States' First Amendment, it only prevents free speech from consequences by the government, provided you aren't doing any real harm (slander, libel, etc).
No matter where you are, no speech is without consequence.
For example, if you are rude on these forums and get suspended or banned, the First Amendment will not protect you, and it is perfectly within the right of the private entity to ban you for breaking their rules.
On the other hand, private publications are also free to censor themselves

You are right that it is an overreach, but this is because
1) this is a Japanese publication and therefore U.S. laws do not apply, and
2.) the government is not involved in trying to censor this, so any laws regarding "free speech" are not relevant here anyway.
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Old 2022-04-19, 17:14   Link #71
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Originally Posted by Konja9 View Post
To be fair, I remember Free has a lot of criticism from male audience. When the first trailer was release, many men complained that Kyoani realize that kind of series.

That said, men don't care about the sexualization of male bodies so much. However, they care and have complained a lot about fanservice suits that "threaten" masculinity and have gotten these censored:

Spoiler for Image:
thanks for info

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Old 2022-04-19, 20:04   Link #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BladeMancer View Post
If this is the incident where UN ladies from New York, a shithole nowadays, complained about tawawa on an newspaper ad, make note that most Japanese are in objection against it. This is a clear overreach of American sensibilities and tbe UN, an organization that is no stranger to rape and pedophilia cases, has no right to force nor protest the freedom of expression. Americans have lost touch with their freedoms honestly like how free speech was eroded. Free speech, which they state isnt free from consequences, is protected from consequences via freedom of expression but they will never mention this fact.
I read about this incident and it's "a bit of column A, a bit of column B" situation. On one hand, I fully agree that this is something completely for the Japanese and aimed at the Japanese, and the Americans just want everyone to know their opinion because Americans are loudmouths.

On the other hand, the ad was in the Nikkei (I think that's the name of the paper?), and I understand that the Nikkei, because it's an international paper, is supposed to conform to certain standards (for better or worse), and this particular ad doesn't appear to conform to those standards.

In Japan fo course, no one even so much as gives the ad a second glance. But because Americans still have a strong strand of Puritanism running in the culture (that's a topic for a different thread), of course they freaked out.
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Old 2022-04-19, 22:53   Link #73
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Ai's not even dressed inappropriately or acting provocative in the image.
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Old 2022-04-20, 08:50   Link #74
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She's a well-endowed high school girl; that's more than enough to set off a bunch of people as "She's promoting an unrealistic standard of beauty, so clearly it's a sexualization!"

Not the first time something like this has happened; check out the history of the American doll Barbie...
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Old 2022-04-20, 11:20   Link #75
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Originally Posted by Magin View Post
She's a well-endowed high school girl; that's more than enough to set off a bunch of people as "She's promoting an unrealistic standard of beauty, so clearly it's a sexualization!"

Not the first time something like this has happened; check out the history of the American doll Barbie...
That's not really something you can tell by the ad. Her chest is obscured by her arm.

If it was something that was usually shown on Twitter or in the manga, then that's understandable, but this one was drawn purposely to be conservative so that it's presentable to the general audience.
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Old 2022-04-20, 17:23   Link #76
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A Japanese politician became famous on twitter because buying tawawa on monday volumes.

https://twitter.com/fujisue/status/1516624068946317312

And there was also a large scale survey of over 3,000 people and the result was that 80% saw nothing wrong with the ad.

https://twitter.com/1chan_nobit/stat...90708669476865
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Old 2022-04-20, 19:22   Link #77
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And there was also a large scale survey of over 3,000 people and the result was that 80% saw nothing wrong with the ad.
Here's the original survey The guy on Twitter was nice enough to link back to that article, and this is exactly the sort of hard evidence I've been looking for. I'm satisfied that the ad is not an issue for most, with only a limited few making a mountain out of a molehill.
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Old 2022-04-21, 06:36   Link #78
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Glad to see this controversy isn't negatively impacting the series, at least for now.
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