2008-12-26, 20:34 | Link #163 | |
Shameless Fangirl
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Germany
Age: 33
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*nods her head* And before someone asks... no, that's not an excuse. But one of the reasons why I completely agree with Lelouch on this.
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2008-12-26, 21:17 | Link #164 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
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So that somehow excuses the whole genocide thing? Quote:
I mean she's not Hitler but if your idea of a good person is "not Hitler" than you have a low expectations. |
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2008-12-27, 16:02 | Link #169 | ||
Shameless Fangirl
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Germany
Age: 33
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And even if that was true... it's not about why she started to see the error of her ways. To me - and probably also to Lelouch - it only matters that she eventually did. As always, I I really don't see the point in killing someone who changed and might even have become a better person than most just because of their past sins. Quote:
Did I ever compare any of the characters to Hitler or claim that Nina was a "good person"? I only now mentioned that she might have become a better person than most by the end of the series, but everything else is your interpretation, at best.
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2008-12-27, 17:14 | Link #170 | |
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2008-12-27, 20:15 | Link #173 | |
Shameless Fangirl
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Germany
Age: 33
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But yes, I would give the same "free pass" to Nina and... errr... an average Britannian civilian. Why not?
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2008-12-27, 20:32 | Link #174 | |
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Some things are still absolute, no matter how you bend them. You can't point to Nina and say she is the same as an average Britania civilian. The fact she comprehended the shit she did, is for her own sake and for her own redemption. This does not apply to the environment around her. The whole Lelouch-said-Nina-good scene, does not make Nina someone that is ok with a free pass paper. Lelouch just CAN'T judge people, he has not right, when he has committed same and worse crimes. This was more of a moment of him acknowledging her help and getting past her hatred for him to co-operate with him for a greater "good" if you can call it like this. //which pretty much she started but let's not go there as well. |
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2008-12-27, 20:58 | Link #175 | ||||||
Shameless Fangirl
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Germany
Age: 33
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But everything else is a matter of opinion. Quote:
As I see it, the fact that Nina lived in the end and her scene with Lelouch support my interpretation - and that's what I was talking about when I brought up Lelouch's opinion of her. I, personally, have no problem disageeing with Lelouch if I feel that he's wrong about something. By the end of the anime, however, I only disagreed with the notion that he deserved punishment. Quote:
But that doesn't necessarily make his views wrong. Quote:
To me, it seemed pretty clear that Lelouch liked and even respected the person Nina had become, and that he deemed everyone "worth saving". And that is definitely a part of the philosophy of Code Geass for me.
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2008-12-27, 21:11 | Link #176 | |||
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Of course the people that got in the mess of her own stupid actions are the one that should "judge" her first. But for the life of me, beats me who anyone else would see this as a "meh, ok" action. Quote:
Eh? You think the philosophy of Geass is that everyone should get a free pass in the end because he is so called of "worth-saving"? |
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2008-12-27, 21:32 | Link #177 | ||||
Shameless Fangirl
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Germany
Age: 33
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I said I would give them the same "free pass". But maybe I should have asked you how you define "free pass" first. What I basically meant is that I don't see any need for punishment where it wouldn't do any good. Quote:
Or at least, that's how I see it. Quote:
I'm only saying that if one wants to punish Nina for the Fleya incident, they would need to do it before it actually happened - because after that, Nina realized that she had done something horrible, and she probably couldn't have felt any worse about it. In my opinion, punishing her simply wouldn't have served any purpose. Quote:
I think that the philosophy of Code Geass is that everyone is striving for happiness - that all people are grey and that, given the right circumstances, they might change completely... be it for the better or the worse. After that, they might be better off dead, need someone to give them a push in the right direction, or a "free pass" - depending on what they have become and why (and how likely it is that it will be permanent).
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2008-12-27, 21:44 | Link #178 | |
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All people are "grey'? Please, stop with this "grey" line. It is true that sometimes people do not actually want to cause bad things, but they do. And for this, there needs to be punishment. If one does not feel the need to get "punished", in whatever that form is, then he is amoral. Redemption and remorse, only comes when you realize that you have to be punished. Otherwise, it is all preach. And not everyone strive for happiness in Geass. For example, the main chara, strive for destroying something in the beginning, while the antagonist strive for a death to get him out of his burden. And the list goes on and on. |
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2008-12-27, 21:51 | Link #179 | ||||
No Eyes
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Dirac Sea
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If you give her a free pass, then you have to give everyone a free pass. You cannot excuse her by the idea that "she learned her lesson". You don't know if she did. You'd also have to give everyone else who "learned their lesson" a free pass, but how can you fairly judge such an abstract concept. Quote:
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Nina is more arguable, but she still deserves punishment for her actions. They cannot, or more should not, just be forgiven. That opens up a pandora's box for the world of law. And in reality, she did not learn anything. She never showed that she got past her hatred for the Japanese. She never showed that she moved past her fixation on the dead. |
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2008-12-27, 22:26 | Link #180 |
A l i c e
Graphic Designer
Join Date: Nov 2008
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Wrong. He wanted a peaceful world for Nunnally. He wanted to live happily with her without the fear they will be used again. And to do that, he had to destroy something. He didn't strive to destroy for no reason. If destroying Britannia wasn't needed at the beginning, he wouldn't have done that. Your just putting it into simpler, more basic terms that are also vague.
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