2010-06-22, 14:23 | Link #11421 | ||
Homo Ludens
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Canada
Age: 34
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Many of the characters have temporarily narrated the story at least once already. |
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2010-06-22, 14:41 | Link #11422 |
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
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I actually thought that was the culprit narrating in episode 5 since he was basically laughing at Natsuhi and the readers. It totally broke the fourth wall. But i think episode 5 was mostly third person and not first person anyway.
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2010-06-22, 14:48 | Link #11423 | |
Back off, I'm a scientist
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
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Let me try to put it into a more practical example. Let's say that I am... say, George, for the sake of this argument. I am not present during the Virgilia/Beatrice battle. I may still be narrating it, but I never saw it. But while the pronoun "I" in this scene may refer to George, the point of view used is actually not that of George. It's that of Maria. But Maria has not been present during this battle either, she never saw it! Yet the point of view is hers. This is what Maria would remember if she did see it, and wanted to tell of what happened to someone she liked, years later, when time would wash holes in the memory and she would gleefully fill them with fantasy to make it more awesome. The core idea in this interpretational theory is that Gamemaster actually is not allowed to lie to anyone. They can't convey a knowing lie either, because they simply don't have one at their disposal. But if someone is mistaken, deluded, wishes to see the scene in a different way, leaves holes over the things they don't want to see and fills them with imagination, Gamemaster is allowed to use that, and not someone's factual point of view. Gamemaster in this interpretation is not the author, they're an editor. Let's call it an Editor Theory. It's like a multitrack narrative exists, seen from all possible points of view at once, and some of these points of view are highly unorthodox and non-factual, and the Gamemaster jumps between the tracks as they see fit. Like you have eighteen music tapes running in parallel, each of which is playing it's own melody, and someone is trying to play a new melody by switching which tape gets to play to your headphones at any given point, feeding them through delay loops, and otherwise cutting and pasting - but not actually being capable of making a melody from scratch.
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2010-06-22, 16:30 | Link #11425 | ||
Back off, I'm a scientist
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
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If it's Maria's point of view, magic will be visible and Beatrice will inspire awe. She is probably not the only character who actually sees it that way, though! If it's Shannon's point of view, George will probably be a hero in a subtle, but very effective way. If it's Kyrie's point of view, Rudolf probably gets to shine. If it's Natsuhi's point of view, things that would dishonour the Ushiromiya family will be conspicuously missing even when they should be present, she doesn't want to see them, and sexual innuendo won't be present either, she runs from it. And someone on the board wants Erika to exist so much that they imagine her being there when she isn't, a magical detective to solve all mysteries. If any discernible cues actually exist to find the point of switching, it is possible to find out whom most of the points of view initially belonged to, and determine which of these people are sufficiently detached from reality to be called lying to themselves. Once we know which is true, which is a delusion, and which is imagination that someone forgot to turn off. And there's always a reason to pick a particular point of view to show a scene from. That reason is itself what the Gamemaster-Beatrice wants Battler to understand but cannot express in words, and it probably encodes what she really wants from him. No, it's not really believing in magic and witches.
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2010-06-22, 16:33 | Link #11426 | |||||
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
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Nanjo and Maria both mention "talismans" when talking about magic circles. Quote:
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2010-06-22, 16:39 | Link #11427 | |
Homo Ludens
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Canada
Age: 34
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Huh, okay. So you're saying we should look for fake scenes that are internally consistent with one another, and try to figure out whose POV is being used in those scenes?
That's interesting. Could make a fine game out of that, one could. I'll be on the lookout whenever I get back to reading Ep2. Quote:
How is that heroic? What, "Birth of a New Witch"? That's song's been around from long before Ep6 was written. |
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2010-06-22, 16:46 | Link #11430 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Meta-Meta-Meta-Space
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No, usan no kaori (胡散の香り) literally means 'scent of suspicion.' Technically 'suspiciousness' or 'suspicious person.'
Interestingly enough, people call JIMANG, 胡散臭い (Stinks of suspicion) ... although I think he was chosen to sing the ED song because he's in Sound Horizon and their past cooperation... but still.. that's one suspicious coincidence. 8) The 07151129 sung in German that you heard was the new Beatrice version of Usan no Kaori; the one she sings. (As opposed to the old Battler version someone sang on nicovideo a long time ago... heh.) ... as far as I know the Beatrice version was played in EP6 too, right? I can't quite remember... EDIT: Birth of a New Witch is the ED6 song.. I thought it has been around for awhile.. but this is the new R&B voiced version... |
2010-06-22, 16:58 | Link #11434 |
Senior Member
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The fourth Thursday of a month can never be after the 28th. (IIRC, for a while the US Thanksgiving was defined as the last Thursday in November, but FDR changed it.)
And other countries have a Thanksgiving with on a different date. Canadian Thanksgiving is in October, IIRC.
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2010-06-22, 17:05 | Link #11436 | ||
Back off, I'm a scientist
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
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Mind you, it could all very well be a bunch of nonsense, but it doesn't hurt to try since nothing else is getting us much closer anyway. Quote:
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2010-06-22, 17:19 | Link #11437 | |
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
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EDIT: or maybe they just think he'd be romantic in a passionate and possessive way? EDIT2: Wait those scenes like the magic Battle and that scene with George and Gaap are in third person a lot of the time though. Why would the game master use somebody else's perspective and write it in third person? The only thing I can think of is that they're trying to hide whose perspective it is.
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2010-06-22, 17:42 | Link #11438 | ||
Back off, I'm a scientist
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
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My current guess is Rosa, though it's not settled, because this would imply Rosa sees reality much like Maria, which probably can't be true. Quote:
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2010-06-22, 17:48 | Link #11439 |
Ace Detective
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: MIA
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Well, in regards to George, his fantasy self IS a jerk. In episode 6, he talks about not caring about killing the characters as they are "only pieces." This is where I became a huge Jessica fan, as Jessica is the only one who simply can't kill innocent people for selfish reasons. It says that even though they were pieces, Jessica felt that they should live.
Of course Rog Limitation kicks in and Jessica enjoys some delicious Kentucky Fried Kyrie, but that's beside the point. When human pieces are shown to be human in fantasy scenes, George comes off as quite the jerk. Kanon and Shannon are also willing to kill while completely human. I just found it so griping that out of all the pieces, Jessica was the one who was fetterred and could not, as a human, bring herself to kill a strange, while George killed his mother, Kanon Rosa, and Shannon Maria and Saku. So, I'm much more open to the idea of George as a major accomplice due to his fantasy scenes. Of course, there is the reality of Jessica's lying habit, and close relationship(s?) with the most suspicious characters in the game. But perhaps I've digressed. I feel like the fantasy scenes at least have consistent characterization, unless of course it's shown that a particular character is possessed or something similar. |
2010-06-22, 17:55 | Link #11440 | |
Mystery buff
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
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I haven't really been paying much attention to music cues.
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Last edited by Judoh; 2010-06-22 at 18:06. |
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