Character Discussion - Shirley

[Nobodyman9]

Originally Posted by Kid Ying

And i think the timeskip was great for Shirley, sort of. Thanks to it, now we knows that even after a geass, she still would love Lelouch, i think that's quite something. But it's awful for Shirlulu, he spend a year with the girl and never did anything? C'MON.

I always loved that aspect about here. About how she keeps falling in love with Lelouch now matter how many times she forgets him or is "reborn". To me, well, that's just gotta mean something.

And hey, c'mon, a year? So what? Rome wasn't built in a day. Shirley herself had to start over from scratch, and we all know Lelouch is the more resistant one. Hmm, I wonder would've happened if Lelouch continued his life like that after Charles geassed him. It was actually probably the best chance at a normal life he had in the show.

Originally Posted by morbosfist

They probably disposed of it while checking for evidence of Nunnally.

Yeah probably. Plus, you know, it's a letter. Stuff like that can get lost fairly easily. Kinda stinks that they never did more with it though. Now that I think about, I can't help but think they were planning to do more with it in R2.

[Kid Ying]

The main problem is that Lelouch can be a slippering one, but when he's Zero, he got an excuse "I can't do this cause world domination comes first", here, he didn't do anything in the whole year, Shirley got all the time in the world(okay, not all, but i assume she didn't take the whole year to fall for him again) to make her move, hehe.

BUT, i know Lelouch is a tough one to break in this department, so i can deal. It just seems wrong to me that she can make more progress in a couple of eps when he got other stuff to do than in a whole year(or t when the only thing he's doing is to take care of a psycho(okay, that's probably a lot of work, hehe).

About the letter, i know it could be lost, but the first time i saw it, it looked like a big cliffhanger (OMG! WTF she's going to do with that letter? Maybe she will remember something and win against the geass?) but it seems like the scene never existed in R2, since she never mention about. Even when she regain her memories she didn't say something like "ah, i understand that letter now". A shame, but i think it was for good. Who knows what a Shirley that don't care for Lelouch could have did what that...

[Nobodyman9]

Originally Posted by Kid Ying

The main problem is that Lelouch can be a slippering one, but when he's Zero, he got an excuse "I can't do this cause world domination comes first", here, he didn't do anything in the whole year, Shirley got all the time in the world(okay, not all, but i assume she didn't take the whole year to fall for him again) to make her move, hehe.

BUT, i know Lelouch is a tough one to break in this department, so i can deal. It just seems wrong to me that she can make more progress in a couple of eps when he got other stuff to do than in a whole year when the only thing he's doing is to take care of a psycho(okay, that's probably a lot of work, hehe).

Hey, don't forget that with Shirley it wasn't really love at first sight. At first she was very disapproving of his behavior (gambling) but it wasn't until the traffic incident that she started to love him, and it was around Turn 3 that I think she tried to make her first move on him. Also, despite not having a world to save, as you said, Lelouch is just a really hard nut to crack in this department. I think a lot of it is in his personality, and he's not going to just hastily jump into a relationship. He's a man that needs time and needs space

Of course, the real truth is that we don't know what went on exactly during that year. Although, I guess it would've been pretty interesting if Lelouch and Shirley were really in a romantic relationship at the start of R2 that could've caused some problems.

[Cosmic Eagle]

Originally Posted by Nobodyman9

Hey, don't forget that with Shirley it wasn't really love at first sight. At first she was very disapproving of his behavior (gambling) but it wasn't until the traffic incident that she started to love him, and it was around Turn 3 that I think she tried to make her first move on him. Also, despite not having a world to save, as you said, Lelouch is just a really hard nut to crack in this department. I think a lot of it is in his personality, and he's not going to just hastily jump into a relationship. He's a man that needs time and needs space

Of course, the real truth is that we don't know what went on exactly during that year. Although, I guess it would've been pretty interesting if Lelouch and Shirley were really in a romantic relationship at the start of R2 that could've caused some problems.

And did such a simple incident make a lasting impression or what? To the point that with no memory of Lelouch whatsoever and being held hostage along with the rest of the school by the BK, she still fell for him again.

[Rising Dragon]

I'd just like to correct you guys that she didn't fall in love with him because of that incident in traffic--though it was a start. As she said, that's when her interest in him was piqued, and as Suzaku pointed out, it evolved from there into love.

[Nobodyman9]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

I'd just like to correct you guys that she didn't fall in love with him because of that incident in traffic--though it was a start. As she said, that's when her interest in him was piqued, and as Suzaku pointed out, it evolved from there into love.

Well, that's pretty much what I said, she "started" to fall in love with him. Maybe I should've phrased it better But at any rate, this was the point at which Shirley and Lelouch's "just friends" situation was put into question and Shirley began to develop feelings for him. Of course we don't know when the "pique of interest" started during the 1-year hiatus, but I'm willing to bet that it wasn't immediate, and probably, again, took some time for Shirley to develop her feelings. Unless of course, as Cosmic Eagle said, her feelings were so strong that they prevailed even with the Geass affecting (not that that wouldn't be awesome )

BTW, when did Suzaku say that?

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by Nobodyman9

Well, that's pretty much what I said, she "started" to fall in love with him. Maybe I should've phrased it better But at any rate, this was the point at which Shirley and Lelouch's "just friends" situation was put into question and Shirley began to develop feelings for him. Of course we don't know when the "pique of interest" started during the 1-year hiatus, but I'm willing to bet that it wasn't immediate, and probably, again, took some time for Shirley to develop her feelings. Unless of course, as Cosmic Eagle said, her feelings were so strong that they prevailed even with the Geass affecting (not that that wouldn't be awesome )

BTW, when did Suzaku say that?

Uh, the episode we found about Shirley's reasons for her crush. I don't remember the exact episode number.

[Levy]

mh, Nobody, now that you mention that, it would have been much more of a cruel thing to Shirlulu fans, but quite interesting plot-wise, if Shirley and Lulu were shown as some sort of couple at the beginning of R2 and split apart when he regained his memory as Zero. Cruel, yet a good measure of the price you pay for getting carried away with superhuman powers and the desire of revolutioning te world....

...uhm....

[Cosmic Eagle]

Originally Posted by Nobodyman9

Well, that's pretty much what I said, she "started" to fall in love with him. Maybe I should've phrased it better But at any rate, this was the point at which Shirley and Lelouch's "just friends" situation was put into question and Shirley began to develop feelings for him. Of course we don't know when the "pique of interest" started during the 1-year hiatus, but I'm willing to bet that it wasn't immediate, and probably, again, took some time for Shirley to develop her feelings. Unless of course, as Cosmic Eagle said, her feelings were so strong that they prevailed even with the Geass affecting (not that that wouldn't be awesome )

BTW, when did Suzaku say that?

Actually, there really could be a case for that. I mean, she has no memories of her time with him and all she knows is that he's Zero (whom every Brittanian knows as a murdering terrorist.) Then he razes the entire city, holds the entire school plus herself hostage and she still falls for him.

[Bonzo]

Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle

Actually, there really could be a case for that. I mean, she has no memories of her time with him and all she knows is that he's Zero (whom every Brittanian knows as a murdering terrorist.) Then he razes the entire city, holds the entire school plus herself hostage and she still falls for him.

Then, in a alternative story, she can become a black knight too, looking the paradox

[Nobodyman9]

Originally Posted by Levy

mh, Nobody, now that you mention that, it would have been much more of a cruel thing to Shirlulu fans, but quite interesting plot-wise, if Shirley and Lulu were shown as some sort of couple at the beginning of R2 and split apart when he regained his memory as Zero. Cruel, yet a good measure of the price you pay for getting carried away with superhuman powers and the desire of revolutioning te world....

...uhm....

Well, I guess Lelouch would have to continue working on his rebellion while also dating Shirley But you're right, that would be a very interesting plot development. Maybe he would even let her in on it if the two grew close enough. Sounds pretty fanfic worthy.

Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle

Actually, there really could be a case for that. I mean, she has no memories of her time with him and all she knows is that he's Zero (whom every Brittanian knows as a murdering terrorist.) Then he razes the entire city, holds the entire school plus herself hostage and she still falls for him.

Ha ha, indeed. I think if here memories were kept, that is, if she wasn't geassed by Charles, she would probably confront Lelouch about it a lot sooner in R2. Unfortunately, if it was always the staff's plan to kill her, that might result in her death coming sooner. Again, fanfic worthy.

Originally Posted by Bonzo

Then, in a alternative story, she can become a black knight too, looking the paradox

Yeah yeah, we've all contemplated the idea of her being a Black Knight. Not that the idea wouldn't be awesome, but realistically I don't see it happening. BTW, when is that other Shirley pic of yours going to be done?

Anyway, I have a question for you all. What do you all think happened to Shirley's mother after her death? I mean, this is a very unfortunate woman, and quite possibly the only person I pity more than Shirley herself. Of course we don't know, and we'll never know what happened to her for sure, so it's just speculation.

[incorrupts]

Originally Posted by Nobodyman9

Anyway, I have a question for you all. What do you all think happened to Shirley's mother after her death? I mean, this is a very unfortunate woman, and quite possibly the only person I pity more than Shirley herself. Of course we don't know, and we'll never know what happened to her for sure, so it's just speculation.

Ah, you gotta feel for her, honest. :x
Well, i suppose she would just "exist", to remember her lost husband and her daughter. Not even living.

[Nobodyman9]

Originally Posted by incorrupts

Ah, you gotta feel for her, honest. :x
Well, i suppose she would just "exist", to remember her lost husband and her daughter. Not even living.

Yes indeed *sigh*

Well, personally I'm not committed to any one idea (since it's just speculation), but I've considered the possibility that she could've died of grief or committed suicide. And then I've gone to the other end considering the possibility that she could've remarried and regained some semblance of happiness.

[Bonzo]

Don't worry nobodyman, I never forget my promises, just is a little slow this time, I must build three comics in the same time, however, in one of these, shirley is present.

[Kid Ying]

Well, to lose her husband and daughter in a little more than one year is... Hard. I think she died of grief or is just living to wait for her end. It's really hard to move on when something like that happen.

It's a shame.

[Nobodyman9]

Originally Posted by Bonzo

Don't worry nobodyman, I never forget my promises, just is a little slow this time, I must build three comics in the same time, however, in one of these, shirley is present.

Ah, good to know. Don't worry, I know how busy you are, and really I can't thank you enough for giving us such awesome comics I'll be patient.

Originally Posted by Kid Ying

Well, to lose her husband and daughter in a little more than one year is... Hard. I think she died of grief or is just living to wait for her end. It's really hard to move on when something like that happen.

It's a shame.

Yep. I think she's a character who got one of, if not the, worst and most undeserved endings of any of the characters. Then again, I guess we don't know much about. Hmm, perhaps we should move on to a more pleasant topic, so...

Hmmmmmmmm............Dangit, we gotta keep this thread going people. We need a good topic. Something debatable that could spark some difference of opinion.

All right, I have an idea. What do you all think of the kiss at the end of Stage 12? Do you think that Shirley was just using Lelouch for emotional support and to steal a kiss from him, or do you think it was just a very difficult time for her and she just reached out to him because she didn't know what else to do? Well, I am looking through orange-tinted glasses, so I am more inclined to go with the latter.

[Kid Ying]

You don't even need to state your opinion, it's obvious, hehe, and i agree with you and not with Mao. C'mon, the girl was destroyed there and kissed Lelouch in a moment of desperation. Shirley didn't know what else she could do. It's not like she really used her father's death to personal gain.

In fact, this scene is sad as hell. Even with the kiss, i can't consider it even a least bit romantic.

The main problem with that matter is that no one will say that Mao was right. And if someone say it, well, it's a bad person.

[Nobodyman9]

Originally Posted by Kid Ying

You don't even need to state your opinion, it's obvious, hehe, and i agree with you and not with Mao. C'mon, the girl was destroyed there and kissed Lelouch in a moment of desperation. Shirley didn't know what else she could do. It's not like she really used her father's death to personal gain.

Ha ha, well I seem to recall that there actually was a debate about this some time ago and people were actually arguing for the "manipulation" idea (absurd :P). I was just wondering where everyone stood now.

In fact, this scene is sad as hell. Even with the kiss, i can't consider it even a least bit romantic.

I can totally understand what you mean. Tragedy and sadness definitely was the dominant theme during this scene, but still a kiss is a kiss. There's a reason Shirley kissed him rather than just cry on his shoulder.

[Kid Ying]

Yeah, it's not like i'm trying to diminish the kiss, but it's just one of the saddest scenes in the series. Goddamit, when Shirley appears totally soaked and crying is so sad that can bring tears to the eyes of the most heartless person.

I think this scene is worse than her death, because when she dies, at least she's is happy, because she's dying with the man she loves at her side, here, everyone is sad and will have to live with it, cause Lelouch still is the man that killed her father and she still have to deal with the fact that will never see him again.

[Nobodyman9]

Originally Posted by Kid Ying

Yeah, it's not like i'm trying to diminish the kiss, but it's just one of the saddest scenes in the series. Goddamit, when Shirley appears totally soaked and crying is so sad that can bring tears to the eyes of the most heartless person.

I think this scene is worse than her death, because when she dies, at least she's is happy, because she's dying with the man she loves at her side, here, everyone is sad and will have to live with it, cause Lelouch still is the man that killed her father and she still have to deal with the fact that will never see him again.

Well, I definitely don't disagree with you on that first part.

As for the second part, I assume when you say "never see him again" that "him" refers to her father. But anyway, I have to admit it is a tough call between this scene and her death (not to mention the end of Stage 14) But I think her death scene is really sad because, although she's happy and right by Lelouch, she's still dying and will never be able to live a happy life with Lelouch. Not to mention everyone else will be sad about her death including us, the fans, who have lost a great character.