Lucky Star (Generic Discussion thread)

[Anh_Minh]

Yes, and they want to see you take it up the butt. That`s what I learned from Genshiken.

[KitsuneNineTails]

Originally Posted by aorta

Interesting article about this:

http://www.jref.com/nikkeiview/jap.shtml

I have to agree here (and I'm guessing that my fellow Boulder-ite didn't mean anything racist by it, although people in this city are usually over-the-top PC, so it was unusual to see a word like that from someone who lives here)... It's the same all around for all the racial epithets. They mean things to different people and generations. Like "WOP". For me it doesn't mean hardly anything because I'm third generation Italian-American and I didn't live in New York during the 40's where racism against (and between) the Irish and Italians was rampant. My dad, though... He'd also plant faces in pavement if you said that to him...

True, words only have the meaning we give them, and I think saying a racial word in ignorance is to be forgiven (after a polite reminder of how the word IS a racial slur), but to knowingly use a racist word, even without the venom behind it is disrespectful, IMHO. I really am amused when someone says "no disrespect to XXX, but <disrespectful language here>" or "not to be racist but <racist words here>". It's like they are actively acknowledging that they are about to be racist, but try to fool us into believing they're not? Heh.

Anyways - On topic...

I really love this series exactly because of that self-deprecating humor. Kona-chan's Asperger's-esque "social etiquette" (or lack thereof, which is not too uncommon in the geek/nerd/otaku community), Kagami's exasperation with said "etiquette" (which I see quite often with my friend's SOs when we used to talk about World of Warcraft all the time), and the over-the-top obviously unrealistic moe and Kona-chan's real-time comments on how life isn't at all like manga/anime is all just too poignantly true yet too tongue in cheek to think that it's meant to be insulting . But, yeah I can see how some people who take themselves way too seriously can be pretty put off by the show.

I also love the show because it's a nice intro into some parts of everyday Japanese life and watching how different the Japanese vs. American lifestyle is really informative (and seeing the not-insignificant similarities is very cool as well ). To all the people that posted on the "references" thread, you ROCK! To someone who's seen a few anime and knows just a little about Japanese culture, getting those guides and walkthroughs to all the references was awesome (AVPlaya gets the gold medal for the tome o' knowledge in those posts! ). I feel like I learned as much about Japanese culture watching this show and reading the forums as I did in my classes and reading books!

BTW - What's the deal with the word "gaijin". I know it is sometimes used in a derogatory fashion but it also seems to be a self-deprecating "badge of honor" among some people too (kinda like "otaku" or "nerd", etc.). Am I understanding the situation correctly? Is using it in a self-deprecating way an advisable practice?

Ciao!

[Kagami~n]

Using a racist word in ignorance should be pointed out and corrected by those who aren't ignorant, or else no lessons will be learned and someone's face will wind up in the pavement.

Originally Posted by KitsuneNineTails

I really am amused when someone says "no disrespect to XXX, but <disrespectful language here>" or "not to be racist but <racist words here>". It's like they are actively acknowledging that they are about to be racist, but try to fool us into believing they're not? Heh.

That is SO TRUE, and I see it all the time on the internet. It's like saying that you don't mean to be racist right before acting like a racist jerkbag makes everything a-ok. e_e Reality, people.

On topic, you're really passionate about the show! That's cool. I love it for all the same reasons. I've also learned a lot about daily Japanese life and culture from researching things I've seen in this show. In some cases like you said, more than I did in school.

I can't help you with the whole gaijin thing, but I usually prefer not to use self-deprecating terms. If the terms were meant to insult me, I'd rather not humor them. I've seen gaijin used in humorous ways by Westerners (ie GAIJIN SMASH!), but I don't think I'd use it on myself if I traveled. Likewise I wouldn't use the word f*g to describe myself, despite being of deviant sexuality...

[KitsuneNineTails]

Originally Posted by Kagami~n

On topic, you're really passionate about the show! That's cool. I love it for all the same reasons. I've also learned a lot about daily Japanese life and culture from researching things I've seen in this show. In some cases like you said, more than I did in school.

Heh, this should be required viewing in class, I say! Distribute that wonderful stickied thread with all the references along with the raw episode to the students and assign it as homework. That'd be the fun way to learn a new language/culture, lol!

As an aside, I've actually really gotten passionate about a lot of anime series within the past couple of years. I only watched shows here and there in and after college, but recently I've just been completely drawn in. I have to admit that anime was a big part of why I started learning Japanese and really becoming interested in general Japanese history/culture a couple years back . I guess it's because the stories are so well done and the characters so well thought out, and the little details are always so down pat (L*S being a great example). That and the overabundance of cuteness (which I'm a sucker for, I'll admit).

Likewise I wouldn't use the word f*g to describe myself, despite being of deviant sexuality...

I wouldn't even go far to say other sexual preferences are "deviant." To me, there's nothing abnormal about people's sexual and/or relationship interests as long as both partners are cognizant of their decision and in agreement. I do love this country, but there are definitely things about this country's culture and society that I dislike a great deal and the big Hoorah about who people can and can't have relationships with is one of them. Heh, I've noticed those who are the most outspoken and intolerant are often the ones trying hardest to convince themselves of something...

On that note, how are bisexuality and homosexuality treated in Japan? I've heard that it used to be considered completely within norms, especially for the warrior classes but that Westernization and the slow (albeit small) rise of western religions affected that to some extent. I wonder what the current culture's views are on this topic (or are we getting too off topic with that? ).

Ciao!

[Kagami~n]

Originally Posted by KitsuneNineTails

Heh, this should be required viewing in class, I say! Distribute that wonderful stickied thread with all the references along with the raw episode to the students and assign it as homework. That'd be the fun way to learn a new language/culture, lol!

Unfortunately, anime fans like us are the only ones who'd really show enthusiasm for something like that...lol.

As an aside, I've actually really gotten passionate about a lot of anime series within the past couple of years. I only watched shows here and there in and after college, but recently I've just been completely drawn in. I have to admit that anime was a big part of why I started learning Japanese and really becoming interested in general Japanese history/culture a couple years back . I guess it's because the stories are so well done and the characters so well thought out, and the little details are always so down pat (L*S being a great example). That and the overabundance of cuteness (which I'm a sucker for, I'll admit).

I've been watching anime almost constantly since the end of high school. I was introduced to the slice of life/high school life genre by Azumanga Daioh, and Lucky*Star took it to a new personal level of awesome for me. It is currently my favorite anime. I am also a sucker for cute things ::sigh::, and I like tv shows that are very character-centric, so these kinds of shows really appeal to me. Lucky*Star's constant references and overflowing geekiness are what set it aside for me...that and the interaction between Konata and Kagami.

I agree with your notes on this country's view of homosexuality. While my tastes might be considered "deviant", I live a totally normal life with my partner that consists of none of the oddities often stereotyped.

On that note, how are bisexuality and homosexuality treated in Japan? I've heard that it used to be considered completely within norms, especially for the warrior classes but that Westernization and the slow (albeit small) rise of western religions affected that to some extent. I wonder what the current culture's views are on this topic (or are we getting too off topic with that? ).

We're still doing some fair talk on Lucky*Star, so I hope this isn't too off topic. From what I understand, love between two men was accepted and even seen as superior to man/woman back in the old days, but Western influence has since cast a negative light on it. I don't know what their attitudes were towards female/female, but those of us on that side of the spectrum are often ignored anyway. Although their media appears friendly to homosexuality and will even portray it in a positive light (even with a few of the Lucky*Star girls ), it doesn't really reflect the country's general attitude towards it. Gay marriage is illegal in Japan, and a recent poll I looked at showed that the majority of the population disapproved of it. So they still have some things to fix. At least it's not a sin punishable by death like it still is in some countries...

[Claies]

Originally Posted by KitsuneNineTails

BTW - What's the deal with the word "gaijin". I know it is sometimes used in a derogatory fashion but it also seems to be a self-deprecating "badge of honor" among some people too (kinda like "otaku" or "nerd", etc.). Am I understanding the situation correctly? Is using it in a self-deprecating way an advisable practice?

Ciao!

It seems to enjoy a very unique status. People definitely try not to say that in public anymore, but I'm willing to bet they still do in private, where parents might let it slip in family conversations. It's so ingrained with the language but it's not offensive enough to get blasted too hard for saying it (absolutely not like saying the n-word makes you flinch), so people still use it.

I probably shouldn't bring China into this, but in Cantonese we like to call westerners "gweilo". Charitably, we're playfully calling you "ghosts" in reference to your skin color, but with the proper spin it could have meant "foreign devil." And we throw that around like it's a badge of honor for you guys. My parents almost always end up using it, and I admit I sometimes do, too.

[Lucky_Day]

I am going to Dragon Con this weekend. My handle is Lucky Star, which I have had for years. With this advantage, I will see what I can do to promote the show ... and myself.

[Kagami~n]

Had for years...? Lucky Star hasn't existed for years.

[Vexx]

Well... the phrase "lucky star" predates the anime series by a long time. In fact, I still get Madonna hits at top rather than the anime when I google on the words.

[Strahan]

I noticed something today when watching Lucky Star. During the opening, it shows the four girls from the waist down standing around talking:



Their skirt bottoms are all pretty much even. However, Konata is a bit shorter than the others. Shouldn't hers be lower? My girlfriend said no, because they design them to be even. Even though I should take a woman's opinion on the topic of skirts, lol, that doesn't make sense to me. So what if a girl is -really- short, if they design them to always be even does that mean she won't be able to bend over w/o flashing everyone? Hehe.

The cheerleader part further along in the intro looks more like what I'd expect:



Granted, they're not really standing normally in that scene so ya have to take it with a grain of salt, but even so it's significantly lower there. So.. do they really line up IRL or is the first part just an artist gaffe?

(Yea, I'm that bored lol)

[MidnightViper88]

Perspective

I've just destroyed your boredom with the power of a single word...

"In vein!"

[Gemstar]

I don't think it was on purpose maybe an error in drawing ? I don't think he measured the hieght with a rule when drawing them he just did.

[MidnightViper88]

On top of perspective, it's just an article of clothing...I don't know if there's any significance in differing lengths, other than personal preference, so I also think the artist didn't make any errors, just did it like that so everything wouldn't look exactly the same, or did it on purpose to make a certain character stand out...

Who knows...Reminds me I could use a pair myself...

[Strahan]

Well, I certainly hope it isn't in vein, that sounds painful lol. Foreshortening perspective would certainly explain variance between the front row and the back row in the second pic, but the first one it's fairly obvious they are meant to be standing close together so that doesn't really apply there.

Regarding difference in lengths, it's a school uniform so I'd assume it's a standardized article of clothing. If they are all uniform (yuk-yuk) in length, Konata's should be drawn lower in the group shot as her hips would obviously be lower to the ground since she's shorter.

-yawn- Ahh me and my darned OCD

[Kyuusai]

I imagine that this will end up in the silly questions thread or the Lucky Star generic discussion thread, but to answer the question...

Here are the more rational explanations.
http://www.raki-suta.com/img/res/446.html

[Claude]

This topic reminds me of that episode from Sayonara Zetsubo Sensei where they discuss the fact that people tend to pay more attention to the weird side details than the main idea of things.

[Aoie_Emesai]

The artist got lazy. It like me when I draw a few frills or ruffles, and I know i need to make them artistic, but I do the simply way cause it saves me time.

ps: Plus Lucky Star character designs are confusing. On some parts of the anime, they look very young and much shorter but you can still tell the heigth difference, then you got some that makes them look like the current Clamp style, umm... what was that style called... Match Stick or something like that. What ever, really slim body.

[Ithekro]

One thinks they forgot...and corrected in show as a later date, but never the opening. (or Konata is standing on a box).

[Strahan]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

One thinks they forgot...and corrected in show as a later date, but never the opening. (or Konata is standing on a box).

Hehe, I like that suggestion

[Ryuugu-chan]

Originally Posted by Aoie_Emesai

Plus Lucky Star character designs are confusing. On some parts of the anime, they look very young and much shorter but you can still tell the heigth difference, then you got some that makes them look like the current Clamp style, umm... what was that style called... Match Stick or something like that. What ever, really slim body.

Yea,usually they look young and you can't tell their size. But in part's like the cheerleading part of the opening, they look...Odd. In the beginning part's of the opening they look just fine,but cheerleader outfits on them and they look taller..And creepily slimer sometimes. That's happened a few times in the series..i wonder why LS is a sitcom in their world,so...How can the height difference be?