AnimeSuki Forums

dragon1412 · 2018-08-30, 23:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by wuhugm

^^Kaettekitemo Fantasy!?

Indeed lol~

In this case, I prefer Chinese approach

Unless MC's power is something like transmutation or something

I'm sick of MCs turn Isekai into freaking Japan

CN MC is generally very shallow and amoral though so with a few exceptions i always prefer JP over CN.

The issues i found biggest with Isekai is not memorizing the whole tech, but rather the success rate. In a different world, there is no guarantee the law of physics is the same as our world, similar, might be, but definitely not the same, if magic exist, since new matter and energy source exist outside of our world. Logic dictated why the world grow the way it is. and MC success always in just 1 or 2 times trial is rather weird, i mean, leaving aside stuff like water wheel. Engine and electricity is far more delicate than people think, and they require entire industry to support them with countless calculations beforehand.

Log · 2018-08-30, 23:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by wuhugm

^^Kaettekitemo Fantasy!?

No it's this:

https://www.novelupdates.com/series/...n-the-shadows/

Quote:

Indeed lol~

In this case, I prefer Chinese approach

Unless MC's power is something like transmutation or something

I'm sick of MCs turn Isekai into freaking Japan

In Japanese Isekai they go to western fantasy world. In Chinese Isekai they are already in a world similar to ancient China (with cultivation superpowers being the most obvious difference). Hence there's very little for the MC to change.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garn

Basically while having less Japanese element is better since they are the same points as always but in a kind of European environment (according to them) and with archetype of protagonist that even in a fictional story can not exist, meanwhile the Chinese are in a Chinese world with a protagonist who feels human.

If by "feels human" you mean genocidal, petty, spiteful asshole with rapist tendencies then yea sure. Srsly tho, I can see why people like Chinese MC since they subvert the annoying traits of Japanese MC but they usually go way, way to far the other way.

Garn · 2018-08-31, 00:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Log

If by "feels human" you mean genocidal, petty, spiteful asshole with rapist tendencies then yea sure. Srsly tho, I can see why people like Chinese MC since they subvert the annoying traits of Japanese MC but they usually go way, way to far the other way.

I was going to respond with a lot of text but better exemplified my point of view,since you do not get what I wanted to exemplify.

-This is generalization.

Isekai: Supernatural power everywhere, monsters, beasts, multiple races.

Isekai JP MC: hetare/donkan = still can coexist with others, herbivore, beta, self-sacrifice, without real ambition (always forgotten), does not kill in a world of constant death (although this causes harm later), it doesn't take actions (worsens any future event), model to follow, etc ...

Isekai type CH MC: Kill in a world of constant death, corrupt with power, earthly desires, take action and retaliation in a world without real authority, almost never a role model.

Which one feels more human?

wuhugm · 2018-08-31, 02:46

Xianxia has a problem of endless enemy tho

Chinese MC usually kills any "enemy" who breaths to his general direction
Then a family of the killed one searched for the MC and say things like "You killed our 5th brother, you are the sworn enemy of our family"
Even if MC doesn't kill them, they just find reasons to hate MC
"You embarassed me, I will plot for your downfall"
Then his cousin, his uncle, etc etc will keep trying to kill MC despite the massive losses they have sustained

I read many chinese webtoons based on WN lately and this development is freaking everywhere
MC just make enemies wherever he goes

Quote:

Originally Posted by Log

No it's this:

https://www.novelupdates.com/series/...n-the-shadows/

Ha?

Log · 2018-08-31, 05:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garn

I was going to respond with a lot of text but better exemplified my point of view,since you do not get what I wanted to exemplify.

-This is generalization.

Isekai: Supernatural power everywhere, monsters, beasts, multiple races.

Isekai JP MC: hetare/donkan = still can coexist with others, herbivore, beta, self-sacrifice, without real ambition (always forgotten), does not kill in a world of constant death (although this causes harm later), it doesn't take actions (worsens any future event), model to follow, etc ...

I'm generalizing but you're also doing the same thing with Japanese Isekai MC so........

Quote:

Isekai type CH MC: Kill in a world of constant death, corrupt with power, earthly desires, take action and retaliation in a world without real authority, almost never a role model.

Which one feels more human?

Except, like I said Chinese MCs go to far the other way. Chinese MCs will get provoked over the smallest things (ffs there's plenty of times where a Chinese MC will get pissed that someone stared at him the wrong way), piss off someone far beyond his level of power and get bailed out due to plot, molest, harass or even rape women that the MC barely knows but it doesn't matter because women in Xuanhuan are basically pokemon, once you put your dick in them they're yours forever. That's not someone that's human.

This would be easier to swallow if the narration or story presented the MC with some nuance or consequence to his actions but nope, the MC is the greatest. Girls will fall head over for him because he's the greatest, the narration will bend over backwards to praise him because he's the greatest, any genocide he commits is justified because he's the greatest. As a result the MC won't develop at all and any action he takes will work out in his favor because plot says it's so.

In a way the Japanese Isekai MC and the Chinese Isekai MC are two sides of the same coin. One side takes being good to stupidity and gets away with it, the other side takes being a edgelord to stupidity and gets away with it. This is why neither side is likable and why current successful Xuanhuan and Isekai novels are straying more and more away from these types of MCs and putting more originality and thought into their MCs personality.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wuhugm

Ha?

The post you're responding to was referring to To Be a Power in the Shadows (陰の実力者になりたくて!) getting picked up by Kadokawa. You responded with Kaettekitemo Fantasy!? which isn't the novel the guy you're responded to is talking about.

wuhugm · 2018-08-31, 05:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Log

The post you're responding to was referring to To Be a Power in the Shadows (陰の実力者になりたくて!) getting picked up by Kadokawa. You responded with Kaettekitemo Fantasy!? which isn't the novel the guy you're responded to is talking about.

You don't understand the meaning of ^^

Quote:

Originally Posted by Breimn

^I Came Back but the World is Still a Fantasy!?
Hated by the brother/sister while the mother basically thinks MC was dead since too many years passed so she doesnt belive MC is her son.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wuhugm

^^Kaettekitemo Fantasy!?

Log · 2018-08-31, 05:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by wuhugm

You don't understand the meaning of ^^

:O My bad.

Xellos-_^ · 2018-08-31, 14:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garn

I was going to respond with a lot of text but better exemplified my point of view,since you do not get what I wanted to exemplify.

-This is generalization.

Isekai: Supernatural power everywhere, monsters, beasts, multiple races.

Isekai JP MC: hetare/donkan = still can coexist with others, herbivore, beta, self-sacrifice, without real ambition (always forgotten), does not kill in a world of constant death (although this causes harm later), it doesn't take actions (worsens any future event), model to follow, etc ...

Isekai type CH MC: Kill in a world of constant death, corrupt with power, earthly desires, take action and retaliation in a world without real authority, almost never a role model.

Which one feels more human?

Japanese MC needs to be more assertive and be more self-aware
Chinese MC needs to have more Self-Restrain

sasuke706 · 2018-09-03, 04:23

Random recommendation.

女になった親友の為に、おれは仕方なく成り上がる
Story is three friends in Japan get killed by a meteor (probably with a ton of other people) and reincarnate into a time period seemingly corresponding to ancient Rome, but with magic.
Protagonist is born into a nobody knight family and quickly becomes an orphan at the age of 6, while his two friends also reincarnate but as women.
He himself has no real ambitions outside of wanting to see some yuri-action, but after reuniting with his friends upon joining the army as a nobody infantry, he decides to help them out with their own ongoing problems.

Spoiler for Possibly spoilery, more detailed info:

Protagonist's merits are he's above average at everything from looks to strength, with his magic abilities being minimal at best. Of course in a world where being able to use any magic at all is treasured, it has its uses.
His friends are respectively reborn at a duke's daughter with super strength and a brain only for swords, and the other a knack for magic with a kind of severe corpse appreciation fetish.
Protagonist is a history nerd, however, so he's able to make use of his knowledge to guide his reunited friend to victory in war, where he starts to slowly gain prestige.

Fun part is his friends seem to be battling with their bodies as women, with at least the Duke girl developing a severe thing for our protagonist but struggling to try to convey that his best 'friend' when he doesn't want to come off as 'homo.' The other has also been showing signs so far.
Problem being the protagonist has no interest at all in having sex, calling himself a pro-virgin, him only interested in watching hot women be intimate/he wants to see some goddamn yuri and he wants it bad, wishing he could have reincarnated as a decorative plant. So his goal is to hook his now female friends together so he can enjoy the results, and he's willing to overthrow an empire to make it happen.
The protagonist is actually kind of aware that the duke girl has a thing for him, but he just resolves to make him/her return to the yuri side. That said, he does turn into a relatively shy virgin (hence pro-virgin) when approached by her in the bath and whatnot, so it's not like he has no interest himself, it's just he's extremely into his yuri fetish.
He also does try his best to treat his friends as he did on Earth outside of the yuri fetish.

The protagonist says his looks are average but it's mentioned by a few of the heroines that he's just as handsome as guys the protagonist hates for being 'ikemen' unlike himself.
His magic, aka put one person to sort of sleep a day, is also apparently considered fairly strong. No one else is seen using sleep magic and all.
That said half the characters he uses it on resists it, and he can only cast it once a day with his mana pool.
FYI, strong mages can get pretty crazy but so far mages haven't influenced battles all that much in the long-run.

Protag is not OP but is a strategic genius compared to everyone else. Is fairly strong but basically everyone else in the cast is stronger than him in some way or another.
It's harem, including more heroines than just the two genderbent girls.
No snu-snu, orthodox or yuri otherwise, but you can bet the protag is trying for the yuri side of it.

Anyway, it's a pretty fun story for me.
The characters are quirky, the setting is pretty nice and set roughly around isekai 200 B.C., and it isn't just your generic get-strong isekai. Though it is a very likely a going to be emperor one.
That said the strategy, plot and intrigue is, while there, on the relatively simple side of the spectrum so don't go expecting anything amazing. It's not over-simplified either, however, with nobles generally not making complete asses of themselves in front of everyone like your typical isekai.

wuhugm · 2018-09-03, 04:28

^Kinda interesting buy the yuri lover thing puts me off

sasuke706 · 2018-09-03, 04:37

It's pretty obvious he's going to get together with them all at the end.
Him being a yuri fanatic probably even doubles a plot device to prevent him from trying to get with one heroine (instead of just the usual noble hierarchy difference), seeing as a couple have tried to monopolize him already when they have higher status than him. Although he does also use the status thing as an excuse, not that anyone seems to give two shits.it would seem.
That said it's not like there's nothing platonic there at all. It's just in the end he always tries to turn it yuri.
At one point it almost turns completely platonic but they get interrupted (surprise).

I'd usually find protagonists with zero romantic interest annoying myself but I think the author does it nicely.

Valky · 2018-09-04, 05:10

It's sasuke's recommendation, putting it on alert. Still not many content though.

kari-no-sugata II · 2018-09-07, 08:27

I know we all love to bitch about multiple authors writing things we think are stupid or silly... but am I the only one who gets annoyed with series that equate farming with "the slow life"? Farming could be described as the original "black company". Do people in Japan have a highly romanticised idea of countryside life?

There's other things that are annoying too of course but this one seems to have been coming up a bit lately, for what I've been reading (mostly translations).

Kyureki · 2018-09-07, 09:13

Farming as a hobby is slow life though. Farming as your actual occupation however....depends on the circumstances.

kari-no-sugata II · 2018-09-07, 09:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyureki

Farming as a hobby is slow life though. Farming as your actual occupation however....depends on the circumstances.

If you have a vegetable patch or an allotment or something, I could consider that a "hobby", no problem. However, I think for something to be "farming" you'd need at least a field. I don't think tending to a whole field could be considered a hobby...

wuhugm · 2018-09-07, 09:50

^Well, most farming shits are boosted by cheats tho

That Nonbiri Nouka has all-purpose farming tools, in others there's like instant crops or automation

kari-no-sugata II · 2018-09-07, 11:17

With cheats anything can become easy, even farming.

I don't have a problem with that... but more like the idea that farming is something to aspire to in general under the banner of "the slow life". Like I said, it's the original "black company".

I'd rather work in a poorly regulated sweat shop with long hours and bad wages than be a farmer.

Garn · 2018-09-07, 20:46

ニトの怠惰な異世界症候群～最弱職〈ヒーラー〉なのに最強はチートですか？～
These types of novel make me imagine an old balance, on one side [the author erases the novel] on the other [The author ruins the novel], I'll summarize.

-Chapters with MC points of view -> Chapters with MC points of view and others -> Chapters of others points of view -> Several chapters of others points of view.
-Normal MC -> Hetare MC -> MC forget his "pseudo harem" -> MC creates harem for someone else -> MC doesn't want harem.
- Following the pattern above the protagonist becomes increasingly foolish.
-2 School Arcs of 121 chapters.

cabman11 · 2018-09-12, 00:52

Boy, can someone help me find that one about that skeleton loli knight.
you know, guy reincarnated as a lesser undead servant of this little demon girl and they have to fight some kind of demon world chess war game or something and she's at Last Place rank 72? 73?

I think it's called astria's Knight or something.. but I can't find it

sasuke706 · 2018-09-12, 01:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by cabman11

Boy, can someone help me find that one about that skeleton loli knight.
you know, guy reincarnated as a lesser undead servant of this little demon girl and they have to fight some kind of demon world chess war game or something and she's at Last Place rank 72? 73?

I think it's called astria's Knight or something.. but I can't find it

Dude, Astarte's Knight got deleted forever ago. The author removed his entire account for some unknown reason.

2018-09-03, 04:28	Link #7250
wuhugm Confused Shark Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Atlantis	^Kinda interesting buy the yuri lover thing puts me off __________________ ------------------------------------------ [SPOILER] Manga, Anime, & LN Where The Girl MC Ended Up With Is Not The Main Heroine All My Threads

2018-09-04, 05:10	Link #7252
Valky Radioactive Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: The Big Durian	It's sasuke's recommendation, putting it on alert. Still not many content though. __________________

2018-09-07, 09:13	Link #7254
Kyureki Part-time Translator Join Date: Mar 2015	Farming as a hobby is slow life though. Farming as your actual occupation however....depends on the circumstances. __________________

2018-09-07, 09:50	Link #7256
wuhugm Confused Shark Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Atlantis	^Well, most farming shits are boosted by cheats tho That Nonbiri Nouka has all-purpose farming tools, in others there's like instant crops or automation __________________ ------------------------------------------ [SPOILER] Manga, Anime, & LN Where The Girl MC Ended Up With Is Not The Main Heroine All My Threads

2018-09-12, 00:52	Link #7259
cabman11 Senior Member Join Date: May 2014	Boy, can someone help me find that one about that skeleton loli knight. you know, guy reincarnated as a lesser undead servant of this little demon girl and they have to fight some kind of demon world chess war game or something and she's at Last Place rank 72? 73? I think it's called astria's Knight or something.. but I can't find it __________________ "The goal of all life is death" - ainz ooal gown

2018-09-03, 04:23	Link #7249
sasuke706 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008	Random recommendation. 女になった親友の為に、おれは仕方なく成り上がる Story is three friends in Japan get killed by a meteor (probably with a ton of other people) and reincarnate into a time period seemingly corresponding to ancient Rome, but with magic. Protagonist is born into a nobody knight family and quickly becomes an orphan at the age of 6, while his two friends also reincarnate but as women. He himself has no real ambitions outside of wanting to see some yuri-action, but after reuniting with his friends upon joining the army as a nobody infantry, he decides to help them out with their own ongoing problems. Spoiler for Possibly spoilery, more detailed info: Protagonist's merits are he's above average at everything from looks to strength, with his magic abilities being minimal at best. Of course in a world where being able to use any magic at all is treasured, it has its uses. His friends are respectively reborn at a duke's daughter with super strength and a brain only for swords, and the other a knack for magic with a kind of severe corpse appreciation fetish. Protagonist is a history nerd, however, so he's able to make use of his knowledge to guide his reunited friend to victory in war, where he starts to slowly gain prestige. Fun part is his friends seem to be battling with their bodies as women, with at least the Duke girl developing a severe thing for our protagonist but struggling to try to convey that his best 'friend' when he doesn't want to come off as 'homo.' The other has also been showing signs so far. Problem being the protagonist has no interest at all in having sex, calling himself a pro-virgin, him only interested in watching hot women be intimate/he wants to see some goddamn yuri and he wants it bad, wishing he could have reincarnated as a decorative plant. So his goal is to hook his now female friends together so he can enjoy the results, and he's willing to overthrow an empire to make it happen. The protagonist is actually kind of aware that the duke girl has a thing for him, but he just resolves to make him/her return to the yuri side. That said, he does turn into a relatively shy virgin (hence pro-virgin) when approached by her in the bath and whatnot, so it's not like he has no interest himself, it's just he's extremely into his yuri fetish. He also does try his best to treat his friends as he did on Earth outside of the yuri fetish. The protagonist says his looks are average but it's mentioned by a few of the heroines that he's just as handsome as guys the protagonist hates for being 'ikemen' unlike himself. His magic, aka put one person to sort of sleep a day, is also apparently considered fairly strong. No one else is seen using sleep magic and all. That said half the characters he uses it on resists it, and he can only cast it once a day with his mana pool. FYI, strong mages can get pretty crazy but so far mages haven't influenced battles all that much in the long-run. Protag is not OP but is a strategic genius compared to everyone else. Is fairly strong but basically everyone else in the cast is stronger than him in some way or another. It's harem, including more heroines than just the two genderbent girls. No snu-snu, orthodox or yuri otherwise, but you can bet the protag is trying for the yuri side of it. Anyway, it's a pretty fun story for me. The characters are quirky, the setting is pretty nice and set roughly around isekai 200 B.C., and it isn't just your generic get-strong isekai. Though it is a very likely a going to be emperor one. That said the strategy, plot and intrigue is, while there, on the relatively simple side of the spectrum so don't go expecting anything amazing. It's not over-simplified either, however, with nobles generally not making complete asses of themselves in front of everyone like your typical isekai.

2018-09-03, 04:37	Link #7251
sasuke706 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008	It's pretty obvious he's going to get together with them all at the end. Him being a yuri fanatic probably even doubles a plot device to prevent him from trying to get with one heroine (instead of just the usual noble hierarchy difference), seeing as a couple have tried to monopolize him already when they have higher status than him. Although he does also use the status thing as an excuse, not that anyone seems to give two shits.it would seem. That said it's not like there's nothing platonic there at all. It's just in the end he always tries to turn it yuri. At one point it almost turns completely platonic but they get interrupted (surprise). I'd usually find protagonists with zero romantic interest annoying myself but I think the author does it nicely.

2018-09-07, 08:27	Link #7253
kari-no-sugata II Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2015	I know we all love to bitch about multiple authors writing things we think are stupid or silly... but am I the only one who gets annoyed with series that equate farming with "the slow life"? Farming could be described as the original "black company". Do people in Japan have a highly romanticised idea of countryside life? There's other things that are annoying too of course but this one seems to have been coming up a bit lately, for what I've been reading (mostly translations).

2018-09-07, 11:17	Link #7257
kari-no-sugata II Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2015	With cheats anything can become easy, even farming. I don't have a problem with that... but more like the idea that farming is something to aspire to in general under the banner of "the slow life". Like I said, it's the original "black company". I'd rather work in a poorly regulated sweat shop with long hours and bad wages than be a farmer.

2018-09-07, 20:46	Link #7258
Garn Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2016	ニトの怠惰な異世界症候群～最弱職〈ヒーラー〉なのに最強はチートですか？～ These types of novel make me imagine an old balance, on one side [the author erases the novel] on the other [The author ruins the novel], I'll summarize. -Chapters with MC points of view -> Chapters with MC points of view and others -> Chapters of others points of view -> Several chapters of others points of view. -Normal MC -> Hetare MC -> MC forget his "pseudo harem" -> MC creates harem for someone else -> MC doesn't want harem. - Following the pattern above the protagonist becomes increasingly foolish. -2 School Arcs of 121 chapters.