[Game] Umineko no Naku Koro ni - Ep. 4 Alliance of the golden witch

[maximilianjenus]

The theory of tehre being a main culprit who makes use of the surviving adult woman as an acomplice/scape goat is the one I like the most.

[Tenerezza]

Just something I thought but doesn't make fully sense about battlers mom

Spoiler:

If I recall correctly battler supposed to be 16 at the events when it happened, his lil sister at the future 12 years later talk with the boat captain about the other side of the island as 30 years ago sadly this doesn't match up exactly as this would be 2 years before battler would been born, but maybe he wasn't exact on the year. Could it possible be that Beatrice is battlers mom? And also that she died by giving birth to him?, Well I don't have much to base this on, just some minor hunch or idea that I got after finishing episode 4.

Also sorry if this been taken up before bit time consuming to read 105 pages But at least I think it may possible be true as long as the red text is actually the fully truth we don't know truthfully as it came from an witch :P

[maximilianjenus]

Spoiler for f:

Batler's age can be a complete lie so yeah, but I would rather think it's correct that he is 18.

[momobunny]

Originally Posted by Tenerezza

Just something I thought but doesn't make fully sense about battlers mom

Spoiler:

If I recall correctly battler supposed to be 16 at the events when it happened, his lil sister at the future 12 years later talk with the boat captain about the other side of the island as 30 years ago sadly this doesn't match up exactly as this would be 2 years before battler would been born, but maybe he wasn't exact on the year. Could it possible be that Beatrice is battlers mom? And also that she died by giving birth to him?, Well I don't have much to base this on, just some minor hunch or idea that I got after finishing episode 4.

Also sorry if this been taken up before bit time consuming to read 105 pages But at least I think it may possible be true as long as the red text is actually the fully truth we don't know truthfully as it came from an witch :P

Battler is 18, not 16.

[Sterling01]

Why are people still using spoiler tags?

Oh and Battler is 18 (Though there's no red text to confirm this)

[Marion]

Originally Posted by Sterling01

Why are people still using spoiler tags?

Oh and Battler is 18 (Though there's no red text to confirm this)

I mostly use them since in discussion about EP 4 I don't want to spoiler people who have just come xD; Other 3 EPs I don't use.

But yes, Battler is 18. I don't feel like we need red text for this imo.

[maximilianjenus]

Battler is 18

[Renall]

Shannon = Kanon has to explain the ep3 First Twilight where there are two corpses in separate places. The only explanation I can think of is "all the adults are lying about what they found where," but I'm not even sure Battler didn't go and see the bodies. In any event, that would seem to dispense with the theory altogether.

[Mikachiru]

Originally Posted by Renall

Shannon = Kanon has to explain the ep3 First Twilight where there are two corpses in separate places. The only explanation I can think of is "all the adults are lying about what they found where," but I'm not even sure Battler didn't go and see the bodies. In any event, that would seem to dispense with the theory altogether.

Then there would be 16 people, not 17...What's next? Genji=Gohda? Kinzo=Natsuhi? Mackerels=Beatrice?

[LyricalAura]

Originally Posted by Renall

Shannon = Kanon has to explain the ep3 First Twilight where there are two corpses in separate places. The only explanation I can think of is "all the adults are lying about what they found where," but I'm not even sure Battler didn't go and see the bodies. In any event, that would seem to dispense with the theory altogether.

Summarizing my earlier post:

The corpse that was identified as Shannon's in Episode 1 is not in fact Shannon's, but a double prepared to fake her death. Therefore, in Episode 3, this corpse and Shannon/Kanon's real corpse could account for both crime scenes. Episode 3 is the only Episode in which Shannon's death is confirmed in red.

[Mikachiru]

Originally Posted by LyricalAura

Summarizing my earlier post:

The corpse that was identified as Shannon's in Episode 1 is not in fact Shannon's, but a double prepared to fake her death. Therefore, in Episode 3, this corpse and Shannon/Kanon's real corpse could account for both crime scenes. Episode 3 is the only Episode in which Shannon's death is confirmed in red.

I thought double body tricks don't exist, or something...(wrong Ep?)

[Jan-Poo]

Originally Posted by Mikachiru

Then there would be 16 people, not 17...What's next? Genji=Gohda? Kinzo=Natsuhi? Mackerels=Beatrice?

The last has been said already.

[LyricalAura]

Originally Posted by Mikachiru

I thought double body tricks don't exist, or something...(wrong Ep?)

That was only stated for "corpses with unknown identities". The corpse of "Shannon" was identified as Shannon since only half the face was smashed, so it may not fall under that definition.

If Shannon is captured under this definition, then either Eva is the staker and faked her death (doubtful) or there must be a supernatural entity on the island, because at the 9th twilight there would be no women left to pose as Beatrice.

[Christen]

Originally Posted by LyricalAura

Summarizing my earlier post:

The corpse that was identified as Shannon's in Episode 1 is not in fact Shannon's, but a double prepared to fake her death. Therefore, in Episode 3, this corpse and Shannon/Kanon's real corpse could account for both crime scenes. Episode 3 is the only Episode in which Shannon's death is confirmed in red.

Regarding the unidentified corpses, all of their identities are guaranteed. Therefore, no body double tricks exist!

[kaitwospirit]

One guess I have about about Kanon:

Spoiler for Kanon:

It's pretty funny that Battler never sees Kanon and Shannon together, but I don't think that they're the same person. It's also funny that his body is only found in episodes where Battler ends up going to Kinzo's room personally outside of fantasy sequences (unless I'm wrong?). Kanon is dead before the game begins, in addition to Kinzo, and his body is being kept in Kinzo's room. However, his death is fairly recent in comparison to the date of Kinzo's death so there is less need to disguise the body. There is another servant who is posing as Kanon, perhaps a twin. This allows for a "nineteenth person" again, who could be responsible for some of the murders that are not yet explained.

Doesn't explain everything (like why Jessica wouldn't notice) but it's my current working theory.

[Freelii]

Originally Posted by Christen

Regarding the unidentified corpses, all of their identities are guaranteed. Therefore, no body double tricks exist!

Shannon's was an identified corpse due to only half the face being smashed. I think the second statement only applies to the unidentified corpses.

"Therefore, no body double tricks exist, in terms of those corpses which were unidentifiable."

Phrasing it like this kind of twists the red text, but I think the semantics allow for a loop hole.

[Mikachiru]

Originally Posted by kaitwospirit

One guess I have about about Kanon:

Spoiler for Kanon:

It's pretty funny that Battler never sees Kanon and Shannon together, but I don't think that they're the same person. It's also funny that his body is only found in episodes where Battler ends up going to Kinzo's room personally outside of fantasy sequences (unless I'm wrong?). Kanon is dead before the game begins, in addition to Kinzo, and his body is being kept in Kinzo's room. However, his death is fairly recent in comparison to the date of Kinzo's death so there is less need to disguise the body. There is another servant who is posing as Kanon, perhaps a twin. This allows for a "nineteenth person" again, who could be responsible for some of the murders that are not yet explained.

Doesn't explain everything (like why Jessica wouldn't notice) but it's my current working theory.

Spoiler for Response:

That would make Genji and Nanjo in on it as well, since they constantly visit Kinzo's room...

[Christen]

Originally Posted by kaitwospirit

One guess I have about about Kanon:

Spoiler for Kanon:

It's pretty funny that Battler never sees Kanon and Shannon together, but I don't think that they're the same person. It's also funny that his body is only found in episodes where Battler ends up going to Kinzo's room personally outside of fantasy sequences (unless I'm wrong?). Kanon is dead before the game begins, in addition to Kinzo, and his body is being kept in Kinzo's room. However, his death is fairly recent in comparison to the date of Kinzo's death so there is less need to disguise the body. There is another servant who is posing as Kanon, perhaps a twin. This allows for a "nineteenth person" again, who could be responsible for some of the murders that are not yet explained.

Doesn't explain everything (like why Jessica wouldn't notice) but it's my current working theory.

We have a similar theory, as I posted this before. The greatest obstacle for this theory are these two.

They definitely would not mistake any different person for Kanon!.
The only one who can claim Kanon's name is the person himself!

As of now, I can probably say this.

There is more than 1 person named Kanon. This doesn't violate the declaration in red that no one can claim Kanon's name aside from the person himself. Another person named Kanon existed before the game, and this Kanon was killed in the room which is now Jessica's.

The remaining problem is how to beat the 1st red text.

[Squirrellord]

twins......

[Christen]

Should have said "aside from identical twins".