One Piece - Chapter 552 (manga)

[ArabianLuffy]

if the yonkou and dragon come then the world government is screwed, but the yonkou may betray whitebeard, except for shanks though since they are rivals and everything. boa is probably gonna join whitebeard's side because ace is lufy's brotyher, she may even prevent the execution.

[seiji_kun]

Originally Posted by Master Mold

Since when does Sengoku's words > What really transpired on Newgates ship? on that subject matter. Heck the last chapter just gave us the scoop on what Newgate thinks, about Ace being rogers son, so I think that pretty much puts Sengoku's words as null at this point. Unless more info on the matter is revealed, backing up What Sengoku said. Oh and one more thing its against the rules to posts the scans, Quotes are Ok.

I haven't seen anything that I find rules it out. So as long as I don't see something that shows that Sengoku was flat out lieing I do take his words serious. Of course it could just be propaganda like they said Roger was captured and Crocodile was captured bye the WG but for now I don't think Sengoku is completely lieing.

Didn't remember whether is was a zero policy against pics or that at least a limited amount of pics were allowed.

Originally Posted by Master Mold

By the strongest man in the One Piece world at this point in time, then going back for more, I'd say that not worth mocking, but respecting.

Like my earlier comment showed, I myself fully agree but I have seen others on other boards mock him for it.

[AddiKtioNn-BlaCk]

Originally Posted by lonewolf777

You think Blackbeard is that strong? I always thought his strength lied in his scheming and his unpredictability. I mean... Magellan wiped him out pretty easily. And while he defeated Ace, he didn't do so overwhelmingly.

Its not that I believe his is that strong. I'm not even a fan of Blackbeard, I said that he might be the only capable of taking out Whitebeard because of his Devil Fruit Ability

Originally Posted by lonewolf777

Ah, I see, many thanks. Where was it confirmed that there was a stalemate? I remember it said 'Shanks intercepted him', but nothing else.

Yeah it was I believe.

Spoiler for Shanks and Kaidou:

Originally Posted by AnbuItachi

I'd say whitebeard has that title only because he's the oldest and has fault equally with roger. After roger died, he took over and at that time the other 3 yonkous probably didn't exist yet. Now they do exist but none of them took whitebeard out because they are relatively equal in power, at least they aren't afraid of each other. Kaidou was going to fight whitebeard, Shanks successfully intercepted Kaidou. Shanks also stepped onto whitebeards ship alone. It shows that the yonkous are about similar in strength. I guess since Whitebeard has yet to be defeated, he still claims the world's strongest title and the one closest to one piece.

Actually Whitebeard is the strongest because he's stronger than the other Yonkou. Kaidou didn't actually try to fight him, I think that was a mistranslation, in some translations it says Kaidou tried to attack from behind, others it said Kaidou was trying to stop Whitebeard from going to war with the World Government. Shanks didn't plan on fighting Whitebeard is the only reason why he went alone, that's why Shanks is allying with Whitebeard because Shanks knew about Ace's lineage and tried to stop it when he went to see Whitebeard. Proof of that is when Shanks intercepted Kaidou when Kaidou was trying to attack/stop Whitebeard. That's what they (World Government) fear, Shanks and Whitebeard met, now Shanks is helping Whitebeard, the same could happen between Kaidou and Shanks, which what they (the World Government) are nervous about

Originally Posted by The Small One

IIRC we have no reason to believe it was WB or anyone associated with him, who opened those gates.
Whitebeard's fleet came from a completely different direction and therefore have no reason to open those gates, especially since they have no idea what's waiting behind them. From their point of view, the marines could have stationed additional reinforcements there.
So I think the gates were indeed opened by someone, who is in some way associated with Luffy and knew that he is waiting before the gate.

Ok, but in the Marines could possible be associated with Luffy other than Garp, Koby and Helmeppo? Nobody, presumably. It makes since that Whitebeard had people inside, or it may have been a Revolutionary that's disguised as a marine.

[Rawrz]

In this arc :
- Whitebeard will be screwed soon.
- Dragon and his revos will come to WB's aid just because they hate WG.Maybe not Dragon himself but at least a small group that will aid (Mysterious powerful guys will always pop up at the worst time.For ex: Gaara and his pawns, Those masked freaks at bleach)
- Blackbeard laughing at all three sides while ravaging though them via Pluton/Poseidon.Now that Shiryu just joined them it is pretty much clear that Blackbeard's barely beginning his plan, will be the the final boss and the one deserves these death machines the most.

[How the heck does a so called high class Shichibukai pirate that's been to the New World [Supposeldy Rivaled Kaidou] and back not able to control his own power?]

According to bounties so far he is the strongest Shichibukai just before Donflamingo.he clearly underestimated Luffy and I can see that massive amounts of Brick Bats will be the bane of all weaklings in this war.If Moria didnt used his trump card back there World Government should've one handedly win this war just by Moria and his invincible zombies.So I admit a bit that Oda rushed Moria and made him look weak.Personally Moria is the most interesting looking shichi to me and I want him to be portrayed as the monster that rivaled Kaidou, not just a sleepyhead lazy demon.This fight may be a good opportunity to give Moria the reputation he deserves.

[paradox13]

I can see that massive amounts of Brick Bats will be the bane of all weaklings in this war

Lolol

I don't thinkt he WG fears weaklings. A single laser from Kizaru, a swipe of WB's bisento or indeed Shanks's/Hancock's mere presense can easily decimate a couple of thousand weaklings each, so I don't think being 'the bane of all weaklings' is anything to boast about.

[Rawrz]

Originally Posted by paradox13

Lolol

I don't thinkt he WG fears weaklings. A single laser from Kizaru, a swipe of WB's bisento or indeed Shanks's/Hancock's mere presense can easily decimate a couple of thousand weaklings each, so I don't think being 'the bane of all weaklings' is anything to boast about.

The thing here is that Moria doesnt have to focus/care about the bats directions (as the doppelman wondered deep into forest without Moria seeing him) They can just go wreak havoc over those weakling pirates while Moria is having a duel with one of main captains.So he is a good crowd control person

[MihawkXGP]

Originally Posted by AddiKtioNn-BlaCk

I think the Admirals are called the Marine's Greatest Military Force because of their highly destructive abilities. On top of that, it takes more than strength to be considered the position for Admiral, Garp clearly doesn't had the mental capacity to be a Admiral. He doesn't believe in Absolute Justice, he went the WG's back and hid Ace for Gol. D Roger the Pirate King, his son is the World's Most Wanted Man and now his Grandson is a Pirate. So based on that alone, along with his carefree personality at times, he wouldn't be Admiral material.

How can you say he doesn't have the mental capacity to be an Admiral? Does Ao Kiji? Lazy as hell, doesn't believe in Absolute Justice either, and he has let the SH's escape twice and let Robin go on a few occasions.

Garp is the hero of the Marines. He fought Roger many times, he was an Admiral, I'm certain of it, and 1 day in the future I'm certain this will be confirmed.

[AddiKtioNn-BlaCk]

Originally Posted by MihawkXGP

How can you say he doesn't have the mental capacity to be an Admiral? Does Ao Kiji? Lazy as hell, doesn't believe in Absolute Justice either, and he has let the SH's escape twice and let Robin go on a few occasions.

Garp is the hero of the Marines. He fought Roger many times, he was an Admiral, I'm certain of it, and 1 day in the future I'm certain this will be confirmed.

When I say he doesn't have the mental capacity its not like I'm calling him retarded or nothing. Being a Admiral doesn't go with his personality, the responsibilities that come with it and etc. Hell he might have even been offered a position but turned it down, who knows?

[Master Mold]

Originally Posted by seiji_kun

I haven't seen anything that I find rules it out. So as long as I don't see something that shows that Sengoku was flat out lieing I do take his words serious. Of course it could just be propaganda like they said Roger was captured and Crocodile was captured bye the WG but for now I don't think Sengoku is completely lieing.

Newgate himself said (last chapter) that he finds Ace being Rogers son as no big deal, rather something little, when Ace informed him after being on his ship for a while, after earning a spot/invite to be the 2nd division commander. Newgate found it as a surprise, but overall thinks its no big deal. So at this point that rules out Sengoku's words, since we got the scoop from horses mouth (Newgate & Ace via Flashback).

[james0246]

Originally Posted by AddiKtioNn-BlaCk

Its not that I believe his is that strong. I'm not even a fan of Blackbeard, I said that he might be the only capable of taking out Whitebeard because of his Devil Fruit Ability

It's not like Whitebeard is immune to DF attacks. A long-range fighter could still, potentially, score hits off of him. For instance, Robin's Hana Hana fruit could be quite deadly against Whitebeard...if she had more physical power that is. Otherwise, theoretically, her fruit could grip, hold, and then break Whitebeard from afar.

That beign said, Blackbeard would have to be able to get close to Whitebeard first, before he could cancel out any quakes (earth or other), and getting close is really half, if not more, of the battle.

[Master Mold]

Originally Posted by james0246

That beign said, Blackbeard would have to be able to get close to Whitebeard first, before he could cancel out any quakes (earth or other), and getting close is really half, if not more, of the battle.

Get close? Blacky wouldn't have to get close. He would just pull/suck Newgate towards him, but then Blackbeard got to worry about Newgates big a** Kwan Do.

[Blackbeard D. Kuma]

Originally Posted by james0246

That beign said, Blackbeard would have to be able to get close to Whitebeard first, before he could cancel out any quakes (earth or other), and getting close is really half, if not more, of the battle.

This is where the dark vortex comes in. Nothing can escape the gravitational pull of Blackbeard's darkness. That being said, Blackbeard doesn't have to get close to Whitebeard, for he can just use his gravity to pull Whitebeard in towards him.

Edit: Master Mold beat me to it .

[james0246]

Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma

This is where the dark vortex comes in. Nothing can escape the gravitational pull of Blackbeard's darkness. That being said, Blackbeard doesn't have to get close to Whitebeard, for he can just use his gravity to pull Whitebeard in towards him.

Edit: Master Mold beat me to it .

As long as Whitebeard can see his opponent, then he can cause quakes to disrupt, harm, and kill them. While Blackbeard could be trying to suck Whitebeard toward him (if he was even allowed the opprotunity to), Whitebeard could simply unleash some earthquakes or airquakes at Blackbeard, effectively stopping Blackbeard from using his powers. That is why I emphasized long-range fighters as having a pseudo-advantage over close and mid-range fighter when fighting Whitebeard (Whitebeard is, of course, protected on almost all fronts because he can fight on all fronts - he can use close-, mid-, or long-range attacks to battle anyone on the land, in the sea, or in the sky).

There is no reason to assume that Blackbeard's gravity can defeat Whitebeard. By the end of this arc, we will see that Whitebeard can dodge or block light; burn through ice with his sheer manliness; and do something to Akainu's powers. It will take the combined might of the top military to truly defeat Whitebeard.

[Master Mold]

Originally Posted by james0246

There is no reason to assume that Blackbeard's gravity can defeat Whitebeard. By the end of this arc, we will see that Whitebeard can dodge or block light; burn through ice with his sheer manliness; and do something to Akainu's powers. It will take the combined might of the top military to truly defeat Whitebeard.

Well I wasn't arguing whether or not Blackbeard would be able to beat the king with one tech, but the bold does hold truth. LOL

[marvelB]

Originally Posted by james0246

There is no reason to assume that Blackbeard's gravity can defeat Whitebeard. By the end of this arc, we will see that Whitebeard can dodge or block light; burn through ice with his sheer manliness; and do something to Akainu's powers. It will take the combined might of the top military to truly defeat Whitebeard.

Well, while it's anyone's guess as to how effective Blackbeard's power is against Whitebeard, I definitely agree that defeating him would still be easier said than done. After all, we ARE talking about a guy who can literally punch a hole in the atmosphere......



....But I'm still more interested in seeing the commanders and New World captains in action. Marco in particular looked pretty pumped up in that last panel, heh. I also really want to see the abilities of Bohemian Knight Doma and Thunder Lord Makugai, as well (since both of those guys' designs are my favorite out of the NW captains. The fact that we find out that Ace beat Doma in this chapter's flashback still doesn't change my opinion of him yet!). It's about time we got to see the level of hte various pirates of the New World......

[Blackbeard D. Kuma]

Originally Posted by james0246

As long as Whitebeard can see his opponent, then he can cause quakes to disrupt, harm, and kill them.

The only thing Whitebeard has done so far is create two tsunamis. I won't be surprised if Blackbeard can use his black hole to suck up those tsunamis and use "Liberation" to throw them right back at Whitebeard. Also, Blackbeard has an advantage over Whitebeard, which is the fact that Blackbeard knows how Whitebeard's ability works, whereas Whitebeard is completely ignorant as to what the Darkness fruit can do. In other words, he won't know what to expect from Blackbeard should they get into a fight.

Originally Posted by james0246

There is no reason to assume that Blackbeard's gravity can defeat Whitebeard.

Really? Then why is it that Blackbeard spent decades on Whitebeard's ship looking for the darkness fruit? The whole point of him pursuing and acquiring the darkness fruit was so that he can overcome and defeat all devil fruit users.

[james0246]

Originally Posted by marvelB

....But I'm still more interested in seeing the commanders and New World captains in action. Marco in particular looked pretty pumped up in that last panel, heh. I also really want to see the abilities of Bohemian Knight Doma and Thunder Lord Makugai, as well (since both of those guys' designs are my favorite out of the NW captains. The fact that we find out that Ace beat Doma in this chapter's flashback still doesn't change my opinion of him yet!). It's about time we got to see the level of hte various pirates of the New World......

Doma does look pretty cool. Plus he has a monkey...And if he is a swordsman (since he has a sword), maybe we have found a fun opponent for Mihawk.

I'm eager to see all have a brief moment, even if they are defeated a few seconds later.

Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma

The only thing Whitebeard has done so far is create two tsunamis.

And seemingly split the sky during the Shanks encounter. This isn't fully confirmed, but his abilities seem very closely related to the encounter.

Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma

Also, Blackbeard has an advantage over Whitebeard, which is the fact that Blackbeard knows how Whitebeard's ability works, whereas Whitebeard is completely ignorant as to what the Darkness fruit can do. In other words, he won't know what to expect from Blackbeard should they get into a fight.

Fair enough. Then again, Whitebeard could be just as familar with the devil fruits (via the same books that Blackbeard read (and we know that the books list, at least, basic abilities, or else Blackbeard would have never chosen the fruit)), so he could very well know the powers of the darkness fruit.

Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma

Really? Then why is it that Blackbeard spent decades on Whitebeard's ship looking for the darkness fruit? The whole point of him pursuing and acquiring the darkness fruit was so that he can overcome and defeat all devil fruit users.

Blackbeard could have easily chosen the fruit for its ability to cancel out Logia and other DF users. There is no reason to assume that he chose the fruit specifically for the possibility that it could defeat Whitebeard. Added to that, unless Blackbeard hurries, he is going to live up to my prediction of completely skipping the war, and just heading to the New World.

[Blackbeard D. Kuma]

Originally Posted by james0246

Fair enough. Then again, Whitebeard could be just as familar with the devil fruits (via the same books that Blackbeard read (and we know that the books list, at least, basic abilities, or else Blackbeard would have never chosen the fruit)), so he could very well know the powers of the darkness fruit.

If Ace wasn't even aware of the capabilities of the darkness fruit (he was taken by surprise in his duel with Blackbeard), chances are that Whitebeard or anyone else doesn't know of its capabilities either. The only person who probably had a good knowledge and understanding of the fruit was Satch (the 4th division commander) since he was originally in possession of it, but he's dead now so it doesn't really matter anymore.

Originally Posted by james0246

There is no reason to assume that he chose the fruit specifically for the possibility that it could defeat Whitebeard.

Why not? Whitebeard is an obstacle for Blackbeard no matter how you look at it. By the time he left Whitebeard's crew, it was clear to him that Whitebeard wouldn't let his crimes go unpunished, and that a duel between them would be inevitable at some point later on since Blackbeard's goal is to exalt himself to pirate king status, which involves taking down all of the top dogs (of which Whitebeard is one of them).

[lonewolf777]

I'm not sure Blackbeard wants to take Whitebeard out face-to-face. Blackbeard doesn't seem to be the type to flex his muscles and take things out. He's a conniver who works from behind the scenes. I think he doesn't even intend to take part in the war. He's alluded to his plan, now all that remains is for us to find out what it is. But I don't think he expects to destroy all the strong men by his own hand.

[james0246]

Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma

If Ace wasn't even aware of the capabilities of the darkness fruit (he was taken by surprise in his duel with Blackbeard), chances are that Whitebeard or anyone else doesn't know of its capabilities either. The only person who probably had a good knowledge and understanding of the fruit was Satch (the 4th division commander) since he was originally in possession of it, but he's dead now so it doesn't really matter anymore.

That wasn't my point. Whitebeard could enter a battle with an unknown foe already knowing all of the fruits on the sea because he studied the same books as Blackbeard. So, when he sees the potential foe use their DF power, he would immediately know that the potential foe has X fruit with Y abilities and Z disabilities (if all that info had been written down, that is), all because he read the same books that Sanji, Blackbeard, and Lucci have read.

Conversely, someone with the same book knowledge could know Whitebeard's abilities/potential disabilities, just by reading the correct book.

Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma

Why not? Whitebeard is an obstacle for Blackbeard no matter how you look at it. By the time he left Whitebeard's crew, it was clear to him that Whitebeard wouldn't let his crimes go unpunished, and that a duel between them would be inevitable at some point later on since...

Considering that Whitebeard was asking Ace, one of his best, not to seek out Blackbeard, your point is a little off. Whitebeard probably knew, at the time that Blackbeard defected, that only he, as you said, could potentially defeat Blackbeard. So, he called off the search, as was willing to simply leave the situation alone. It was Ace that went against Whitebeard's orders and sought Blackbeard, which in turn forced Whitebeard's hand.

Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma

...Blackbeard's goal is to exalt himself to pirate king status, which involves taking down all of the top dogs (of which Whitebeard is one of them).

I still don't see the logic behind the assumption that Blackbeard himself has to defeat Whitebeard. He could just as easily play the chessmaster and have someone else defeat Whitebeard. Realistically, there is no direct reason why Blackbeard would need to confront Whitebeard - confronting him raises the potential for being harmed, if not killed, and the only reward appears to be fame, something Blackbeard could attain by simply finding One Piece. In the end, unless Whitebeard holds a piece of info that is pivotal for finding One Piece or something to that affect, any direct challenge against him seems to serve only superficial purposes.