Is anime a media that is particularly prone to objectify women?

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Notshane

What's all this talk about tentacles? Every Hentai I ever did see just looked like the way a regular porn would. Not that I watch that stuff, but I have honestly never seen anything involve all the things people are bringing up here. Am I missing something?

Genderswap, mindbreak, cuck....

[itisjustme]

Originally Posted by Notshane

I can understand some people liking the unusual stuff where it is the different aged human beings, but why throw squids and animals into it? You truly must've been traumatized, or something else, if your mind has an attraction for that stuff

Not trying to judge those that do and all, but I could never watch stuff like that.

Rather unfortunate thing though, well I was thinking about this I remember going on Newgrounds where a user updated an American Hentai cartoon so I did see it once. I will not say what it so you do not get curious, but it effectively ruined a certain cartoon for me for many years thanks to how well the art style was copied from it. The animation was so fluid; so, so, fluid

Hahahaha. I think people actually made studies and such, like they showed <disgusting fetish that shall remain unnamed here> porn to a bunch of average people and they were all disgusted/puking, but three days later almost everyone showed accustomization and within a week most were showing signs of arousal.

If you spend enough time on the internet you'll find fetishes that'll make you realize tentacle porn is just a funny harmless thing (the worst ones I've personally heard of/seen don't come from japan/anime culture though). And then you come to realize there's no normal person, everyone is a closet freak or not yet corrupted, it's just varying degrees. :P

[Nightbat®]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Anyhow, as oompa loompa had well stated; just because some or maybe "feminists" say absolutely nonsensical bullshit does not mean problems do not exist. I do think this very term of objectification has its loaded connotations, but at the same time, responding with one's own form of hyperbole doesn't help matters. Except me of course. Children should not try what I do at home though.

"Hate the dog enough and you'll always find a stick to hit him with"

Anyone looking for something offending will often find it, but at what point can we stop calling
"stirring the soup in the direction not desired by a bunch of ideologists" a problem?
1st world feminism has spiraled out of control, where -if enough successes are achieved-
we're gonna see the most petty and useless issues being scrutinized and condemned until we reach a state of pure and utter apathy

Objectification is a biological issue, nothing to do with oppression or rape culture
only with propagating the human species

So we're gonna ban it and it won't be long until we're gonna see an 8 year old getting sentenced
to 50 hours community service because he didn't hand in the right forms before sending his classmate a loveletter

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by Nightbat®

"Hate the dog enough and you'll always find a stick to hit him with"

Anyone looking for something offending will often find it, but at what point can we stop calling
"stirring the soup in the direction not desired by a bunch of ideologists" a problem?
1st world feminism has spiraled out of control, where -if enough successes are achieved-
we're gonna see the most petty and useless issues being scrutinized and condemned until we reach a state of pure and utter apathy

Objectification is a biological issue, nothing to do with oppression or rape culture
only with propagating the human species

So we're gonna ban it and it won't be long until we're gonna see an 8 year old getting sentenced
to 50 hours community service because he didn't hand in the right forms before sending his classmate a loveletter

And at what point can we start accepting the possibility that things could be a problem? Well, at least there is a line that can be drawn between practicality and nonsense.

And again, by using hyperbole to frame the only alternatives to doing nothing is not a good argument.

Yes, there is a lot of so called feminists that simply are bigoted against men, and people who would rather preach feel god solutions that do nothing. But honestly, the most disappointing thing is that people on all sides of the issue are so intent to believe the other side has nothing of value to say.

I mean as I have said, I watch lots of politically incorrect stuff and won't intend to change. But I will still listen to critctism or what not even if I don't accept it.

[Nightbat®]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

But honestly, the most disappointing thing is that people on all sides of the issue are so intent to believe the other side has nothing of value to say.

Honestly: I fail to see that issue
The whole idea that all behavior is taught instead of instinctive, already denies a total misunderstanding of the issues
People have preferences for a biological reason, most of everything today is built around that
I'm willing to bet the marketing profession is closer to understanding the truth of problems (if they actually are problems) than feminism

Tell me: where is a [insert preference]sexual person wrong when looking at and desiring the body of a [insert gender]?


To me, it looks like the Women's Rights Movement is heading for a "boy who cried wolf" situation
Where the real problems are buried under trifling BS and everyone stops listening

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by Nightbat®

Honestly: I fail to see that issue
The whole idea that all behavior is taught instead of instinctive, already denies a total misunderstanding of the issues
People have preferences for a biological reason, most of everything today is built around that
I'm willing to bet the marketing profession is closer to understanding the truth of problems (if they actually are problems) than feminism

Tell me: where is a [insert preference]sexual person wrong when looking at and desiring the body of a [insert gender]?


To me, it looks like the Women's Rights Movement is heading for a "boy who cried wolf" situation
Where the real problems are buried under trifling BS and everyone stops listening

You're just proving my point.

Why are any of your points in any way inclusive of people that push this so called Women's rights movement?

Would any of these beliefs be held by anyone in this thread? Are we really implying that posters here support that kind of sex shaming? If not, why is it brought up so much?

Again, it is no longer an issue of right or wong but a matter of perceiving other views.

[Nightbat®]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Again, it is no longer an issue of right or wong but a matter of perceiving other views.

Wait, I enjoy boobs in my anime, I'm not killing cartoonists, polluting the north pole, rape whistling girls, etc.

So I'm sitting here enjoying the bouncies and the compromising situations
along comes some Moral High Ground Soldier telling me that my entertainment is evil and should be banned and I'm evil and should repent and change my ways

...you see my reluctance to even begin to put myself in their position?

[Archon_Wing]

That sounds like people that support censorship and thought police, rather than being inclusive of feminism. What inherently in feminism as defined by yourself really dictates that logically speaking, this must be accepted with it? You might find out that buzzwords easily can be used both ways.

My problem is (and it's not just you) that by associating feminism with that kind of line of thought is associating people in this thread that may support feminism with those. I certainly hope none of you are, so I would have to ask why exactly do the extremists have to always be brought up?

Has anyone in this thread actually professed that certain anime is evil and should be censored?

I think the problem is that this is being perceived as some zero sum game, where if there might just have the possibility of having issue means that something must be taken away.

Aka,
Some anime objectifies women, and that anime must be changed or, neutered.

as if and only if that's the only stance to take when I can say "There is a problem. How to cope?"

You can't put yourself in the position of a vague entity, so focus on people in this discussion.

[Notshane]

You know, this current argument alone is probably why people judge anime viewers if you think about it

[Nightbat®]

Originally Posted by Notshane

You know, this current argument alone is probably why people judge anime viewers if you think about it

"I fail to see the issue"

You mean, because it's not a clear cut case and one big grey area?

[risingstar3110]

Once again, my take on the issue is simple: if scientific study can provide enough evidences on it, then it can be the basis for social change.

The problem with feminist movement in this case is because... well...they are all activists rather than scientists. And we all know the problem with having activists doing scientific researches: they are obviously biased due to their own conflict of interest.

I also think that feminist currently based a lot of their argument on assumption/ sentiment/ lack of scientific evidences (objectify of women led to violence of women for example..). So it will be hard for them to invest into independent research that 'may' deny their stance in the first place.

[Notshane]

Originally Posted by Nightbat®

"I fail to see the issue"

You mean, because it's not a clear cut case and one big grey area?

Excuse me?

[Nightbat®]

Originally Posted by Notshane

Excuse me?

I'm not quite clear as to how this discussion creates a certain view towards anime fans
Replace "Anime" with "Porn" or "Violence" or whatever topic is apparently leading to the downfall of western civilization
and you're having the same discussion

[Fizix]

Originally Posted by Notshane

You know, this current argument alone is probably why people judge anime viewers if you think about it

Ive thought this a few times when reading this thread.

[GDiddy]

Originally Posted by Nightbat®

I'm not quite clear as to how this discussion creates a certain view towards anime fans
Replace "Anime" with "Porn" or "Violence" or whatever topic is apparently leading to the downfall of western civilization
and you're having the same discussion

Because a lot of people think anime fans are weird with their figurines and pillow wives and want to marry 16 year old fictional waifus?

[Nightbat®]

Originally Posted by GDiddy

Because a lot of people think anime fans are weird with their figurines and pillow wives and want to marry 16 year old fictional waifus?

Guilty on the figurines

...I shudder thinking about the discussions between stampcollectors

[Notshane]

Not gonna lie, I actually do own a mini figurine. Though if prices were not so high up, I would not mind buying just one full-sized one because there is a certain character that was sculpted into figurine form flawlessly and it looks very nice but the price is not worth it.

What is funny though is that some current anime even have episode plots where there is a recurring character that is a figurine collector. One in particular even had the character ventriloquist with an anime character puppet and successfully making his voice higher pitched for the voice and not once moving his mouth. He had real conversations with the puppet too and blushes when the puppet gives him compliments. So basically, he is complementing himself and also animating the puppet in a quite realistically-scary fashion. In the same show, there is a scene with an anime shop that is filled with dudes and they are all cuddling with the figurines and it is quite disturbing. But, the anime itself is actually very enjoyable.

It was not until I watched this anime recently that I realized just how creepy some collectors probably are in the real world as well.

[risingstar3110]

Originally Posted by GDiddy

Because a lot of people think anime fans are weird with their figurines and pillow wives and want to marry 16 year old fictional waifus?

Not as weird as those who have a whole platoon's arsenal in their basement. Or pack their house full of stuffs in case of zombie/ nuclear apocalypse. Or the most common: spend 10 years grinding 20 different virtual polygons to accumulate enough virtual money to buy a virtual horse....

You know hobby tended to be weird to those don't have it

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by GDiddy

Because a lot of people think anime fans are weird with their figurines and pillow wives and want to marry 16 year old fictional waifus?

At least we are not Peter Coffin wwwww.

[oompa loompa]

This is not the topic of the thread but.. my god guys, why the insecurity? anime is considered a weird hobby, and surely everyone here can empathize as to why people find it weird; so what? If you're defined (or people define you) singularly by the fact that you watch anime or are heavily invested in otaku-culture, well maybe you are a 'weirdo' , and again, so what? Stubbornly trying to justify your hobby is not going to make people see it as any different, so why bother? You're just singing to the choir on these forums by discussing, and not a lot of meaningful debate is going to come from it. If people are judging you about it, just don't tell them that you're into it; no harm done.