2013-06-12, 00:36 | Link #2201 | |
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Spoiler for general spoilers:
In terms of real world possible, based on my field of study (microbiology), I can argue that that solution is most definately within the realm of real world possible. Based on the commonalities, I think I have a pretty solid idea as to Spoiler for spoilers for the 8th novel:
Just found the manga. Don't know if I'm allowed to post the link though. The investigation starts on page 13 of chapter 9. Seems to show the soy sauce bottle to be empty and the cooker is off with a panel specifically dedicated to each. There also seems to be an object the size of a large piece of paper next to the cooker on the right side. Could this be the note? On page 14, Rena inspects the contents of the cooker noticing a bunch of cube like objects inside and checks the refridgerator, noticing the same cubes wrapped in plastic wrap (apparently tofu) with an expression that seems to indicate that she thinks something's wrong. I think it is at this point that where a "predatory trap" theory can be established, even if the clues require some knowledge of cooking (which I admittedly didn't have until Rena's explaination) to fully notice. In chapter 10, page 29, Rena has what appears to be a large piece of paper in her hands, indicative that she found something important. Since the contents of the note weren't shown, I concede on the paper, but it seems everything else regarding the dinner were presented to the reader in the manga incarnation. Enough at least for a "Rika and Satako were lured to their deaths by a predatory trap" hypothesis. That combined with the "psycho rant" and Ooishi's comments about the whereabouts of certain individuals are enough clues for the reader to figure out the identity of the culprit. Of course, my argument is completely moot in the visual novel. Last edited by magnum12; 2013-06-12 at 01:23. |
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2013-06-12, 21:42 | Link #2202 |
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Except it wasn't a predatory trap; it was an opportunistic trap. Shion had no way of knowing that Rika would run out of soy sauce. She had no plans to kill Rika until Rika pulled out the spray can. (Shion was unsure whether Rika was involved at that time.) Also, the paper describing the soy sauce had been distributed to the town as a whole. Keiichi could have potentially read about the soy sauce days before.
And the rule is "The detective must not light on any clues which are not instantly produced for the inspection of the reader." The reader might guess that something important was written on the paper; Rena knew that the Sonozakis were distributing soy sauce. Side comment: Who is the detective in Higurashi? Ooishi? Keiichi? Rena? Rika?
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2013-06-12, 23:23 | Link #2203 |
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I think who the detective is might vary by arc. I know Van Dyne's rules mandate the presence of a detective, but I don't think Knox says anything about it. Keiichi is never the detective. Mion and Shion are never the detective. I don't think Rika is the detective in any arc either (except MAYBE???) Minagoroshi-hen. This is just a guess, but the closest person to a detective in novels 1, 3 and 6 is Ooishi, and his role is minor. Akasaka is the detective in the 4th novel. The closest to detective's objectivity in Watanagashi-hen is Rena. Ooishi is also helpful in that arc as well.
On the whole, I'd say Higurashi is about as compliant with the concept of "fair play" mystery as Persona 4; i.e. some violations, but on the whole it seems to try to play fair by providing adequete clues and foreshadowing for the player to find the culprit. Yes, I know Persona 4 snaps Knox's 2nd in half, but the point is the same (the smoking gun in that series being found in October). As per the theory I mentioned in spoilers for those interested. Spoiler for spoilers for 8th novel:
A bit off topic, but I think we might have a way to find some answers to some of our unresolved questions. Apparently, R7 answers questions on his twitter page. If we have someone who's fluent in Japanese, perhaps we could have someone ask the questions as a representative to the anime suki community. Personally, I would just love to get some answers regarding HS (which I found to be a really cool yet absolutely scientifically plausible solution), and maybe find out if the theory above was correct or not. I wonder how R7 would react to said theory. Maybe even some of the questions that are currently ambiguous in terms of how they're interpreted. Last edited by magnum12; 2013-06-13 at 00:02. |
2013-06-29, 14:25 | Link #2204 |
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Join Date: Sep 2009
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I'm reading the Higurashi VN for the first time (having only seen the anime before and bits and pieces of the manga), and I'm at the part of Tatarigoroshi-hen where Keiichi calls "Mion" and asks to make sure she can take Satoko to the festival...but I'm starting to feel a little confused about the situation.
Spoiler for Meakashi-hen:
Edit: I've now finished Tatarigoroshi-hen in the VN and I have a few more questions. Spoiler for Series-wide spoilers:
Sorry for all the questions!!
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Last edited by KanonTheFurniture; 2013-06-30 at 16:46. Reason: Added more questions. |
2013-07-02, 06:43 | Link #2205 | |||||||
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2013-07-04, 22:01 | Link #2206 | ||
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Join Date: Sep 2009
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I think it'll be a lot more interesting when I hit Tsumihoroboshi-hen (I just finished Himatsubushi-hen and will be starting Meakashi-hen next), because I've ONLY experienced the anime version of it (and I know they left a ton out) - Meakashi-hen is as far as I've collected the Yen Press volumes of the manga, and the scanlation project for Tsumihoroboshi-hen didn't get very far either, so I think it'll feel a lot more revealing to me from this point on (I've also yet to read more than the first chapter or two of the Minagoroshi-hen or Matsuribayashi-hen manga). Plus, coming from Umineko, I was expecting lots of epic music in Higurashi, and the question arcs were very short on that...I hear Kai really turns it around, so I'm definitely more excited to go on from here. Spoiler for response:
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2013-07-05, 03:44 | Link #2207 | ||
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2013-07-09, 07:39 | Link #2208 |
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About the Shion/Mion telephone call in Tatarigoroshi:
I always thought that in Tatarigoroshi, Mion was the one who received both calls (the one before Watanagashi 1982 and the one in 1983) and therefore can connect the two conversations. I have two problems ... In Onikakushi, Spoiler for whole story:
In Meakashi, Spoiler for meakashi:
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2013-07-14, 23:19 | Link #2210 | |
Witch's Golden Breaker
Join Date: Sep 2009
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Quote:
I have a new question... Spoiler for Minagoroshi-hen:
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2013-07-15, 02:57 | Link #2211 |
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No, I know what happened in Meakashi. What I tried to say is that in Tatarigoroshi (not in Meakashi) Satoshi spoke to Mion (as he intended) about taking Satoko to the festival.
He also called Mion in Meakashi, but Mion said she was busy and would call him back later and then rang up Shion, so Shion could talk to Satoshi and apologize about what happened at school. Pretending to be Mion, of course. What I meant was that in Tatarigoroshi one year ago, the quarrel at school maybe didn't happen. So when Satoshi called Mion, she talked to him herself the whole time and didn't transfer the phone call to Shion as she did in Meakashi. And when Keiichi called Mion a year later, she remembered the whole conversation. |
2013-08-13, 07:27 | Link #2214 |
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Is Miotsukushi-hen could be considered as canon? Did Ryukishi write this?
IIRC he is the supervisor of this game, but the scriptwriter is another person from Alchemist whose name is Kanou Kiichi (叶希一). It seems that arc is pretty popular among Japanese fans, but I don't like it if it's not written by Ryukishi himself. |
2013-08-13, 09:14 | Link #2216 |
阿賀野型3番艦、矢矧 Lv180
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...I have no idea if you are serious or not, but better be safe.
It was never confirmed to be canon at all. Hell, it was an arbitrary mention by the fans just because it has a sort of bittersweet ending, and still involve more ridiculous stuff than it should be. The very fact Matsuribayashi-hen was still included in the Kizuna remake series says it all. A good deal of the spin off scenario cannot be considered as canon considering the incompatible setting with the main plot. Advocating the fragments setting argument for these doesn't make sense at all.
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2013-08-13, 11:59 | Link #2217 | |
天下御免の園崎詩・魅音
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The scanlated ones are fine, but others... Some of them just like Kira. You know what I'm saying. If you're one of people who can't stand Kira, you can't stand the rest which is in shadow as well.
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2013-08-14, 09:36 | Link #2218 | |
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[EDIT] did not mean to sounds rude, it's just that I recently had a talk with a guy who refused to acknowledge word of god regarding madoka, so I might have a bad tone. Last edited by maximilianjenus; 2013-08-14 at 10:13. |
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2013-08-15, 04:31 | Link #2219 |
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@maximilianjenus Thanks. I understand what you meant.
@Klashikari Thanks. But, someone with this post saying that Ryukishi declared it as the "true ending". But, according to this Alchemist page, there are 3 original scenario with complete supervision by Ryukishi07. And it is just doesn't make sense if he didn't write it, but he declared it as canon. Also, a guidebook says that according to Ryukishi07, Miotsukushi-hen is like another side of a coin of Matsuribayashi-hen. (Source: http://www.wikihouse.com/higurasi/in...D4%A4%B7%CA%D4) Maybe I could take FMA to FMA:B (or original manga) relationship as an analogy to Higurashi: Matsuri to Higurashi (original VN). Maybe not. Last edited by goldenlander; 2013-08-15 at 04:54. |
2013-08-15, 09:49 | Link #2220 |
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well, the thing about it being a true ending might be a misunderstanding; "true ending" usually means a bitter sweet ending, something that is not a bad end (like what we get for most higurashi arcs) but is not a happy end either, because some people tend to find hapy endings to be ridiculous ( i have seen people complain about the way higurashi kria ended becuase they think it's stupid that a few kids can beat a military platoon.)
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