sola - Episode 5 Discussion / Poll

[Klashikari]

Originally Posted by Nemesis2124

Y'know. reading through this topic I think people are getting a little too fixated on the concept of "seed mode". It was pretty clear that it was meant to emphasize a non-emotive state, rather than a simple strength boost. After all, she had him overpowered even before that.

nah... i think they are just referring how the look of the eyes were similar, while it didn't have the same result.
but, when did matsuri physically overpower Takeshi? as far as i can see (except if i missed a scene), she could only run away from him, by using the metal structure around the church.

so far, except her ability to turn things into ashes/corrode/rot them, she kinda has normal girls physical traits.

[Skyfall]

Given Matsuri's personality i really can't imagine her intentionally killing (or harming) some one. (Else our hunter would have been a smoking pile of crap... which i would have preferred ).

I agree that her "seed mode" was just a state of mind, not some power boost/ability usage/whatever - she didn't want to die(doh), so her survival instincts simply kicked in.

What i want to know though - how is Takashi's arm doing ? I wonder whether the damage she inflicted is going to be permanent or not. I hope it is... would be kinda lame if the effect just happens to "wear off" >.>

Originally Posted by Klashikari

nah... i think they are just referring how the look of the eyes were similar, while it didn't have the same result.
but, when did matsuri physically overpower Takeshi? as far as i can see (except if i missed a scene), she could only run away from him, by using the metal structure around the church.

She made quite a high jump there (I would say 5 meters or so) to get trough the window, which would translate to very above-human strength. Obviously, she isn't fond of the idea of harming him, so she she simply chooses to run away. Skilled or not, Takashi is still human, so as far as physical abilities go it would seem that Matsuri would win in that department quite easily.

Also, don't take my word on this, because i am not following the manga, but as far as i overheard (and too lazy to look for details atm):

Spoiler for possible manga spoiler for something that was not shown in the church scene, but took place in manga:

Matsuri's speed is quite above that of a human as well.

[Doraneko]

Neat thing is though, after breaking out of her trance, she practically goes on a suicide run outside. It suggests that she has a deep-rooted fear of harming(killing?)people to the point where death seems preferable. Presumably she's been in a similar situation and done something rather awful in the past. Would certainly explain a few things from earlier episodes. Now I can't wait for the next batch of crap to hit the fan.

That sounds possible. But practically speaking there is no way to retreat in the house except the window. Takeshi will throw out a new batch of darts in no time. Matsuri only had two choices after she had decided not to kill Takeshi: either be killed on spot, or try getting out and see if she could find a sheltered area before losing her consciousness.

The reason that she has developed such a fear of killing is probably she has unintentionally killed her loved one before, or witnessed him getting killed by her clan. As for who that guy was...

Spoiler for possible manga spoiler for something that was not shown in the church scene, but took place in manga:

Matsuri's speed is quite above that of a human as well.

Spoiler:

In episode 00 (prologue), She literally jumped on the roofs from one house to another at high speed (pretty like Chii), just for getting to the nearest convenience store to pay her electric bills and restoring the electricity supply to watch her favourite TV show...

[Nemesis2124]

Originally Posted by Klashikari

but, when did matsuri physically overpower Takeshi?

I'm just talking about when she grabbed his wrist and stopped his swing in its tracks. He's a big enough guy where he should have been able to follow through.

Originally Posted by Skyfall

Given Matsuri's personality i really can't imagine her intentionally killing (or harming) some one. (Else our hunter would have been a smoking pile of crap... which i would have preferred ).

Likewise, unless if it was in self-defense. But we know how humans love to misunderstand things, especially when it comes to supernatural creatures. And I actually do think he would have been a smoking pile, had Matsuri not caught herself in the act.

Originally Posted by Doraneko

That sounds possible. But practically speaking there is no way to retreat in the house except the window. Takeshi will throw out a new batch of darts in no time. Matsuri only had two choices after she had decided not to kill Takeshi: either be killed on spot, or try getting out and see if she could find a sheltered area before losing her consciousness.

True, but I found it odd that the writers added that little statement of Takeshi commenting on how absurd it was of her to go outside, which suggests that maybe they were trying to imply something else.

And the other thing...I'm actually referring to her choice to not kill him. Like you said, there was nowhere else to go, but then why wouldn't she just kill him? Seems like an obvious enough choice to me. That is unless if there's some excess baggage we aren't privy to yet. ^^;

[darkchibi07]

I expect that scene was trying to convey that Takeshi thought of Matsuri going outside in the daylight was flat out suicide which he didn't expect her to do. As for the wrist handling,



...it's clear that Matsuri was holding both of Takeshi's wrists. So wouldn't that contribute the fact that she was able to immobilize him?

[Klashikari]

well, that's not how i considered the scene :
Takeshi left hand joined his right hand, holding his sword. (the angle is kinda weird however) Matsuri's both hands were grabbing his right wrist.

check the very next frame after she parried Takeshi sword, you will see that when takeshi withdraw his left arm, matsuri's hands were already on his right wrists, and didn't move an inch.

also, Matsuri "Dark mode" activates only when she performs her "rot spell". so it is still really weird how they executed the scene.

[Deathkillz]

Originally Posted by Nemesis2124

I'm just talking about when she grabbed his wrist and stopped his swing in its tracks. He's a big enough guy where he should have been able to follow through.

sure he would have followed through if the had already begun to swing down the sword but from what i can she he lifted it up and was caught by matsuri before he could gain any momentum to swing down...and about him stopping in his tracks as if he was paralyzed ~ well you know fear of knowing what is going to happen next can sometimes stop any movement at all for the simple answer ~ and i tend to go for the easier option ~ as far as i know matsuri's powers do not go as far as paralysis

[Skyfall]

Originally Posted by Nemesis2124

I'm just talking about when she grabbed his wrist and stopped his swing in its tracks. He's a big enough guy where he should have been able to follow through.

As already noted, her physical abilities are above that of a human, so him being a big guy and all counts for nothing >.>

[Kyuusai]

Yes, this episode both delighted and mortified me.

It delighted me because I'm in love with this series. For all its flaws, it's absolutely charming. It mortified me because it's so charming that I actually care about the characters and by golly BAD THINGS are happening. Matsuri being attacked, Aono growing suspicious and possibly about to become even more depressed... It's bad all around.

The chemistry between Yorito and Matsuri is great, and it's something we just don't see too often. How often do you see a confident, mature adult woman being a friendly flirt? And even rarer to see such a woman simultaneously be ABSOLUTELY ADORABLE. Aono, Koyori, Mana... They all manage to exist beyond the limits of the usual female character cliches. Maybe if Kyoani's Kanon could set a new standard for an ideal man instead of a cliched pushover, maybe sola can do the same for women. I hope it catches on. sola doesn't do so badly for guys, either: Yorito is clearly young, but he's not a loser. Takeshi is clearly not a cliched dishrag guy, but he's not the protagonist, which is where such roles generally live.

More beautiful art plagued by animation hacks and weirdness (Seriously, what was the pixelation on Takeshi at 13:35 as he walked down the street?!). But I'll forgive it for being so wonderful overall.

Originally Posted by Skyfall

What i want to know though - how is Takashi's arm doing ? I wonder whether the damage she inflicted is going to be permanent or not. I hope it is... would be kinda lame if the effect just happens to "wear off" >.>

While it would be sort of "cheap" for it to wear off, I really hope it does. Even if he's the antagonist, he's not portrayed as evil, so for such a devastating injury to be permanent when it was inflicted with so little drama (drama for Takeshi, not Matsuri) would make its significance very... hollow. More of a distraction than an enhancement to the story.

If he's going to sustain permanent debilitating injuries, he deserves a better, more sympathetic way of having them inflicted upon him.

As for why he didn't struggle when it was happening... Shock is reasonable, and we really have no idea how having that happen would feel.

[Solace]

There was a few nitpicky things but this is about as close to a 10 an episode can get for me. We got it all - action, drama, comedy, character and plot progression. I can overlook a few leaps of faith and some animation troubles since everything else was so damn good.

[Kyuusai]

I have to add that I agree with the general consensus: OMGPONYTAIL!

[Nemesis2124]

Originally Posted by Skyfall

As already noted, her physical abilities are above that of a human, so him being a big guy and all counts for nothing >.>

Yeah, that's exactly what I was going for.


And on another note, there sure seems to be a lot of fuss about Takeshi's reaction, eh? Personally, I have a hard time believing anyone would be thinking too clearly as their limb is being eaten away like that. ^^;

[orion]

Or maybe it wasn't a suicide run? She could have for some yet unexplained reason now developed a slight tolerance to sunlight which enabled her to dash outside and stick to the shade, defend herself against light darts and survive a light dart attack indoors.

I hope the damage to his arm doesn't reverse. It would add to Matsuri's danger potential if we see what she can really do when she's up against a wall.

[Nemesis2124]

Ha, I should watch my terminology. I don't presume it was a suicide run per se, just an incredibly dangerous thing to do given the alternative. And sunlight immunity, eh? I don't think the series has ever given us the impression that the sunlight is an instant kill, so there's no real need for that yet. Also, I'll be one angry camper if they ever resort to something that cheesy in this show. ^^;

[Kyuusai]

Originally Posted by orion

Or maybe it wasn't a suicide run? She could have for some yet unexplained reason now developed a slight tolerance to sunlight which enabled her to dash outside and stick to the shade, defend herself against light darts and survive a light dart attack indoors.

I hope the damage to his arm doesn't reverse. It would add to Matsuri's danger potential if we see what she can really do when she's up against a wall.

I'm not sure the tolerance is anything new. The damage done by direct sunlight never seemed to have an immediately fatal effect, just a fast working one. It's reasonable to assume that in a dire emergency she could survive a quick dash through it as a last resort.

I think the danger she posed was quite clear, especially when Takeshi asked why she didn't kill him. Since that was stated so clearly, I hope his arm heals.

[Guido]

The action sequence was very welcomed, but the strong point of episode five to me was Yorito's day off together with Matsuri.

It is very understandable Matsuri's surprise and naivety to have gone on the boat ride and taking a walk on the rainy day when she cannot normally do so during ordinary, sunny days.

This was the perfect setup for both to continue bonding and endured the crisis that ensued later.

When we have very few hints and leads about the background for the story we're at last treated with a brief flashback of Takeshi's past.

Spoiler:

I think that Yaka were viewed as a bad omen or beings which only carry tragedy and misery.

Maybe or not that is one among many reasons why Takeshi's people were trying to kill Mayuko. I am certain that the boy from the flashback was Takeshi, and he was protecting Mayuko from being done harm to her.
Subsequently, he may or not have been casted out by his family.

No leads or clues have been shed to pinpoint for sure why Takeshi desperately needs Matsuri's life, but I theorize it is for the sake of Mayuko. Most likely to save her life.

There is also the issue about Matsuri's strange reaction towards Takeshi when she turned into a dazed trance and partially burnt his wrist.
A power slumbering within her? or maybe her survival instinct kicked in to protect herself?

And more bad news keep on raining, since unintentionally and without awareness Koyori slipped to Aono that Matsuri is being friends with Yorito.

Spoiler:

The shocked reaction on Aono's face is fear that a girl, whom she has not met, is befriending her mother, and henceforth, taking him away from her side.

Aono never admits it to Yorito, but she is specially thankful to him for giving her all those dolls, and she did mind to fix back the broken doll.

[Deathkillz]

Originally Posted by Guido

And more bad news keep on raining, since unintentionally and without awareness Koyori slipped to Aono that Matsuri is being friends with Yorito.

Spoiler:

The shocked reaction on Aono's face is fear that a girl, whom she has not met, is befriending her mother, and henceforth, taking him away from her side.

Aono never admits it to Yorito, but she is specially thankful to him for giving her all those dolls, and she did mind to fix back the broken doll.

well if yorito can put two and two together im sure he knows how much those dolls mean to aono even without her stating it...the sheer fact that she wanted 5 the day yorito forgets one is a noticable fact :3

and exactally my thoughts that aono is afraid that yorito is going to be leaving her side...and its the first time i detect some selfishness from her ~ i wonder what other roles she is going to adopt in the near future :3

[Icerack]

well if yorito can put two and two together im sure he knows how much those dolls mean to aono even without her stating it...the sheer fact that she wanted 5 the day yorito forgets one is a noticable fact :3

And also in ep 4 when Mana tells him to quit buying those dolls, Yorito continues to buy them. I'm sure he knows.. But then again, alot of main characters in these types of anime are oblivious of everything, so who knows.

[Telliamed]

Well, the aforementioned technical flaws still disappoint me, but I'm willing to give this episode an 8 (7.5, really) because the writing was so good. I like the way Matsuri jokes about her age and teases Yorito for being "old fashioned". And he can't complain about her buying all that tomato juice; it was his idea to get as much as she can before it's discontinued.

edit: Okay, the real reason I bumped-up the score is because Matsuri is humming Colorless Wind as she sorts her clothes. Too cute!

Interesting observation: Mayuko prefers the confined confession box to sitting in the large apse. (Loved the confession joke, BTW.) So she's agoraphobic, while Matsuri desires to stand under a wide-open sky.

And Takeshi didn't bother mentioning that Matsuri had been hiding in the church previously.

The sound-effects and music during the first flashback reminded me of Haibane Renmei. Particularly when Rekka's wings sprout. I was kinda wondering, when I saw those feathers fluttering during the OP, whether the story would go in that direction.

Now, what was the gift Matsuri gave to Koyori?

[xat]

Originally Posted by Klashikari

but even if we speculate that matsuri used a spell which restrain Takeshi, the way how he is struggling, without moving his FREE left arm and both legs is completely silly.

I don't think it was a spell; I'd say Takeshi simply stopped out of pure fear. He's facing something that could decimate him if he isn't careful. Stopping for a moment just before piercing Matsuri is her opening, and he probably realized it. Given the situation he was in, he probably assumed he would die. She's probably physically stronger than he is, so I think he figured struggling would be useless.

The heartbeat that plays while Matsuri nearly kapoofs Takeshi's wrist is probably his own. For another theory in the box, maybe the effect was more immediate than what viewers are shown. It could have started from the inside, and maybe Takeshi was already feeling pain well before it was visually presented to us.

Originally Posted by Skyfall

What i want to know though - how is Takashi's arm doing ? I wonder whether the damage she inflicted is going to be permanent or not. I hope it is... would be kinda lame if the effect just happens to "wear off" >.>

I... think it is permanent? If not that, then maybe long-lasting. During the closing scene of the confrontation, we see he's not using the hand that was affected. The way it's animated, it seems to be rather lifeless, simply hanging there. If it is long-lasting by any means, I'm sure it'll be problematic if Mayuko were to find out.