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Old 2014-09-07, 16:28   Link #25461
GrrDraxin
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Go ahead and keep going. We've got nothing better to do, might as well hear the whole of your thoughts.
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Old 2014-09-07, 17:05   Link #25462
kusabireika
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Go ahead and keep going. We've got nothing better to do, might as well hear the whole of your thoughts.
I'm ok now thx for answering my question
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Old 2014-09-07, 19:02   Link #25463
Diggy DaCosta
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Hey I'm glad you're intrigued and want to hear more.

As far as continuing the story, I have no problem staying within canon, save for one lil detail: I don't think you need a 10-month gap for what transpires in the epilogue to take place. Here's what I have written as part of my 26-page (and counting) "treatment":

Quote:
The Time Skip after Alucard
In my opinion, 10 months is quite the time skip given the end of Alucard and what takes place in the epilogue. Yes, some sort of time skip can be implemented given the fact that the Newspaper Club and friends just saved all of Japan. The secret of the Youkai is out, and the group needs time to recover to get back to normal school life; I just don’t believe the story needs to skip 10 months for that to happen.
My query into this is two-fold:
1. The two main protagonists each just persevered through one hell of a transition and evolution, physically and psychologically. How the hell are they coping with all of what just happened?
a. Tsukune really needs the time to go home – the manga shows his family watching the events of the Alucard battle on TV. He’s got a little explaining to do to his parents (boy, won’t they believe what they got their son into by enrolling him at Youkai Academy), plus he needs time alone to mourn the death of Outer Moka/Akasha. He also needs to come to grips with his new manifestation as a Shinso vampire. Let him also spend time with his cousin, who could help him get his spirits back.
b. As for Moka, she absolutely could use time for self-reflection. She is someone whom (real/Inner self) had been used to keeping her emotions tucked away for a very long time, so she has a lot to process. She also should use time to mourn the death of her mother whom she finally reunited with for all of what, five minutes (?), before she disintegrated with Alucard and the other two Dark Lords?
i. I mean, it’s safe to say she’s gone through the emotional wringer during the Fairy Tale and Alucard battles. That entire experience, along with the dedication of Tsukune and her friends, should have greatly humbled her – another feeling that is still relatively new for. Also, the manga’s epilogue has her as cheery and playful, with both Inner and Outer personalities begun blending. Isn’t it worth seeing how she gets to that state from where she is at the conclusion of the Alucard? More on this in the next section.
ii. She could also mend things up with Akua (who definitely owes her an apology) and maybe spend some time with Kokoa(?).
2. The 10-month skip also glazed over or ignored a few peripheral things that, while not in the direct focus of the main story, should be addressed to add story depth.
a. Everyone should be, for all intents and purposes, about a year older. Which means Ginrei and Haiji, who were a year ahead of Tsukune and the gals, should have graduated.
b. Speaking of the main gang, they all should be at least be in the middle of their third/senior year which means final exams and graduation is on the horizon. The question of if and how they will all stay together post-graduation should be a looming focal point.
c. Since the school’s headmaster is gone, who the hell is running the academy in his place?
That last point could provide the rationale for a shorter time skip. The school could close down for a period of time similarly to after the student riots at the end of Season One. The time skip can be explained that the powers that be (the Bus Driver?) needed to figure out who will succeed former (and now-deceased) Headmaster Mikogami before reopening the academy. In canon, Tsukune has been chosen to be the next Headmaster, but he needs grooming by Issa. And Issa needed time to repair his family name and empire after his release from imprisonment via Fairy Tale’s coup d'etat. Thus, it’s reasonable that the academy needed to close until Bus Driver could get all his ducks in order. Besides, someone needs to presumably oversee Youkai Academy until Tsukune is ready.
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Old 2014-09-08, 00:26   Link #25464
Diggy DaCosta
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Here's more on what I wrote w/r/t the Time Skip:

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I believe having the time skip to the middle of the group’s senior year misses the opportunity to set up their whole senior year as a transition period that furthers the coming-of-age for each main character (Rubi isn’t a student, but she is no less important as part of the group’s fabric). “What the hell are we going to do after graduation?” is a question that, as I mentioned earlier, should be asked and pondered over throughout the course of the year. Tsukune’s training to become the new headmaster should also begin sooner than the 10 months skipped but perhaps a month or two after classes resume. I’d also want to see – if not how long Tsukune needs to be trained before he assumes Headmaster duties – what factors will shape how much time he will have or need to be trained.
Back on the romantic side of things, I believe that the group’s senior year should be a year of in-depth transition as well. Ten months without any movement on that side of things is just too long. As I stated before, the skip would miss out on a lot of character development and how Moka comes to reconsider her stance on polygamy. This is the period of time where everyone should “learn their place”. And by the way: I think the mangaka has done enough teasing with the “Kurumu x Mizore” dynamic (i.e. Kurumu’s kiss and the Black and White Duet) so there should be room for them to explore each other sexually within the polyamory dynamic at some point. Succubae, by all accounts, are naturally bisexual, and the two share a common bond as being Moka’s runner-ups. The further development of their bond has a lot of room for exploration.
A few things on this.
One: I mentioned that the way I am writing it, Moka will reverse her position on polygamy. If y'all want, I'll talk about why she changes her mind in another post.
Two: Tsukune's career map has basically been planned out for him. The girls - not so much. BUT we all know they ain't leaving ol' Tsukune Mac's side (that's my new nickname for him... give it time it'll grow on ya, lol). I'd like for them to ponder on their "post-graduation" plans throughout a good course of their senior year before the solution we talked about gets presented to them: joining the school faculty (that or becoming something of a school board in the form of a Knights of the Round Table - I favor the faculty move b/c I think the whole school board thing might be too mature a job for them to handle fresh out of high school)
Three: Kurumu x Mizore... it's time, folks. And I believe it's only natural. They are the 2A and 2B, and like I said, Ikeda left enough breadcrumbs to lead us down this path. You can easily imagine a scene where they're "consoling" each other for being stuck in 2nd place. OR, maybe the two of them decide to have a "rehearsal" on how they both will take young Aono. In "Here in My Arms", Sabr has them losing their virginity together to T-Mac, and I think that's a very fitting and creative way for it to be done.
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Old 2014-09-08, 21:05   Link #25465
Mach56gs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diggy DaCosta View Post
Here's more on what I wrote w/r/t the Time Skip:



A few things on this.
One: I mentioned that the way I am writing it, Moka will reverse her position on polygamy. If y'all want, I'll talk about why she changes her mind in another post.
Two: Tsukune's career map has basically been planned out for him. The girls - not so much. BUT we all know they ain't leaving ol' Tsukune Mac's side (that's my new nickname for him... give it time it'll grow on ya, lol). I'd like for them to ponder on their "post-graduation" plans throughout a good course of their senior year before the solution we talked about gets presented to them: joining the school faculty (that or becoming something of a school board in the form of a Knights of the Round Table - I favor the faculty move b/c I think the whole school board thing might be too mature a job for them to handle fresh out of high school)
Three: Kurumu x Mizore... it's time, folks. And I believe it's only natural. They are the 2A and 2B, and like I said, Ikeda left enough breadcrumbs to lead us down this path. You can easily imagine a scene where they're "consoling" each other for being stuck in 2nd place. OR, maybe the two of them decide to have a "rehearsal" on how they both will take young Aono. In "Here in My Arms", Sabr has them losing their virginity together to T-Mac, and I think that's a very fitting and creative way for it to be done.
Eh.

Too much emphasis on romance. Look they gotta save the world not take away Tsukune's virginity.

If the series would continue I would want it to be a more mature route where Tsukune and Co as a team and independently get involved in Youkai academy and police the human world as people from the newspaper club. Perfect excuse for them to go out in the human world and report on human/monster relationships.

Kurumu and Mizore could hook with Tsukune, each other, or maybe just not have any romance whatsoever. To me, they could be so much more than just blushing maidens. They're both so independent I feel its unbecoming for them to just gush over Tsukune 24/7... Seriously. Mizore had moments of profound growth and Tsukune wasn't even in the picture. Same with Kurumu. They've been like this with Tsukune for so long and still his romantic focus is on Moka, couldn't they just stay as friends and continue to grow as people? Kurumu's reflections of love are profound, but not her insistence to smother Tsukune's face in her breasts... Can't we just focus on the good stuff and not the ecchi comedy? I guess thats the problem, anytime I think of Kurumu with Tsukune I see her smashing his face in her breasts. Its not really... romantic... Its humor that is only good for so long, like Gin's ecchi-ness. Then you realize its actually sexual assault and yeaaaaaaaahhh.....

I'm assuming that the sequel is able to work around the topics of Kurumu's Succubus mortality and Mizore's Snow-Maiden situation. I think its possible, others might not... I'm biased anyway. I'm a huge Tsukune/Moka guy, so yeah... xP

Even Moka doesn't need romance. She has her own things she needs to develop. Obviously I'd like to see empathetic growth as she learns how to express her feelings, but she's a solid character no matter how you'd spin her.

Yukari and Fong-Fong would be the hilarious editors who go around serving as backup. Yukari's keeping Fong-Fong in line would be a hilarious character dynamic. No romance needed here either, Yukari's young and doesn't need to narrow her horizons, and Fong-Fong is pretty much a kid too, especially when it comes to ladies. I can just imagine Fong-Fong walking down the boardwalk with crowds of ladies following him and Yukari just dragging him by the ear saying "Come on, we're going to miss the freaking meeting stop giving them your (*&^% number".
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Old 2014-09-09, 00:31   Link #25466
Diggy DaCosta
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Eh.

Too much emphasis on romance. Look they gotta save the world not take away Tsukune's virginity.

If the series would continue I would want it to be a more mature route where Tsukune and Co as a team and independently get involved in Youkai academy and police the human world as people from the newspaper club. Perfect excuse for them to go out in the human world and report on human/monster relationships.
Except romance is, to me, the heart of R+V. It's a romance/comedy that evolved into an dark action/thriller - with romance/devotion/friendship at the heart of it. The action and darkness came in when sh!t got real, but it doesn't have to stay that way consistently. Gintama (a fav of mine) is mostly a spoof/comedy, but when they go into their action and drama arcs, they do it very well. A R+V sequel could somewhat mimic that balance, but with a romance/comedy identity that has good, dark arcs of drama and action.

Sounds like you favor them being world ambassadors/action heroes. I think there's definitely room for them to partake on much of that in the future. As for how I'm envisioning the start of the sequel - one that's picking up roughly 1/4 or 1/3 way into their senior year - I'd like to get back to re-establishing the romancing between Tsukune and the girls. I've read a couple other boards on another site where folks were battling word-for-word on how to interpret Issa's statements to Tsukune after their sparring session. To me it's clear: Issa co-signed on Tsukune pursuing polygamy (albeit with a warning of sorts). So that's how I'm building my view of the sequel: re-establish a level-up-in-maturity romance and romantic comedy, then start bringing in pieces to form the next new major conflict.

Quote:
I'm assuming that the sequel is able to work around the topics of Kurumu's Succubus mortality and Mizore's Snow-Maiden situation. I think its possible, others might not... I'm biased anyway. I'm a huge Tsukune/Moka guy, so yeah... xP

Even Moka doesn't need romance. She has her own things she needs to develop. Obviously I'd like to see empathetic growth as she learns how to express her feelings, but she's a solid character no matter how you'd spin her.
Kurumu's mortality and Mizore's limited window of reproduction are topics that should come up at some point during their senior year. Call me a moralist of sorts, but I don't want to see Mizore or anyone else knocked up before graduation. She's got until, what, age 25 to bear kids? She can wait til she gets her diploma before delving into motherhood. Kurumu can wait a little while longer; from what I understand, she just needs to ensure she has her Destined mate to reproduce (now how about this for an alternate continuity: what if Kurumu was wrong about Tsukune being her Destined One? Like, she loves him to death but realizes he "isn't the droid she's looking for"? Wouldn't THAT fuck with her? Ah, I digress).

I get you being a Tsukune x Moka guy, though. Like I said in an earlier post, I was on the fence and maybe tilting in that direction until I read platinumsabr's fic. I agree that Moka is a solid character who can hold her own weight: she's multitalented, intelligent, knowledgeable and a powerful fighter that has the whole Shinso blood-thing going for her. Her beauty can rival that of a supermodel. She has the makings of Beyoncé-level swag. Kurumu may be a natural heart-stopper, and Mizore has a graceful prettiness to her, but Moka is "that chick".

That said, I respectfully disagree with her not needing romance. It's the core premise behind Tsukune being the one to remove her rosary. In my "treatment", here's what I wrote:

Quote:
[Moka] should also come to recognize the irony that through all the times she’s had to be released from the rosary to come save Tsukune from trouble, it was in fact Tsukune who was slowly saving her. He was the very first friend she’s ever had, and through his dedication and bravery, he stayed by her side in both her forms. Even as she, in pure Inner form, tried to push him away because she thought herself destined to live in solitude. Even as she tried to deny how her Outer-self fell in love from the moment she met Tsukune, tried to deny even her own feelings as she came to appreciate Tsukune. She tried to come up with excuses to hide her own insecurities about whether she was even worthy of this kind of happiness. The Outer-self connected with Tsukune and chugged right along while she was stand-offish in her vampiric pride. It should hit her: Tsukune saved her from solitude, from loneliness, from avoiding the very things her mother wanted her to experience so that she may lead a happy life. That man, Tsukune Aono, unlocked it all for her – and she needs to tell him.
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Old 2014-09-09, 18:11   Link #25467
Mach56gs
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Originally Posted by Diggy DaCosta View Post
Except romance is, to me, the heart of R+V. It's a romance/comedy that evolved into an dark action/thriller - with romance/devotion/friendship at the heart of it. The action and darkness came in when sh!t got real, but it doesn't have to stay that way consistently. Gintama (a fav of mine) is mostly a spoof/comedy, but when they go into their action and drama arcs, they do it very well. A R+V sequel could somewhat mimic that balance, but with a romance/comedy identity that has good, dark arcs of drama and action.
Romance only goes so far, and the more often it is, the less impactful it is.

Same thing with action, adventure, etc, of course, but romance more so because there's you can't confess twice to the same chick. Virginity is also a single-use...

Awkward silence....

So yeah, scarcity makes things more valuable. Economics man!

And of course, they characters are growing up. People are going to outgrow some of their more negative qualities. Kurumu isn't going to be as clingy, neither is Mizore, romance or not. It would make them less of joke characters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diggy DaCosta View Post
Sounds like you favor them being world ambassadors/action heroes. I think there's definitely room for them to partake on much of that in the future. As for how I'm envisioning the start of the sequel - one that's picking up roughly 1/4 or 1/3 way into their senior year - I'd like to get back to re-establishing the romancing between Tsukune and the girls. I've read a couple other boards on another site where folks were battling word-for-word on how to interpret Issa's statements to Tsukune after their sparring session. To me it's clear: Issa co-signed on Tsukune pursuing polygamy (albeit with a warning of sorts). So that's how I'm building my view of the sequel: re-establish a level-up-in-maturity romance and romantic comedy, then start bringing in pieces to form the next new major conflict.
I'm one of those guys who argues word for word.

FEAR MEEeeee...

Since this is all projected its all possible. Harem, Single-Pairing, it all counts... So I'd really not want to start interpreting canon, I just want my perspective to be understood.


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Originally Posted by Diggy DaCosta View Post
Kurumu's mortality and Mizore's limited window of reproduction are topics that should come up at some point during their senior year. Call me a moralist of sorts, but I don't want to see Mizore or anyone else knocked up before graduation. She's got until, what, age 25 to bear kids? She can wait til she gets her diploma before delving into motherhood. Kurumu can wait a little while longer; from what I understand, she just needs to ensure she has her Destined mate to reproduce (now how about this for an alternate continuity: what if Kurumu was wrong about Tsukune being her Destined One? Like, she loves him to death but realizes he "isn't the droid she's looking for"? Wouldn't THAT fuck with her? Ah, I digress).
Yeah well, thats a hard point: All of the girls... are girls...

Why are they going to narrow their horizons already?

Of course, they might be perfectly alright, its just an impression, but I don't think Yukari knows enough about love to actually decide that she wants to marry Tsukune. I mean, she can't even drive a car and you want her to share her life with someone until death?

Of course, its fiction. Its completely FINE.... its just that realistically weird.... And I like the realism of Rosario Vampire more than the boob-smothering.

On the same vein... Why does Mizore need a freaking child? A lot of people freak out about Snow Maiden society...

...but the fate of the species doesn't rely on her ovaries. Maybe it relies on her freaking powers instead. Of course, thats not saying that she shouldn't get a child, its just something to consider.

Kurumu finding someone else is possible, also a more favorable option is that it turns out that Succubi don't need to live off of love. There's a quote in "Fake" that really speaks to me. Obviously, the canon is kinda straight-up in this matter but its not 100%.

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Originally Posted by Diggy DaCosta View Post
I get you being a Tsukune x Moka guy, though. Like I said in an earlier post, I was on the fence and maybe tilting in that direction until I read platinumsabr's fic. I agree that Moka is a solid character who can hold her own weight: she's multitalented, intelligent, knowledgeable and a powerful fighter that has the whole Shinso blood-thing going for her. Her beauty can rival that of a supermodel. She has the makings of Beyoncé-level swag. Kurumu may be a natural heart-stopper, and Mizore has a graceful prettiness to her, but Moka is "that chick".
Not even based on character, its just the fact that her relationship with Tsukune is mutual and exclusive. I'd say that most of the canon up til now has shown that her and Tsukune want each other, and they both don't want a polygamy.

But of course, thats opinion.

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Originally Posted by Diggy DaCosta View Post
That said, I respectfully disagree with her not needing romance. It's the core premise behind Tsukune being the one to remove her rosary. In my "treatment", here's what I wrote:
I like Tsukune/Moka, I was just being frank that pretty much all of the characters could have relationship teases as usual and not go all the way to third base, or at least not have physical touchy time every chapter.
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Old 2014-09-10, 00:37   Link #25468
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Well, I'll let you guys deal with the entirety of the R+V world. I prefer to stick with Inner Moka's characterization. Heh, I'm still perfecting how to merge both the anime and manga Inner Mokas into one Inner that I can have a field day with, but as one can imagine, it's hard and yet it's fun.

The thought of the future of R+V is that Tsukune takes Moka as his wife. Kurumu and Mizore are the only ones that I can see being concubines and/or secondary wives for Tsukune. And unlike Issa's deal with Akasha and Gyokuro, Moka and the girls are on good terms already. Tsukune is too emotionally invested in both Kurumu and Mizore to not continue a relationship with them, and they with him as well.
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Old 2014-09-10, 01:40   Link #25469
Diggy DaCosta
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Hey before I go on Mach56gs, I appreciate the feedback and convo. This is one of those things that's kinda hard to find people to discuss it with passionately.

Although I could go word-for-word, I try not to. Obviously, we're both passionate about R+V and would like to see the story furthered, even if we differ on how that should play out. It's all Bueno in the end, ya know?

Quote:
Not even based on character, its just the fact that her relationship with Tsukune is mutual and exclusive. I'd say that most of the canon up til now has shown that her and Tsukune want each other, and they both don't want a polygamy.

But of course, thats opinion.
Nah you're right, mane. That's absolutely true - canon says neither of them want it. If you never read the epilogue, this would be open and shut. It's the epilogue that leaves the door to polygamy more than a little bit cracked open, and you have to (maybe not have to, but ya know what I'm saying) give weight to who it was that wedged open that crack (Issa, Moka's own father).

Quote:
On the same vein... Why does Mizore need a freaking child? A lot of people freak out about Snow Maiden society...

...but the fate of the species doesn't rely on her ovaries. Maybe it relies on her freaking powers instead. Of course, thats not saying that she shouldn't get a child, its just something to consider.
Canon establishes why she needs to reproduce. Obviously, one could deviate from this should they choose for. Me personally, I'm fine with sticking with the details given in-canon.

Quote:
Why are they going to narrow their horizons already?

Of course, they might be perfectly alright, its just an impression, but I don't think Yukari knows enough about love to actually decide that she wants to marry Tsukune. I mean, she can't even drive a car and you want her to share her life with someone until death?
If you take a step back, that's absolutely one way you can look at it. After all, they're just high school students. Who really sticks with their high school crushes and sweethearts these days anyways? (and yes you could apply this criticism to countless other high school mangas)

Here's something I noticed about the manga/anime I've seen: the romance, the proclamation of devotion and love is really deep. I mean on levels of "I literally cannot live without you". Non-R+V example: Kirito x Asuna of SAO. I know people had beef with how Asuna was turned from battlegirl bad-ass to damsel in distress, but give it up to Kirito - he fought for his woman, in-game and out. (as an aside, I hope they return Asuna to her bad-assery at some point - what can I say? I've become more of a fan of the whole "battle couple" dynamic).

You did say you aren't a huge romance guy, so I wont go on and on about it in regard to you and talking about it. I'll just respond to this last thing you said at the top of your recent comment:

Quote:
Romance only goes so far, and the more often it is, the less impactful it is.

Same thing with action, adventure, etc, of course, but romance more so because there's you can't confess twice to the same chick. Virginity is also a single-use...

Awkward silence....

So yeah, scarcity makes things more valuable. Economics man!
I believe you can have a well-written base-romance comedy that takes momentary but successfully detours in action and drama, in the same vein as you can have a well-written comedy that takes detours into action and drama... in the same vein as you can have a well-written coming-of-age drama that takes detours into comedy and action/adventure... in the same vein that you can have a well written action/adventure that detours into romance and comedy. So scarcity can make things more valuable, but you have to consider what the root of your story is. I believe a successful story remembers its base while branching out into other areas while never straying too far from the base.

P.S.: I always viewed Virginity to be more of a threshold. Yeah, it's a "one time thing", and once you cross, all new doors can open for you.
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Old 2014-09-10, 11:13   Link #25470
Mach56gs
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Originally Posted by Diggy DaCosta View Post
Hey before I go on Mach56gs, I appreciate the feedback and convo. This is one of those things that's kinda hard to find people to discuss it with passionately.

Although I could go word-for-word, I try not to. Obviously, we're both passionate about R+V and would like to see the story furthered, even if we differ on how that should play out. It's all Bueno in the end, ya know?
Definitely.

I've seen a lot, and its calming to be able to just speak stuff honestly without stepping on people's toes or having people stomp on your toes.

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Originally Posted by Diggy DaCosta View Post
Nah you're right, mane. That's absolutely true - canon says neither of them want it. If you never read the epilogue, this would be open and shut. It's the epilogue that leaves the door to polygamy more than a little bit cracked open, and you have to (maybe not have to, but ya know what I'm saying) give weight to who it was that wedged open that crack (Issa, Moka's own father).
Yeah the epilogue gave it possibility, of course it was always an open ending so anything ultimately can happen.

I also like holding onto Issa's "I'll reform you" line as something that equalizes his assumption that Tsukune has a harem. Of course "Tsukune stepping between to defend his women" scene also could be spinned as Harem.

Its a matter of interpretation. -_(._.)_-

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Originally Posted by Diggy DaCosta View Post
Canon establishes why she needs to reproduce. Obviously, one could deviate from this should they choose for. Me personally, I'm fine with sticking with the details given in-canon.
Well, meh. She herself doesn't have to do it, especially since it kinda scarred her quite a bit and put her such a poor state when she first attended Youkai academy.

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Originally Posted by Diggy DaCosta View Post
If you take a step back, that's absolutely one way you can look at it. After all, they're just high school students. Who really sticks with their high school crushes and sweethearts these days anyways? (and yes you could apply this criticism to countless other high school mangas)
Well there are some examples, and of course its fiction duuuuh.... So the complaint can fall on deaf ears.

I feel that some more realism wouldn't hurt, nothing edgy like some Gantz weirdness but just something more fulfilling than light-hearted harem and Ikeda always was able to dabble in a realistic, serious vibe...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diggy DaCosta View Post
Here's something I noticed about the manga/anime I've seen: the romance, the proclamation of devotion and love is really deep. I mean on levels of "I literally cannot live without you". Non-R+V example: Kirito x Asuna of SAO. I know people had beef with how Asuna was turned from battlegirl bad-ass to damsel in distress, but give it up to Kirito - he fought for his woman, in-game and out. (as an aside, I hope they return Asuna to her bad-assery at some point - what can I say? I've become more of a fan of the whole "battle couple" dynamic).
Battle couples are my OTP's huehue.

Watched a bit of SAO, meh. I got tired halfway through when they went on a honeymoon and found a girl who turned out to....

Yeah that part was weird :/

The theme of "Putting up with adversary" in order to protect my love was great because it was applied to BOTH Tsukune and Moka. Moka nearly desroyed the rosary in "Key" in order to protect Tsukune.

Thats kinda what won Moka/Tsukune for me. From the start it was a reciprocal pledge of "Through sickness and health", that wasn't even done in front of an audience. It wasn't even in front of their partner, it was something they weren't afraid of committing to on their own.

Thats deeeeeep.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diggy DaCosta View Post
You did say you aren't a huge romance guy, so I wont go on and on about it in regard to you and talking about it. I'll just respond to this last thing you said at the top of your recent comment:
I am VERY romantically inclined, its just that I've been burned so much by that topic I rather not talk about it.

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Originally Posted by Diggy DaCosta View Post
I believe you can have a well-written base-romance comedy that takes momentary but successfully detours in action and drama, in the same vein as you can have a well-written comedy that takes detours into action and drama... in the same vein as you can have a well-written coming-of-age drama that takes detours into comedy and action/adventure... in the same vein that you can have a well written action/adventure that detours into romance and comedy. So scarcity can make things more valuable, but you have to consider what the root of your story is. I believe a successful story remembers its base while branching out into other areas while never straying too far from the base.
The base was surviving high-school.

Then the went off and saved the world :P

I started out living life for candy. That's changed a bit. Of course the roots should never be forgotten, and romance is not some unappealing thing. Of course I'd like to see Tsukune share a umbrella with someone close...

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P.S.: I always viewed Virginity to be more of a threshold. Yeah, it's a "one time thing", and once you cross, all new doors can open for you.
Point taken. Its just that the overall trend of the manga has stayed fairly predictable and comedy is too mixed with the romance at times. Never with Moka, but many of the other's girls romantic moments are mixed with comedic ties which make them less "serious".... As if that's possible.

Like everyone laughs at Ruby's tastes... but *&^% she's a girl with feelings too guys...
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Old 2014-09-10, 13:19   Link #25471
Diggy DaCosta
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Well, I'll let you guys deal with the entirety of the R+V world. I prefer to stick with Inner Moka's characterization. Heh, I'm still perfecting how to merge both the anime and manga Inner Mokas into one Inner that I can have a field day with, but as one can imagine, it's hard and yet it's fun..
I'd be very interested to see how you're tackling that, so please share when you get the chance. I'm torn btwn whether the characterizations are different or if it's just that the manga evolved her more. One thing though: I can't see manga Inner Moka asking Tsukune, "am I not good enough for you?" as she did in the 2nd (or 3rd?) to last anime episode.

I'm tackling how the gradual blending of Inner and Outer can play out for future stories. Let me know what ya'll think:

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A Word about Moka: Two Becomes One
Before I talk about how I would have the beginnings of the polygamy agreement play out, I think it’s important to talk about Moka’s blending of her Outer and Inner personalities now that she is (back to) one person. Specifically, how should this blending manifest itself? If we look at the final arc and epilogue from the manga, we know that that Inner Moka’s heart has completed “melted” for Tsukune, thus “catching up” with the feelings of the Outer. By way of the epilogue, we know that while Akasha had cloned herself to be Outer Moka, she slowly imprinted pieces of her personality into the real/Inner Moka to balance the bitter and cold side of her. Starting with her “melting”, we should see how the balance develops through post-Alucard and senior year.
And an aside about her pride: vampires are known throughout lore to be rather prideful creatures, especially those whom are embedded with nobility. Moka is exactly that: a high-powered, skillful vampire from a family of nobility and wealth (the wealth part is somewhat alluded to in the manga; it should be a minor plot point to be played upon at some point in the future of the story). But oddly enough, this pride didn’t turn her into a complete stuck-up snob: that is to say, her pride and background didn’t shape her personality. Instead, Moka infused this pride with her cold, warrior-like mentality, which was then melded by her middle-school years where she was ostracized. It could be said that her alter-ego, the former Outer Moka, was the manifestation of her severely repressed desires for companionship and even love.
...Within cannon, it takes the events of the assault and battles for her to “break” (or as the tropes say, a complete de-frosting of her ice-queen persona). Through self-reflection and the ongoing blending of her mother’s personality within her, I believe the way Moka should continue to develop is for her to realize that her pride is no longer needed as a defense mechanism to keep people away from her. She will never be alone again.


Display of Personality
We see in the epilogue that she’s now playful, cheery and more upbeat – gone is the coldness that emanates from someone who once thought they were destined for loneliness. She’s fully embraced the other girls as her true friends, though she won’t hesitate to kick their asses over Tsukune (also shown in the epilogue). Personally, I would like to see the cheeriness countered with a mix of Inner’s maturity and confidence. I also believe it to be a nice little wrinkle for her to display some cunning and wit when playing around with the group, perhaps becoming a bit of a trickster or schemer from time to time. After all, she’s smarter than everyone save Yukari.

Now, for the other girls...
Quote:
The thought of the future of R+V is that Tsukune takes Moka as his wife. Kurumu and Mizore are the only ones that I can see being concubines and/or secondary wives for Tsukune. And unlike Issa's deal with Akasha and Gyokuro, Moka and the girls are on good terms already. Tsukune is too emotionally invested in both Kurumu and Mizore to not continue a relationship with them, and they with him as well.
Here's what I wrote in my treatment w/r/t that:

Quote:
Given Tsukune’s personality, Moka’s opinion will ultimately be the deciding factor...In the manga, Tsukune moves further and further away from any opportunities to return the many advances made on him by Kurumu and Mizore; Rubi has never really pressed the issue in an upfront manner, and we’ve already discussed Yukari’s position. Moka’s conditional permission (remember: Moka will make clear that she needs to always come first) will provide the watering to the seed Issa Shuzen planted in Tsukune’s mind about proceeding with polygamy.

In time, Tsukune will realize this decision takes a load off his shoulders: instead of eventually facing what he thought was the inevitable moment that he would have to formally reject and even distance himself from the other girls, he can now accept their romantic advances and return them with clear conscience. What will also help his conscience and values is that he is no longer human, and through Issa’s advice, he gradually gains a better understanding that he is not dealing with a romantic situation that would ever manifest itself in the human world he’s used to.
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Old 2014-09-10, 17:12   Link #25472
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Can you guys give it a break already? The manga ended, it's over. If you want to "continue" it as a series of fanfics then take it to fanfiction.net.
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Old 2014-09-10, 21:57   Link #25473
Diggy DaCosta
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Can you guys give it a break already? The manga ended, it's over. If you want to "continue" it as a series of fanfics then take it to fanfiction.net.
Um, a lil rude, don'tcha think?

I started posting on this thread because I was looking for someplace to share thoughts and ideas on how a canon-based sequel could proceed based on what happened in the manga. We've been having good convo so far, even while expressing different opinions. So let's keep it that way, keep things positive, ya?
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Old 2014-09-11, 12:02   Link #25474
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There will be no sequel. It was axed, sales dropped, rankings flopped, the last volume had nothing out of the ordinary and the author has started working on an entirely unrelated new work. The absolute best you can hope for is a cameo of the RosaVamp characters, or "timeskip happened and now their children are side characters in the author's new work!" kind of deal.
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Old 2014-09-11, 14:53   Link #25475
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Hai hai, Nazi-san.

Nothing has been written, these are just ideas. And even so ... *points to the post title* Separation of the topics - that's what it's for. So as long as it's labeled such, and we're still talking about Rosario + Vampire, then there shouldn't be a problem, right?
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Old 2014-09-11, 20:28   Link #25476
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Just remember that it was stated Fairy Tale group still had run in's with Tsukune's group, but that is saved for another story.
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Old 2014-09-11, 23:34   Link #25477
GreyZone
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Urgh not this again. It's "Fairy Tale" here. It refers to a "childrens' story". "Fairy Tail" however literally refers to the tail of a fairy, which to my knowledge is never used outside of the Manga of the same name.
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Old 2014-09-12, 02:45   Link #25478
Diggy DaCosta
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Originally Posted by amtro View Post
There will be no sequel. It was axed, sales dropped, rankings flopped, the last volume had nothing out of the ordinary and the author has started working on an entirely unrelated new work. The absolute best you can hope for is a cameo of the RosaVamp characters, or "timeskip happened and now their children are side characters in the author's new work!" kind of deal.
A lot of popular shows wane in their ratings late-run. Everything has a shelf-life. And from what I understand, if the ratings in Japan ain't hittin, they can give a damn about American ratings/etc.

That said...

Reboots happen. Rights to stories can be sold to others who have different visions on how to execute and market a story. Shows and movie concepts that flop can be reborn with the right backing, good vision and good writing. R+V manga ran ten years - that's a damned good run, and I can definitely understand if the magaka felt he ran his course writing it.

Despite the current model for manga popularity, R+V consistently made the New York Times top rankings. That has to stand for something. And like I said in a previous post, the supernatural is a hot trend right now in the U.S. (They rebooted the Teen Wolf movies into a series on MTV, and it's actually pretty good. Witty dialogue, decent characters and a gradual expansion of the Teen Wolf universe into areas the movies never touched)

What I want to know is, can an American buy the rights to a manga (not just U.S. animation rights) and then build a plan to reboot the series here and market it? The animation style doesn't have to change (much); I understand that you can't call it "anime" if it's not made in Japan, but the Boondocks had me fooled before I learned the difference between anime and anime-inspired animation.

There's SO much more story available to this series. I really believe that a well-done reboot can set up the R+V universe to eventually expand beyond its current parameters.
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Old 2014-09-12, 03:10   Link #25479
kusabireika
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geez .... I thought the tread is dead already oh well I will wait for mangaka new project p.s. this will be my last post here
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Old 2014-09-12, 23:39   Link #25480
Diggy DaCosta
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Nope...
I mean I'm more than happy to continue the convo as long as other are interested.

Here's a thought: the reason I found this site and the reason I'm writing up my own "treatment" for story progression is because it's hard to find a fanfic that takes over right at the conclusion of the manga. It's cool that folks take what they like out of the story and build their own fics off it, no doubt. But since I've already started my writing, I figure maybe I'll come up with some sort of fanfic of my own.

My mind does funny things: I believe I can analyze most of the major story openings Ikeda either left open or open to interpretation, then build upon these to conceptualize pretty well in terms of where I'd like to see the general direction of the "sequel" go. But the details come in bits and pieces, and there's certain things I struggle to capture.

For example: our favorite genius/perverted pre-teen Yukari. I get it: the Japanese don't like pedo anymore than Americans, but the difference is they'll dance around it in their anime, whereas most American shows just wont touch it period. To me, Yukari's character has always straddled a bit of a fine line, and that line is a key element for interaction and humor in R+V. So what happens to your normal pre-teen as they grow from age 11 to 13?


C'mon... guess...

...

Yeap that's right: PUBERTY!

This wasn't addressed in the manga (understandably), but if a pre-teen, yearning-bisexual Yukari was a handful, what on Earth would a pubescent 13-yr old Yukari be like? She already knows (or desires) way too much through the course of the manga. What happens when her hormones and bodily changes start to catch up with her brain?

Let's make this a group exercise, folks. Have at it...
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