Learning Japanese

[Haak]

Just out of curiosity, how good is Rosetta Stone for learning Japanese anyway?

[Alchemist007]

I used it for a tiny bit of Russian, it's an ok way to get the feel of the language and on the same level as something you'd want if you were just briefly visiting Japan, but ultimately less effective than a real education. If you want an introduction, it's OK but I'd suggest just going with a teacher.

[Irenicus]

Originally Posted by Haak

Just out of curiosity, how good is Rosetta Stone for learning Japanese anyway?

Rosetta has a pretty bad reputation for any language that does not share your language's alphabet and grammatical structures in some ways.

It focused too much on the whole "natural learning" schpiel. That can work if you're working with some ideas of where to go, for example if you already know a romance language (French, Spanish, Italian, etc.) and want to learn another in a fortnight.

Japanese however requires three new writing systems, but more importantly very different grammatical structures. That requires organized teaching, or at the very least organized sources of information.

[Kudryavka]

Originally Posted by Alchemist007

Komari - the master of your fate (as evidenced by the signature).

What does that have to do with this

[Alchemist007]

To be a master of fate is to have some magical control, which is what Link seems to be doing.

[Edijs]

How can i get job in japan if i dont know japanese its very bad.

so anyone can help me learn something please? I will be your best friend

[Mystique]

Originally Posted by Edijs

How can i get job in japan if i dont know japanese its very bad.

so anyone can help me learn something please? I will be your best friend

Easy, you have a degree, come to any English teaching school, live life as an ALT and just speak/teach English.
If you hang out in Roppoingi, you can be part of the gaijin bubble that never bothers to learn or use Japanese and just piss about here

PS: I am not encouraging this, it just gives the rest of us Westerners a bad name, when people come to mess about here with no aim in their lives.
Try for online skype courses with webcam which will get you in touch with native speakers from afar if there are no courses near you.

[Kudryavka]

Originally Posted by Alchemist007

To be a master of fate is to have some magical control, which is what Link seems to be doing.

Ok, I get it now, lol. Thanks for explaining

[Edijs]

This was post i made mistake by diffrent theards, my mistake.

[Hatsune_AR]

How about this website to learn Hiragana?

http://www.darugo.jp/

So cute illustrations!!
We can watch stroke-order animation and hear native pronunciation !!

[Kyero Fox]

Think i'm learning japanese think i'm learning japanese, I really think so! ba da da dan dan dan~

Sorry XD just had to do it, a little bored.

[chikorita157]

I have started self-studying Japanese few weeks ago and I was able to get both writing systems down and can read them proficiently in the matters of two weeks. I focused mostly on reading the characters before going on writing them. Also, making flash cards in Anki were a big help in remembering them and it's free (open source software).

If one still has trouble with the Kana just from charts and flashcards, Remembering the Kana by James Heisig (the person who also make the Remembering the Kanji series) also a big help. It's relatively inexpensive and it's what I used to get the Hiragana/Katakana down within weeks.

[Alchemist007]

If you want to continue learning Kanji I'd first recommend Japanese: The Written Language by Eleanor Jorden. It's perfect in introducing and utilizing them in reading examples. I just wish I could find something as good for more kanji, since this goes up to 400. I wish I could find a book good enough to continue learning the same way.

ed: This seems to be a very useful program http://ankisrs.net/

The JLPT material is great as well as the 8555 sentences.

[NoemiChan]

I'm trying to learn Japanese right now but damn, I think I must review my basic English sentence structuren again. Damn the particles, verb conjunctions and many rule excepted verbs adjective etc...

But I will learn it, I'll bet I will you. Hehe

[Miko Miko]

Originally Posted by Edijs

How can i get job in japan if i dont know japanese its very bad.

Would there be a point? Unable to communicate with many people around you unless they speak English.. Not fun.

&& Ohhh, I start a Japanese class next year, it's a 1 year class though.. probably 1-2 evenings a week.. September - July..

Is that long enough? I mean, I pick up things quickly.. which is good.. but like since there's so much to learn one year might not be enough right?

[Alchemist007]

Enough for what? 1 year is enough to learn Hiragana and Katakana. My teacher didn't start kanji (the actual hard stuff) until start of year 2. Of course you should take it to get some basics done right. 70% of my first semester's class didn't make it to semester 2, so it's one way to figure out if you have realistic expectations.

[Raiga]

Originally Posted by Alchemist007

Enough for what? 1 year is enough to learn Hiragana and Katakana. My teacher didn't start kanji (the actual hard stuff) until start of year 2. Of course you should take it to get some basics done right. 70% of my first semester's class didn't make it to semester 2, so it's one way to figure out if you have realistic expectations.

An afternoon is enough to learn Hiragana and Katakana. Maybe a week or two to really master it. It's only 90 simple characters; if you're diligent you'll know them in no time.

In response to "is that long enough?" I ask the same question: long enough for what? There is no hard line between "knowing the language" and "not knowing the language." You're going to start off, then know a bit more, then know a bit more, then start to be able to say some things, then start to be able to say some more complicated things, then start to understand simple conversations, then more complicated conversations, and then you'll be nearly fluent, and then pretty much fluent, and eventually very fluent. But nowhere along the way is there a clear landmark that says "now I know the language." It's all gradual.

[Alchemist007]

I meant from a (standard?) Japanese class, all you will learn is those kanas in 1 year. I doubt many average students would be passing J-101 if they had to learn Kanji right off the bat as well.

[Raiga]

Originally Posted by Alchemist007

I meant from a (standard?) Japanese class, all you will learn is those kanas in 1 year. I doubt many average students would be passing J-101 if they had to learn Kanji right off the bat as well.

At my school students are expected to have a vocabulary of ~150 kanji by the end of first year. It's fully possible for a first-year course to require students to master kana within the first month or two and start gradually introducing simple kanji after that. I mean, imagine what it must be like in Chinese language classes. You can't exactly use pinyin all year.

I don't know how the language program is set up at your school, but that sounds too slow to me, personally. Anyone self-studying, especially, should have the diligence to learn all the kana reliably well by the third week. Without mastery of the kana, you can't move on into anything more advanced; its the most basic of the basic.

[Alchemist007]

Well my teacher emphasized vocabulary more than anything the first year. The second year we learned ~200 Kanji and more advanced sentence structure. IMO it's a good way to get the students knowing the words and speaking rather than throwing that many foreign letters at the same time. I mean I certainly would've handled a good number of Kanji just fine but it is what it is. Unfortunately my school didn't even have a proper degree for Japanese, just 4 semesters with the best teacher in the world