AnimeSuki Forums

Trogdor Jube · 2013-07-11, 22:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirty_Harry

Many clues will be like Deus Ex Machina in the School Trial.

Throughout the game there are several pieces of evidence and bits of information that are discovered only during the trials. It's not that thier DEM's but rather discussion tends to lead to new information being revealed and thus painting a clearer picture of who what when where why and how
Stating that "the ball was soft" an episode before the trial is really no different then stating that "the ball was soft" a few minutes before the trial or during the trial. The point is there's no info being revealed and the idea is that the viewer will follow along with the debates as if they were there, hearing what everyone has to say and what everyone found rather then playing the role of the beholder who gets to see what everyone found before the actual debate begins and what everyone will be revealing during it.

AC-Phoenix · 2013-07-11, 22:54

Well Only showing the clues without explaining them is fine imho;
That is if you at least know how they were found, instead of them being magically pulled out of a top hat.

Edit:
So finally got to watch the episode

2 (actually 3) vital clues seem to be missing the rest was just moved or left to the viewer for examination.
Trying to solve the entire incident will be hard without those two though lol.

Whodunit and howdunit are still solvable the whydunit will be a bit more of thinkwork though...

Crimrui · 2013-07-12, 08:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Von Himmel

Spoiler:

I love her design. Was screaming at my PSP when that scene kicked in.

When the episode started, I too was thinking how faithful it's being adapted, but as soon as investigation kicked in they rushed it, and I'm simply giving thumb down for that. 13 episodes simply isn't enough. With this pace the audience won't give a damn about characters when they aren't fleshed out. I mean as I played the game, I'll still enjoy it but don't know for others...

hamazura · 2013-07-12, 08:54

Kyouko <3
"upupupu.... daahahahahaha!!!!"
Is monokuma theme actually played in anime? That BGM is so funny

gecd · 2013-07-12, 10:54

awwww
I still wish the blood is red
this anime doesnt satisfy my thirsty of guro

Shadow5YA · 2013-07-12, 12:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by gecd

awwww
I still wish the blood is red
this anime doesnt satisfy my thirsty of guro

The blood was pink even in the game.

Dengar · 2013-07-12, 14:35

I always lol'd at the pink blood. In a good way. I mean, it doesn't stop anyone from realising it's blood, yet somehow it DOES bump the rating down a little.

As for the investigation, to be honest, it was pretty much exactly like I expected, so my complaint about it is rather mild. Adapting the "fair play whodunit" of a game to a 1 cour anime is hard enough as is. Perhaps some of the missing clues will come up during the trial. In that case, that's not so much a deus ex machina as it's just clues we don't know about yet. For example, one could assume not all of the clues were found by Naegi in the first place, instead having other characters pitch in as well.

Not sure if they're actually GOING for this, but it wouldn't be a disaster if it all went like that.

Remember, the trial is not an explanation of whodunit, with the detective already knowing the answer ahead of time. It's a debate to determine whodunit.

Gundamx · 2013-07-12, 14:59

sub out
anyway, they cut a lot from the game
almost whole first chapter story been cut ( info about maizono+ at least make us care about her...etc)
+
fast investigation phase
(I waste a lot of time here... yet they show it like it was simple to find all that clues...
+ like other people said > the cut some important clue )

unless they want to kill maizono fast without any character info so die-hard otaku fan will not get angry?

than again it's only 13 eps >>> they take about 3 eps for chapter 0/1
(prologue, chapter one story, investigation phase, class trail)
so how many eps every chapter will take?
(I have bad feeling they will do like some other light novel anime >>> whole volume in one eps = cut most of the story)

+
it look like every time someone die >> the will show up in the ending
(unlike devil survivor where they get remove from it)

Kirito · 2013-07-12, 15:06

I just finished the second episode and finally I can come to this thread and discuss things without being left out of the loop. Note this is someone who's hasn't played the game yet, so bear with me on my thoughts regarding this.

Spoiler for Episode 2 Thoughts:

So the murder has happened, but the situation and case is awkward for the MC due to the fact that he was the last one to see Sayaka alive and first to see her dead. The one thing that goes me interested the most in the investigation phase was the bloody number code in the shower room.

I really liked the example of punishment for breaking the school rules came into play, in Junko's case. As much as it was painful and brutal to watch her go like that I had to phrase the fact that rule enforcement is once again used as not only as an intimidation factor, but to further set an example to the students to know their place and where they stand in all of this. Nice to see that the rules post murder from the game being explained in a condensed and somewhat thorough fashion. Perfect murder = innocents die while killer leaves. Crime solved = Innocents leaves while the killer gets killed for disturbing the order of the school, which in turn is ironic due to the fact that murder was encouraged for "graduation" from Monobears standpoint. Regarding the punishment, I'm sure that there was more to say, but won't touch on that for the time being.

In an anime standpoint it's fair to say that the MC is the prime suspect, but the fact that Sayaka's and Makoto's door room tags were switched really got me to think about things. It got me thinking that possibly that someone or people were watching and monitoring them waiting to make a move. This is just pure baseless conjuncture, but as of now the other classmates/suspects are pointing the finger towards him, it's to be expected since she died in her room, and it's a good excuse for the killer or "ers" to cover their tracks... for the time being.

There were many things to take note of, but over all, like I said, the bloody number code, the switched name tags, and at the fact that the room Sayaka was in wasn't locked. Whether or not it was a forced entry or she opened it believing it to be Makoto, we don't know. I'm going to say that the culprit is most likely someone who could potential overpower a young girl let around fracture her arm like that. Just speaking in the pretext of the adaptation rather than the original game itself.

Overall two people are now dead, one murdered by someone and other for breaking the school rules. All and all a good episode as it showed us a bit of the investigation phase, the explanation of the rules post murder, and an idea of how the school trial will take place.

My gripes were the Sayaka was dead, but will hold off that for the sake of the adaptation and to keep my general interest in the series in mind. Plus, at the fact that the murder leading to the investigation didn't really have a good natural lead in into it. It's to be expected since with 13 episode and 11 more to go, it's probably to get the investigation and trial aspect going in full circle.

It looks to be that the ending theme (despite being cool and catchy) will likely be a collection of people who die during the anime experience. Depending if the killer get away than all 11 plus the MC will be there minus the crime doer.

Now off to either play the game and finish it or go back to the game walkthrough I'm following to catch up on the relevant stuff that episode 2 did or did not cover.

Dengar · 2013-07-12, 15:06

So... I'm the only one who thought from the start that 25 episodes is way too much for a game as short and high on fluff as this one?

Kirito · 2013-07-12, 15:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dengar

So... I'm the only one who thought from the start that 25 episodes is way too much for a game as short and high on fluff as this one?

I wouldn't say so probably due to the fact that the game has "Social Link" type of mechanics that the Persona series have. It could be possible to expand the series a little longer if took the time to delve into the characters a bit more, and the MC getting to bond with them or whoever is left. I'm sure we'll see that but not as in depth as the games.

**Klashikari** · 2013-07-12, 15:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dengar

So... I'm the only one who thought from the start that 25 episodes is way too much for a game as short and high on fluff as this one?

Actually, considering the original game, an accurate adaptation would require 19-22 episodes, and they could easely fill the rest with content from Dangan Ronpa 0 and/or Dangan Ronpa IF.
Expecting 24 episodes from the game alone isn't far fetched, especially if you factor free time social links and potential anime exclusive content/bridging content towards other material.

Gundamx · 2013-07-12, 15:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clarami

I wouldn't say so probably due to the fact that the game has "Social Link" type of mechanics that the Persona series have. It could be possible to expand the series a little longer if took the time to delve into the characters a bit more, and the MC getting to bond with them or whoever is left. I'm sure we'll see that but not as in depth as the games.

This and the anime cut 90% of story phase from chapter one

SquirrelLuvsPnut · 2013-07-12, 15:28

When people stop watching because of character deaths, in an anime about murder...?????
I'm sad that Junko bit it so soon. I thought she seemed spunky and would last longer. I'm not gonna stop watching just because of that though. That number clue has me thinking of one character who might be the murderer. I'm usually wrong about these things though.

AC-Phoenix · 2013-07-12, 15:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dengar

Not sure if they're actually GOING for this, but it wouldn't be a disaster if it all went like that.

Remember, the trial is not an explanation of whodunit, with the detective already knowing the answer ahead of time. It's a debate to determine whodunit.

They are going for this I guess, in the game not all clues were found by naegi either.
All in all only two of them are missing, which they can compensate for during the debate.
I just hope there won't be any visible MTB's and Flythrough text shoot-downs....

The detective does not yet know how did it btw.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gundamx

sub out
anyway, they cut a lot from the game
almost whole first chapter story been cut ( info about maizono+ at least make us care about her...etc)
+
fast investigation phase
(I waste a lot of time here... yet they show it like it was simple to find all that clues...
+ like other people said > the cut some important clue )

unless they want to kill maizono fast without any character info so die-hard otaku fan will not get angry?

than again it's only 13 eps >>> they take about 3 eps for chapter 0/1
(prologue, chapter one story, investigation phase, class trail)
so how many eps every chapter will take?
(I have bad feeling they will do like some other light novel anime >>> whole volume in one eps = cut most of the story)

+
it look like every time someone die >> the will show up in the ending
(unlike devil survivor where they get remove from it)

Uff I'm not don't know if they made popularity votes for her, or how they went. I can't imagine she was one of the more popular characters though. All those 'Because I'm an esper' - jokes really get to people.
Finding the clues and understanding them is simple btw; the mystery is not really hard and I think everyone has already figured out who did it.

Two of the clues are missing, which they probably did in order to make the howdunit and whydunit a bit harder.

Personally I would have given the Anime different Mysteries/Culprits/ Victims.
While I'm glad I didn't have to listen to all the esper stuff, Maizono and lots of other soon-goners would in my opinion be more interesting at the end of the story than some others.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dengar

So... I'm the only one who thought from the start that 25 episodes is way too much for a game as short and high on fluff as this one?

The guy who did the lets plays has several one to two hours long videos per chapter. He admittingly went afk sometimes whithout stopping the record, but the game itself isn't exactly too short either. Build in a bit character information and you got enough material for 25 episodes.

On the other hand I think I would have gone crazy if I would have had to hear all her 'I'm an esper' jokes...

hamazura · 2013-07-12, 15:29

So the studio saving too much money and make this series 13 episode instead of 24-26, sigh i can already see the outcome...
I mean this series is fun, coz the cases arent impossible to solve by ourself, maybe the director want to surprisemadafuka the viewer with super twist deus ex machina proof in court room -_-

Again with game>>>>>>anime adaptation.... Not only > but >>>>>>>>>> -_-

Dengar · 2013-07-12, 15:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Klashikari

Actually, considering the original game, an accurate adaptation would require 19-22 episodes, and they could easely fill the rest with content from Dangan Ronpa 0 and/or Dangan Ronpa IF.
Expecting 24 episodes from the game alone isn't far fetched, especially if you factor free time social links and potential anime exclusive content/bridging content towards other material.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

The guy who did the lets plays has several one to two hours long videos per chapter. He admittingly went afk sometimes whithout stopping the record, but the game itself isn't exactly too short either. Build in a bit character information and you got enough material for 25 episodes.

I disagree. If you did that, you would end up with at least 10 episodes of nothing happening at all. The first death wouldn't even happen until the end of episode 3.

SquirrelLuvsPnut · 2013-07-12, 15:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dengar

I disagree. If you did that, you would end up with at least 10 episodes of nothing happening at all. The first death wouldn't even happen until the end of episode 3.

Yes! I remember thinking that a few anime would have been better if the episode amount was cut shorter, since there was literally episodes and episodes worth of BS. Dangan Ronpa cuts straight to the delicious murder.

**Klashikari** · 2013-07-12, 15:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dengar

I disagree. If you did that, you would end up with at least 10 episodes of nothing happening at all. The first death wouldn't even happen until the end of episode 3.

Who said you can't rearrange things to have a steady pacing for the anime?
Having the first death at the end of episode 2 would be a fair timing, pushing the cliffhanger as well.
Funnily enough, I consider the first case being rushed as hell due to the corpse discovery timing instead of the investigation: not only very little is known about the victim prior their death, but the incident is played in a very quick succession of other events and rushed investigation, leaving less impact than an actual cliffhanger.

Frankly, if people can't stick with a series past 2 episodes, just because a murder didn't happen prior episode 3, that's quite a limited attention span if you ask me.

Kirito · 2013-07-12, 15:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dengar

I disagree. If you did that, you would end up with at least 10 episodes of nothing happening at all. The first death wouldn't even happen until the end of episode 3.

Wouldn't that technically be a good thing considering that we could get another episode where we get to know the characters a bit more, and a means to see their respective "drives" or motivation to risk committing a murder in order to "graduate". Having a murder at the end of episode 2 would have been the best idea, to get the overall context going in a fair and steady point. I'm not saying make over 5-6 episodes of making sure that nothing happens, but it'll possibly give leeway to allow certain elements from the game to be implemented instead of rushed, which is the current complaint right now.

I'm no expert on the game and what happens, but I'm just speaking from a "potential fan" standpoint instead of veterans and people who have laid hands on the original source material.

2013-07-11, 22:54	Link #342
AC-Phoenix Detective Join Date: Aug 2010 Age: 36	Well Only showing the clues without explaining them is fine imho; That is if you at least know how they were found, instead of them being magically pulled out of a top hat. Edit: So finally got to watch the episode 2 (actually 3) vital clues seem to be missing the rest was just moved or left to the viewer for examination. Trying to solve the entire incident will be hard without those two though lol. Whodunit and howdunit are still solvable the whydunit will be a bit more of thinkwork though... __________________ Those who forget about the past are condemned to repeat it - Santayana Sidenote: I'm seemingly too dumb for my current keyboard, so if you see the same character twice in a row, when it doesn't belong there just ignore it. Last edited by AC-Phoenix; 2013-07-11 at 23:35.

2013-07-12, 08:54	Link #344
hamazura whatever Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: wherever	Kyouko <3 "upupupu.... daahahahahaha!!!!" Is monokuma theme actually played in anime? That BGM is so funny __________________

2013-07-12, 10:54	Link #345
gecd Cah Gunungkidul Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Jogja Age: 35	awwww I still wish the blood is red this anime doesnt satisfy my thirsty of guro __________________ Wedang Jahe Kalengan, teman anda melewati malam yang dingin dan sepi! 0% alcohol, 80% ginger syrup, 10% love, 10% GALAU!!

2013-07-12, 15:06	Link #349
Kirito Enjoying Snack Time! Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Where It's Legal to Marry Clara and Alice Age: 35	I just finished the second episode and finally I can come to this thread and discuss things without being left out of the loop. Note this is someone who's hasn't played the game yet, so bear with me on my thoughts regarding this. Spoiler for Episode 2 Thoughts: So the murder has happened, but the situation and case is awkward for the MC due to the fact that he was the last one to see Sayaka alive and first to see her dead. The one thing that goes me interested the most in the investigation phase was the bloody number code in the shower room. I really liked the example of punishment for breaking the school rules came into play, in Junko's case. As much as it was painful and brutal to watch her go like that I had to phrase the fact that rule enforcement is once again used as not only as an intimidation factor, but to further set an example to the students to know their place and where they stand in all of this. Nice to see that the rules post murder from the game being explained in a condensed and somewhat thorough fashion. Perfect murder = innocents die while killer leaves. Crime solved = Innocents leaves while the killer gets killed for disturbing the order of the school, which in turn is ironic due to the fact that murder was encouraged for "graduation" from Monobears standpoint. Regarding the punishment, I'm sure that there was more to say, but won't touch on that for the time being. In an anime standpoint it's fair to say that the MC is the prime suspect, but the fact that Sayaka's and Makoto's door room tags were switched really got me to think about things. It got me thinking that possibly that someone or people were watching and monitoring them waiting to make a move. This is just pure baseless conjuncture, but as of now the other classmates/suspects are pointing the finger towards him, it's to be expected since she died in her room, and it's a good excuse for the killer or "ers" to cover their tracks... for the time being. There were many things to take note of, but over all, like I said, the bloody number code, the switched name tags, and at the fact that the room Sayaka was in wasn't locked. Whether or not it was a forced entry or she opened it believing it to be Makoto, we don't know. I'm going to say that the culprit is most likely someone who could potential overpower a young girl let around fracture her arm like that. Just speaking in the pretext of the adaptation rather than the original game itself. Overall two people are now dead, one murdered by someone and other for breaking the school rules. All and all a good episode as it showed us a bit of the investigation phase, the explanation of the rules post murder, and an idea of how the school trial will take place. My gripes were the Sayaka was dead, but will hold off that for the sake of the adaptation and to keep my general interest in the series in mind. Plus, at the fact that the murder leading to the investigation didn't really have a good natural lead in into it. It's to be expected since with 13 episode and 11 more to go, it's probably to get the investigation and trial aspect going in full circle. It looks to be that the ending theme (despite being cool and catchy) will likely be a collection of people who die during the anime experience. Depending if the killer get away than all 11 plus the MC will be there minus the crime doer. Now off to either play the game and finish it or go back to the game walkthrough I'm following to catch up on the relevant stuff that episode 2 did or did not cover. __________________

2013-07-12, 15:29	Link #356
hamazura whatever Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: wherever	So the studio saving too much money and make this series 13 episode instead of 24-26, sigh i can already see the outcome... I mean this series is fun, coz the cases arent impossible to solve by ourself, maybe the director want to surprisemadafuka the viewer with super twist deus ex machina proof in court room -_- Again with game>>>>>>anime adaptation.... Not only > but >>>>>>>>>> -_- __________________

2013-07-12, 14:35	Link #347
Dengar Kamen Rider Muppeteer Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Unknown Age: 39	I always lol'd at the pink blood. In a good way. I mean, it doesn't stop anyone from realising it's blood, yet somehow it DOES bump the rating down a little. As for the investigation, to be honest, it was pretty much exactly like I expected, so my complaint about it is rather mild. Adapting the "fair play whodunit" of a game to a 1 cour anime is hard enough as is. Perhaps some of the missing clues will come up during the trial. In that case, that's not so much a deus ex machina as it's just clues we don't know about yet. For example, one could assume not all of the clues were found by Naegi in the first place, instead having other characters pitch in as well. Not sure if they're actually GOING for this, but it wouldn't be a disaster if it all went like that. Remember, the trial is not an explanation of whodunit, with the detective already knowing the answer ahead of time. It's a debate to determine whodunit.

2013-07-12, 14:59	Link #348
Gundamx Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2010	sub out anyway, they cut a lot from the game almost whole first chapter story been cut ( info about maizono+ at least make us care about her...etc) + fast investigation phase (I waste a lot of time here... yet they show it like it was simple to find all that clues... + like other people said > the cut some important clue ) unless they want to kill maizono fast without any character info so die-hard otaku fan will not get angry? than again it's only 13 eps >>> they take about 3 eps for chapter 0/1 (prologue, chapter one story, investigation phase, class trail) so how many eps every chapter will take? (I have bad feeling they will do like some other light novel anime >>> whole volume in one eps = cut most of the story) + it look like every time someone die >> the will show up in the ending (unlike devil survivor where they get remove from it)

2013-07-12, 15:06	Link #350
Dengar Kamen Rider Muppeteer Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Unknown Age: 39	So... I'm the only one who thought from the start that 25 episodes is way too much for a game as short and high on fluff as this one?

2013-07-12, 15:28	Link #354
SquirrelLuvsPnut Kill on sight Join Date: Apr 2007	When people stop watching because of character deaths, in an anime about murder...????? I'm sad that Junko bit it so soon. I thought she seemed spunky and would last longer. I'm not gonna stop watching just because of that though. That number clue has me thinking of one character who might be the murderer. I'm usually wrong about these things though.