Aquarion Series: Genesis-to-EVOL Speculation/spoiler discussion thread

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Zuul

The dog spoiler is confirmed it seems.

According to Japaneses who bought Spoon, it was an interwiew with Yamamoto the director, and he was serious.



It's fantastic, and the troll of the decade...

Not 100% confirmed but it is gaining lot of legitimacy.

If the dog spoiler is true, I'd be shocked if Zessica isn't Apollo and if Mykage isn't Touma. If Amata/Kagura are the dog, then Apollo almost has to be Zessica by sheer process of elimination of remaining important characters (not to mention you'd think Apollo would have to be there to trigger some of the things that Zessica triggered). And if Zessica is Apollo, then Mykage being Touma fits so beautifully.

If Zessica is Apollo and Mykage is Touma, it's probably going to be interesting to see how this all plays out. Zessica might still get a bad/bitter end anyway (Mikono: Who cares if Amata is a reincarnated dog? I still love him anyways!), but it opens up a few different possibilities at least.

[finalfury]

If the dog spoiler is true, my mind just got blown away by that damm epic troll.

[Triple_R]

Some (hopefully) funny ideas I have if the dog spoiler is true.

Image Idea 1/Demotivational Poster: Zessica crying while Amata flies off with Mikono (Dogs: Not a Man's Best Friend After All)

Image Idea 2/Demotivational Poster 2: Mykage looking dramatic in the background while Amata and Kagura chase after Mikono dog-style (Who Let the Dogs Out?!: Answer - Mykage did!)

Image Idea 3: Zessica hitting Amata over the head with a rolled up newspaper and shouting "Sit, boy, sit!" while Amata salivates over a dog version of Mikono walking by.

Image Idea 4: Screen-shot of freaked out Mikono from when Zessica told her about her plans to not give up on Amata. Photoshop thought bubble coming off of Mikono ('OMG! Apollo wants to get with his own dog!')


Feel free to come up with your own, folks. This spoiler is comedy gold!

[kuromitsu]

"Oh, there goes Mikono-san!"

"Uwah I saw her p-p-panties~!"

Actually, I just remembered that the music in Evol is released under the Flying Dog label... 8D;;

[Vena]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

Well, nothing particularly important would change - given that both Amata and Kagura are humans, at least Amata is, not so sure about Kagura (re: demonwolf). Then again, I suppose people who complain about the "fighting fate" motif would be satisfied, since a dog really needs to fight fate to win his mistress' love... ^^;;

I refuse to be satisfied... (is it really fighting fate (?) since the (supposed) fated couple are not into yuri, there doesn't seem to be any fated opposition )


...Why did a giant robot stalk a dog?

[mayumi]

This universe is the world of dogs. This is why Mikono is not blonde and has similarities to Alicia(Amata's mother) who was Pollon's owner I wonder if Pollon had a lover? How did Rena come about? Is Pollon a guy or a girl? If a guy, how did he reincarnate into Rena?

[Destined_Fate]

Originally Posted by genjo sanzo

What should we do if it's all true? Amagura was a dog long time ago, now it's human, he needs to live that life...away from Mikono and Zessica if possible.
Zessica turning into Apollo? We won't get any happy end.

It would be some crazy trolling and make everyone look like a bunch of fools for taking EVOL too seriously. Than I can just wait for EVOL to get into Super Robot Wars and let the writers there fix EVOL like they fixed Gundam Seed Destiny, End of Evangelion, Code Geass ending, and ect.

[GoldenLand]

So, either the spoiler is true, or the director is outright lying. Which means it's probably true. YESSSSSSSSSSSS.

This is wonderful. Aquarion was my favourite out of the current season of anime anyway, but this spoiler makes it so much better as a series. To check on some lines, I had a flick through some of the earlier eps. While looking through them, the fact of knowing that spoiler and that because of it Zessica is most likely Apollo makes a huge difference to the characterisation and interactions.

All of Mikono's jealous scenes took place with Amata and Zessica there, didn't they? The scene in episode 17 where Mikono walks in after having seen what she thought was a compromising situation with Amata and Zessica...The scene reads differently knowing Mikono = Sylvia and Zessica = Apollo. The intensity in Mikono's gaze might not just be there because she thinks Zessica is trying to steal Amata. Or at least it's possible to interpret it that way. At any rate, Zessica and Mikono's interactions throughout the whole series are a lot more fun if they are Apollo and Sylvia's reincarnations.

Originally Posted by Triple_R

If the dog spoiler is true, I'd be shocked if Zessica isn't Apollo and if Mykage isn't Touma. If Amata/Kagura are the dog, then Apollo almost has to be Zessica by sheer process of elimination of remaining important characters (not to mention you'd think Apollo would have to be there to trigger some of the things that Zessica triggered). And if Zessica is Apollo, then Mykage being Touma fits so beautifully.

It really is beautiful.

Looking at the flashbacks we've seen to the earlier series via EVOL's Aquarion, the only characters seen there are: Apollo, Sylvia, Fudo, and Toma. EVOL as a series was made so that new viewers who hadn't seen Genesis could enjoy it. It would be odd for them to make EVOL so that it can only be understood with heavy knowledge of characters who aren't even shown in Aquarion's flashbacks. It could probably be done once or so - and this is the way it must be with Amata's previous doggy incarnation - but it would be reasonable to assume that the characters we've been shown are the important ones.

So I think it really does increase the likelihood of Mykage being Toma. Although I don't understand why he wouldn't know about Aquarion's location.

[Zaresh]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

"oh, there goes mikono-san!"

"uwah i saw her p-p-panties~!"

actually, i just remembered that the music in evol is released under the flying dog label... 8d;;

oh, god, this is madness!

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by GoldenLand

So, either the spoiler is true, or the director is outright lying. Which means it's probably true. YESSSSSSSSSSSS.

This is wonderful. Aquarion was my favourite out of the current season of anime anyway, but this spoiler makes it so much better as a series. To check on some lines, I had a flick through some of the earlier eps. While looking through them, the fact of knowing that spoiler and that because of it Zessica is most likely Apollo makes a huge difference to the characterisation and interactions.

All of Mikono's jealous scenes took place with Amata and Zessica there, didn't they? The scene in episode 17 where Mikono walks in after having seen what she thought was a compromising situation with Amata and Zessica...The scene reads differently knowing Mikono = Sylvia and Zessica = Apollo. The intensity in Mikono's gaze might not just be there because she thinks Zessica is trying to steal Amata. Or at least it's possible to interpret it that way. At any rate, Zessica and Mikono's interactions throughout the whole series are a lot more fun if they are Apollo and Sylvia's reincarnations.

I think that Okada/Kawamori have given themselves just enough room that if they want to pull a Zessica/Mikono ending (with or without one of them becoming a man on Altair) they can make it work, presuming that Mikono = Sylvia and Zessica = Apollo. They'd also need to make the key reincarnation reveals very soon, but if they do, I think they could make it work.

I wouldn't write that if not for the beach episode, of all things. The beach episode had a couple Zessica/Mikono scenes that struck me as a bit yuri (furthermore, they struck me as yuri with Zessica clearly in the more masculine/protective role). I almost brought it up back when the episode first aired, but I thought "Nah, this is just you and your huge yuri goggles again, Triple_R... Besides, Amata/Mikono is clearly the way it's going!".

Take away the beach episode, and there's just not enough foreshadowing there, even if Zessica = Apollo and Mikono = Sylvia. Even as is, it is stretching it a bit, admittedly. If we do get Zessica/Mikono, then that beach episode will be THE most plot-relevant anime beach episode of ALL TIME.

This is just a guess, but I'd say there's a 10 percent chance of a Zessica/Mikono end. I think that Amata/Mikono is still most likely, even with that dog spoiler, but it's not quite as predictable now (thankfully).

[GoldenLand]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

I think that Okada/Kawamori have given themselves just enough room that if they want to pull a Zessica/Mikono ending (with or without one of them becoming a man on Altair) they can make it work, presuming that Mikono = Sylvia and Zessica = Apollo. They'd also need to make the key reincarnation reveals very soon, but if they do, I think they could make it work.

I wouldn't write that if not for the beach episode, of all things. The beach episode had a couple Zessica/Mikono scenes that struck me as a bit yuri (furthermore, they struck me as yuri with Zessica clearly in the more masculine/protective role). I almost brought it up back when the episode first aired, but I thought "Nah, this is just you and your huge yuri goggles again, Triple_R... Besides, Amata/Mikono is clearly the way it's going!".

I'm not holding out a lot of hope for a Zessica/Mikono ending, although I certainly wouldn't be complaining if there was one, despite also liking Mikono/Amata. They would have to pull off some masterful writing in order to get it to work. It could be done. But what I would like to see (assuming Zess = Apollo) is for the possibility to at least be brought up or suggested in a serious way, even if it's discarded in favour of Amata/Mikono. "Fate...I'm fated to be Mikono's lover?"

Ah, that beach episode. When I watched that one, I was thinking that Zessica and Mikono were communicating really well together, had good chemistry there, and might make a good couple. ("You two should forget Amata and run away together", etc.) I didn't think that the writers were intending it to be there, so I didn't consider it as a serious option for the series. But I wonder now about whether the writers were intentionally or subconsciously giving those two decent chemistry.

[Vena]

Originally Posted by GoldenLand

So, either the spoiler is true, or the director is outright lying. Which means it's probably true. YESSSSSSSSSSSS.

I don't know. Some part of me loves the idea, but the normal part of me finds some parts of this so stupid... specifically, Pollon has never been introduced in this story. When you say that a story does not need its predecessor and you do something like this, well you may as well have made Amata and Kagura two halves of a Giant Space Flee from Nowhere.

It fits in with many scenes retrospectively but the detail of whom, in and of itself, will (would) never be present until the moment of the reveal. In this way, its not really a masterful troll or a swerve, where the character was in the story all along but no one simply paid it attention (like, say, we see the movie with the dog watching from the side as its masters disappear). Its just an ass pull for the sake of a twist and almost every single detail of the characters (Kagura and Amata) could easily (and logically) fit into place as Apollo but isn't *just cause we wanted to trick you!*

I'm really torn on the matter.

That said, if they can pull this sort of curve ball out of nowhere in the last few episodes, and with Cayenne's vision still lingering about, I wouldn't be to too sold on exactly what's going to happen or what the final pairings are anymore. If you really sit down and think about it... Cayenne's vision is pretty damn wrong in terms of "this is fated because of fate" and seems to be just as his other visions, "this is the future and Jin died". They may well have been trolling us since day 1 with that vision.

[miketyson]

One thing I just remembered: if you go back to the end of that first episode, during the scene in which Izumo's finally pulling Kagura back to Altair, part of Kagura's dialog has him making a noise that really, really, really sounds like his script said "back/growl like a dog". I remember noticing it at the time and thinking it was just part of his animalistic characterization, but...

Having to wait until Sunday is really ruff.

[mayumi]

http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost...&postcount=100

I wondered why Kagura was with Crea in this pic. It's cause he was a dog. I am thinking because Mykage is on the other side with Amata, Amata is still considered a angel cause of his wings but Kagura is just a beast.

I am sure they will do some crap and change story 24000 yrs ago which is why Apollo was so animalistic 12000 yrs ago. The culprit is either Celiane or Alisia.

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by mayumi

http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost...&postcount=100

I wondered why Kagura was with Crea in this pic. It's cause he was a dog. I am thinking because Mykage is on the other side with Amata, Amata is still considered a angel cause of his wings but Kagura is just a beast.

AFAIK that picture is a drawing of a recording session, which is why it lists the seiyuu. Apparently Suwabe Junichi and Toriumi Kousuke had a cold which is why they're wearing masks (also note the tissue box).

Also, the dog theory is really fun and all, but why is everyone suddenly treating it as fact? ^^;; Has anyone posted the full interview so we know the context?

[miketyson]

kuromitsu: I'm not so much taking it as fact as relishing it for returning us to the days when EVOL was mostly fun and fabulous. It is crazy enough it could be true, a welcome distraction from the borderline ship-war direction the discussions had been going, and removes the bite from the mopey, emo-ish direction the show's gone the past few weeks.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

AFAIK that picture is a drawing of a recording session, which is why it lists the seiyuu. Apparently Suwabe Junichi and Toriumi Kousuke had a cold which is why they're wearing masks (also note the tissue box).

Also, the dog theory is really fun and all, but why is everyone suddenly treating it as fact? ^^;;

It did occur to me that some of us (myself definitely included) will look awfully silly if this dog spoiler ends up being a mistranslation or an intentional hoax or a typo gone horribly wrong.

But the way people have latched on to it just shows how desperately some of us wants a "game-changer" in Aquarion EVOL to free us from the status quo.

[kuromitsu]

>miketyson
"Borderline" shipwar? ^^;; It's far past that line if you ask me (and has been for quite a while), which is one of the things that sucked the fun out of the discussions as far as I'm concerned. Ah well.

>Triple_R
But a game changer was to be expected from the start? ^^;; I mean, I can't be the only one who has been sure from day 1 that there would be huge twists in the end...

Anyway, as much fun as I have imagining Amata as a doggie, I only believe my own eyes so I reserve judgement on this until I have actual proof.

[GoldenLand]

I'm intending to pretend it's true even if it turns out fake, because it's just so much fun and is so silly. :P

It has definitely made theorising much more fun, and has been said, it goes to show how much the show could benefit from deviating from plain Amagura = Apollo. I would like Aquarion anyway, but it's become clear to me that its quality goes up when I think of it in terms of Amata not being Apollo. And it has been nice to have people talking about things other than ship wars. If it's a hoax, I'd like to buy the hoaxer a drink.

[Zuul]

Some of the theory floating around.

Alicia is not a reincarnation, she's THE Alicia, daughter of Appollonius and Celiane who inherited the dog. Amagura is not the reincarnation of the angel dog. He's is the dog that was turned into an human by Alicia before she left.

Amagura will be a dog again at the end and will have an happy cat marriage with Shushu.

I love the doggy spoiler a lot. And its probable consequences of Zessica being Appollo.
1) It explains a bit why Amata and Kagura acts so obssessed. Dog love is always something a bit creepy.
2) It opens possibility for a yuri end. Well, I'm not much of a yuri fanatics, but I have always loved the few moment we have seen Mikono and Zessica interacting (episode 17 ).
3) It gives a reason for Zessica's sufferings. Gods are punishing her for what Appolonius did to Touma, having an heartbreak over a dog XD. It makes it more bearable this way instead of the writers being sadists for the lulz.