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PhantomX · 2006-04-28, 10:41

Shiki is from an earlier Type Moon game (I donno who he is or what he does, that's all I can tell you :\)

And I can't really define Caliburn, I think it is just your regular sword, but Shiro traced a version that would achieve his goal of killing Berserker (remember Archer said something about imaging what he needed to win? I think Shiro made sure that when he traced the sword, it had that one-hit kill built into it :\)

And Gae Bolg, unlike Saber's swords, does not get any power boosts when the Noble Phantasm is used, it just redirects it's attack to the opponent's heart. This makes me believe that if the opponent's armor is thick enough, or if they're fast enough, they can survive (much like Saber did). Good luck surviving an Excaliber blast

mr.muffin · 2006-04-28, 11:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamandragon

Who's Shiki Tohno? I don't remember such character in F/SN...?

He's the main character from the Type Moon game Tsukihime which was later made into an anime series. He has the power to see objects' "life-lines" (can't think of a better term). When these "life-lines" are cut the object is destroyed.

Shiroth · 2006-04-28, 12:03

Basically, Shiki's a guy you don't wanna mess with.

iamandragon · 2006-04-28, 12:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkside

Unlimited Ova Works?

That'd be brillant. Though we'll have to kill Yuji Yamaguchi(director of the anime), revive him as a servent, and have Archer teach him how to change UBW into UOW.

iamandragon · 2006-04-28, 12:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr.muffin

He's the main character from the Type Moon game Tsukihime which was later made into an anime series. He has the power to see objects' "life-lines" (can't think of a better term). When these "life-lines" are cut the object is destroyed.

Just watched the anime...doesn't make too much sense...(why do you need to see the break lines just to kill a person? Chop off their head and it's all done!)

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhantomX

Shiki is from an earlier Type Moon game (I donno who he is or what he does, that's all I can tell you :\)

And I can't really define Caliburn, I think it is just your regular sword, but Shiro traced a version that would achieve his goal of killing Berserker (remember Archer said something about imaging what he needed to win? I think Shiro made sure that when he traced the sword, it had that one-hit kill built into it :\)

And Gae Bolg, unlike Saber's swords, does not get any power boosts when the Noble Phantasm is used, it just redirects it's attack to the opponent's heart. This makes me believe that if the opponent's armor is thick enough, or if they're fast enough, they can survive (much like Saber did). Good luck surviving an Excaliber blast

Armor won't stop GaeBolg. Luck is needed.

PGilis · 2006-04-28, 12:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr.muffin

He's the main character from the Type Moon game Tsukihime which was later made into an anime series. He has the power to see objects' "life-lines" (can't think of a better term). When these "life-lines" are cut the object is destroyed.

Actually, they're more like the "lines of death" from anything, even living beings. With such power, Shiki could destroy anything, even immortal beings.

Like i said, with such power, he could destroy even Nero Chaos.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angelsama

Basically, Shiki's a guy you don't wanna mess with.

Yeah, specially in his "Shiki Nanaya"-mode. He was an absolute badass.

I just loved how he fought Nero in TSUKIHIME manga volume 2.

Xellos-_^ · 2006-04-28, 12:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamandragon

Just watched the anime...doesn't make too much sense...(why do you need to see the break lines just to kill a person? Chop off their head and it's all done!)

Armor won't stop GaeBolg. Luck is needed.

Shiki can see the line of existance for everything form the a grain of sand to the entire universe. If he cuts the lines he can end the existance for anything. His killed list included, Acruid, Nero and the Other Shiki which has a lesser ver of his power. He also came form a long line of assassins and was train form birth to be a master assassin.

Magister Aurelius · 2006-04-28, 14:27

Quote:

With the way of how the anime's bring in parts of the three scenarios together, i think anything after the anime would just be pointless.

Well.. if they wanted to make new stories.

Like a new Grail War with Archerko? And perhaps all of the previous war's female servants could be indisposed due to pregnancy....

riznar · 2006-04-28, 17:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magister Aurelius

Like a new Grail War with Archerko? And perhaps all of the previous war's female servants could be indisposed due to pregnancy....

Fate/Doujin Night

Xellos-_^ · 2006-04-28, 17:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by riznar

Fate/Doujin Night

or Fate/Stay Night School Rumble

Tenma would make a very good archer

iamandragon · 2006-04-28, 20:31

Acruid was killed by him though she wasn't destroyed while Nero was...which is weird. If his power is only to kill a certain person, the eye of death is not needed...(anyone can kill a person)

Nameless · 2006-05-05, 02:50

Eh, I think you guys are underestimating how fast a woman's feelings can change.

When you're dealing with emotion, feelings, love, 5 hours is a long enough time as it is. Even her feelings changing over the course of 2 episodes was long enough.

In my opinion, you guys are too used to stupid anime like Love Hina where the feelings between people span over 20+ episodes.

Maybe I'm putting it in too short of words.

Okay let's say you meet this girl, and you and her have a professional relationship, but inside you think to yourself how cute she is when she's focused on work or mad at you. One day you and her get trapped in an elevator and might die. 5 hours in that elevator will go by, and you'd think you and her have been married for 5 years.

It's a heat of the moment type of thing, but because Shirou is so much like Arthura, but also dominantly protects her, she feels something she probably never felt even in her first life- A dependancy to a man.

You also forgot all those nights she stayed up waiting for him while he was at school trying to take on Servents by himself.

As someone mentioned, jealousy is love's first stone. Wanna take a guess at what the second usually is?

mlai · 2006-07-08, 11:48

I don't understand how Saber's *original* Excalibur bounces off of Berserker's skin, but Shirou's *imaged* Caliburn (a lesser sword even in its original form) kills Berserker 7 times with one blow.

Deathkillz · 2006-07-08, 11:57

^ its because wht shirou images is something that he thinks that would beat his opponent...therefore his image becomes reality...thats wht i think

Hemisphere · 2006-07-08, 11:58

Shiki actually kills the existence by cutting the dot. The dot is the central point that holds the existence of whatever it is he's fighting together. The lines, when cut, just has their existence "collapse" in a sense, or "destroyed" in a physical sense, but not "destroyed" in an existential sense.

Oh, and traced Caliburn? PLOT DEVICE. The original wasn't even that powerful.

It was supposed to highlight Shirou's ability to refine and utilize Imaging/Tracing. As with Archer and Caladbolg 2, since refining a pre-existing Noble Phantasm ranks very high in the difficulty meter.

Well, it'd only work like that with Saber, at the least. That and, the way that Caliburn + Saber got Berserker killed is different in the anime than in the game.

---

Here's an example of just how hard it is to modify Noble Phantasms. Although I'll be using someone else's example from Beast's Lair (because the way it was put was very sensible than anything on this topic).

Imagine the Mona Lisa as seen in person. Obviously everyone already has fixed perceptions of just what the Mona Lisa looks like. Now, imagine adding a part of neko ears on the Mona Lisa to serve as your modification. It won't hold, because the improvement doesn't agree with the imagery of the fixed perception of what the Mona Lisa is. Improving on something that's already been defined is a very hard mental task, moreso for that mental imagery to take form.

That is essentially Imaging/Tracing.

mlai · 2006-07-08, 13:47

Quote:

Seeing Saber with dual swords wouldn't make sense....knights only wield one sword =S and if they said her origin was in England...even more impossible with the Knight's code of honor.

She used 2 swords in the battle of Camlann against Mordred.

gammaoh · 2006-07-08, 14:24

He meant dual-wielding. Of course you can use a second sword if necessary.

Question · 2006-07-09, 00:02

mlai : you sure about that? Which 2 swords was that? By that time caliburn was long gone.

mlai · 2006-07-09, 11:55

I only meant in the anime, where Arturia used 2 swords against Mordred. One is Excalibur, the other is some generic sword she prolly picked up off the ground.

I kinda remember King Arthur in the old movie "Excalibur" doing the same thing against his son Mordred.

LoveYouSaber · 2008-08-10, 09:16

Hi guys, this is my first post to the forum~

Currently watching Fate/Stay Night for the first time (lol, guess I'm really slow). I was distressed after watching this episode. Regarding the bathing scene, how could Shirou not say any words of comfort to Saber~!!! Clearly she seemed on the verge of tears about her body uncomparable to Rin and too muscular and the like. I just wished Shirou would have told her body is beautiful (my opinion) or at least all right, instead of just walking out, like passively agreeing with Saber's (wrong) view. Shirou is really a bastard for this lol.

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2006-04-28, 12:03	Link #323
Shiroth Beautiful fighter. Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: England, UK Age: 37	Basically, Shiki's a guy you don't wanna mess with. __________________ MyAnimeList Twitter

2006-07-08, 11:57	Link #334
Deathkillz ~ You're dead ^__^* ~ Graphic Designer Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: uk, England Age: 34	^ its because wht shirou images is something that he thinks that would beat his opponent...therefore his image becomes reality...thats wht i think __________________ Siggy: hohohohoho~ \| AnimeHistory welcome to our blog ~ \| Summer2009 early review Under the radar series Summer2009: Kanamemo, GA Geijutsuka Art, NEEDLESS

2006-07-08, 11:58	Link #335
Hemisphere 見習い魔剣使い Join Date: May 2006 Location: 大陸の片隅	Shiki actually kills the existence by cutting the dot. The dot is the central point that holds the existence of whatever it is he's fighting together. The lines, when cut, just has their existence "collapse" in a sense, or "destroyed" in a physical sense, but not "destroyed" in an existential sense. Oh, and traced Caliburn? PLOT DEVICE. The original wasn't even that powerful. It was supposed to highlight Shirou's ability to refine and utilize Imaging/Tracing. As with Archer and Caladbolg 2, since refining a pre-existing Noble Phantasm ranks very high in the difficulty meter. Well, it'd only work like that with Saber, at the least. That and, the way that Caliburn + Saber got Berserker killed is different in the anime than in the game. --- Here's an example of just how hard it is to modify Noble Phantasms. Although I'll be using someone else's example from Beast's Lair (because the way it was put was very sensible than anything on this topic). Imagine the Mona Lisa as seen in person. Obviously everyone already has fixed perceptions of just what the Mona Lisa looks like. Now, imagine adding a part of neko ears on the Mona Lisa to serve as your modification. It won't hold, because the improvement doesn't agree with the imagery of the fixed perception of what the Mona Lisa is. Improving on something that's already been defined is a very hard mental task, moreso for that mental imagery to take form. That is essentially Imaging/Tracing. __________________ Last edited by Hemisphere; 2006-07-08 at 12:17.

2006-04-28, 10:41	Link #321
PhantomX Tsuruya's Lover Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: In Rider's Arms Age: 36	Shiki is from an earlier Type Moon game (I donno who he is or what he does, that's all I can tell you :\) And I can't really define Caliburn, I think it is just your regular sword, but Shiro traced a version that would achieve his goal of killing Berserker (remember Archer said something about imaging what he needed to win? I think Shiro made sure that when he traced the sword, it had that one-hit kill built into it :\) And Gae Bolg, unlike Saber's swords, does not get any power boosts when the Noble Phantasm is used, it just redirects it's attack to the opponent's heart. This makes me believe that if the opponent's armor is thick enough, or if they're fast enough, they can survive (much like Saber did). Good luck surviving an Excaliber blast

2006-04-28, 20:31	Link #331
iamandragon Martian diplomat Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Mars	Acruid was killed by him though she wasn't destroyed while Nero was...which is weird. If his power is only to kill a certain person, the eye of death is not needed...(anyone can kill a person)

2006-05-05, 02:50	Link #332
Nameless Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2003	Eh, I think you guys are underestimating how fast a woman's feelings can change. When you're dealing with emotion, feelings, love, 5 hours is a long enough time as it is. Even her feelings changing over the course of 2 episodes was long enough. In my opinion, you guys are too used to stupid anime like Love Hina where the feelings between people span over 20+ episodes. Maybe I'm putting it in too short of words. Okay let's say you meet this girl, and you and her have a professional relationship, but inside you think to yourself how cute she is when she's focused on work or mad at you. One day you and her get trapped in an elevator and might die. 5 hours in that elevator will go by, and you'd think you and her have been married for 5 years. It's a heat of the moment type of thing, but because Shirou is so much like Arthura, but also dominantly protects her, she feels something she probably never felt even in her first life- A dependancy to a man. You also forgot all those nights she stayed up waiting for him while he was at school trying to take on Servents by himself. As someone mentioned, jealousy is love's first stone. Wanna take a guess at what the second usually is?

2006-07-08, 11:48	Link #333
mlai Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006	I don't understand how Saber's original Excalibur bounces off of Berserker's skin, but Shirou's imaged Caliburn (a lesser sword even in its original form) kills Berserker 7 times with one blow.

2006-07-08, 14:24	Link #337
gammaoh Reality Marble User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: UBW Age: 37	He meant dual-wielding. Of course you can use a second sword if necessary.

2006-07-09, 00:02	Link #338
Question Crossdresser Join Date: Jun 2006	mlai : you sure about that? Which 2 swords was that? By that time caliburn was long gone.

2006-07-09, 11:55	Link #339
mlai Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006	I only meant in the anime, where Arturia used 2 swords against Mordred. One is Excalibur, the other is some generic sword she prolly picked up off the ground. I kinda remember King Arthur in the old movie "Excalibur" doing the same thing against his son Mordred.

2008-08-10, 09:16	Link #340
LoveYouSaber Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Age: 36	Hi guys, this is my first post to the forum~ Currently watching Fate/Stay Night for the first time (lol, guess I'm really slow). I was distressed after watching this episode. Regarding the bathing scene, how could Shirou not say any words of comfort to Saber~!!! Clearly she seemed on the verge of tears about her body uncomparable to Rin and too muscular and the like. I just wished Shirou would have told her body is beautiful (my opinion) or at least all right, instead of just walking out, like passively agreeing with Saber's (wrong) view. Shirou is really a bastard for this lol.