(L) Rosario+Vampire Manga

[HayashiTakara]

I'm simply itching to see how the all out war with FT is gonna be like >.<

[RexDraco]

Originally Posted by GrrDraxin

Heh heh, well just another to add to the fun and semi-orderly chaos of people we have here. By the way, FriedRice, where is your ava from? Looks sufficiently ecchi enough, I think I might like to watch it sometime.

But yes, so many tangled threads of plots that weave in with just Tsukune alone, and now that Moka's threads are being revealed I think that one of Rexy's fics concerning dear ol' Issa "Daddy Starbucks" Shuzen might be accurate on why Moka is being so possessive of Tsukune versus the other girls. She might not like polygamy because that would be precisely what her father was doing, and she might be afraid that Tsukune would fall into a similar pattern and not wholly care for each of them like he does now, so she want to encourage Tsukune to be more focused in love as well as battle.

We may yet see Tsukune pull out a few tricks with his development in fighting yet, but..... those could end up being done on accident, and he'd probably go "I didn't know I could do that," and find that it would help him greatly to exploit it to win a difficult battle, though I don't think this potential confrontation with the group and Akua will result in such a fight, but hopefully they'll separate this time with Akua stating something similar to old Dr. Claw when a plan fails.

Right now there are at least 3 things going on, and possibly more, with whats happening in Moka's head with Tsukune and them, the appearance of Akua on their doorstep, and with the egg thing in the Yuki Onna village, and possibly others. the group is gonna have one heck of a time trying to keep up with all of them.

I gotta say though

Spoiler for Chapter 30, R+V SII:

there just isnt enough information to rule what side Akua is on. As far as vampire relations go, realistically and R+V universally speaking, though they are rather pretentious and power hungry they are still close knit clans. And being the Patriarch's daughters our four little heiresses have more leverage than anyone else in teh clan so though they love each other there will be natural instances of "sibling rivalry" much unlike Kokoa's and Moka's. I mean They al s eem loving to each other but they also like to fight and seem to hold no hard feelings after a lost or won battle (noting Akua's and Kahlua's fight).

Just because Akua is on the Wong's doorstep doesnt mean she wants to hurt Moka. Perhaps Akua's and Wong's faction are enemies and they simply stand in the way of something she wants, being Moka. Seems whenever you stand in the way of what Shuzen wants they break you.

There is a missing formula. Kiria and Hokuto tried to stop them from going to Hon Kong, but why? Why did they not want Moka and Akua meeting? Would it had furthered Shuzen's plans or delayed them? All we are sure of is Akua did nto want Moka hurt and pulled into her affairs back than, but what affairs were they?

[FriedRice84]

Originally Posted by GrrDraxin

By the way, FriedRice, where is your ava from? Looks sufficiently ecchi enough, I think I might like to watch it sometime.

She's Hattori Junko from Ichiban Ushiro no Daimaou. Typical tsundere character but I find her character design cute.

The anime's alright, the story feels disjointed at times. Just make sure you watch the uncensored version since the censored version pretty much covers up to 3/4 of the screen with a black shadow at times.

I heard the manga was better but there aren't too many chapters that were scanlated even though there's about 8 volumes out.

[DragoZERO]

Originally Posted by FriedRice84

She's Hattori Junko from Ichiban Ushiro no Daimaou. Typical tsundere character but I find her character design cute.

The anime's alright, the story feels disjointed at times. Just make sure you watch the uncensored version since the censored version pretty much covers up to 3/4 of the screen with a black shadow at times.

I heard the manga was better but there aren't too many chapters that were scanlated even though there's about 8 volumes out.

It is a surprisingly entertaining series actually. And Junko is a great tsundere because she reacts differently, like she won't just punch the guy but may run away or do something else that's cute and funny.

And yes, uncensored is a must.

[FriedRice84]

Originally Posted by DragoZERO

And Junko is a great tsundere because she reacts differently, like she won't just punch the guy but may run away or do something else that's cute and funny.

That's why she's my favorite girl from the series

[Xagzan]

Originally Posted by FriedRice84

That's why she's my favorite girl from the series

Not to derail the Rosario train any more, but Ditto.

[Chris38]

Originally Posted by Ou-Rex

I gotta say though

Spoiler for Chapter 30, R+V SII:

there just isnt enough information to rule what side Akua is on. As far as vampire relations go, realistically and R+V universally speaking, though they are rather pretentious and power hungry they are still close knit clans. And being the Patriarch's daughters our four little heiresses have more leverage than anyone else in teh clan so though they love each other there will be natural instances of "sibling rivalry" much unlike Kokoa's and Moka's. I mean They al s eem loving to each other but they also like to fight and seem to hold no hard feelings after a lost or won battle (noting Akua's and Kahlua's fight).

Just because Akua is on the Wong's doorstep doesnt mean she wants to hurt Moka. Perhaps Akua's and Wong's faction are enemies and they simply stand in the way of something she wants, being Moka. Seems whenever you stand in the way of what Shuzen wants they break you.

There is a missing formula. Kiria and Hokuto tried to stop them from going to Hon Kong, but why? Why did they not want Moka and Akua meeting? Would it had furthered Shuzen's plans or delayed them? All we are sure of is Akua did nto want Moka hurt and pulled into her affairs back than, but what affairs were they?

Well OuRex ... it actually depends on what has happened between Moka and Akuha in their childhood .... that's pivotal thing that's going to shape how Moka's and Akuha's reunion will look like.

There are a lot of factor's to consider here, but at this point I think we don't have enough information yet to draw a definite conclusion on how things will shape up.

[RexDraco]

Originally Posted by Chris38

Well OuRex ... it actually depends on what has happened between Moka and Akuha in their childhood .... that's pivotal thing that's going to shape how Moka's and Akuha's reunion will look like.

There are a lot of factor's to consider here, but at this point I think we don't have enough information yet to draw a definite conclusion on how things will shape up.

Word. It's gunna be pretty epic when we get that lat puzzle piece that's for sure. Also...

Has anyone noticed Miyabe went poof? What is that sneaky rice-cake up to? I do not like him... defiling Mizore-chan's precious Mizore-chan-ness! I never forgave him for that >_>

[Chris38]

Originally Posted by Ou-Rex

Word. It's gunna be pretty epic when we get that lat puzzle piece that's for sure. Also...

Has anyone noticed Miyabe went poof? What is that sneaky rice-cake up to? I do not like him... defiling Mizore-chan's precious Mizore-chan-ness! I never forgave him for that >_>

I'm quite positive that he will show up, at the last possible place we expect him too, not to mention the fact that he promised Tsukune that they will meet again. (Rosario + Vampire Season II, chapter 14 page 28)


The reason why he hasn't appeared yet is probably caused by the fact that Tsukune is still too weak to face against Miyabi ... we are talking about the guy who was able to stop Kahula's attack , and I belive that he hasn't shown his true capabilities during his fight with Tsukune, since there is a strong possibility that Miyabi is a vampire as well ... but I don' think he's at the same level as Moka or Kahula for example I believe he's still too strong for Tsukune to beat at his current level, since the next time Miyabi meets Tsukune I doubt he's going to underestimate him again.

So I think we still have to wait a little bit, until we will see Miyabi again.

[RexDraco]

Originally Posted by Chris38

I'm quite positive that he will show up, at the last possible place we expect him too, not to mention the fact that he promised Tsukune that they will meet again. (Rosario + Vampire Season II, chapter 14 page 28)


The reason why he hasn't appeared yet is probably caused by the fact that Tsukune is still too weak to face against Miyabi ... we are talking about the guy who was able to stop Kahula's attack , and I belive that he hasn't shown his true capabilities during his fight with Tsukune, since there is a strong possibility that Miyabi is a vampire as well ... but I don' think he's at the same level as Moka or Kahula for example I believe he's still too strong for Tsukune to beat at his current level, since the next time Miyabi meets Tsukune I doubt he's going to underestimate him again.

So I think we still have to wait a little bit, until we will see Miyabi again.

I honestly thinking Miyabe is human. Only fact I suspect he stopped her cause he has some more romantic level of connection, but Ican't tell if that's my fangirl talking or the possibility because he had only gently touched her you know? He didn't exactly flare or anything to halt her advances, that and he's in charge. Being an assassin Kahlua has to heed to the highest orders and Miyabe sure seemed in charge, be it because he has the money or connections.

More over

Spoiler for Miyabe's Power:

As it was mentioned in the current of chapter 30, season II seems that Shuzen's running some big item underground party and as vampires or of any group like that race doesnt matter in the underground, only green matters and getting the job done with one's recourses. In the underground the one with the most resources can buy the most power.

[Tsuyoshi]

lol late response so it'll be long

Originally Posted by Chris38

Well, you're statements here Yoko Takeo, made me think that maybe Moka ... or rather Inner Moka is slowly raising Tsukune into a man, that her vampire pride will allow to be with ... it's probably something that was mentioned many times before, but I wouldn't say that Inner Moka is unable to pull something like that off. Furthermore she has probably already marked Tsukune as something that "belongs" to her ... by injecting her blood into Tsukune along with taking his blood as well, which would explain her possessive tendencies foreword Tsukune that Moka displays sometimes (Rosario +Vampire Season II, chapter 23,page 38), and while, I doubt the rest of the girls in Tsukune's harem, would take any notice of that ... I think that vampires take something like, what Moka did to Tsukune as something serious and won't bite a person who has been "marked" like that.

I'm inclined to agree with this, especially because Vampires in most traditional literature are fond of "marking" their prey in some way. In Moka's case, though, Tsukune is more than just a prey. She sees in him the man she wants to be with and, as you say, wants him to achieve the strength that would make him worthwile to boast about. However, there is also the fact that she was reluctant to give him more blood after a certain point, worried that giving him more of her blood would break him. Turning him into a full Vampire may never have been her intention, and it's not uncommon, even in literature, for a Vampire to fall in love with a human. So Moka falling in Love with Tsukune even though he's not a Vampire and not exactly inclined to turn him would also make sense. What I'm saying is that perhaps Moka isn't interested in Tsukune for his strength, but for his character.

Originally Posted by Chris38

To me it could be the explanation why Kokoa only takes Tsukune's blood from some wound that he has acquired and doesn't bite him to suck his blood. (Rosario vampire Season II, chapter 3,page 7)

If what you said is true, then yes, that would explain it, except I don't remember Kokoa being aware that Tsukune was ever bitten by Moka, so correct me if I'm wrong on that point. Unless there are other ways for Vampires to tell they have been previously bitten or not.

Originally Posted by GrrDraxin

But yes, so many tangled threads of plots that weave in with just Tsukune alone, and now that Moka's threads are being revealed I think that one of Rexy's fics concerning dear ol' Issa "Daddy Starbucks" Shuzen might be accurate on why Moka is being so possessive of Tsukune versus the other girls. She might not like polygamy because that would be precisely what her father was doing, and she might be afraid that Tsukune would fall into a similar pattern and not wholly care for each of them like he does now, so she want to encourage Tsukune to be more focused in love as well as battle.

Exactly. Moka, especially inner-Moka, has always been possessive, albeit in a good way, making her quite protective as well. This has always been evident in every battle she was in where Tsukune was involved. She even tried to take measures where Tsukune wouldn't have to fight to keep him safe. That's why she wants him to make a choice. Also, she is likely training Tsukune to become stronger and develop his Vampire traits so that there is more reason for him to be with her rather than anyone else, although this probably wasn't her original intention because as I said, she was not interested in his strength, but his character.

Originally Posted by Chris38

We may yet see Tsukune pull out a few tricks with his development in fighting yet, but..... those could end up being done on accident, and he'd probably go "I didn't know I could do that," and find that it would help him greatly to exploit it to win a difficult battle, though I don't think this potential confrontation with the group and Akua will result in such a fight, but hopefully they'll separate this time with Akua stating something similar to old Dr. Claw when a plan fails.

I think that if something like that were to happen, it would be a good sign that he's losing control of his power, which is what you said. If that happens, though, he'll turn into a ghoul. He's training so that he will have more control over his powers, so I doubt he will consciously make a mistake like that because if he does, he will take one step further to turning into a ghoul. I do think that Tsukune will run that risk again before he completes his training.

Originally Posted by Ou-Rex

I gotta say though

Spoiler for Chapter 30, R+V SII:

there just isnt enough information to rule what side Akua is on. As far as vampire relations go, realistically and R+V universally speaking, though they are rather pretentious and power hungry they are still close knit clans. And being the Patriarch's daughters our four little heiresses have more leverage than anyone else in teh clan so though they love each other there will be natural instances of "sibling rivalry" much unlike Kokoa's and Moka's. I mean They al s eem loving to each other but they also like to fight and seem to hold no hard feelings after a lost or won battle (noting Akua's and Kahlua's fight).

Just because Akua is on the Wong's doorstep doesnt mean she wants to hurt Moka. Perhaps Akua's and Wong's faction are enemies and they simply stand in the way of something she wants, being Moka. Seems whenever you stand in the way of what Shuzen wants they break you.

There is a missing formula. Kiria and Hokuto tried to stop them from going to Hon Kong, but why? Why did they not want Moka and Akua meeting? Would it had furthered Shuzen's plans or delayed them? All we are sure of is Akua did nto want Moka hurt and pulled into her affairs back than, but what affairs were they?

I also don't think Akuha wants to hurt Moka. If anything, I think she wants to bring Moka to her side. That's why she staged the whole rescure from the monster triads, taking advantage of the situation to show her sisterly love. But I have little doubt that Akuha is on the side of FT. Akuha seems loyal to her father, at least that's the impression I get, and Issa is most certainly on FT's side considering Khalua said that the Shuzen clan would support FT. So if Issa is with FT, so is Akuha. The only reason I have doubts about that is because Khalua said in R+V2, chapter 29, page 19, that Akuha and Moka mustn't meet. The reason for that could be because Akuha isn't in fact supporting FT and wants Moka on her side. If Akuha gets to Moka first, the Shuzen will lose her, especially considering how powerful Akuha is.

Originally Posted by Ou-Rex

I honestly thinking Miyabe is human. Only fact I suspect he stopped her cause he has some more romantic level of connection, but Ican't tell if that's my fangirl talking or the possibility because he had only gently touched her you know? He didn't exactly flare or anything to halt her advances, that and he's in charge. Being an assassin Kahlua has to heed to the highest orders and Miyabe sure seemed in charge, be it because he has the money or connections.

I agree. I also think Miyabe is human, but a special human at that. If there can exist all kinds of Ayashi in one story, that so could humans with special abilities of their own, albeit they appear much less often compared to Ayashi without powers.

[Chris38]

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Spoiler for snip:

I'm inclined to agree with this, especially because Vampires in most traditional literature are fond of "marking" their prey in some way. In Moka's case, though, Tsukune is more than just a prey. She sees in him the man she wants to be with and, as you say, wants him to achieve the strength that would make him worthwile to boast about. However, there is also the fact that she was reluctant to give him more blood after a certain point, worried that giving him more of her blood would break him. Turning him into a full Vampire may never have been her intention, and it's not uncommon, even in literature, for a Vampire to fall in love with a human. So Moka falling in Love with Tsukune even though he's not a Vampire and not exactly inclined to turn him would also make sense. What I'm saying is that perhaps Moka isn't interested in Tsukune for his strength, but for his character.

I definitely agree that Moka might not have planned for Tsukune, though at the same time she didn't want to loose him - which is basically the reason why Tsukune has gained vampire power's of his own in the first place, since if he hadn't been important to her, I don't think she would even consider giving him her blood in the first place.

I agree as well that Moka has fallen in love with Tsukune, when he was still a normal ordinary human, though I think that Outer and Inner Moka had become attracted to different aspects of Tsukune's character ... and the only aspect that the two personalities share in their feelings for Tsukune is their attraction to his blood, apart from that I think that most of their feelings for Tsukune stream from different things.

Um ... I mean that I think that Outer Moka became attracted to Tsukune ... apart from her obvious attraction to his blood , because he stayed in the Youkai Academy and became her first friend despite being a human.

With Inner Moka things become a little more tricky, since we don't have much insight into her heart, probably caused by her Tsundere nature, but from the little hints given I think that her attraction foreword Tsukune started from his willingness to protect her, even at the risk of loosing his life ... despite the fact that he was human, so someone theoretically weaker then her. Of course I think she was also touched (but I doubt she will admit it ) that Tsukune was willing to stay in a Academy, full of youkai's ... witch carried the risk of him losing his life ... basically for her, so that he could be her friend.

So to me what had caused Moka to inject her vampire blood into Tsukune, is her feelings for him and we already know the results of that.

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Spoiler for snip:

If what you said is true, then yes, that would explain it, except I don't remember Kokoa being aware that Tsukune was ever bitten by Moka, so correct me if I'm wrong on that point. Unless there are other ways for Vampires to tell they have been previously bitten or not.

Well, I think it's something that is instinctive for a vampire to sense, if you remember in chapter 5 of Season II when Tsukune has saved Kurumu from the Doppelganger, she somehow knew that Tsukune was given an injection of Moka's vampire blood and I don't think anyone has told her about Tsukune getting injected with Moka's vampire blood.

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Spoiler for snip:

Exactly. Moka, especially inner-Moka, has always been possessive, albeit in a good way, making her quite protective as well. This has always been evident in every battle she was in where Tsukune was involved. She even tried to take measures where Tsukune wouldn't have to fight to keep him safe. That's why she wants him to make a choice. Also, she is likely training Tsukune to become stronger and develop his Vampire traits so that there is more reason for him to be with her rather than anyone else, although this probably wasn't her original intention because as I said, she was not interested in his strength, but his character.

Well, I agree with what you added to my initial thought on Moka's character, though like I said before, to me while it's certainly true that Moka became interested with Tsukune for different reasons then him being physically strong or something like that, but it's her love for Tsukune that is ultimately the reason why he has acquired vampire abilities in the first place but, because she didn't want to loose him, and during the fight with Midou it became quite evident that Tsukune wasn't planning to leave, even when Inner Moka has tried to make him by trying to push him away when she, basically said that he means nothing to her and even that wasn't enough for Tsukune to leave.

So, in my opinion Tsukune's transformation was probably something that was bound to happen sooner or later, after he met with Moka and wanted to stay with her, despite the numerous risks this relationship brought.

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Spoiler for snip:

I think that if something like that were to happen, it would be a good sign that he's losing control of his power, which is what you said. If that happens, though, he'll turn into a ghoul. He's training so that he will have more control over his powers, so I doubt he will consciously make a mistake like that because if he does, he will take one step further to turning into a ghoul. I do think that Tsukune will run that risk again before he completes his training.

It's a possibly , though like you said Yoko Takeo I doubt that Tsukune will consciously do something like that ... well there isn't much to discuss about this, since we can't possibly predict what the author plans to do in the future ... right .

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Spoiler for snip:

I also don't think Akuha wants to hurt Moka. If anything, I think she wants to bring Moka to her side. That's why she staged the whole rescure from the monster triads, taking advantage of the situation to show her sisterly love. But I have little doubt that Akuha is on the side of FT. Akuha seems loyal to her father, at least that's the impression I get, and Issa is most certainly on FT's side considering Khalua said that the Shuzen clan would support FT. So if Issa is with FT, so is Akuha. The only reason I have doubts about that is because Khalua said in R+V2, chapter 29, page 19, that Akuha and Moka mustn't meet. The reason for that could be because Akuha isn't in fact supporting FT and wants Moka on her side. If Akuha gets to Moka first, the Shuzen will lose her, especially considering how powerful Akuha is.

Well we don't know much about Kahula either ... and what are the reasons for her being a member of Fairy Tale. About the warning that she gave to Kokoa, I think the reason for her saying that Moka and Akuha shouldn't meet is caused more by what has actually happened in their childhood when Moka, Kahula and Kokoa met with Akuha for the first time. So I doubt that Kahula's warning has much to do with the current situation and her affliction with Fairy Tale but it's more likely, because of the consequences of the incident ,that happened between Akuha and Moka in their childhood and the Shuzen family dosen't want something like that to happen again.

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Spoiler for snip:

I agree. I also think Miyabe is human, but a special human at that. If there can exist all kinds of Ayashi in one story, that so could humans with special abilities of their own, albeit they appear much less often compared to Ayashi without powers.

Well it's a possibility, but we still don't now enough information about Miyabi to have a definite conclusion that could explain what kind of being Miyabi is. If he is human I doubt he's going to be a normal human ... meaning that he could be a hybrid of some kind or like you said Yoko Takeo a human with some kind of special abilities.

[Tsuyoshi]

Originally Posted by Chris38

I definitely agree that Moka might not have planned for Tsukune, though at the same time she didn't want to loose him - which is basically the reason why Tsukune has gained vampire power's of his own in the first place, since if he hadn't been important to her, I don't think she would even consider giving him her blood in the first place.

I agree as well that Moka has fallen in love with Tsukune, when he was still a normal ordinary human, though I think that Outer and Inner Moka had become attracted to different aspects of Tsukune's character ... and the only aspect that the two personalities share in their feelings for Tsukune is their attraction to his blood, apart from that I think that most of their feelings for Tsukune stream from different things.

Um ... I mean that I think that Outer Moka became attracted to Tsukune ... apart from her obvious attraction to his blood, because he stayed in the Youkai Academy and became her first friend despite being a human.

With Inner Moka things become a little more tricky, since we don't have much insight into her heart, probably caused by her Tsundere nature, but from the little hints given I think that her attraction foreword Tsukune started from his willingness to protect her, even at the risk of loosing his life ... despite the fact that he was human, so someone theoretically weaker then her. Of course I think she was also touched (but I doubt she will admit it ) that Tsukune was willing to stay in a Academy, full of youkai's ... witch carried the risk of him losing his life ... basically for her, so that he could be her friend.

So to me what had caused Moka to inject her vampire blood into Tsukune, is her feelings for him and we already know the results of that.

This is true to an extent, although you're making it sound as if Outer and Inner Moka are two different people when in fact Outer Moka is effectively part of Inner Moka. She's what remains once Inner Moka's other attributes, such as her combat skills, powers and Vampire nature, are suppressed so that only her feelings and her intelligence are left in the open. So what outer Moka feels for Tsukune, Inner Moka feels exactly the same way. They wouldn't have separate feelings even if they're sharing some of them. As you said, Outer Moka was attracted to Tsukune because he accepted to be her first friend at Youkai academy even though he's human. But her attracted was also further boosted when she saw Tsukune's willingness to risk his life to stay with her at a school full of demons who'd gladly have a piece of his flesh for lunch, and risk his life again to protect her from those very demons. Those weren't just Inner Moka's feelings. I'm quite certain Outer Moka.

But you are right in saying that it was her attraction toward Tsukune that made her inject her blood into him when he was on the edge of paradise. She would not have done that if she didn't deem him special. At the same time though, she would've preferred to avoid that situation, and that's why she wanted to rely on the Ririsu Mirror, for instance, and she would have been able to fight on her own rather than constantly putting Tsukune in danger.

Originally Posted by Chris38

Well, I think it's something that is instinctive for a vampire to sense, if you remember in chapter 5 of Season II when Tsukune has saved Kurumu from the Doppelganger, she somehow knew that Tsukune was given an injection of Moka's vampire blood and I don't think anyone has told her about Tsukune getting injected with Moka's vampire blood.

Well, when Tsukune was rescuing Kurumu, it was pretty obvious judging by his Vampire traits that he received a Vampire's blood, and since Moka was the only Vampire at Youkai apart from herself, it would be easy even for someone who'se not a Vampire to figure out what happened, assuming of course you knew that Tsukune was human beforehand. Also, I wasn't suggesting that Kokoa and other Vampires can tell when a human received blood, but simply that they had been bitten previously, and Vampires have their way of telling, whichever that might be.

Originally Posted by Chris38

Well, I agree with what you added to my initial thought on Moka's character, though like I said before, to me while it's certainly true that Moka became interested with Tsukune for different reasons then him being physically strong or something like that, but it's her love for Tsukune that is ultimately the reason why he has acquired vampire abilities in the first place but, because she didn't want to loose him, and during the fight with Midou it became quite evident that Tsukune wasn't planning to leave, even when Inner Moka has tried to make him by trying to push him away when she, basically said that he means nothing to her and even that wasn't enough for Tsukune to leave.

So, in my opinion Tsukune's transformation was probably something that was bound to happen sooner or later, after he met with Moka and wanted to stay with her, despite the numerous risks this relationship brought.

Sure, it was bound to happen, but it also proves that she doesn't want Tsukune to get hurt or get involved with her dangerous affairs any longer because it would ruin his life as a human. But Tsukune had already claimed he was willing to become a Vampire for her, which is already foreshadowing what may happen in the future. It could even be that Tsukune really will turn into a Vampire. We'll just have to wait and see.

Originally Posted by Chris38

Well we don't know much about Kahula either ... and what are the reasons for her being a member of Fairy Tale. About the warning that she gave to Kokoa, I think the reason for her saying that Moka and Akuha shouldn't meet is caused more by what has actually happened in their childhood when Moka, Kahula and Kokoa met with Akuha for the first time. So I doubt that Kahula's warning has much to do with the current situation and her affliction with Fairy Tale but it's more likely, because of the consequences of the incident ,that happened between Akuha and Moka in their childhood and the Shuzen family dosen't want something like that to happen again.

Khalua's reasons are likely Issa's reasons. We need to find out more about what happened in Moka's past before we can get an answer. As for Akuha, it could be true that she had done something terrible to Moka in the past that caused her to run away on her own into the human world. I stand by my theory that Akuha showed her sisterly love so that she could buy Moka's trust and have her join FT. But all we know comes from speculation. We really do not know what happened and couldn't possibly know right now. Perhaps her affection for Moka could be true, and she wanted Moka on her side because she knew the other side is vile and cruel. Unlikely, considering they hardly know each other, but that is still possible for various reasons, but once again, all speculation. But what I think is that perhaps Akuha isn't with FT, but with a rival Chinese gang that has plans of its own with regards to the Issa and FT, and she is also aware, as Issa, that Moka is (possibly) from a very powerful and ancient Vampire clan and wants her to join. That is why Khalua and Issa can't allow Akuha to meet with Moka, as they are also after her abilities, whichever they are.

Originally Posted by Chris38

Well it's a possibility, but we still don't now enough information about Miyabi to have a definite conclusion that could explain what kind of being Miyabi is. If he is human I doubt he's going to be a normal human ... meaning that he could be a hybrid of some kind or like you said Yoko Takeo a human with some kind of special abilities.

I think he is human. I remember that the Ice Priestess said that he's an executive of a human organization. But you are right, even that still isn't enough information as he could easily be an Ayashi who happens to be the CEO of a human company secretly contributing to FT.

[Chris38]

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Spoiler for snip:

This is true to an extent, although you're making it sound as if Outer and Inner Moka are two different people when in fact Outer Moka is effectively part of Inner Moka. She's what remains once Inner Moka's other attributes, such as her combat skills, powers and Vampire nature, are suppressed so that only her feelings and her intelligence are left in the open. So what outer Moka feels for Tsukune, Inner Moka feels exactly the same way. They wouldn't have separate feelings even if they're sharing some of them. As you said, Outer Moka was attracted to Tsukune because he accepted to be her first friend at Youkai academy even though he's human. But her attracted was also further boosted when she saw Tsukune's willingness to risk his life to stay with her at a school full of demons who'd gladly have a piece of his flesh for lunch, and risk his life again to protect her from those very demons. Those weren't just Inner Moka's feelings. I'm quite certain Outer Moka.

But you are right in saying that it was her attraction toward Tsukune that made her inject her blood into him when he was on the edge of paradise. She would not have done that if she didn't deem him special. At the same time though, she would've preferred to avoid that situation, and that's why she wanted to rely on the Ririsu Mirror, for instance, and she would have been able to fight on her own rather than constantly putting Tsukune in danger.

Well, that's true and I know that Outer Moka is a part of Inner Moka's personality, ... so I certain that they share their feelings for him. What I had meant earlier is ... since Inner Moka has a little different outlook on life and her surroundings she might be expecting different things from Tsukune compared too Outer Moka ... sigh, well since I'm getting a little confused about this ... I mean it's pretty hard to deal with two different kinds of personalities, which effectively make one person so maybe I should take you're example and don't try to distinguish between both off them.

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Spoiler for snip:

Well, when Tsukune was rescuing Kurumu, it was pretty obvious judging by his Vampire traits that he received a Vampire's blood, and since Moka was the only Vampire at Youkai apart from herself, it would be easy even for someone who'se not a Vampire to figure out what happened, assuming of course you knew that Tsukune was human beforehand. Also, I wasn't suggesting that Kokoa and other Vampires can tell when a human received blood, but simply that they had been bitten previously, and Vampires have their way of telling, whichever that might be.

Well I agree with what you said here, but I think that currently we have too little information about vampires to continue a discussion on this topic. So maybe we should hold discussing something like that, until we learn more about vampires and what kind of customs they have.

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Spoiler for snip:

Sure, it was bound to happen, but it also proves that she doesn't want Tsukune to get hurt or get involved with her dangerous affairs any longer because it would ruin his life as a human. But Tsukune had already claimed he was willing to become a Vampire for her, which is already foreshadowing what may happen in the future. It could even be that Tsukune really will turn into a Vampire. We'll just have to wait and see.

I doubt that Tsukune will turn into a vampire, since it would kind of lessen Tsukune's significance since at the moment he's a living symbol that Ayashi and humans can coexist with each other and since coexistence is one of the main themes of this manga ... , but like you said Yoko Takeo we have to wait and see what happens from now on.

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Spoiler for snip:

Khalua's reasons are likely Issa's reasons. We need to find out more about what happened in Moka's past before we can get an answer. As for Akuha, it could be true that she had done something terrible to Moka in the past that caused her to run away on her own into the human world. I stand by my theory that Akuha showed her sisterly love so that she could buy Moka's trust and have her join FT. But all we know comes from speculation. We really do not know what happened and couldn't possibly know right now. Perhaps her affection for Moka could be true, and she wanted Moka on her side because she knew the other side is vile and cruel. Unlikely, considering they hardly know each other, but that is still possible for various reasons, but once again, all speculation. But what I think is that perhaps Akuha isn't with FT, but with a rival Chinese gang that has plans of its own with regards to the Issa and FT, and she is also aware, as Issa, that Moka is (possibly) from a very powerful and ancient Vampire clan and wants her to join. That is why Khalua and Issa can't allow Akuha to meet with Moka, as they are also after her abilities, whichever they are.

It's a possibility, though personally I think that Akuha works for Fairy Tale and came to recruit Moka into their ranks. I agree that we aren't certain about it yet, but when Kahula tells Kokoa that the entire Shuzen family is supporting Fairy Tale, Kokoa automatically assumed that Akuha belongs to Fairy Tale as well. (Rosario + Vampire Season II,chapter 29, page 19 ) . Furthermore it has been said already that the Miu family collaborates with Fairy Tale as well (Rosario + Vampire Season II, chapter 28, page 17) and at last let's not forget the reason why the Gremlin was sent to crush the plane Tsukune and his friends where flying in. It has been clearly said that the objective of that mission was to capture Moka (Rosario + Vampire Season II, chapter 28, page 2).

So taking all of that into consideration I think that Akuha belongs to Fairy Tale and her mission is to recruit Moka into Fairy Tale or maybe she came to kill all of the member's of the Wong family and came upon Moka accidentally ... who knows at this point, there are a lot of possibilities to consider.

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Spoiler for snip:

I think he is human. I remember that the Ice Priestess said that he's an executive of a human organization. But you are right, even that still isn't enough information as he could easily be an Ayashi who happens to be the CEO of a human company secretly contributing to FT.

Well from what I have seen the actual phrasing was that Miyabi was an executive of an organization located in the human world ... there hasn't been anything mentioned what kind of organization it was, so I think that it might be just a cover for ayashi that work there. I kind of think that it even might be, one of the Fairy Tale branches, but like I said before, anything is possible, so it's probably best to wait until we learn more about him.

[RexDraco]

Has anyone considered that perhaps Moka is training Tsukune not to make hi ma viable mate, but that because she knows the trouble that is on the way? Ever since chapter 1 Ura had showed signs of being extremely intuitive when it came to her environment. She was always able to indicate trouble before it came, what if this is the same case?She knows Tsukune has a tendency to jump in to save them without thinking, though she believes reckless she would find an admirable quality as it is what defines Tsukune as Tsukune.

Could it stand to reason that she simply wants to protect him of the dangers that seem to follow them and are obviously escalating? Even Ura can see something so plain as often as she has been present as of late. She knows more than she ever lets on and only gives "as needed" information to the others and is never too surprised when the "unexpected" happen (least in some cases she's still a teenager he he).

[Chris38]

Originally Posted by Ou-Rex

Has anyone considered that perhaps Moka is training Tsukune not to make hi ma viable mate, but that because she knows the trouble that is on the way? Ever since chapter 1 Ura had showed signs of being extremely intuitive when it came to her environment. She was always able to indicate trouble before it came, what if this is the same case?She knows Tsukune has a tendency to jump in to save them without thinking, though she believes reckless she would find an admirable quality as it is what defines Tsukune as Tsukune.

Could it stand to reason that she simply wants to protect him of the dangers that seem to follow them and are obviously escalating? Even Ura can see something so plain as often as she has been present as of late. She knows more than she ever lets on and only gives "as needed" information to the others and is never too surprised when the "unexpected" happen (least in some cases she's still a teenager he he).

I believe you have got a point there OuRex though in my opinion it's a combination of those two things ... she's preparing him to become stronger so that he could face the danger's that he might face in the future. At the same time she is also making Tsukune into a viable mate, so she's basically taking care of two things at once, simply by training him.

About the other things you mentioned OuRex, while I agree that Inner Moka is more intuitive when it comes too her environment I think it's the result of her training ... I mean she was trained in martial arts, probably since she was born ... so it's probably something natural for her to do.

I certainly agree that she knows more information then she has provided so far, but I doubt she knows everything ... I mean she was certainly surprised when her Rosario has weakened. (Rosaro + Vampire Season II, chapter 26, page 35)

So while she certainly knows about more things then she let's on, I doubt she can predict everything. So I think that her training sessions with Tsukune are taking place so that he could get stronger, and could protect himself without her help, at the same time they allow her to spend some quality time with Tsukune, so she certainly has a lot of reasons to continue Tsukune's training.

So I'm confident that Inner Moka has a lot of ulterior motives when she offered to train Tsukune, but I think that the most important one is that it would give him chances to survive, since Tsukune is still at the risk of turning into a Ghoul and Moka is certainly aware of that, so she has offered to train him, simply because she want's him to live and her training Tsukune in using his vampire abilities is definitely something that is going to be pretty useful for him in the future.

[Tsuyoshi]

Originally Posted by Chris38

Well, that's true and I know that Outer Moka is a part of Inner Moka's personality, ... so I certain that they share their feelings for him. What I had meant earlier is ... since Inner Moka has a little different outlook on life and her surroundings she might be expecting different things from Tsukune compared too Outer Moka ... sigh, well since I'm getting a little confused about this ... I mean it's pretty hard to deal with two different kinds of personalities, which effectively make one person so maybe I should take you're example and don't try to distinguish between both off them.

Again, you're making it sound like they're different characters, especially when you say one has a different outlook on life from the other. I don't think that's true given that Inner and Outer Moka are the same person. Everything they think and feel is the same. The only reason it may come across that way is because Outer is more likely to act on her emotion, given that that's the only part of Moka left after the seal's effect, whereas Inner will act on logic and intuition on top of her emotions (which are the same as Outer Moka's). If anything, I'd say the emotions of Tsukune that Outer feels are what encourage Inner to act. It is the basis of her thought process, although her actions are more planned out on the long run, something Outer doesn't do simply because that part of her is sealed.

Originally Posted by Chris38

Well I agree with what you said here, but I think that currently we have too little information about vampires to continue a discussion on this topic. So maybe we should hold discussing something like that, until we learn more about vampires and what kind of customs they have.

Probably, but I feel I'm right about the fact that anyone who knows Tsukune is human could figure out he was given blood by Moka if they saw him turn into a Ghoul

Originally Posted by Chris38

I doubt that Tsukune will turn into a vampire, since it would kind of lessen Tsukune's significance since at the moment he's a living symbol that Ayashi and humans can coexist with each other and since coexistence is one of the main themes of this manga ... , but like you said Yoko Takeo we have to wait and see what happens from now on.

Of course, I don't mean that will happen anytime soon. I also believe it would undermine Tsukune's significance in the plot, being the only human in a story driven almost exclusively by demons. But I believe it will happen, and if it does, it will only be at the very very end when Moka and Tsukune finally decide that when all their troubles are over, they want to be together forever.

Originally Posted by Chris38

It's a possibility, though personally I think that Akuha works for Fairy Tale and came to recruit Moka into their ranks. I agree that we aren't certain about it yet, but when Kahula tells Kokoa that the entire Shuzen family is supporting Fairy Tale, Kokoa automatically assumed that Akuha belongs to Fairy Tale as well. (Rosario + Vampire Season II,chapter 29, page 19 ) . Furthermore it has been said already that the Miu family collaborates with Fairy Tale as well (Rosario + Vampire Season II, chapter 28, page 17) and at last let's not forget the reason why the Gremlin was sent to crush the plane Tsukune and his friends where flying in. It has been clearly said that the objective of that mission was to capture Moka (Rosario + Vampire Season II, chapter 28, page 2).

I wouldn't take one character's assumption as definitive proof. By definition, an assumption doesn't prove anything. Also, Khalua never said that Akuha is in FT. In fact, she even spoke of her as though she's another faction of the Shuzen, and a lower one at that. I don't exactly know what the rest of what you said has to do with Akuha and how that hints to her specifically being on FT's side.

Originally Posted by Chris38

Well from what I have seen the actual phrasing was that Miyabi was an executive of an organization located in the human world ... there hasn't been anything mentioned what kind of organization it was, so I think that it might be just a cover for ayashi that work there. I kind of think that it even might be, one of the Fairy Tale branches, but like I said before, anything is possible, so it's probably best to wait until we learn more about him.

You could be right about this. Both options are open for the moment, although I would like for him to be human so that he would play a bigger part in Tsukune's growth.

Originally Posted by Chris38

I believe you have got a point there OuRex though in my opinion it's a combination of those two things ... she's preparing him to become stronger so that he could face the danger's that he might face in the future. At the same time she is also making Tsukune into a viable mate, so she's basically taking care of two things at once, simply by training him.

Lol you didn't really get my point then. I said that Moka already had strong feelings for Tsukune from the beginning, and Moka also said much later that Vampires can love whoever they want, regardless of what race of Ayashi they are, or even if they're human. I highly doubt it has anything to do with her trying to make tsukune a viable mate. Tsukune already is one and has been one from the beginning. I also think Moka is preparing him for the dangers that may come in addition to training him to control his powers for his own good.

Originally Posted by Chris38

I certainly agree that she knows more information then she has provided so far, but I doubt she knows everything ... I mean she was certainly surprised when her Rosario has weakened. (Rosaro + Vampire Season II, chapter 26, page 35)

We've yet to know her reasons for running away from the Vampire society and why her powers were sealed. It's certainly got something to do with her mother, and she is certainly not letting anyone know everything that she knows, perhaps because she doesn't want them to worry for her. She did something similar with Tsukune and the others when she discovered the Ririsu mirror.

[Tempest35]

As he uses his powers, Tsukune will no doubt draw more and more powerful people for him to fight. A vampire who doesn't know how to fight is ludicrous. She knows that Tsukune will continue to jump into things because of his sense of honor and justice and friendship. Now that he has her blood, he just had to learn to take care of himself since now he has the power to do so.

Other ulterior motives include but are not limited to: spending time with him as Inner; fighting/training against a pwr-ed up Tsukune, thus reinforcing her own training; a chance to learn a bit more about Tsukune.

[RexDraco]

Originally Posted by Tempest35

As he uses his powers, Tsukune will no doubt draw more and more powerful people for him to fight. A vampire who doesn't know how to fight is ludicrous. She knows that Tsukune will continue to jump into things because of his sense of honor and justice and friendship. Now that he has her blood, he just had to learn to take care of himself since now he has the power to do so.

Other ulterior motives include but are not limited to: spending time with him as Inner; fighting/training against a pwr-ed up Tsukune, thus reinforcing her own training; a chance to learn a bit more about Tsukune.

This is true. Plus with how Moka is, being awfully protective and kindhearted in her own tsundere way, you can't help but think it is her own special way of caring.

Also I am intrigued by Hokuto.

Spoiler for Chapter 33, Season I:

They use hi mas a comparison to Tsukune. Hokuto kind of like Tsukune's yang, the darker Tsukune. The what Tsukune could have become had he not had true friends when he needed them most, but Hokuto did have a friend, just not like the girls. Hokuto had Kiria, and Kiria was the source of his monster blood,. Which I find intriguing. They specifically use the word monster, not vampire or ayashi or youkai which make s me also wonder what kind of creature Kiria is because (until I see the original kanji) if they really did use bakemono, that would put Kiria on a whole other level. But onto my point, when Hokuto attempted to destroy the barrier, so did he destroy his own "Holy Lock" that had been keeping his monster blood at bay.

What if it is as much the same matter for Tsukune? As mentioned in an above conversation, there is a possibility he will take a non human form later, and I do agree it will take away form his humanity, but like youkai have "human forms" can it not be said Tsukune will have a reverse "youkai form" ? His humanity will remain intact but like Hokuto will one day be able to revert to it at will but still be able to return to his human state. We can also determine from the power of Tsukune's will, as shown since the first chapters, specifically chapter 2 , he could resist a Succubus' charm. To do as such you have to have a great mental will power, so his trials, could they be Mikogami's game into trying to help Tsu get a reign on his powers like Hokuto, and using the girls as a means of giving him something to protect?

"To protect something makes your blade the sharpest of all.".

[Chris38]

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Again, you're making it sound like they're different characters, especially when you say one has a different outlook on life from the other. I don't think that's true given that Inner and Outer Moka are the same person. Everything they think and feel is the same. The only reason it may come across that way is because Outer is more likely to act on her emotion, given that that's the only part of Moka left after the seal's effect, whereas Inner will act on logic and intuition on top of her emotions (which are the same as Outer Moka's). If anything, I'd say the emotions of Tsukune that Outer feels are what encourage Inner to act. It is the basis of her thought process, although her actions are more planned out on the long run, something Outer doesn't do simply because that part of her is sealed.

Well, it seems that I have made things worse ... well I agree with you, and it seems I kind of messed things and forgot what the recent chapter's have provided.

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Probably, but I feel I'm right about the fact that anyone who knows Tsukune is human could figure out he was given blood by Moka if they saw him turn into a Ghoul

Well that's true ... it's pretty easy to figure out once you know that Tsukune was a human, but to someone who doesn't know that Tsukune was a human at the beginning it's easy to consider Tsukune as a vampire

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Of course, I don't mean that will happen anytime soon. I also believe it would undermine Tsukune's significance in the plot, being the only human in a story driven almost exclusively by demons. But I believe it will happen, and if it does, it will only be at the very very end when Moka and Tsukune finally decide that when all their troubles are over, they want to be together forever.

Well, I would say it's a possibility, but it actually depended on how the stories plot is going to unfold, since he could very well stay as a hybrid between a vampire and a human, simply said we don't know yet, how this manga is going to end, since there are a lot of factor's to consider.

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

I wouldn't take one character's assumption as definitive proof. By definition, an assumption doesn't prove anything. Also, Khalua never said that Akuha is in FT. In fact, she even spoke of her as though she's another faction of the Shuzen, and a lower one at that. I don't exactly know what the rest of what you said has to do with Akuha and how that hints to her specifically being on FT's side.

Well, it's probably something that is going to be revealed sooner or later and since neither of us has enough arguments to make a definite conclusion on this topic, it's the best to wait and see how things will proceed ... then we will probably see who's assumptions are more correct.

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

You could be right about this. Both options are open for the moment, although I would like for him to be human so that he would play a bigger part in Tsukune's growth.

And how Miyabi being a human is going to play a bigger role in Tsukune's development, since I don't quite understand why you're saying that Miyabi being a human is going to take a bigger part in Tsukune's growth, rather then him being a youkai. So do you think that you could explain what do you mean by that.

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

Lol you didn't really get my point then. I said that Moka already had strong feelings for Tsukune from the beginning, and Moka also said much later that Vampires can love whoever they want, regardless of what race of Ayashi they are, or even if they're human. I highly doubt it has anything to do with her trying to make tsukune a viable mate. Tsukune already is one and has been one from the beginning. I also think Moka is preparing him for the dangers that may come in addition to training him to control his powers for his own good.

Well that's true, though I think that she still hadn't quite submitted to her feelings foreword Tsukune. I mean I agree that she has probably deemed him worthy of being her partner, but she still isn't willing to admit that - I mean remember what she said to Tsukune in the first chapter of Season II, at page 45, that Tsukune has to conquer her, and while he is getting closer to wining over Inner Moka, I she hasn't submitted herself to Tsukune yet.

So while she certainly has feelings for him, she still hasn't deemed Tsukune worthy to be with her, and while it might not be something related to Tsukune's training, this is what I had meant by Tsukune not being a viable mate for her yet.

I know it's quite evident that she has strong feelings foreword Tsukune, but since she isn't willing to admit that to Tsukune ... not to mention the fact that it seems her feelings foreword Tsukune are starting to conflict with her vampire pride causing her to fell insecure (Rosario + Vampire Season II, Chapter 27, Page 17). So there still some development's that need to be made, before Inner Moka will accept her feelings for Tsukune. But, it's probably something that is unrelated to Inner Moka's reasons for starting her training sessions with Tsukune, so sorry for bringing it up.

Originally Posted by Yoko Takeo

We've yet to know her reasons for running away from the Vampire society and why her powers were sealed. It's certainly got something to do with her mother, and she is certainly not letting anyone know everything that she knows, perhaps because she doesn't want them to worry for her. She did something similar with Tsukune and the others when she discovered the Ririsu mirror.

That's true, but you can certainly see that she slowly opens up foreword Tsukune and the other girls. As to Moka's reasons for leaving her family house well it's something that we will definitely learn about in the future, but I think that the reason for Moka starting to live in the human world is rather caused by the fact that she met Akuha and some sort of incident, which made other vampires freak out, happened between them. At least that's the impression I got so far.