AnimeSuki Forums

Grey · 2011-10-23, 15:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tenchi Hou Take

I think your looking at this from the wrong angle here. Zenkicii joining Aijimu and Zenkichi believing Medaka as wrong are not the same thing. While there both doing this for "wrong" reasons here, this battle has brought about something that was always there, which was that Zenkichi's views and Medaka's views are fundamentally different. Zenkichi has always had problems with this crusade, he doesn't believe that what Medaka is doing there is quite right. This is something that is totally independent to him wanting to be with Medaka or Medaka wanting him to be an enemy.

That's interesting. But what crusade? I remember fighting to stop the Flask Plan using students. And then fighting Minuses who wanted to mess up the school. But I don't think Zenkichi had a problem with that stuff.

Yeah you're right that maybe Zenkichi joining Ajimu and "Medaka you're wrong" are separate. But the timing is weird then. He said he doesn't care about being right and is willing to be a devil. Then it sounds like he's just making an excuse with "Humans can be too right." What sort of complaint is that?

This all started because he's upset and feels he's losing his special place by Medaka. So it sounds like he's just saying BS and running on emotion with "Humans can be too right." I'll wait for him to say something more clear like Kikaijima. "Medaka, you did these things and they're no good." Then I'll know if he's making sense.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cruor

No. She treated him like shit because he's the type that would try to become stronger because of it. And then he would be stronger and an enemy. Making a strong enemy for Medaka (in other words someone she cares more about then her friends).

I don't know. We don't know for sure when Medaka decided to make Zenkichi her enemy. Was it when he flipped out after the Treasure Hunt? Or was it when he came and challenged her?

I think anyone has good reason to be upset when Zenkichi flipped out. He was being a sore loser. So was Medaka honestly upset, disappointed, and punishing him there? Or did she already decide to make him an enemy?

If Medaka was honest then it's nothing big. But if Medaka decided to start pushing him then that's...a really weird and new character development. She's never treated people like shit just to get an interesting enemy or because they'd grow.

I'll need to see more chapters before I start jumping to conclusions.

ACE2001 · 2011-10-23, 15:38

I'm just going to be blunt here: I want to see Zen whoop Medaka's a$$!! Lol! To quote the movie Platoon, "We've been kicking other people's a$$es for so long I figured it's time we got ours kicked." Only here it's that Medaka has been kicking a$$ for so long, it's just about time for her's to get royally kicked!

She is just too perfect for me to like as a main character. As if she can do no wrong and everything that she says and does its right. It's almost a it's my way or the highway type attitude. I'm really looking forward to this arc and hoping that Zen will be able to put Medaka in her place once and for all. To sort of change her mindset on human interactions.

The question here is, how will this miracle occur? The deck is stacked heavy against Zen. He has like a 0.0000000001 chance of winning! Lol! I'm pro Zen all the way!

Myssa Rei · 2011-10-23, 19:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by ACE2001

The deck is stacked heavy against Zen.

Experts have found that one in a million chances happen nine times out of ten.

sungreentakeo · 2011-10-23, 20:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tenchi Hou Take

Wait did she actually copy the mind reading skill? I don't remember that.

http://www.mangafox.com/manga/medaka...6/c052/19.html
http://medakabox.wikia.com/wiki/Mizou_Yukuhashi

I'm usually pretty careful with my analysis; it would just be a pain to have to point out to the sources every time I make a point.

In any case, Medaka has copied the mind-reading skill. At least, Naze and Maguro think so.

sungreentakeo · 2011-10-23, 20:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grey

Wait. You think Medaka is supposed to be in the wrong here? I'd say there's no right in the first place. Zenkichi isn't trying to do anything right, he just wants to be by Medaka no matter what. So he opposes her. And Medaka wants to help Zenkichi grow in a sociopathic shounen way. By fighting him.

Zenkichi is selfish and says he's willing to do whatever. Medaka is a mix of selfish and selfless and is being a crazy shounen hero. In a twisted way, they're getting what they both want.

When I think about it...I wonder if Medaka even thought of not fighting Zenkichi. I bet she didn't even think it's bad that he challenged her or bad that they fought. It's a shounen cliche: growth through fighting. Understanding through fighting.

It's like Kumagawa and Medaka's big duel. Medaka loved fighting with him. (What is she, Goku?!)

Basically, you're right on all your points... Except I don't think Medaka being wrong is ambiguous.

Chapter 118 is pretty clear. That chapter is supposed to point out Medaka's character flaw. It's supposed to throw into our faces what is disturbing about Medaka's and Zenkichi's relationship... There is exposition and events that pretty much explains it. I can't really explain it better than that. It's the whole point of the past couple of chapters.

Zenkichi is fundamentally different from everyone else. He loves Medaka more than anyone else. He's the only person crazy enough to want to protect her and crazy enough to actually try. He is the only person who seems to resist Medaka's incredibly strong personality while spending all his time around her. Medaka has never really helped him in the same way that she's helped all her other followers. He's also strange in that he tags along, but he doesn't really come off as a follower. It's more like he just wants to be with her than being her follower, and when he supports her because he loves her and because he agrees with her, not because he feels indebted to her. He's a normal person who has made incredible sacrifices and efforts to be with her. If she turned totally evil in the next chapter, he'd still love her and try to save her no matter what happened. If she lost all her specialness, he's still love and support her. He's also pretty much the only person that we could justify Medaka being indebted to... He's the only person who has genuinely succeeded in helping her (i.e. the event of 13 years ago and the brainwashing incident). He's been with her more than anybody else and should be closer than family to her. It's been a running hint that other characters have assumed she has to be in love with him because of the things that he has done.

There is a whole bunch of subtext going on here.

As for Zenkichi being selfish, of course he is... He's trying to become his own person and he's trying to win the attention of the woman he loves. This entire time that he was Medaka's 'sacrifice' he was being mostly unselfish and putting Medaka first.. His 'selfishness' isn't a selfishness that you can fault him for.. It's like faulting someone for taking charge of their life. He may be defying Medaka, but there isn't anything wrong in that. Deep down, he has a different definition of justice from Medaka. The point he was making is something he's believed since the first chapter of the manga and he's always been obviously right about it. This is about his own self-actualization, and there is nothing evil in that... Regardless of what he said to Ajimu about he doesn't care if he becomes a devil, he's not trying to become a villain but a different type of hero. He's not controlling anybody; he's standing up for himself. He's finally being assertive.

In the first couple of chapters, Zenkichi was the main character and he had his own ideas. After a while, Medaka subverted his personality to a degree and took over. I think Zenkichi being called 'the man who couldn't become the main character' and the events at the beginning of the manga are not a coincidence. It was supposed to happen that way.

I think that at this point Zenkichi is trying to become the person he was supposed to be.

telamont · 2011-10-23, 21:37

With all the hype surrounding Medaka's and Zen's upcoming battle, I'm kinda curious, how would you all react if Kumagawa actually succeeds with his plan and the battle... never happens?

I know it's very unlikely, but Ajimu Najimi is the ultimate antagonist of this arc. Stopping the fight would be the best way to mess up her plans. Kumagawa does have history of foiling Ajimu and putting a stop to people's training. And the author does have a history of hyping an upcoming battle to the skies only to have it happen offscreen (see Katanagatari).

So... yea, if it actually happens here, how would most of you react?

"LOL. Oh Nisiosin, you troll, you."

or

"#$%# this %^$%!!! I'm done with this manga!!!"

?

ACE2001 · 2011-10-23, 22:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Myssa Rei

Experts have found that one in a million chances happen nine times out of ten.

Haha! I walked into that one.

I just mean in a sense that if Ajimu, who has a god like amount of abilities, admits she would lose to Medaka, what real chance does Zen have? I mean, he would have to do some Franklin Richards type sh!t in order for him to beat Medaka. But, I guess it's somewhat a forgone conclusion as it's assumed (well I'm assuming) that he will beat down Medaka. I just want to see how. So far, things don't look promising. Nothing that makes me say like, damn, Zen got her on this one.

evil|plushie · 2011-10-23, 23:21

maybe zen's new ability will be to cancel all abilities in a certain area

Markoz89 · 2011-10-24, 03:00

Hello, good, I'm a rookie in animesuki, but I have followed this forum for quite the truth, and if it bothers wanted to join the discussion of the series ...

Well, much has been said about the reason for the action of medaka and Zen for more than 30 pages of the forum, but just wanted to comment on my personal analysis ...

Medaka:
she is being a hypocrite, she did not even realize it, because their ideology that "No one is special" is contrary to the fact that she says she chose to fall in love Zen, because if you chose to say that exalted over any other person in the world, either because he is his childhood friend or because she has a list of qualities to that person which would love and zen meet the criteria, in the end chooses a zen reason that makes it different to those of more "special someone to medaka" if she tried the same without discrimination or exalt one, she fall in love with anyone, even a bum, something like the kiss of use kikaijima reform.

Medaka, in my opinion did so with Zen (all zen back to the enemy) was the fact it is easier to understand when confronted with the staff (for the cuffs, as Kumagawa) than just speaking, is simple she wants to be better understood with Zenkichi.

I've noticed that medaka dark acts as a hero, as his desire to make everyone happy is the only way for her to be happy, because no matter what you do in life she grabs it effortlessly perfect, an example would be that is dedicated to singing just become the most famous idol with a simple one, if it becomes researcher discover the thing that maybe we were never discovered, all before breakfast, then do something good with a selfish desire is the essence of an antihero, not, and if Zen does not give a reason for living, just becomes like Medaka II, a girl with desire autocompletación egomaniacal super, a real villain.

Zenkichi:
This guy also has his fault, is an immature idiot, simply known, can be very honest but not admit defeat even knowing that manipulate it, plus the right from the start to meet someone I consider perfect medaka and went straight to Mount Olympus

I think love is rather Zen, fascination with perfect, so the question of why you want to be by his side, and if at the end zen think that if someone is next to someone special would also be special Of course all this hidden without the same knowledge.

Zenkichi has a very particular way, is to treat everyone in a special way, as special treats each person, ie it treats sode-chan is not equal to that of medaka and possibly that of medaka jealousy gives the relationship of those two.

If I could summarize what would be the confrontation zenkiche madake and output:

-A more intimate form of communication (not just believe it medaka, a zen does not care if she looks)

-Face two kinds of doctrines of life (the "all are equal" in medaka and zen way to treat it the "everyone is special")

-The clash of two heroes (the medaka lonely "He has no friends / as / she always does its best / even that everything comes easy / and always gets the victory" against the charismatic hero "always has and get friends, always works hard and yet they almost never win / win will only munikata the boy murderer / ")

Actually I think these are the central points in this fight, as well as some suppose if you can think of medaka and Zen complements the qualities to be the main characters perfect, medaka zen has the body and personality.

Ashin on in-san, really think she is using this situation to try to create your own character using the unique qualities of medaka and Zen also wondered if Ashin-san in the world sees no value beyond simple office trash, not the plan flask you want to create perfect human is to create human so she can look like people like (where she remains a not equal), ie the world that she sees is empty humans, since none is equal to it (hence the name non-human), then think if there was such a perfect human would look at it you see as equals and would no longer be alone I think

Postscript: I apologize for the bad English Latin and translated with google translator I-sama, if not understood please advise.

Lummie · 2011-10-24, 06:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Markoz89

Hello, good, I'm a rookie in animesuki, but I have followed this forum for quite the truth, and if it bothers wanted to join the discussion of the series ...

Welcome to AS ^^

Quote:

Medaka:
she is being a hypocrite, she did not even realize it, because their ideology that "No one is special" is contrary to the fact that she says she chose to fall in love Zen, because if you chose to say that exalted over any other person in the world, either because he is his childhood friend or because she has a list of qualities to that person which would love and zen meet the criteria, in the end chooses a zen reason that makes it different to those of more "special someone to medaka" if she tried the same without discrimination or exalt one, she fall in love with anyone, even a bum, something like the kiss of use kikaijima reform.

I care to disagree here to some extent with the wording. Medaka never stated that she fell in love with Zen. Whenever you read her saying "like Zenkichi", you have to switch that to "being fond of him" in your mind to avoid this kind of confusion. "Like" is a big word, it can easily be confused for love, but that's not what Medaka meant. Zen's actions, his ideas, that's what she likes about him as a person but not to the point that it reaches the heights of love. She just doesn't understand that term which the author tries to explain through her actions like using that kissing method for example.

sungreentakeo · 2011-10-24, 08:16

Medaka's 'other father' that she killed maybe?

http://www.mangafox.com/manga/medaka...7/c053/12.html
http://www.mangafox.com/manga/medaka...7/c053/13.html

The 'perfect man' she met before? I was reading back through the manga when I found this.

Last Carpet · 2011-10-24, 08:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by sungreentakeo

Medaka's 'other father' that she killed maybe?

http://www.mangafox.com/manga/medaka...7/c053/12.html
http://www.mangafox.com/manga/medaka...7/c053/13.html

The 'perfect man' she met before? I was reading back through the manga when I found this.

I'm fairly sure she's referring to the "Incomplete" or "Defective Product"
Kumagawa Misogi

zeando · 2011-10-24, 08:38

yep she was referring to kumagawa

sungreentakeo · 2011-10-24, 08:46

http://www.mangafox.com/manga/medaka...7/c053/13.html

How exactly is Kumagawa perfect? He's supposed to be the opposite of perfection.

Alright, I think I see what you mean.. I.e. she might be saying that Kumagawa shows that you can't have a complete human being without any imperfections...
What she says though seems to refer to someone who doesn't have any imperfections.. I just simply think it is odd that it is referred to at the height of the flask plan arc.

I've been trying to find hints of this 'other father' event in Medaka's past, so maybe I'm clutching at straws.

Kurosu · 2011-10-24, 09:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by sungreentakeo

http://www.mangafox.com/manga/medaka...7/c053/13.html

How exactly is Kumagawa perfect? He's supposed to be the opposite of perfection.

Alright, I think I see what you mean.. I.e. she might be saying that Kumagawa shows that you can't have a complete human being without any imperfections...
What she says though seems to refer to someone who doesn't have any imperfections.. I just simply think it is odd that it is referred to at the height of the flask plan arc.

I've been trying to find hints of this 'other father' event in Medaka's past, so maybe I'm clutching at straws.

Flaws are what make humans human, and following that logic, the perfect human would have be the one with the most imperfections.

sungreentakeo · 2011-10-24, 09:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kurosu

Flaws are what make humans human, and following that logic, the perfect human would have be the one with the most imperfections.

Alright, interpreting what they're saying in that context, it seems like what she's saying is that in order to make someone complete you wouldn't just need to have a person with all the 'perfections' but that person would need to have all the 'imperfections'... And Kumagawa (being the mirror opposite of Medaka which has the 'perfections') has all the 'imperfections', and Kumagawa is a nightmare.

Geez, I was hoping I had found something here, but it is just a premonition of the minus 13 arc.

I guess that would make Ajimu a truly complete being since she seems to be a combination of 'plus' and 'minus', huh...

But what is weird in the language on that page is that it seems like 'perfect' and 'complete' are being set to equal, but they aren't really the same thing. I think there is a fine meaning that the translation isn't really bringing across that well, because I'm quite sure that being perfect means you don't have any bad qualities in a negation (i.e. what this thing is not) sense... And that you have all the good qualities in the positing (i.e. what the thing is) sense... And being complete would mean you would have to also have all the bad qualities as well, but a complete person wouldn't be perfect under the 'negation' definition of perfect because they have the bad qualities that a perfect person wouldn't have.

Soji · 2011-10-24, 09:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by sungreentakeo

Alright, interpreting what they're saying in that context, it seems like what she's saying is that in order to make someone complete you wouldn't just need to have a person with all the 'perfections' but that person would need to have all the 'imperfections'... And Kumagawa (being the mirror opposite of Medaka which has the 'perfections') has all the 'imperfections', and Kumagawa is a nightmare.

Geez, I was hoping I had found something here, but it is just a premonition of the minus 13 arc.

I guess that would make Ajimu a truly complete being since she seems to be a combination of 'plus' and 'minus', huh...

But if she really is a perfect being because if this is the case does not that mean that the flank plan wants to create someone like her?
And the only difference would be that he/she can defeat medaka?

Quote:

also have all the bad qualities as well, but a complete person wouldn't be perfect under the 'negation' definition of perfect because they have the bad qualities that a perfect person wouldn't have.

I don't think so.
With No bad qualities the good qualities will lose meaning like what we're seeing with medaka now.

sungreentakeo · 2011-10-24, 09:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soji

But if she really is a perfect being because if this is the case does not that mean that the flank plan wants to create someone like her?
And the only difference would be that he/she can defeat medaka?

I guess my position at this point is that complete /= perfect, but maybe it is equal in the Medaka Box world? As for creating another superbeing like herself, maybe it is Ajimu that is lonely so she wants another superbeing on her level.... And she really wants to beat Medaka because it's the only thing she couldn't do!

I'm still not clear on what Ajimu's intentions are... I keep on wanting to think that there is something more going on with her, because I don't get the vibe that she is necessarily a bad influence.... yet...

Not Somebody · 2011-10-24, 11:14

I just registered because these latest chapters drove me insane in my desire to read Medaka Box.

Ajimu was tricking Zen with her offer.
From what I've observed of Ajimu, she does not have a single plan. Rather, she has tons and tons of plans and situations and she's improvising and planning as she goes.
So I don't think we can conclude a single purpose from what she means by tricking him.
So I'll name a few.

1) Her actual plan is to make Medaka not a main character. During the flask plan, her loss of personality made her suck. She could be attempting to do this on a much more permanent way, by snatching a constant in her life and changing it. If her personality changes into that of a villain, which is slightly appearing to be the case, then she may lose her main character status.

The above depends on the status of being a main character being able to change. If you can gain the status of being a main character, you should be able to lose that status as well.

2) She may be giving Zen false hope, to lead him to confront Medaka. Separating those close to Medaka and eventually being the only thing around her. Essentially gaining control of her. Warping her or whatever.

3) She may be trying to make Zenkichi an actual hero. Strong enough to make an even battle with Medaka. A success is a success, and it would prove to Medaka that there are perfect people, and thus getting her as an ally to work on their ideals... She's raising Zen up to switch Medaka to her side.

4) There is a reason why she picked Zen. Because he's the middle ground. Kumagawa, destined to lose, zen, destined to lose and win, and Medaka, destined to win. Those three have been closely entangled since the hospital, and especially the middle school days.

The middle school days importance is gigantic, from the dead other father, lots of Ajimu, and the memory loss.

Mainly, she doesn't have a one track mind. Ajimu made the training camp, then discarded it. She's flexible, willing to adapt change improvise devise and manipulate.
Above all, none of what she has done so far is evil. She has only done good things, regardless of the consequences of those things.

Her goal from what we've seen is the flask plan, but why. A perfect human does not equal a nonhuman. She's impartial. Does she simply want to live her life for the greater good from her perspective? Why does she need to even compete with Medaka, such that she wants to avoid competing so she gets beaten?
Above all, why did Zen see what he saw when he used parasite seeing on her.

Takigashima · 2011-10-24, 20:45

Maybe it's one of those apocalypse from x-men things.
Ajimu considers her self far superior to humans that they seem to be little more than trash, similar to how apocalypse considers himself superior to mutants and humans.

2011-10-23, 23:21	Link #4948
evil\|plushie The Last Frontier Join Date: Apr 2004	maybe zen's new ability will be to cancel all abilities in a certain area __________________ God is on the side with the biggest cannon. http://sining83.blogspot.com

2011-10-23, 15:38	Link #4942
ACE2001 Anime Watchman Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Fussa, Japan Age: 40	I'm just going to be blunt here: I want to see Zen whoop Medaka's a$$!! Lol! To quote the movie Platoon, "We've been kicking other people's a$$es for so long I figured it's time we got ours kicked." Only here it's that Medaka has been kicking a$$ for so long, it's just about time for her's to get royally kicked! She is just too perfect for me to like as a main character. As if she can do no wrong and everything that she says and does its right. It's almost a it's my way or the highway type attitude. I'm really looking forward to this arc and hoping that Zen will be able to put Medaka in her place once and for all. To sort of change her mindset on human interactions. The question here is, how will this miracle occur? The deck is stacked heavy against Zen. He has like a 0.0000000001 chance of winning! Lol! I'm pro Zen all the way!

2011-10-23, 21:37	Link #4946
telamont Member Join Date: Jan 2008	With all the hype surrounding Medaka's and Zen's upcoming battle, I'm kinda curious, how would you all react if Kumagawa actually succeeds with his plan and the battle... never happens? I know it's very unlikely, but Ajimu Najimi is the ultimate antagonist of this arc. Stopping the fight would be the best way to mess up her plans. Kumagawa does have history of foiling Ajimu and putting a stop to people's training. And the author does have a history of hyping an upcoming battle to the skies only to have it happen offscreen (see Katanagatari). So... yea, if it actually happens here, how would most of you react? "LOL. Oh Nisiosin, you troll, you." or "#$%# this %^$%!!! I'm done with this manga!!!" ?

2011-10-24, 03:00	Link #4949
Markoz89 Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2011	Hello, good, I'm a rookie in animesuki, but I have followed this forum for quite the truth, and if it bothers wanted to join the discussion of the series ... Well, much has been said about the reason for the action of medaka and Zen for more than 30 pages of the forum, but just wanted to comment on my personal analysis ... Medaka: she is being a hypocrite, she did not even realize it, because their ideology that "No one is special" is contrary to the fact that she says she chose to fall in love Zen, because if you chose to say that exalted over any other person in the world, either because he is his childhood friend or because she has a list of qualities to that person which would love and zen meet the criteria, in the end chooses a zen reason that makes it different to those of more "special someone to medaka" if she tried the same without discrimination or exalt one, she fall in love with anyone, even a bum, something like the kiss of use kikaijima reform. Medaka, in my opinion did so with Zen (all zen back to the enemy) was the fact it is easier to understand when confronted with the staff (for the cuffs, as Kumagawa) than just speaking, is simple she wants to be better understood with Zenkichi. I've noticed that medaka dark acts as a hero, as his desire to make everyone happy is the only way for her to be happy, because no matter what you do in life she grabs it effortlessly perfect, an example would be that is dedicated to singing just become the most famous idol with a simple one, if it becomes researcher discover the thing that maybe we were never discovered, all before breakfast, then do something good with a selfish desire is the essence of an antihero, not, and if Zen does not give a reason for living, just becomes like Medaka II, a girl with desire autocompletación egomaniacal super, a real villain. Zenkichi: This guy also has his fault, is an immature idiot, simply known, can be very honest but not admit defeat even knowing that manipulate it, plus the right from the start to meet someone I consider perfect medaka and went straight to Mount Olympus I think love is rather Zen, fascination with perfect, so the question of why you want to be by his side, and if at the end zen think that if someone is next to someone special would also be special Of course all this hidden without the same knowledge. Zenkichi has a very particular way, is to treat everyone in a special way, as special treats each person, ie it treats sode-chan is not equal to that of medaka and possibly that of medaka jealousy gives the relationship of those two. If I could summarize what would be the confrontation zenkiche madake and output: -A more intimate form of communication (not just believe it medaka, a zen does not care if she looks) -Face two kinds of doctrines of life (the "all are equal" in medaka and zen way to treat it the "everyone is special") -The clash of two heroes (the medaka lonely "He has no friends / as / she always does its best / even that everything comes easy / and always gets the victory" against the charismatic hero "always has and get friends, always works hard and yet they almost never win / win will only munikata the boy murderer / ") Actually I think these are the central points in this fight, as well as some suppose if you can think of medaka and Zen complements the qualities to be the main characters perfect, medaka zen has the body and personality. Ashin on in-san, really think she is using this situation to try to create your own character using the unique qualities of medaka and Zen also wondered if Ashin-san in the world sees no value beyond simple office trash, not the plan flask you want to create perfect human is to create human so she can look like people like (where she remains a not equal), ie the world that she sees is empty humans, since none is equal to it (hence the name non-human), then think if there was such a perfect human would look at it you see as equals and would no longer be alone I think Postscript: I apologize for the bad English Latin and translated with google translator I-sama, if not understood please advise.

2011-10-24, 08:16	Link #4951
sungreentakeo Member Join Date: Oct 2011	Medaka's 'other father' that she killed maybe? http://www.mangafox.com/manga/medaka...7/c053/12.html http://www.mangafox.com/manga/medaka...7/c053/13.html The 'perfect man' she met before? I was reading back through the manga when I found this.

2011-10-24, 08:38	Link #4953
zeando maybenotimome Join Date: Feb 2011	yep she was referring to kumagawa

2011-10-24, 08:46	Link #4954
sungreentakeo Member Join Date: Oct 2011	http://www.mangafox.com/manga/medaka...7/c053/13.html How exactly is Kumagawa perfect? He's supposed to be the opposite of perfection. Alright, I think I see what you mean.. I.e. she might be saying that Kumagawa shows that you can't have a complete human being without any imperfections... What she says though seems to refer to someone who doesn't have any imperfections.. I just simply think it is odd that it is referred to at the height of the flask plan arc. I've been trying to find hints of this 'other father' event in Medaka's past, so maybe I'm clutching at straws.

2011-10-24, 11:14	Link #4959
Not Somebody Member Join Date: Oct 2011	I just registered because these latest chapters drove me insane in my desire to read Medaka Box. Ajimu was tricking Zen with her offer. From what I've observed of Ajimu, she does not have a single plan. Rather, she has tons and tons of plans and situations and she's improvising and planning as she goes. So I don't think we can conclude a single purpose from what she means by tricking him. So I'll name a few. 1) Her actual plan is to make Medaka not a main character. During the flask plan, her loss of personality made her suck. She could be attempting to do this on a much more permanent way, by snatching a constant in her life and changing it. If her personality changes into that of a villain, which is slightly appearing to be the case, then she may lose her main character status. The above depends on the status of being a main character being able to change. If you can gain the status of being a main character, you should be able to lose that status as well. 2) She may be giving Zen false hope, to lead him to confront Medaka. Separating those close to Medaka and eventually being the only thing around her. Essentially gaining control of her. Warping her or whatever. 3) She may be trying to make Zenkichi an actual hero. Strong enough to make an even battle with Medaka. A success is a success, and it would prove to Medaka that there are perfect people, and thus getting her as an ally to work on their ideals... She's raising Zen up to switch Medaka to her side. 4) There is a reason why she picked Zen. Because he's the middle ground. Kumagawa, destined to lose, zen, destined to lose and win, and Medaka, destined to win. Those three have been closely entangled since the hospital, and especially the middle school days. The middle school days importance is gigantic, from the dead other father, lots of Ajimu, and the memory loss. Mainly, she doesn't have a one track mind. Ajimu made the training camp, then discarded it. She's flexible, willing to adapt change improvise devise and manipulate. Above all, none of what she has done so far is evil. She has only done good things, regardless of the consequences of those things. Her goal from what we've seen is the flask plan, but why. A perfect human does not equal a nonhuman. She's impartial. Does she simply want to live her life for the greater good from her perspective? Why does she need to even compete with Medaka, such that she wants to avoid competing so she gets beaten? Above all, why did Zen see what he saw when he used parasite seeing on her.

2011-10-24, 20:45	Link #4960
Takigashima Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2011	Maybe it's one of those apocalypse from x-men things. Ajimu considers her self far superior to humans that they seem to be little more than trash, similar to how apocalypse considers himself superior to mutants and humans.