Gurren-Lagann - Overall Series Impressions & Total Series Rating

[Flyvapnet]

Voxxchubbs, I appreciate your assessment of Yoko:

They seriously screwed up poor Yoko (Her role in the series also gets smaller and smaller after Kamina's death, which is a shame, she was a great character in the beginning), getting the shaft twice, in the exact same manner.

It's your parenthetical statement -- that Yoko's role is flushed down the toilet by producers in spite of her superior likability and great potential -- which confirms what I was trying to point out earlier in this thread. I've concluded Japanese producers use this formula: Introduce an attractive, charismatic and energetic female character right away; then impeach her via gradual but steady diminution of her role.

Why? It certainly reinforces the female-submissiveness / male-superiority paradigm promoted in Japanese society, embraced by anime/games/manga producers and lapped up by adolescent males; and it also induces controversy, fostering discussions (such as this one) which draw more attention to the product in question. In short, the societal status quo ante is further enshrined at home -- Japan -- whilst monetary profit is increased both at home and abroad.

This formula was used by producers of the various El-Hazard series; and it was likewise used by producers of the console game Final Fantasy VII. Now it's been used by producers of Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann. It's both ham fisted and sexist -- assertive action-oriented females are replaced by delicate submissive ones -- but the target audience of adolescent males either doesn't care or doesn't perceive what's going on (or both).



=^..^=

[7Th]

Originally Posted by Flyvapnet

Voxxchubbs, I appreciate your assessment of Yoko:



It's your parenthetical statement -- that Yoko's role is flushed down the toilet by producers in spite of her superior likability and great potential -- which confirms what I was trying to point out earlier in this thread. I've concluded Japanese producers use this formula: Introduce an attractive, charismatic and energetic female character right away; then impeach her via gradual but steady diminution of her role.

Why? It certainly reinforces the female-submissiveness / male-superiority paradigm promoted in Japanese society, embraced by anime/games/manga producers and lapped up by adolescent males; and it also induces controversy, fostering discussions (such as this one) which draw more attention to the product in question. In short, the societal status quo ante is further enshrined at home -- Japan -- whilst monetary profit is increased both at home and abroad.

This formula was used by producers of the various El-Hazard series; and it was likewise used by producers of the console game Final Fantasy VII. Now it's been used by producers of Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann. It's both ham fisted and sexist -- assertive action-oriented females are replaced by delicate submissive ones -- but the target audience of adolescent males either doesn't care or doesn't perceive what's going on (or both).



=^..^=

It's like if you're ignoring half of the show in order to make your point. Yoko's role was the same from beginning to end, the one I stated in post number 132. If you honestly believe Nia was "weak and submissive" or a "replacement for Yoko" you were obviously not watching the show.

[Flyvapnet]

I believe we're talking about two different things, 7Th, or the same thing but on two different levels. I like that photograph, though! I've felt that way -- "They just don't get it!" -- many times myself.



=^..^=

[voxxchubbs]

Yoko's role does indeed get smaller. She was introduced as one of the 3 main characters in the series' initial episodes. When Kamina died, her character also waned in importance, giving her role as leading female over to Nia.

I do however agree that Nia is not a weak female character. I actually liked Nia moreso than Yoko. But I just can't ignore the fact that Yoko was screwed over twice like that. Kinda reminds me of how Winry gets screwed over in FMA. I felt they didn't make her character justice. But I did like how they developed her attitude after Kamina's death. She grew up noticeably (which I must admit was a pity because I loved her spunky, fierce yet innocent attitude in the beginning of the series.)

I can't say that I have an opinion on the whole Japanese macho culture. I do agree that I've seen that on animes before, and I've heard that Hayao Miyazaki is a strong supporter of strong female leads exactly on that account. But I also really like some anime like Clannad and Kanon that have the opposite type of female characters. Oh well, I guess a good story is really more important than any other details.

[typhonsentra]

The debate about Yoko's importance is interesting. One problem I had was that the decision to make her a teacher on a remote island came with no foreshadowing, why is she the only character not to join the government? There was no previous hinting at her being interested in caring for children, or even not enjoying combat. It just seemed like an excuse to have a big reveal for one of the major characters at a dramatic moment.

[oompa loompa]

wow.. im.. blown away, not sure how else to put it. this was one hell of a ride, and gives a whole new meaning to epic.. i'm not too sure i like the ending at all though. I give it a 9/10, -1 just for the ending.. While I'm sure people will say that it probably is refreshing, and not a stereotypical ' happily ever after ending ' , ( this is personal opinion ) , but TTGL was probably better suited to the ' happily ever after ending '. happily ever after with a bang . The Yoko issue mentioned in above posts is also a major irritatant. Oh well, thats just about all i can complain about it. All in all the show is just brilliant, and I'll consider myself lucky if i get to see something like this again

[anime ronin]

perfect 10 hands down!

definately the most different mecha in anime history if its even considered mecha. the storyline was flawless! just when i thought it wouldnt get any better it just kept blowing me back more and more! as far as the action goes, i never thought they would make an anime thats power could compare to dbz but man!!! the fights were off the charts awsome!!!!!!

there were times when something so awsome would happen, i was sit there and clap with tears of joy. definately wanna my tops and excells 10 - infinity and beyond!

[Ctdash]

Anime
I would have given this anime a perfect rating if it wasn't for the ending and the premature deaths of two characters that I started to like. Overall the anime gets a 9/10 from me and I consider it the best Mecha anime I have seen as of now. Gundam Wing was my first fav. mecha anime and that was knocked out by 08th MS Team which was then knocked out by Escaflowne and then for a long time it remained my favorite mecha show until Gurren Lagann came out with it's unique, inspirational and explosive theme.

Music
The music was awesome. Perfect 10. Without the music the show wouldn't have been that inspiring and great. I liked the Opera/Hip Hop/Jazz feel it gave out throughout the series.


Animation
Vibrant and amazing graphics, colors and illustrations. Reminds me a lot of FLCL except with the craziness toned down. 10/10

Characters
Kamina - This guy was my favorite character of the show. Somehow I always new he was going to be killed because the first 7 episodes made it look like he was the main character while the show was supposed to be about Simon. I liked how he considered Simon a brother rather than a friend, and how much of a role model he was to a lot of characters in the show. Also it showed that he wasn't courageous out of nowhere. He became what he is because of a father who had offered him a life of adventure on a barren surface that seemed to scare him as a child. His father went on, and he stayed behind which prompt not to be so scared to face the unknown, hence why his bravery can seem outrageous and suicidal at times. I loved that. He also reminds me of an older friend I had when I was in elementary school, bringing out the brave of people who seemed weak, defeated and cowardly. It pissed me off more than it saddened me when he met his demise. Personally I believe Kamina should have lasted 6 more episodes. I liked how he returned in the end of the series though, and how much of an influence he was to the entire Gurren Lagann Brigade. Overall Kamina rocks, WHO THE HELL DO YOU THINK HE IS?!


Simon
Simon gets a 9/10. He is the only character to actually remind me of myself when I was a kid. A loner, shy, and looking for friends until I met a great one like Kamina. I didn't like Simon when Nia was introduced but he still was the character I felt resembled me the most. Like his friend and role model. Simon decided not to take shit, and grew up to be a great person. The end of the series screwed him though. Though I did not like Nia, I cared how they killed her off and sent him in a journey as a loner... No he should have had a happy ending and remained with his friends.


Kittan
Though I did not like episode 4, the introduction of Kittan was what kept me watching. He was the eldest sibling of three sisters. Awesome guy, and courageous like Kamina. In a way I feel like that if Kamina remained alive for most of the series, he and Kamina would have been best friends. He was another character that I felt was killed off unfairly but I thought it was necessary anyway because I bet it moved a lot of fans of the show. After Kamina's death I was pretty sure Kittan would have been a love interest to Yoko, atleast they showed a hint of that when they kissed.

Viral
Viral is the best villain gone hero in any series. I thought this guy was going to be an asshole like other anime villains but he just turned the tables on me, and remained a bad ass throughout the show even though he went good. Filled with honor and loyalty all the way to the end. He has the best and most awesome character transformation in the show. I'd hate to hear his name pronounced in the dub though. His names sounds better in the japanese dub, "Vee-Ral!".

Yoko
The series didn't do Yoko any justice. At first it looked like Yoko was a love interest to Simon which was what I was rooting for but then it was switched around to make her a possible lover to Kamina which I thought was unnecessary and shallow. The cool guy doesn't always deserve the hot girl. After that she is liked by Kittan which I thought was realistic. The show started her as a tough, provocative, and SEXY chick but innocent compared to many slutty ones in video games and other anime. She reminds me a little of Faye Valentine. The show took a dump on her though towards the end of the series. It looked like she was only there for eye candy. Her ending also pissed me off since she is another charcter, like Simon who seems to have grown old without a lover and alone.

Gimmy and Darry
Though they weren't focused on much I thought it was awesome how the two grew up to be useful. Seemed like they were also inspired by Simon in the earlier travels with Kamina and Simon. In the end, Gimmy and Darry get to pilot the Gurren Lagann and go forth to discover other galaxies, which to me felt like they were the only two to have the best ending in the anime.

[LotusGenie13]

I have only watched up to episode eight of Gurren Lagann, but I still feel that the series is epic. The battles were awesome to watch and the characters were interesting. However, even though I liked Kamina as a manly, hot-blooded character, watching some of Kamina's stupider antics made me wish that one of the other characters would just whack him on the head and get him some commone sense. He more than made up for it with his epicness in episode eight, though.

[BOOKGLUTTON]

It's been said, but I would give the show a perfect 10 even if it was just Yoko and Nia jumping and sliding around in jello all day. Best series I have seen in a while....

[Kuraudo]

Originally Posted by typhonsentra

The debate about Yoko's importance is interesting. One problem I had was that the decision to make her a teacher on a remote island came with no foreshadowing, why is she the only character not to join the government? There was no previous hinting at her being interested in caring for children, or even not enjoying combat. It just seemed like an excuse to have a big reveal for one of the major characters at a dramatic moment.

I thought so too. Why did she become a teacher? Nothing explains it but I guess we'll never get to know...

She did get her own episode but I think that episode was pretty much a big joke. It didn't add anything to her character really. She disappeared without notice, that is okay, but then we heard nothing which kind of disappoint me.

A story I would like to be told is the one of Yoko, Leeron and Dayakka and what happened to Littner Village.

But the anime is awesome, absolutely one of the best out there. I love the character development and how each episode is packed with stuff happening all the time. You never catch your breath but I totally love that. The story is really great and it touch my heart a couple of times.
10/10

[BOOKGLUTTON]

Actually the teacher thing was pretty well grounded. After Kamina died it wasn't as if she was gonna have a kid with simon or something, so she did the next best thing to having a kid...becoming a teacher. I mean other than bouncing around with them jigglies, she always seemed like she wanted to have kids or something. This is all of course grounded on no evidence, just a feeling or impression that I got from her.

[kamuinoyume]

When I first started seeing this series I never would have thought I would say this but THIS IS THE BEST SERIES EVER, it's awesome, a true masterpiece, although there was an episode or two that annoyed me but by the end it was all long gone, Kamina you have my respect and admiration, Simone you've grown up to surpass you're aniky, in my opinion that is, and the rest are great. Excellent work GAINAX!

[CaptainSmoker]

IM reading why alot of people enjoyed this show but I have serious issues with this anime, ive seen several animes and out of the ones Ive finished- this one was the lamest ive seen yet mainly because i cant figure out the identity of this show (these are my opinions hope som1 can give their take on them),

What I mean by identity is the mix of houmor(or lack of), with attempts of splashing in drama.

Pros-
1-Great animation
2-Fast moving
3-Unique story

Spoiler:

Now the cons...-
1- My main problem was that none of the charachter personalities were the least bit entertaining or unique- they were ALL very boring, Kamina was funny and i did enjoy watching him for the first 8 episodes but was killed off for some reason that doesnt make sense to me, why kill off the one thing that is carrying the show? Was it for plot development? If yes then in that case the story didnt take advantage of his death if you notice he dissapears nearly completly after his death, no flashbacks till like ep 25, the story moves in a different direction as if hes not suppose to be apart of the show. Simon was just painful to watch, Yoko was simply eye candy and the rest arn't worth mentioning.

2- The show tries to be funnny and childish yet dramatic at the same time, but fails at everything.

3- Fighting style was horrible... for a code geass fan like myself... watching mechs that move like humans is disgusting and defeats reason, ROBOTS ARE ROBOTS, so they should fight like robots? Why not make this into some kind of DBz if they wanted this type of fighting (if it can even be called that). Code geass uses logic and tactics with mechs, Where as in Lagann -Simon uses this mystical spiral weapon with unlimted power that somehow keeps adding more power to your mech as you get into deeper shit... oh and this little key helps him kick "Gods" ass somehow. Now im not comparing Geass with Toppa to put down toppa because i hate mech fighting period anyways but Geass comes up with incredible battles using mechs without the use of magical artifacts with unlimited power.

4- In the end simon defeats "God" yipee!! We see galaxie flung around like disks and world shaking battles, my friend MAde me watch this show, i was really dissapointed that they tried to make this some kind of Mecha DBZ, becuz Dbz stands way above this shit in my opinion.

IN the end I just dont get why this show is great, i think if you remove the perverted scenes and stuck this on saturday morning cartoons here in the states it would have been a great show for todlers.

[UnDeaD]

Originally Posted by CaptainSmoker

IM reading why alot of people enjoyed this show but I have series issues with this animes ive seen several animes and out of the ones I finished this one was the lamest (these are my opinions hope som1 can give their take on them),
I have a list of problems but ill first giv the Pros then cons

Pros-
1-Great animation
2-Fast moving
3-Unique story

Now the cons...-
1- My main problem was the that none of the charachter personalities were the leaast bit entertaining or unique they all sucked bad, Kamina was funny but waas killed off for some reason that i dont get, Simon was just painful to watch, Yoko was simply to stand as a eye candy all day. No one else is worth mentioning

2- The show tries to be funnny and childish yet they atempt to make the show dramatic sometimes, now i enjoy watching shows where good guys die which raises the stakes and drama, but this show had no identity when ever som1 would die i didnt know weather it was supose to be cool, sad, funny or what mainly because the animation is very childish.

3- Fighting style was horrible... for a code geass fan like me... watching mecks that move like humans is disgusting and defeats reason, ROBOTS ARE ROBOTS, so they should fight like robots, why not make this into some kind of DBz if they wanted this type of fighting if it can even be called that. code geass uses logic and tactics with mechs, Where as in Lagann Simon uses this mystical spiral weapon with unlimted power that somehow keeps giving him more power when ever hes in deep shit and he manages to kick Gods ass somehow with it = retarded

4- In the end simon defeats God yipee, we see galaxie flung around like disks and world shaking battles, my friend MAde me watch this show, i was really dissapointed that they tried to make this some kind of Mecha DBZ, becuz Dbz stands way above this shit in my opinion.

IN the end I just dont get why this show is great, story was different, but charachters sucked bad, no comedy, lil and random drama, and dumb action, i think if you remove the perverted scenes and stuck this on WB or Fox saturday morning cartoons it would have been a great show for todlers.

You've probably written the worst review in this entire thread. Congratulations.

Gurran-Lagann takes certain stereotypical character models and mkes them more realistic and relatable. So for example with Yoko when you first see her you assume she's going to be a Faye Valentine type character who acts hard on the outside but is really very sensitive and the usual fluff They haven't made her that way though. Gurren Lagann is a very "knowing wink" kind of series that takes a lot of very typical, larger than life anime archetypes and humanizes them, yet at the same time pays homage to the genre that created them.

Kamina's a good example in that he's a very classic Go Nagai kind of character; full-on, hot-blooded aggression, but in some ways, that's just a front he's projecting to inspire Simon, you could say that's why he wears the shades; to hide the fear in his eyes. There's this one flashback that perfectly encapsulates Kamina's character; when him and Simon are tunneling though some deep ground and everything starts collapsing around them - Kamina admits to Yoko he was scared shitless, but kept smiling and shouting because he didn't want to worry Simon, the guy who, despite his weedy appearance, is the real hero.

Then again, I don't expect a fan of Code Geass who actually believes that show involves "tactics" or "logic" to understand and enjoy something as clever and well-written as Gurren-Lagann.

[CaptainSmoker]

Okay i understand my "review " which was more or less a unthought out rant. It was harsh but some times I like stirring up controversy and arousing argument for the sake of discussion. Now I still beleive Tengen Toppa to be one of the worse animes ive ever seen and its exactly as you said

Originally Posted by UnDeaD

I don't expect a fan of Code Geass who actually believes that show involves "tactics" or "logic" to understand and enjoy something as clever and well-written as Gurren-Lagann.

i enjoy things that one can grasp as its dished out. Deathnote is another one of those shows. By episode 9 I lost complete interest in the gurren laggan (kamina dies by this time) and the show doesnt really have any other leg to stand on unless if you enjoy bizzare mech fights.

I have a problem with the words used to describe gurren lagann as "clever "and "well-written", now i thought laggan was large scale in that one kid defeats a world dictator and later kills "god", but the story wasnt exactly clever to me. Clever would be random twists that a good shonen usually has like the first 100 ep of naruto or one piece. Tengen toppa was story driven but that story to me wasnt very grand.

[BOOKGLUTTON]

Originally Posted by CaptainSmoker

I like stirring up controversy and arousing argument

GTFO TROLL. Are you serious? That review was nothing but a full on rant.

[Spectacular_Insanity]

Originally Posted by BOOKGLUTTON

GTFO TROLL. Are you serious? That review was nothing but a full on rant.

Seconded. Trolls are annoying. GTFO.

[musashiken]

Originally Posted by CaptainSmoker

IM reading why alot of people enjoyed this show but I have serious issues with this anime, ive seen several animes and out of the ones Ive finished- this one was the lamest ive seen yet mainly because i cant figure out the identity of this show (these are my opinions hope som1 can give their take on them),

What I mean by identity is the mix of houmor(or lack of), with attempts of splashing in drama.

Pros-
1-Great animation
2-Fast moving
3-Unique story

Now the cons...-
1- My main problem was that none of the charachter personalities were the least bit entertaining or unique- they were ALL very boring, Kamina was funny and i did enjoy watching him for the first 8 episodes but was killed off for some reason that doesnt make sense to me, why kill off the one thing that is carrying the show? Was it for plot development? If yes then in that case the story didnt take advantage of his death if you notice he dissapears nearly completly after his death, no flashbacks till like ep 25, the story moves in a different direction as if hes not suppose to be apart of the show. Simon was just painful to watch, Yoko was simply eye candy and the rest arn't worth mentioning.

2- The show tries to be funnny and childish yet dramatic at the same time, but fails at everything.

3- Fighting style was horrible... for a code geass fan like myself... watching mechs that move like humans is disgusting and defeats reason, ROBOTS ARE ROBOTS, so they should fight like robots? Why not make this into some kind of DBz if they wanted this type of fighting (if it can even be called that). Code geass uses logic and tactics with mechs, Where as in Lagann -Simon uses this mystical spiral weapon with unlimted power that somehow keeps adding more power to your mech as you get into deeper shit... oh and this little key helps him kick "Gods" ass somehow. Now im not comparing Geass with Toppa to put down toppa because i hate mech fighting period anyways but Geass comes up with incredible battles using mechs without the use of magical artifacts with unlimited power.

4- In the end simon defeats "God" yipee!! We see galaxie flung around like disks and world shaking battles, my friend MAde me watch this show, i was really dissapointed that they tried to make this some kind of Mecha DBZ, becuz Dbz stands way above this shit in my opinion.


IN the end I just dont get why this show is great, i think if you remove the perverted scenes and stuck this on saturday morning cartoons here in the states it would have been a great show for todlers.

Wtf, that dude should understand that Code Geass is not a robot show. Guy is liking it for the wrong reasons! He should be shot for basing his preconception of Japanese robot shows on a sobfest like Code Geass! The hell, Full Metal Panic does a whole lot better job in the Robot department than Code Geass.

That guy is insulting the very genre of Japanese robot shows! He probably has never watched a true super robot show in his whole life! And no, Gundam is another kind of robot show if that's what you're thinking. I'm talking about true robot shows like Mazinger, Getter Robo, Ideon etc. And we're talking about 30 over years of japanese animation! Gurren Lagann is a tribute to those robot shows.

So stop talking like an ignorant peon.

[AceD]

this anime doesnt even need a long review, it was epic on every level, masterpiece