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Old 2022-08-12, 05:25   Link #4001
Obelisk ze Tormentor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tactics View Post
He mentioned that Genesis Lemon didn't affect much to Baron overall performance and IMO its fair assessment.
He inflict damage to Demushu, only for later episode Demushu powered up and overwhelmed him again despite number advantages which lead to Kiwami Arms debut.
The bolded one is GDB's initial comment:
Quote:
Originally Posted by GDB View Post
I always felt like Lemon Baron was just a visual upgrade anyway. The story never seemed to treat it like an actual power-up.
Which is not true by default because Lemon Baron is indeed a literal & factual power-up as shown & stressed by the show itself. A power-up is a power-up regardless of how small you think the impact is.

Whether Demushu "gets more serious" after fighting Lemon Baron initially is an entirely different topic & issue. In fact, "Demushu getting more serious after fighting Lemon Baron" itself is a testament of the power of Lemon Baron that Demushu felt.
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Old 2022-08-12, 16:19   Link #4002
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Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor View Post
I don't know what you mean by this particular comment, but I already proven my argument that the show both depicted & stated that Genesis Lemon Baron is indeed a power-up from Sengoku Banana Baron.
So you can remember a random fight scene but can't remember quite possibly the largest plot hole in the entirety of Gaim?
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Old 2022-08-12, 16:31   Link #4003
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So you can remember a random fight scene but can't remember quite possibly the largest plot hole in the entirety of Gaim?
You already lost your original argument. Moving the goalpost is useless.
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Old 2022-08-12, 16:41   Link #4004
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Okay, have fun with that. I'll continue to maintain that it was basically a pallet swap for Mango Baron and you can continue to ignore plot holes.
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Old 2022-08-12, 16:48   Link #4005
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Originally Posted by GDB View Post
Okay, have fun with that. I'll continue to maintain that it was basically a pallet swap for Mango Baron and you can continue to ignore plot holes.
Okay, your original argument was defeated, and now you want to start a different one?

Plot holes on what? The moment Kaito lost the Genesis Driver permanently was when Ryoma push the self destruct button on Kaito & Yoko's Genesis Drivers in episode 43. After that, Kaito used his Sengoku Driver to fight Ryoma/Duke. Which one is the plot hole?

If the above is not the one that you meant then enlighten me which episode of this so-called plot hole. That is, if you really want to defend your argument and continue.
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Old 2022-08-12, 17:04   Link #4006
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Sorry, I don't have the episodes all on hand and haven't memorized each episode. I remember it's when he and Kouta were fighting one of the Overlords on Earth, some rubble traps Kaito from moving and separates him from the Genesis Driver. Instead of just pulling out the Sengoku Driver, he just keeps reaching for the Genesis Driver proclaiming he needs more power.

If that's not acceptable to you, then just move on.
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Old 2022-08-12, 18:05   Link #4007
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Originally Posted by GDB View Post
Sorry, I don't have the episodes all on hand and haven't memorized each episode. I remember it's when he and Kouta were fighting one of the Overlords on Earth, some rubble traps Kaito from moving and separates him from the Genesis Driver. Instead of just pulling out the Sengoku Driver, he just keeps reaching for the Genesis Driver proclaiming he needs more power.

If that's not acceptable to you, then just move on.
Ooh, that one. I've checked. That was a moment from episode 31, and you call it the "largest plot hole in the entirety of Gaim"? Eh, I don't think so.

Kaito was blasted by Demushu's super fireball and sent flying into a building. The building then crumbled and the debris separated Kaito from his GD, but not very far, he could almost reach it. Meanwhile, he was actually listening to the conversation between Kouta & Demushu with curiosity (coz it's rare to have an Overlord speak his mind at the time). Not long after that, the fight started again & a Kurokage kicked the GD to Kaito's reach and he used it.

So, why did Kaito try to reach the GD instead of pulling the SD? His mind might simply being too preoccupied & laser-focused on Demushu & reaching the GD to have a fighting chance against such Overlord. He was just blasted by a huge Overlord force after all. So I won't blame him if he acted less sharp afterwards

And that's it. Not much of a plot hole IMO. It arguably is a plot hole but nothing that can't be rationally explained by watching the show itself.
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Old 2022-08-14, 04:53   Link #4008
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Spoiler for Revice 48:
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Old 2022-08-14, 05:49   Link #4009
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Spoiler for Revice 48:
Spoiler for Revice Ending Episodes:
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Old 2022-08-14, 13:44   Link #4010
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so it's just Georgie throwing tantrum and nothing more...we couldn't even see the evil that was inside Georgie
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Old 2022-08-14, 18:14   Link #4011
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George's character arc has to be one of the worst in Rider history. They completely shat on him, not even a shred of dignity left in the end.

Revice started out great but it turned into a complete trainwreck in the end. As far as I'm concerned, Reiwa has been a complete bust for now.
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Old 2022-08-14, 18:44   Link #4012
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Like seriously

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Old 2022-08-14, 19:36   Link #4013
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George's character arc has to be one of the worst in Rider history. They completely shat on him, not even a shred of dignity left in the end.
His arc isn't even the worst in Revice. Daiji still takes that cake.
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Old 2022-08-14, 20:31   Link #4014
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His arc isn't even the worst in Revice. Daiji still takes that cake.
And that's because it was only two episodes. However the choice of putting this as part of the final arc is definitely headscratching.

I'm not going lie, the final stretch of Revice is so underwhelming and anti-climatic compared to past seasons.
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Old 2022-08-14, 21:55   Link #4015
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And that's because it was only two episodes. However the choice of putting this as part of the final arc is definitely headscratching.

I'm not going lie, the final stretch of Revice is so underwhelming and anti-climatic compared to past seasons.
TBH, Jeanne power-up and Juuga feels like a V-Cinema material that shoved into series similar to Destream and Vail.
Especially Juuga, with it design being tribute to Ultimate Kuuga and 10th Rider, also conclusion to George we saw in this episode.

It made me wonder if Revice writing team didn't have any idea past Demons Olteca, and I don't get how it could happen compare to Zero One and Saber that struggle with COVID restriction. To make it worse, it looks like they write themselves into corner; I can't see Ikki, Daiji, Sakura nor George characters properly saved by additional form like Lone Wolf Vulcan or Thousand Nights Espada.

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Old 2022-08-15, 06:54   Link #4016
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His arc isn't even the worst in Revice. Daiji still takes that cake.
I don't know. At least Daiji's arc had a somewhat decent resolution. George's ended with him crying for his daddy while rolling on the ground.

They were both atrocious, but to me George is worst.
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Old 2022-08-15, 09:23   Link #4017
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When you have debates on which two characters in a single KR show that has the worst arc in the entire franchise, the show itself must not be too far behind in terms of badness .
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Old 2022-08-15, 09:41   Link #4018
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Any possibility this is a result of Too Many Riders?

Like, I totally understand that more Riders= More Toy Sales. But I'm starting to wonder if many of the "ultimately bleh" season of KR also happen to have three or more Riders. Of course, it could just be "correlation is not causation"
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Old 2022-08-15, 10:09   Link #4019
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Any possibility this is a result of Too Many Riders?

Like, I totally understand that more Riders= More Toy Sales. But I'm starting to wonder if many of the "ultimately bleh" season of KR also happen to have three or more Riders. Of course, it could just be "correlation is not causation"
The key is writing, production management & execution. Ryuki had 13-ish Riders but the showrunners managed their assets very well to the point where it became a modern classic that inspired a lot of people even cross industries. Gaim had 11+ Riders and it went really well for them too.

So it's not really about "Riders being too many" but more about "How many Riders that you can manage with your writing & execution?". Even if you have just 1 Rider, if the writing is bad, the management is all over the place & the production value is cheap then the show will still suck.
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Old 2022-08-15, 11:20   Link #4020
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Any possibility this is a result of Too Many Riders?

Like, I totally understand that more Riders= More Toy Sales. But I'm starting to wonder if many of the "ultimately bleh" season of KR also happen to have three or more Riders. Of course, it could just be "correlation is not causation"
Won't be accurate because there were series that telling stories just fine under "too many Riders": Ryuki, Gaim, Ex-Aid and Saber.
Surely the quality between them varies but I considered they all delivered their last quarter nicely in comparison to Revice last quarter.

"Too many Riders" that notably underperformed by second half are Hibiki and Kabuto, it happened due to both got change in writing direction.
Hibiki main writer kicked from production team due to low rating and unwillingness to change script to fit production cost, causing severe OOC in storytelling during second half it made Hibiki actor didn't want to work with Kamen Rider again until both sides made truce. Meanwhile Kabuto somehow have to facilitate duo Hopper and DK Kabuto, likely for toys selling as it contrast to Kabuto after-story that tell Kagami is at point he's going to propose to Hiyori during times Tendo travelling around the world, mirrorring GSL movie.

So yeah, like Obelisk said, the key is writing and coordination. Not an easy thing to do, several example other than two above:

Den-O and Wizard couldn't keep their original plan for second half as Hana and Koyomi actress prioritized other jobs.
Some things changed for Gaim as Kaito received upgrade via Toei request. Later, Ryoma actor got good job for a while, another change, go to space it is.
Izu as Zero Two should be happened by series and Ark-One is intended to be someone else, but COVID restriction said "Not happening" it goes to Aruto and Horobi.
COVID became worse during Saber that director and Fukuda (the main writer) admit Tassel is unplanned, originally exist to fit 24 minutes duration per episode.

Its difficult to give benefit of doubt to Revice because COVID restriction in Japan already lifted during Revice and they can facilitate Hiromu, who sometimes absent for another role similar to Ryoma.
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