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Old 2021-12-05, 05:22   Link #1521
Guardian Enzo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mangamuscle View Post
There is also the possibility that by the time the virus reaches such a stage, it would have killed a sizeable share of the human population, let's not forget hat the bubonic plague killed in Europe between 25% to 60% of the population; even 10% would be quite apocalyptic imo.
Apples and oranges. The bubonic plague was many orders of magnitude more lethal than any COVID variant from the start. It's also bacterial, not viral. As a rule viruses don't evolve to be more deadly - that's counter-evolutionary. What's advantageous is to be more transmissible and less severe.
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Old 2021-12-05, 07:27   Link #1522
MeoTwister5
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And bacteria very rarely mutate this fast. Viral genomes are much more malleable than bacterial genomes.
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Old 2021-12-05, 11:50   Link #1523
EroKing
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
As a rule viruses don't evolve to be more deadly - that's counter-evolutionary. What's advantageous is to be more transmissible and less severe.
Hasn't Delta already proved that wrong already? Do viruses even understand the concepts of rules and time? Or are we talking decades or centuries when this theory comes into play. Evolution is just a part of mutation and theories seem to heavily ignore real factors such as other viruses circulating in the world. Such as this variant seems to have picked up a piece of common-cold virus and hence the symptoms are more like common cold and nothing like Covid-19 cases, caused by the other variants.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kari-no-sugata II View Post
That's exactly what's discussed here:
https://www.cityam.com/from-covid-cu...elta-mutation/
Ruling out the factor that one can't be infected with both Delta and Omicron at the same time is weird when there have been cases of people getting infected by both the Alpha and Delta variants. Having it wash over countries is going to leave countless dead, have people deal with long-term health problems and complications that make them go through painful treatments and therapies, which most couldn't afford, only to die a second time. You already have countries where the number of deaths are shooting up. Can't bother to even mention Murica where the active cases have remained between 9-10 million for a few months now... Is it really a good idea to have it spread everywhere and leaving them vulnerable to the Delta and other variants which might have gone unnoticed just for an experiment, when there are still plenty of people in 3rd world countries who haven't gotten their first dose of the vaccine yet? There's nothing to suggest that Delta and Omicron can't coexist in the world.

[Random rant]
Today, things are way better here in India with just about 100 deaths a day from Covid. It's just the one state of Kerala which is updating their numbers as they heavily under-counted since June 2020 and those 200-300 extra deaths are getting added daily making it look like we still have 400-500 deaths a day. What Trump once suggested to have the virus wash over their country, it ended up happening here because of the bad healthcare and too many election rallies with no Covid guidelines being followed. A few million probably died, we will never know the official numbers. Having it spread at the same time everywhere, Delta largely is now no longer a threat here, for now. But the cost for it was huge.
[End of rant]
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Old 2021-12-05, 12:13   Link #1524
mangamuscle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
As a rule viruses don't evolve to be more deadly - that's counter-evolutionary. What's advantageous is to be more transmissible and less severe.
I keep reading this over and over. But we are ignoring a simple fact, we live in the XXI century. For most of mankind history, if a virus with a high mortality rate appeared, it makes sense that the village where the mutation took place would be wiped out, worst case scenario a few villages near them also and then the virus would cease to exist.

In the XX century the so called spanish flu moved by boat and train, probably becoming the fastest pandemic in history. Nowadays the virus moves by airplane, literally one day is all it takes for it to hope into a new continent.

Maybe we should stop saying vaccination provides immunity, since it is more accurate to say it grants (high) levels of resistance, but you can still be infected and become (even if for a short amount of time) a carrier for the disease to spread further.

Call me an alarmist if you will, but a virus is not a sentient being, it is merely a piece of code that reproduces due to a feature in our biology, so as long as we keep transporting it where there are new hosts it will continue to spread and the variant that does it more efficiently will become predominant, whether it is more or less deadly is but an afterthought.

Last edited by mangamuscle; 2021-12-05 at 12:23.
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Old 2021-12-05, 17:47   Link #1525
Guardian Enzo
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First of all, epidemiologists have never been saying the fax provides immunity. That’s the mulyaks in the press who love simple and dramatic black and white answers to spoonfeed the public.

It doesn’t matter whether a living creature is self-aware and understands evolution or not, it works either way. And it acts a lot faster on viruses than it does on complex animals like moles or humans. Over time Corona will evolve into a less deadly but more transmissible version - the question that matters in practical terms is how quickly that takes place.
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Old 2021-12-05, 20:09   Link #1526
The Green One
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Don't forget the pack of drooling morons who proudly announce to the world they'd rather die then take basic safety protocols against Covid and don't care how many they take with them around them.
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Old 2021-12-05, 22:58   Link #1527
Guardian Enzo
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Some interesting news now that Omicron may have picked up a bit of the rhinovirus (common cold) as it mutated. That might help explain why it’s seemingly less severe for most people.
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Old 2021-12-07, 04:01   Link #1528
EroKing
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
Some interesting news now that Omicron may have picked up a bit of the rhinovirus (common cold) as it mutated. That might help explain why it’s seemingly less severe for most people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EroKing View Post
Such as this variant seems to have picked up a piece of common-cold virus and hence the symptoms are more like common cold and nothing like Covid-19 cases, caused by the other variants.
Bruh...

Anyways,
Italian dentist presents fake arm for vaccine to get pass.
This is pretty hilarious. Anti-vaxxers are getting more creative at this than they would in their sex lives
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Old 2021-12-16, 19:23   Link #1529
ganbaru
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Robby Soave: Airplanes Have Better Air Quality Than ICUs. Isn’t It Time To End Mask Mandates?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezRXLM2Qzhg

I have a serious doubt about that one, thoses statements about the airplane's air quality would be more convincing coming from actual scientific insted of Air Transportation Corporation executive and go in contradiction with all the informations I got previously, but maybe I am just too suspicious.
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Old 2021-12-16, 20:27   Link #1530
McW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
Robby Soave: Airplanes Have Better Air Quality Than ICUs. Isn’t It Time To End Mask Mandates?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezRXLM2Qzhg

I have a serious doubt about that one, thoses statements about the airplane's air quality would be more convincing coming from actual scientific insted of Air Transportation Corporation executive and go in contradiction with all the informations I got previously, but maybe I am just too suspicious.
If this conclusion doens't come from an extensive study, there's no reason to take this seriously
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Old 2021-12-16, 23:39   Link #1531
mangamuscle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
Robby Soave: Airplanes Have Better Air Quality Than ICUs. Air Transportation Corporation executive
You mean, The ones that certified the Boeing 737 Max? What could go wrong!
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Old 2021-12-17, 19:19   Link #1532
ganbaru
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McW View Post
If this conclusion doens't come from an extensive study, there's no reason to take this seriously
The more I think about it, the more it make think of thoses others ''corporate-funded-reaserch-than-end-up-agreeing-with-corporate''. I read for years about the bad quality of the air in airplane and now it's supposed to be great, unless they did massive investment and work in the last 2 years I find it pretty untrustworthy.
And let's not forget the elephant in the room; we are still in a pandemic, a new (said to be more contagious) variant is out, what kind of idiot really think than we should ease-up air travel insted of restricting it more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mangamuscle View Post
You mean, The ones that certified the Boeing 737 Max? What could go wrong!
Actually wouldn't it be one of the federal agency, not the corporate executive, than certify airplane?
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Old 2021-12-17, 22:28   Link #1533
mangamuscle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
Actually wouldn't it be one of the federal agency, not the corporate executive, than certify airplane?
The way I see it, they are basically joined at the hip, unless of course this administration does something that really probes the neutrality and independence of said federal agency.

Now I will say what I have been thinking since I read that "omicron is less deadly", my fear is that what early data shows is that oung & healthy people (the ones in previous variants simply got the virus but thought they simply got the flu and never went to a hospital) are now getting sick enough to go get checked at the hospital, skewing the data towards "milder infection" but when the new variant hits the unvaccinated, unhealthy or unlucky people, we will start to panic like never before.

I hope to be wrong, but I will stay put under my rock until further notice.
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Old 2021-12-18, 09:38   Link #1534
GDB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
And let's not forget the elephant in the room; we are still in a pandemic, a new (said to be more contagious) variant is out, what kind of idiot really think than we should ease-up air travel insted of restricting it more.
Also, when an issue is still present but getting better because of preventative measures, you don't just remove said preventative measures just because it's getting better. It means it works, so you keep going until the problem is resolved to an agreeable extent.

Also, masks are basically nothing, people need to stop being babies.
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Old 2021-12-18, 14:53   Link #1535
mangamuscle
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Originally Posted by GDB View Post
Also, masks are basically nothing, people need to stop being babies.
Circa April/1990

https://i.imgur.com/HfGZhw6.jpg
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Old 2021-12-19, 20:28   Link #1536
Key Board
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If Warren and Booker has it, than it’s only time before the entire Senate , congress and government has it.

Edit: A state senator from my state already died.

//
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Old 2021-12-22, 10:55   Link #1537
kari-no-sugata II
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Seems increasingly clear to me that the Omicron outbreak is less severe than Delta. I'm not saying that Omicron by itself is a good thing of course, more like - it's reasonable to be cautious but no need to panic or freak out.
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Old 2021-12-22, 18:21   Link #1538
ganbaru
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kari-no-sugata II View Post
Seems increasingly clear to me that the Omicron outbreak is less severe than Delta. I'm not saying that Omicron by itself is a good thing of course, more like - it's reasonable to be cautious but no need to panic or freak out.
I can't say that with the situation where I live, the number of daily case explosed in my province and even if they would be less severe the sheere number of them might overload the health system.
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Old 2021-12-22, 19:11   Link #1539
kari-no-sugata II
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Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
I can't say that with the situation where I live, the number of daily case explosed in my province and even if they would be less severe the sheere number of them might overload the health system.
I live in London and cases are up about 4x and might have peaked. Hospitalisations are up about 2x and don't seem to have peaked yet. ICU patients are flat, or if anything going down currently. Obviously these numbers could change as more data comes in but this is relatively in-line with other countries.

Apparently a higher than normal number of patients counted in more recent figures are patients entering hospital for reasons other than COVID and also the average stay in hospital is lower.

If cases were continuing to grow exponentially I'd be more concerned. This would be likely to happen if both the government and the people completely ignored the situation. If that's happening where you are then I think it would be reasonable to be concerned.
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Old 2021-12-23, 09:06   Link #1540
The Green One
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People ARE ignoring the situation by refusing to get vaccinated which is what's giving Covid time to mutate like this.

Once Covid mutates enough to invalidate the vaccine's protection I fully expect these idiots to crow about how they're "right" not to get the vaccination if "it doesn't help."

Idiots.....
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