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View Poll Results: Fate/Zero - Episode 24 Rating | |||
Perfect 10 | 62 | 48.82% | |
9 out of 10 : Excellent | 36 | 28.35% | |
8 out of 10 : Very Good | 14 | 11.02% | |
7 out of 10 : Good | 4 | 3.15% | |
6 out of 10 : Average | 3 | 2.36% | |
5 out of 10 : Below Average | 3 | 2.36% | |
4 out of 10 : Poor | 3 | 2.36% | |
3 out of 10 : Bad | 2 | 1.57% | |
2 out of 10 : Very Bad | 0 | 0% | |
1 out of 10 : Painful | 0 | 0% | |
Voters: 127. You may not vote on this poll |
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2012-06-17, 21:24 | Link #181 | |
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Join Date: Jan 2007
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2012-06-17, 22:05 | Link #183 | |
Bittersweet Distractor
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 32
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I pretty much agree that they should have left the last few minutes with Gil and Saber and Kiritsugu out for next episode and that might've alleviated some of the problems that we had here...
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2012-06-17, 23:08 | Link #184 | |
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Join Date: Mar 2009
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You know, retail version will be always more important and there is a tv timeslot they have to obey. The same happened with episode 11, and they fixed it later (even re-broadcasting it full edition in a season 1 marathon some weeks after). Battle conclusions (with the only stuff left out being Berserker motivation and last words) were the same in the original material so... |
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2012-06-17, 23:24 | Link #185 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
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I agree with that (and I went into it in that "We'll do it better on bluray" thread, which is basically a sub-thread for this episode... ), but ultimately I still believe certain scenes are a little too important to completely excuse their absence from the TV edit, which was definitely the case here. And it certainly doesn't help that they (thought they) had time to fool around in the first season, where far less relevant (or even canon) material made it to the TV edits.
But yeah, my realizing (and desperately hoping) that the retail version will fix the problems with this episode is the reason why I've also opted out of rating it like Reckoner. |
2012-06-17, 23:25 | Link #186 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
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So that was the big disappointment of this episode As for Saber, poor girl. Not to sound sadistic as Gilgamesh, but I found myself understanding what he said. In a way, Saber really is beautiful in despair. Or maybe it was just the amazing job her seiyu was doing with her screams and pleas to Kiritsugu to stop at the end. It's unfortunate, she has zero idea about any of his personality or motivations which we all now know thoroughly. I can't imagine how terrified she must have felt at those commands. |
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2012-06-17, 23:26 | Link #187 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Here's the biggest point you people are missing:
If the Loli Rin stuff was removed, then where does the 10 minutes that make up that episode come from? Do we just move everything ten minutes up? Take the first ten minutes of episode 11 and essentially cut that entire sequence in half, ruining the effect of the IH? Think about what kind of change that will make. What would necessarily happen if everything was moved ten minutes forward? When I say that each episode is "standalone", I mean that all the events of the episode either flow into each other or have some kind of cohesive theme. More importantly, do you really think that skipping ten minutes of an episode will have ANY kind of effect on a sequence FOURTEEN episodes later? Really? That's more than half of the series gone by, and any effect that changing the sequence of events would've been long gone by then anyway. |
2012-06-18, 00:03 | Link #188 |
Banned
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Figures that the part of the episode I was looking forward to seeing most in the Saber/Lancelot character clash would apparently be excised for Blu-Ray only release. I really didn't think I asked for that much from this show. I don't think I've really had any particular expectations as of yet since I'm really not that hardcore into Type/Moon like some anyway and I mostly just watch this entry for the complex morality conflict angles by Gen that I've come to enjoy puzzling over since Madoka Magica and of course the fancy action scenes. Apparently though I did ask for more than could be offered in the immediate present. Guess I might have to find a way to read the light novel chapter if I want to find out what happened with Saber this summer. Shame cause this feels like it could be the grand daddy of them all and maybe could have even brought me that much more into the Type/Moon universe....but it'll have to wait.
Desipte that pretty disappointing reality though there's still there's some other points of interest like Kiritsgu making the just choice in the end and putting the world ahead of his own desires, but is Saber actually going to be able to take out the grail or is Gilgamesh going to work some hax and stop her? I would have to imagine that Gilgamesh is finally going to be placed in some real peril and have little time to react, but I thought that last time and oh how wrong was I proven. Not even going to jinx it by saying I'm looking forward to anything specific from next episode so cutting my commentary short right here. |
2012-06-18, 00:46 | Link #189 | ||
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Join Date: Jan 2007
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And hey, if you'd like, I can come up with the exact same solution ufotable came up with for this episode, only for episode 10: Shorten episode 9's events a little and fit a very abridged version of "Rin's Adventure" into a few of its minutes. If it's okay for Arthur vs Lancelot to received that treatment, then why not loli Rin? And with that, there would be no padding and your precious Grail Dialogue could still take place in one episode. Not that that's actually important either, since the notion that a story event is automatically ruined simply because it is not concluded in the same episode where it began is highly questionable. How about Saber vs Berserker then? That sequence was cut in half in the previous episode, but I'm pretty sure no one would have minded it being concluded in this episode if it had been done properly. There's dozens of other examples of stuff like that in every single series, not just Fate/Zero. Ever heard of cliffhangers? It's honestly baffling to me that I'm even discussing something like this. The start/end points of each episode should get priority over the wholeness of the work? C'mon now. Quote:
As for this "cohesive theme" each episode has to have, tell me then, what was the cohesive theme for, say, episode 9? The first half was basically entirely dedicated to a love triangle falling apart, whereas the second half had a complete mood whiplash into Waver and Rider's bromance and their rampaging through the wicked Caster's lair. Which is but one of many examples that there's nothing wrong with episodes having scenes that are different in tone, and that in the end what matters most is that all of the important material makes it in and the story truly feels like a whole. How that whole is divided into weekly bits of 22 minutes is a secondary priority. ...At least, that's how I feel. However, I can accept that you, in turn, feel the individual content and cutoff points of each episode are something of the utmost importance. Just… don't try and force that feeling onto those of us who would rather have the complete story (or something resembling it), even if it's not so neatly separated into these so-called standalone episodes of yours. And that's a big if, because the two are hardly mutually exclusive. |
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2012-06-18, 01:47 | Link #190 |
❤Ichigo 100%❤
Join Date: Jan 2011
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Just watched the episode tonight at a family house after dinner... very depressing episode. For me, especially when he chose to weed out 1 person out of 3. Seeing Maiya die was saddening.
What made my buddy more depress was watching "Kara no Kyoukai 5: Mujun Rasen" after this episode. He was cursing the director afterwards! lolz
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2012-06-18, 02:54 | Link #191 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2009
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I'd argue the Rin episode was actually one which fitted the TV format. It wasn't jumping between 5 parties ruining the pacing of every other scene, it had structure and presented a satisfying little story for the week. Now the last few episodes of the show: constantly jumping between different expositions and fights. When Rider charges for Gil it cuts to Saber talking. When Berserker is charging for Saber it cuts to Gil talking while Rider is still running towards him. Same for the figths in 24. Extended episodes will not make it any better to me! Shonen fightan, etc. Here's my simple suggestion: WHY NOT make the last 3 episodes happen at the same time? Have one episode for all the buildup and fighting of Rider and Gil, then all the buildup and fightan for Saber and Lancelot and all the buildup and fighting for Kirei and Kotomine. End them all at the same spot with the Grail - revealing only seconds more of the scene every week. This is what the TV format is good for! It's easy to do and you only need to give the viewer a clue that it's happening at the same time as the last episode - you don't need to have a stupid rewind effect like in Shiki. It may be annoying for the "story" to be stuck at the same point in time for 3 weeks but it would not be Endless 8 and each week we would be presented with "complete" events rather than a Soap where after 10 episodes they are still pouring that same fucking tea (which is what ufotable is doing in my opinion). I've been saying it for the last 16 or so episodes: the pacing sucks, ufotable failed at planning this show for the TV format. The show is just not good. PS. Why am I still watching the show? Cause I'm a fool falling for the "it gets better in the last volume" hype and a Kajiura fan still hoping to be surprised. Bitchslapping myself on both accounts. |
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2012-06-18, 03:15 | Link #192 |
Art Block Specialist
Join Date: Jun 2007
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let's just put it simply, where would you cut off from ep11 to put in ep10? Where would you say to be a suitable stopping point? Remember that the Kariya scene has to be there.
Also Horse. remember that it's only 2 episodes instead of 3, so your method won't work.
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2012-06-18, 04:04 | Link #193 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2009
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I'm really not trying to fix the show (I'm no writer or director) so I'm just pointing out what exactly I'm not enjoying (the pacing) and saying how they COULD have done things differently (without simply hating on the actual story). There's really no way of telling it would actually be better either. It was their job to make a good show and I simply do not think they did - they keep taking the most bland approach that exists. Obviously my opinion means squat for the sales - the majority loves the show and I don't understand why. |
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2012-06-18, 04:07 | Link #194 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Age: 33
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Also, if the vast majority of anime were nearly as good as Fate/Zero, I'd probably watch far more anime on a regular basis. Fate/Zero avoids a lot of the pitfalls, cliches, and fetish pandering that has scared me away from the medium.
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2012-06-18, 04:21 | Link #195 | ||
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Join Date: Sep 2009
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#2 I don't know what you're getting at. In my eyes those were very different cases. For example: the 3 fights in the last episodes are completely seperate while Lancer takes part in both Saber vs Caster and Kiritsugu vs Keyneth (sp?). Quote:
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2012-06-18, 04:31 | Link #196 | |||
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Age: 33
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2012-06-18, 04:44 | Link #197 | ||
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2012-06-18, 05:13 | Link #198 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Age: 33
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2012-06-18, 05:20 | Link #199 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2009
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And I guess we could leave it at that - just like Kiritsugu and Kirei can't come to an understanding in #24. |
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2012-06-18, 05:34 | Link #200 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Houston
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For me, there's also the fact that there's other scenes that while more important than loli-Rin, I think could have been cut out in favor of the Saber-Berserker battle. Kariya getting that worm shoved in him and Waver's scene with his grandpa are the first two I think of. They're good scenes, but I'd rather give that battle more time.
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