[Manga] Naruto Chapter 585 Discussion

[janipani]

Of course Kabuto is strong. He's a Sage. And Naruto has shown us, that Sage mode is able to take down even a rinnegan user. + that it has been mentioned that environment is strongly in his favor right now.

[HiddenMessage]

No ones gonna talk about Sasuke's "Sharingan-Genjitsu" in his MS mode? Itachi called out Tsukiyomi but Sasuke's using some generic illusion.

[Randrak42]

Originally Posted by HiddenMessage

No ones gonna talk about Sasuke's "Sharingan-Genjitsu" in his MS mode? Itachi called out Tsukiyomi but Sasuke's using some generic illusion.

Tsukiyomi is too mainstream...Sharingan-Genjutsu is the new, hipster way of calling it.

[vansonbee]

Its a bad taste that Kabuto used the "flute girl"

male =/= female body lol

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by ChronoReverse

There were some who insisted that he didn't have access to it as an Edo Tensei zombie despite there being no indications that he wouldn't have it.

Oh? I must have missed that I suppose, it makes no sense whatsoever though.

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

But i was not aware of how strong Kabuto became, now we know that Kabuto is so strong that he can easly stand against all known MS jutsu including any already known genjutsu.

No he can't, he simply worked his way around them : he's able to fight without sight and they cannot kill him before he releases Edo Tensei which make most of their power irrelevant considering the situation.

There's a part where Itachi and Sasuke look into each other's eyes, and it seems that broke down the sound genjutsu, i didn't get how that worked.

The way to release someone from Genjutsu is to put your chakra inside him to disturb his own which is also the way Genjutsu works in the first place. A Sharingan "Kai" if you will.

Originally Posted by Randrak42

Tsukiyomi is too mainstream...Sharingan-Genjutsu is the new, hipster way of calling it.

No, it's just that Sasuke cannot use Tsukuyomi, he has Kagutsuki instead.

[Sasukemaru]

Actually this chapter proves sasuke doesn't have tsukiyomi, which ends a long debate. It also shows that receiving itachis eyes doesn't give him itachis doujutsu. Yeah kabuto is strong but the way sasuke asked if he can just kill him already shows me he is weaker then both bros. Not to mention the way itachi talks down to him basically calling him a cheap knock off. And who said itachi got pwnd? Are u serious? The fight is already over, itachis eye was gone, kabuto was basically lashing out against him like a stupid child. Also why would anybody think itachi couldn't use his tsukiyomi? The only reason he didnt use it on kabuto is because kabuto dropped that film over his eyes making him immune to visual jutsu

[Poetic Justice]

I think using Izanami is probably gonna destroy Itachi's body or something.

[Ulquiorra]

My respect for Tayuya shot up after this chapter. Sound genjustu is badarse if it can bypass Susanoo and even mess up god level Uchiha. At 14 she was already 100,000 times more dangerous than Kurenai as a genjutsu user. Sucks for her she ran into a guy with an over 200 IQ and a girl with a giant fan that could blow sound.

It is interesting to see Sasuke look like a kid out of his league with his big brother protecting him. It makes him so much more likable.

Why doesn't Kabuto get one of those cloths the Sand ninja are throwing on everyone? Much better than trying to kill an immortal zombie. Itachi already won.

[Lunarskylar]

Originally Posted by Detective-san

The first translation read was really trippy, thankfully the second was a bit better.

That jutsu Kabuto used was pretty damn awesome, too bad he's too busy angsting right now to explain how it works...

i'm sure he's using sakon's jutsu to have your twin as part of your body, and have teh snake change into the hosts of the techniques. dunno if it's regular henge or sage related, but it's an interesting combination

i had always wanted kabuto to manipulate itachi into releasing orochimaru, but with this whole "i have his clone in my body", i guessss not

im going to assume that he needed the actual bodies of the people while they were alive to combine these jutsu with his sakon jutsu; otherwise i dunt know why he's not pulling out Madara's dna, or any of the kage's dna.

shuda combined those with himself, not genins from over a decade ago, lool
well i enjoyed the nostalgia

[ntherblast]

Originally Posted by janipani

Of course Kabuto is strong. He's a Sage. And Naruto has shown us, that Sage mode is able to take down even a rinnegan user. + that it has been mentioned that environment is strongly in his favor right now.

Naruto has shown us this is a shonen and he has plot armor

[Ero-Senn1n]

Originally Posted by Hunter

No he can't, he simply worked his way around them : he's able to fight without sight and they cannot kill him before he releases Edo Tensei which make most of their power irrelevant considering the situation.

"working his way around them" is practically the same as being immune to those. Similarly to the raikage being able to outrun the amaterasu. On the other hand it's true that they didn't go for the kill so Kabuto had an advantage, however they are 2 against 1 so they have an advantage too. I got the impression that if it were only EMS-Sasuke he would already be dead and added to Kabuto's body. Or whatever that is I mean that body has an Orochimaru-penis, Kishimoto just invented another level of disgusting jutsus

[octaviahawk]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

It was not because of the context, Kabuto looks upon them as some angry peasants look at royalty and noblemen. Even in the ninja world there are elite clans as opposed to average ninja, and often those who were not born to be ninja royalty begin to hate the royalty. Kabuto probably thinks these people had unfair advantages over him, so he wants to steal their powers, just like the communists wanted to kill rich people and take their money/lands/etc.

True true, I mean, that's a really insightful point, but at the same time, Kabuto's insult still rings hollowly to me; after all, it's because of Itachi's powerful jutsu that he was forced to kill his whole family. And Kabuto wasn't exactly born with no inherent talent; he's got an innate ability for medical ninjutsu.

IDK, I think Kabuto is just being angsty. It's like no one has suffered more than he has, and he has the hubris to say this to the two most traumatized characters in the whole show, Itachi and Sasuke. Ultimately, I think this kind of thinking will lead to Kabuto's downfall.

Originally Posted by Ulquiorra

My respect for Tayuya shot up after this chapter. Sound genjustu is badarse if it can bypass Susanoo and even mess up god level Uchiha. At 14 she was already 100,000 times more dangerous than Kurenai as a genjutsu user. Sucks for her she ran into a guy with an over 200 IQ and a girl with a giant fan that could blow sound.

Indeed, my fangirl heart skipped a beat when we had one panel of Tayuya being bad-ass T-T. I wonder...just how many dead characters does Kabuto have hiding under that snake skin...man is that a creepy thought...:X

Originally Posted by ntherblast

Naruto has shown us this is a shonen and he has plot armor

'nough said.

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by Ero-Senn1n

"working his way around them" is practically the same as being immune to those. Similarly to the raikage being able to outrun the amaterasu.

Your very example shows how different that is. Had Raikage been immune he wouldn't have lost his hand.

On the other hand it's true that they didn't go for the kill so Kabuto had an advantage, however they are 2 against 1 so they have an advantage too. I got the impression that if it were only EMS-Sasuke he would already be dead and added to Kabuto's body. Or whatever that is I mean that body has an Orochimaru-penis, Kishimoto just invented another level of disgusting jutsus

This is Itachi's show, Sasuke is almost entirely useless in this fight and will stay that way as long as his brother is there. Were he alone he would do much better, particulary if he didn't have to bother about Kabuto's life.
That is not to say he would win though, Kabuto is become a beast.

Originally Posted by Ulquiorra

My respect for Tayuya shot up after this chapter. Sound genjustu is badarse if it can bypass Susanoo and even mess up god level Uchiha. At 14 she was already 100,000 times more dangerous than Kurenai as a genjutsu user.

This is not really Tayuya, only her bioengineered Sage-induced DNA and jutsu. It's like comparing, let's say Genin Sasuke's fireball with Edo-Madara's. Same jutsu but entirely different power-level.

[solidguy]

Originally Posted by ChronoReverse

There were some who insisted that he didn't have access to it as an Edo Tensei zombie despite there being no indications that he wouldn't have it.

whats more interesting is the laying to rest of the sasuke using tsukuyomi debate. he CANT

[Ulquiorra]

Originally Posted by Hunter

This is not really Tayuya, only her bioengineered Sage-induced DNA and jutsu. It's like comparing, let's say Genin Sasuke's fireball with Edo-Madara's. Same jutsu but entirely different power-level.

I don't know how you make a sound genjutsu like Mateki-Mugen Onsa more powerful outside of increasing its range. It is different than a fireball where obviously the size and intensity of the flame can be increased.

There is no shame in Itachi and Sasuke getting caught in it. Or having to rely on each other to escape. The sharingan is not immune to sound genjutsu. And Susanoo could not protect them. Sound genjutsu is said to be most dangerous form of genjutsu for a reason. Shikamaru only escaped because...well he is Shikamaru and no one else thinks that many steps ahead. And Temari was able to blow away the sound.

Tayuya was forced to use the second level of the curse seal. to use this genjutsu. So it takes a great deal of chakra. Which is no problem for Kabuto in Sage Mode.

[Suika-Esper]

Originally Posted by Lunarskylar

i had always wanted kabuto to manipulate itachi into releasing orochimaru, but with this whole "i have his clone in my body", i guessss not

I was hoping that too. I still think he might. With all this talk of him being nobody and them saying that he's just trying to be Orochimaru, maybe Kabuto will resign himself, saying "You were right. I really am no one." with a sly smile on his face and then he allows Orochimaru to take his body with all its power-ups.

[HasuMasu]

I was almost starting to wonder why Kabuto hasn't ran out of Sage Mode yet, but then I realized he hasn't used Rasenshuriken.

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by Ulquiorra

I don't know how you make a sound genjutsu like Mateki-Mugen Onsa more powerful outside of increasing its range. It is different than a fireball where obviously the size and intensity of the flame can be increased.

The same way you increase the power of every jutsu. The size and intensity of a Katon is function of the amount and potency of the chakra used and it's the same with Genjutsu sound-based or not. Are you somehow under the impression that a Genjutsu using sound as a vector to propagate chakra to its target means that all sound-Genjutsu must be equally powerfull no matter its user or the particular of the Genjutsu? It makes no sense, do you think all sight-based Genjutsu have all the same potency regardless of who uses them? I think not.

There is no shame in Itachi and Sasuke getting caught in it. Or having to rely on each other to escape. The sharingan is not immune to sound genjutsu. And Susanoo could not protect them. Sound genjutsu is said to be most dangerous form of genjutsu for a reason. Shikamaru only escaped because...well he is Shikamaru and no one else thinks that many steps ahead. And Temari was able to blow away the sound.

The Sharingan isn't immune to Genjutsu period, sound Genjutsu wasn't said to be the most dangerous form of Genjutsu (though Shika once explained it's the worse to deal with because there is not much you can do to stop it from long distance) so yes there is no shame getting caught in it. What is however very impressive is the fact that they needed outside help to break out of it but that's a testament to Kabuto's skill and power, not Tayuya's.
It's the same for all the abilities Kabuto has stored within the freak show that is his DNA. A jutsu is only as good as the person who wield it.

[Jellal]

Originally Posted by Detective-san

I was almost starting to wonder why Kabuto hasn't ran out of Sage Mode yet, but then I realized he hasn't used Rasenshuriken.

That was hilarious!

I'm just waiting for him to have manda save him.

[GDB]

Isn't Manda dead?