Umineko no Naku Koro ni - Episode 4 Discussion / Poll

[Deathkillz]

Originally Posted by sento

They talk about George blushing as a reaction to Shannon's breasts touching him so yes, you totally missed it.

They do indeed. But you are still missing the point. There was no need for exaggeration and special focus on her chest. The scene would have worked fine if they did something more natural (which that blatantly wasn't). Would have been even better if it was a shot that included everyone, not just her chest.

Originally Posted by Ithekro

And yet no "panty shots" as of yet, dispite Jessica's short skirt. We shall see later...

Spoiler for Heh Heh:

When the real fanservice girls arrive.

Oh I'm waiting for the ass-nee chans. At least they keep IN character with the service (Sorry Shannon, Eva, Natsuhi etc etc)

[sento]

Originally Posted by k//eternal

Is this too lewd for TV or something? No, of course not, but it's too lewd for a horror-mystery story. This type of fanservice is inherently lighthearted, and clashes strongly with what the story is supposed to be.

I didn't saw anyone seeing the show as first-viewers complaining about this really. Only over-analizing SN players.

It's not crashing the show at all like you said. I'm a novel reader and didn't noticed it until all of you pointed out (and I noticed other things that can be really labeled as bad, like Battler's delayed reaction or system0 lack of volume, even if this can be fixed with a Home Cinema...).

[tofupika]

Hi there. (Hope I'm not interfering in any discussion--) Personally, I enjoyed this episode, as an anime watcher and VN player (Though I must admit I have a hard time noticing all the bad things that have been pointed out)! o: I agree that some fanservice was unnecessary, though it's not that bad...All I have to say about this episode is that it was okay! I enjoyed watching it, though I guess I didn't quite agree with the design of the stakes. Overall, I don't think a lot of it is worth complaining about, though that's just me. (You can ignore me if you want. I'm just stating my opinion~ >_>)

[k//eternal]

Originally Posted by sento

It's not crashing the show at all like you said. I'm a novel reader and didn't noticed it until all of you pointed out (and I noticed other things that can be really labeled as bad, like Battler's delayed reaction or system0 lack of volume, even if this can be fixed with a Home Cinema...).

Not for you, maybe, but it obviously is a dealbreaker for some, and it doesn't take "overanalyzation" to see that it's out of place. I honestly don't know how you can ignore it when it's shoved in your face, but more power to you.

Incidentally, if you look back, my 6/10 on this had basically nothing to do with the jiggly incident.

[Baru]

That shot with Jessica's butt that's supposedly so bad..... I really don't see the point in complaining, it isn't even a panty shot or anything, and it's not like her butt's taking up the whole screen like some of you are making it out to be..... jeez just let a girl try to open a stuck door, guys, it's only a second-long shot and they show her panic face like right after that anyway... (inb4 they could've used a different angle argument, despite other possible angles when facing a door looking awkward)

It's only bothering you because you're letting it... jeez...

Originally Posted by k//eternal

But it's certainly DEEN's fault, not to mention this wasn't supposed to happen at all.
It was added purely for the jiggle factor. There's really no question about it. And that's pretty much the worst part of it, that it's all so obviously intentional. If the VN had said "George buried his face in Eva's chest" or something and it came out this way, well, fine. But no, they explicitly changed it just so that this could happen.

This argument is ridiculous

You can't say that just because they didn't follow the visual novel word for word, that they were trying to force fanservice into a serious scene...

Did you ever think that to make it more sad/dramatic/whatever they decided to have George hug his poor dead mother and mourn her death rather then clutching at the freaking bed?

And honestly where else would George's face go? her shoulder? her stomach? those shots would look just plain awkward, and excuse DEEN for actually wanting the laws of physics to exist when George raises his face...

If you don't like how something is shown, then fine, but you can't go assuming the staff did things for certain reasons

[maximilianjenus]

I have read the novels and did not notice or find inapropiate the scene with goerge, and shanon's scene should have been done like that, to keep the mood with batler's comments about "breasts on my back, breasts on my arms", those ones I think are an overreaciton, but I agree with the compaints about too much paning to the legs/breasts, those get annoying.

[sento]

Originally Posted by k//eternal

Not for you, maybe, but it obviously is a dealbreaker for some, and it doesn't take "overanalyzation" to see that it's out of place. I honestly don't know how you can ignore it when it's shoved in your face, but more power to you.

It's not "shoved in your face" that's the problem. It's like you're exagerating what you're seeing. It's not THAT BAD at all as you want to try to say. SN readers like us are biased in one way or another, but the show it's pretty good right now, of course I-III was better than I-IV, but maybe I-V is better that I-III, or not.

But my point is that I don't see legions of people complaing about that at all, really.

[momobunny]

Originally Posted by Baru

And honestly where else would George's face go? her shoulder? her stomach? those shots would look just plain awkward, and excuse DEEN for actually wanting the laws of physics to exist when George raises his face...

Oh yeah, because sticking your face between your mom's breasts ISN'T awkward.
Now that you mention it, I think clutching at the sheets would have been a better idea. I can imagine George doing that before what he actually did in the anime.

I just don't like fanservice, that scene was really the only one that bothered me. I'll agree that the Jessica scene wasn't bad at all, I don't really see the problem with that one. Sure a different angle might've been better, but it's nothing to complain too much about really.

Though... I'm pretty sure breasts don't jiggle like jello due to such a small sudden movement. So I can't really agree with your "laws of physics" argument. This isn't DOAX.

Complaining about the fanservice may be annoying, but arguing back that it's NO PROBLEM when it's just a person's opinion on how they don't like how the scene was handled is only making it worse.

[sento]

Originally Posted by Maho Momo

Complaining about the fanservice may be annoying, but arguing back that it's NO PROBLEM when it's just a person's opinion on how they don't like how the scene was handled is only making it worse.

Yeah, you're right, it's better to stop this right now.

[Baru]

Originally Posted by Maho Momo

Complaining about the fanservice may be annoying, but arguing back that it's NO PROBLEM when it's just a person's opinion on how they don't like how the scene was handled is only making it worse.

True, and thus I'm done with this topic...

[Deathkillz]

Originally Posted by Baru

You can't say that just because they didn't follow the visual novel word for word, that they were trying to force fanservice into a serious scene...

Did you ever think that to make it more sad/dramatic/whatever they decided to have George hug his poor dead mother and mourn her death rather then clutching at the freaking bed?

And did it make it more sad or dramatic? Not as far as I can see. Rather I'm getting mixed feelings of sadness (due to George's painful loss of her mother), joy (in a "haha look breasts! they jiggle!" sort of way) and confusion (make up your bloody minds what kind of signal you are trying to send).

And as far as complaints to fanservice, there really hasn't been that much in the past until the topic was touched upon right now.

edit: agree to disagree ^^'

[k//eternal]

I just noticed that in the sub you don't have the "sponsor message" right after the OP. If you watched the raw like I did, then you'd probably understand why I'm a lot more frustrated than most people likely are.

Basically, while they're saying the usual blurb about the sponsors, they play the "George's head causes the boob jiggle" scene twice in a row, which is a VERY unfortunate way to start the episode.

[momobunny]

Originally Posted by k//eternal

I just noticed that in the sub you don't have the "sponsor message" right after the OP. If you watched the raw like I did, then you'd probably understand why I'm a lot more frustrated than most people likely are.

Basically, while they're saying the usual blurb about the sponsors, they play the "George's head causes the boob jiggle" scene twice in a row, which is a VERY unfortunate way to start the episode.

Yeah I watched the raw version and felt the same way. To me it was like they were TRYING to make that scene funny.

[Jan-Poo]

Originally Posted by maximilianjenus

I have read the novels and did not notice or find inapropiate the scene with goerge, and shanon's scene should have been done like that, to keep the mood with batler's comments about "breasts on my back, breasts on my arms", those ones I think are an overreaciton, but I agree with the compaints about too much paning to the legs/breasts, those get annoying.

I agree with max here. As much as that scene of Shannon tits rubbing George's arm thoroughly was kinda excessive, it was supposed to be there. You are giving Ryukishi too much credit if you think he would do it differently. The only reason he doesn't make such camera pans and angles it's because he can't... Oh never mind... he did make a close shot of Shannon's breast didn't he? And don't forget he's the one who gave a considerate cleavage to a 9 year old girl. He's the same person who designed that awkward angel mort costume in higurashi and Shannon's skirt (and I stop here, but I'm sure VN reader get the picture by now).

What I can agree with is that this last episode had fanservice out of place. It is all right in comedy scene, but they should refrain a little during scenes that are supposed to be dramatic. The mackerel can for example, it did serve the purpose to focus the viewer attention on the table so they would remember that there was no letter there. I guess TV anime watcher would look at it just fine. The problem is a VN player seeing that can't help but laugh or giggle at the very least.

[maximilianjenus]

yeah, teh mackerel was anti-fanservice as it actually annoyed the fans of the series.

[Jan-Poo]

The idea itself was cool, it's the place and time that was wrong. If they did it in the first episode that would have been great

[chounokoe]

I think the mackerel joke was okay, it's not like it lasted way over the moment when you first saw it. If it did, your maybe just fixating on 'problems' that you wish should be there.

I'm not saying people don't enjoy the anime, I'm saying people enjoy ranting about the anime, but it's really starting to get on my nerves. I know it's everyones right to openly discuss his/her opinion, but shouldn't things that were said just be left at that and don't be discussed again and again and again and again?
Do we need to hear the Fanservice topic now for every episode that is to come in the future? For every skirt that a girl is to wear, for every furniture that may seem a tad more lascivious than in the VN, for every slightly better endowed female?

Like Jan-Poo already said, it's not like their trying to transform a pure story into hentai-festa 2.1...Ryukishi IS servicing nearly all the time in the VN, sometimes even during scenes that could be considered not appropriate for fanservice.
If they wouldn't include it, everyone would be whining about how the anime portrays only the grisly/drama side of Umineko...

Ah well...no use crying, it's not like anybody can be forced to like Umineko, but everyone should consider that it's starting to drive possible fans away, because nearly every site/blog/community is already talking about the raving Umineko fan-community and the fact that the anime is 'no good anyway'...

[sento]

Originally Posted by chounokoe

Ah well...no use crying, it's not like anybody can be forced to like Umineko, but everyone should consider that it's starting to drive possible fans away, because nearly every site/blog/community is already talking about the raving Umineko fan-community and the fact that the anime is 'no good anyway'...

Yeah, I think that this is also true. This is not giving us a good image at all, neither good publicity.

After all, the anime anime is indeed good, and there is a lot of room for improvement, seeing the direction that the story picks later on. And as far as now, most of people is really liking it, so I don't think that will be any problems.

[Chaho-Chi]

Shouldn't we at least rant about the fanservice in the GD anime board?

Well the episode was entertaining, I liked how they put in Beatrice laugh from the VN into the anime.

[Deathkillz]

Originally Posted by chounokoe

If they wouldn't include it, everyone would be whining about how the anime portrays only the grisly/drama side of Umineko...

LOL...I'm sure they wouldn't. And there are plenty of other choices if people want something like that. And there are series that succeed with pretty much nil service at all.

That asides it isn't like all of us are "ranting" for enjoyment. It is real disappointment here to see things not going the way it should be and pointing out where the faults are rather than blindly accepting that everything is "fine and dandy" and going as expected. But like the usual, negative comments (however small) get blown out of proportion from opposing the side and it snowballs out of control with people defending their points and getting wilder and wilder.

Though I think people can make their own minds up whether something is enjoyable to them or not. For first time viewers it seems like a large number of them are enjoying this series so far no matter how much negative comments appear.