Hyouka - General Discussion

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by Eater of All

I was wondering how 4 pages of thread could develop in less than 24 hours, but I just realized how much of an idiot I am. I forgot this is a KyoAni show! Of course after a PV release (or any tiny bit of new info really), the normal folks would express their natural excitement or criticism, and the usual gang of KyoAni critics would come and 1) lament sorrowfully how disappointed they are, 2) proceed to predict a boring/shitty show, and 3) emphasize for the 1284th time how KyoAni is so totally not a good studio. The cycle would be complete when KyoAni-critic-critics (like me ) join in and start calling out on the critics, leading the thread to spiral into a haze of strawman-picking and off-topic crap. Only in a KyoAni-related thread!

Such is the nature of any popular show. And just because you lampshade it doesn't make coming in on a high horse more productive. Bite sized generalizations are cool, I guess.

And before the obligatory "but... but... we have the right to criticize!!!", yeah you do, just keep the generic whining about how KyoAni is a shit studio or K-On sux or pity for the studio's "untapped potential" to yourself for more than 10 seconds.

Sorry, you don't dictate who says what. And trust me, having spoken with a few of these posters, they widely vary in their own evaluation with the studio. Not everyone thinks that Kyoani is overrated and wants to see everyone stop praising them (Sorry, Kaioshin! )

>Citing a PV from an action series
>Citing a PV from a lively teen slice of life series
>Criticizing "atmosphere and what it's trying to sell" when the first episode hasn't even aired yet

Come now, if you think it's boring, you don't need to make irrelevent justifications for it (intentionally or unintentionally). It's boring for you. Got it.

> Not reading the quoted post
> Focusing on other things rather than the main point
> Dismissive attitude.

*Shrugs* I see you dislike other's criticisms. You don't need to ignore the entire point of their post. It's annoying for you. Got it.

[Dr. Casey]

Shame I don't have any popcorn right now, this is getting good.

[Kunagisa]

The one in the PV is Yusa Kouji, none of the cast talked yet.

[Ithekro]

Who?

Huh. I was under the impression the main character was talking to us about stuff.

[Reckoner]

Originally Posted by OceanBlue

No, that was just poor wording on my part. Does it make more sense if the 'and' is an 'or'?

Makes it better certainly, but I still don't see the reason I must be singled out like I'm my own entity.

Originally Posted by OceanBlue

Actually, that's why I put "base" in quotation marks. I don't know how people are defining the term. I don't even know who Guardian Enzo was referring to. If you want to present your opinion on what a "base" is, go ahead.

For me, though, the insinuation is more than there. My opinion is that their base is exclusive to the people who like the majority of their products. I don't see how liking one or two of their older franchises would place you in their "base", much like how I don't see how liking, say, Rinne no Lagrange would place someone in the Production IG "base" or how liking Sora wo Kakeru Shoujo would place someone in the Sunrise "base".

Edit: Actually, if you want to continue this conversation, do you want to take it to PMs? I don't really intend to have this discussion for a while, but this discussion definitely isn't about Hyouka.

Er no thank you then. I think I heard enough to see that this is nothing but a semantics debate to you of which I care little to be a part of.

Lets just keep it simple. Because I have liked certain products of theirs in the past and see potential in them to satisfy me as a customer if they do something else than what I am seeing here and having bought things form them like Haruhi, I would think I should count as a customer with vested interest no?

-----------

In any case while previews are not the end all be all of anything by any means, I still think it's important to showing just what a show is made of. Sometimes previews are misleading, but a good amount of the time they indicate exactly what you're going to get. That's why seeing this preview is disappointing to me because I learned nothing about this that would interest me. All I have going forward is some quality visuals, albeit with character designs I care nothing for, and a studio's name which has long lost any strong credibility behind its name (E8, K-ON!, Nichijou). That's why I criticized it.

[winhlp32]

Since people are complaining about not able to understand what the narrator is saying, heres a subbed version.

One translation mistake I've noticed: for Mayaka's tagline, its "I didn't want to see you", not "I've wanted to see you."

[Eater of All]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Such is the nature of any popular show. And just because you lampshade it doesn't make coming in on a high horse more productive. Bite sized generalizations are cool, I guess.

I usually laugh at your sarcasm, but ouch does it feel bad being on the receiving side of it.

Hey, if it's worth anything, I generalized myself too. I'm just another generic KyoAni defender, so feel free to call me that. My horse isn't very high, since if it is, I would've just shut up as usual.

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Sorry, you don't dictate who says what. And trust me, having spoken with a few of these posters, they widely vary in their own evaluation with the studio. Not everyone thinks that Kyoani is overrated and wants to see everyone stop praising them (Sorry, Kaioshin! )

Yeah that was presumptuous of me. Sorry, I was wrong! When I see the same people stomping on the same topic in the same way for the 9128th time, I gotta admit my weak perception skills suffer a bit as a result. I'm sure every critic is a great man with their own different reasoning, but unfortunately my humanly limits force me to group them as a collective.

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

> Not reading the quoted post
> Focusing on other things rather than the main point
> Dismissive attitude.

*Shrugs* I see you dislike other's criticisms. You don't need to ignore the entire point of their post. It's annoying for you. Got it.

Thanks for clarifying that for me. It is annoying, especially when it's the 8272th time I've seen the same criticisms. As for the post, what I got was that DemiSoda found the Hyouka trailer boring, and that GC and Hanasaku's were better. I implied (you need Level 31 Read Post to see that) that they were more exciting because one is action and one is a lively teen slice of life show. Then he said their animations are better show that KyoAni isn't untouchable. Then I said I think Hyouka's amination is better. Then end of discussion, because him and I view visual quality differently.

But are you going to make more snide comments as usual or are you going to actually explain what I interpreted wrong?

Originally Posted by Dr. Casey

Shame I don't have any popcorn right now, this is getting good.

It is, as KyoAni-related discussions always gets. Usually I'm just the audience though; I gotta admit being a participant takes a bit of effort.

EDIT: So much that I'm going to sleep now! I hope another 4 pages won't come up when I wake up next morning....

[Ithekro]

Well the PV is correct, Eru does have very striking eyes.

[teja208]

Originally Posted by Ithekro

Well the PV is correct, Eru does have very striking eyes.

Yes, and a bit creepy if I have to say.

[Archon_Wing]

Originally Posted by Eater of All

I usually laugh at your sarcasm, but ouch does it feel bad being on the receiving side of it.

Hey, if it's worth anything, I generalized myself too. I'm just another generic KyoAni defender, so feel free to call me that. My horse isn't very high, since if it is, I would've just shut up as usual.

My horse is higher than yours, runs faster than yours, and will probaly be put down faster than yours.

Yeah that was presumptuous of me. Sorry, I was wrong! When I see the same people stomping on the same topic in the same way for the 9128th time, I gotta admit my weak perception skills suffer a bit as a result. I'm sure every critic is a great man with their own different reasoning, but unfortunately my humanly limits force me to group them as a collective.

I'm not implying you're wrong. Unlike some people who challenge thin air, your targets do exist. So rest assured I won't be accusing you of beating up strawmen, and at least you can be respected for that. However, I would just like to tell you that they're not all here to do that.

There's a huge difference between the folks that are butthurt over Kyoani being popular, those that are warm to Kyoani and expect more, those that are angry there's no Haruhi/FMP/Key, and finally there are those that expect Kyoani do deliver the work of the gods due to some idealized perception (Kyoani sucked until....). Some are just here to throw poop at them, others were disappointed. These are also generalizations, but I draw a division. Some can be drawn down to individuals, but it wouldn't be very nice to do that.

Hating and disappointment are two things. There are also posers who try to copy me, but just ignore them.

Thanks for clarifying that for me. It is annoying, especially when it's the 8272th time I've seen the same criticisms. As for the post, what I got was that DemiSoda found the Hyouka trailer boring, and that GC and Hanasaku's were better. I implied (you need Level 31 Read Post to see that) that they were more exciting because one is action and one is a lively teen slice of life show. Then he said their animations are better show that KyoAni isn't untouchable. Then I said I think Hyouka's amination is better. Then end of discussion, because him and I view visual quality differently.

But are you going to make more snide comments as usual or are you going to actually explain what I interpreted wrong?

Demisoda was actually focusing on visual quality. He was not citing the atmosphere as comparative work. As we all know, Guilty Crown has nothing but visuals. Genre doesn't exclude breathtaking visuals as we can see from something like 5cm per second.

We posted our posts at the same time, and suffice to say it I was redundant, tbh.

He was also judging the trailer on its intended purpose. Aka its ability to advertise itself, and apparently he felt that it was unable to convince him to do so.

This is actually a little different from being boring. Something can be indicative, yet boring. If I started rattling off to you events about history in random order, you might have gained new insights about something, but chances are you'd fall asleep to. This trailer, in someone's opinions wasn't indicative of any new impressions and boring. The duty of such a long trailer should accomplish more. Just think about any wacky commercial about Product X that takes your time.

It is, as KyoAni-related discussions always gets. Usually I'm just the audience though; I gotta admit being a participant takes a bit of effort.

EDIT: So much that I'm going to sleep now! I hope another 4 pages won't come up when I wake up next morning....

4 pages won't come up? That may be the hugest thing I've disagreed with you here!

[HasuMasu]

History of this thread:

1. KyoAni rage.
2. Quiet time.
3. KyoAni rage.

From this I can conclude that we can expect more rage in the future.

[Sheba]

You are forgetting the part where KyoAni executives are painted as James Bond villains leading a conspiration to take over the world with moé, memes and dancing.

This sums up ever kyoani generic threads EVER

[Skane]

Well, I'll chip in that the trailer is not exactly compelling to me either, but that is probably because I'm not the core audience that they are targeting to for this show. That said, KyoAni have done nice trailers before (probably my bias saying). I remember being very hyped up when I saw this trailer (sorry, couldn't find the Japanese original). It's remarkable how the animation quality has held up after all these years. If released today, it would probably still give a lot of shows a run for their money in terms of animation quality.

Still, I am hoping that the trailer is a calm before the storm. I don't know what the novels are about, so I will be going in blind for this one. Maybe it will surprise me, in the opposite way that this trailer was not for a post-apocalyptic show drenched in pathos and despair.

Cheers.

[Dextro]

Originally Posted by winhlp32

Since people are complaining about not able to understand what the narrator is saying, heres a subbed version.

One translation mistake I've noticed: for Mayaka's tagline, its "I didn't want to see you", not "I've wanted to see you."

One thing's for sure: watching the subbed version of the trailer made me realize that, at least for me, the boredom I felt watching the trailer was indeed associated with being unable to fully grasp what was being said by the narrator. Being able to actually understand what the background voice is conveying made the video a lot easier to watch and I actually got to know a little bit of initial info about the characters.

[zeniselv]

Originally Posted by Detective-san

History of this thread:

1. KyoAni rage.
2. Quiet time.
3. KyoAni rage.

From this I can conclude that we can expect more rage in the future.

unless they do something good with this anime, you are correct.

[Eater of All]

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

I'm not implying you're wrong. Unlike some people who challenge thin air, your targets do exist. So rest assured I won't be accusing you of beating up strawmen, and at least you can be respected for that. However, I would just like to tell you that they're not all here to do that.

There's a huge difference between the folks that are butthurt over Kyoani being popular, those that are warm to Kyoani and expect more, those that are angry there's no Haruhi/FMP/Key, and finally there are those that expect Kyoani do deliver the work of the gods due to some idealized perception (Kyoani sucked until....). Some are just here to throw poop at them, others were disappointed. These are also generalizations, but I draw a division. Some can be drawn down to individuals, but it wouldn't be very nice to do that.

Hating and disappointment are two things. There are also posers who try to copy me, but just ignore them.

I'm sure these divisions exists, though again I'm more ticked by these arguments always seemingly getting emphasized at every chance by certain individuals, whom I generalize for convenience. As with all generalizations, if it doesn't apply to you (not you in particular but... wait for it... in general!), then it's not worth responding to.

And I also wanted to find a way to poke fun at the tendency of every KyoAni-related thread to inevitably spiral away from the series itself into KyoAni-specific rage.

Originally Posted by Archon_Wing

Demisoda was actually focusing on visual quality. He was not citing the atmosphere as comparative work. As we all know, Guilty Crown has nothing but visuals. Genre doesn't exclude breathtaking visuals as we can see from something like 5cm per second.

We posted our posts at the same time, and suffice to say it I was redundant, tbh.

He was also judging the trailer on its intended purpose. Aka its ability to advertise itself, and apparently he felt that it was unable to convince him to do so.

This is actually a little different from being boring. Something can be indicative, yet boring. If I started rattling off to you events about history in random order, you might have gained new insights about something, but chances are you'd fall asleep to. This trailer, in someone's opinions wasn't indicative of any new impressions and boring. The duty of such a long trailer should accomplish more. Just think about any wacky commercial about Product X that takes your time.

Well! Fair enough, there's no denying that relatively nothing much was shown in the trailer. I personally watch trailers with no expectations in mind, so I take whatever they want to give me and run with it.

[Kismet-chan]

Originally Posted by Dextro

One thing's for sure: watching the subbed version of the trailer made me realize that, at least for me, the boredom I felt watching the trailer was indeed associated with being unable to fully grasp what was being said by the narrator. Being able to actually understand what the background voice is conveying made the video a lot easier to watch and I actually got to know a little bit of initial info about the characters.

Agreed. :>

[rulfo]

Originally Posted by Detective-san

History of this thread:

1. KyoAni rage.
2. Quiet time.
3. KyoAni rage.

From this I can conclude that we can expect more rage in the future.

Hey at least now it became on topic....

Not unlike that near derailment to FMP/Haruhi territory.

[DragoonKain3]

Trailer not compelling? You guys are crazy! I was absolutely ecstatic the moment they described the red haired girl being inseparable from the main guy in elementary school.

/shippingglasses

[orion]

Originally Posted by DragoonKain3

Trailer not compelling? You guys are crazy! I was absolutely ecstatic the moment they described the red haired girl being inseparable from the main guy in elementary school.

/shippingglasses

Nothing's happened so far and with the trailer animation budget pretty much given to Eru, you might want to consider being on a different ship.