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Myssa Rei · 2013-04-27, 21:26

Makes me want to see the what was behind the decision to change the focus of this movie. Was there an interview already regarding that? Because it really did seem that the content of the preview at the end of 2.00 WAS the movie, then they scrapped it.

As a result, it seems like we're actually missing a movie's worth of information we really need.

Helius · 2013-04-27, 22:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Myssa Rei

Makes me want to see the what was behind the decision to change the focus of this movie. Was there an interview already regarding that? Because it really did seem that the content of the preview at the end of 2.00 WAS the movie, then they scrapped it.

As a result, it seems like we're actually missing a movie's worth of information we really need.

Part of me believes that Anno and co already had Final planned out or else they wouldn't have gone on such a wild tangent with 3.0.

So I'm cautiously hopeful that Final will fill in the gaps and perhaps bring us the satisfaction we've all been yearning for.

Sackett · 2013-04-27, 23:07

Sigh...

Well I agree with most of the complaints here. At least it was better than Rebuild 2.

I've decided the only way for all the plot holes and out of character moments to make sense is that the entire Rebuild series is a dream that Shinji is having during 3rd Impact. The 3rd impact in the original TV series!

Think how much that makes sense:

Didn't you notice the extra-intensity and brightness compared to the TV Series? The detailed and choreographed action scenes? It's almost surreal.

And think about the characters: Asuka being both nicer and more awesome? Kawrou saving him? Ayanami opening up to him? We get to see Toji's sister and she's all okay? Shinji being more assertive and confident?

Clearly Rebuild 1 was Shinji replaying his past history, but with him as a cooler and better hero, and connecting more with Ayanami.

Rebuild 2 was full blown fantasy with Asuka being awesomely cool, dressing in sexy plugsuits, and then being nice to him.

But Shinji's mind started to reject this, he couldn't accept a happy ending because Shinji knows he's worthless, and so things begin to go wrong. Asuka got into Unit 3 and Shinji had to attack her (shades of other images from the TV series third impact!) Rei got caught up in a 3rd Impact Scenario.

No! Shinji resists this ending! He'll make it better, he'll fix it. This time he won't fail! Kaworu will help!

Rebuild 3: Shinji can't keep the fantasy going. He's a failure. He knows he's a failure. He knows he caused 3rd Impact (in End Of Evangelion not just Rebuild 3), and he's slowly coming to accept it. It hurts. It hurts so bad. Misato is so cold and distant. Rei is different somehow (an exaggerated effect compared to what Rei III was really like). All the character actions that are out of character is just Shinji projecting his fear about how they'd react knowing he failed to prevent 3rd Impact.

Kaworu is his friend though. Kaworu will help him. Kaworu will love him. Kaworu has a plan that will fix everything, save everyone, and put it all right again. Then Kaworu dies. Shinji killed him. Because Shinji was a coward, and so Kaworu had to die for him. And the world is a horrible horrible place. Because I, Shinji, am a horrible person and I have destroyed the world. I hate myself.

Oh look, Asuka has to look out for me again. Asuka! Maybe Asuka will save me!

And Asuka's comment to him- wasn't that a direct quote from Asuka during 3rd Impact in the TV series?

You know, sort of an extended visual depiction of the internal conflict that we saw take place on a folding chair and ended in Congratulations?

The point is that Shinji has to accept he screwed up and caused third impact. Only then can he move forward in life and get to return to the desolate world with Asuka on that damn beach.

dnab · 2013-04-27, 23:22

There are sufficient materials for a transitional, Shinji-less Eva arc between 2.x and 3.x. To add: the origins of the Wunder crew (which considerable character designs went into what little movie screen times they (will) have), and what happened to the old Nerv staffers. And how the Legend of the Youth (aka near-3I) panned out. Seele, the Moon, Rei 4-8, missing Angels. In fact everything the fans feel shortchanged in movies become marketable materials for the intermediate story. I would be surprised if nothing came of this setup.

creb · 2013-04-28, 00:06

lol.

I loved 2.0. I thought 3.0 was incredibly boring, much like the original Eva.

That said, I do try to keep in mind that judging 3.0 in a vacuum is pointless, since it's just a chapter in the full story, and it was probably inevitable we'd have a stretch in the story where Shinji reclaims the crown for most emo anime lead ever.

I just wish it wasn't so long between movies. If I hadn't re-watched 1 and 2 I'd have been completely lost.

On the plus side, it was good to hear some of the grand 'ol dames of voice acting, many of whom have had drastically reduced numbers of roles over recent years. It's hard to remember when Kotono Mitsuishi was in everything.

Polarpew · 2013-04-28, 00:56

Okay, I wanna say first thing, this movie was ... absolutely terrible, besides the animation ofc. What in the world happened to the plot? Now it just goes all over the place and us viewers are left out of the loop with absolutely no hope of understanding what just happened. The ONLY thing that makes sense to me in this movie is Shinji Ikari BEING Shinji Ikari. That kid never changes does he? I'd say he got worse, next time? Listen when your buddy says "lets abort, DONT pull the freakin spears out".

Hey kiddo, here's a lesson for you. Trying to save a girl is good and all, but more likely than not, you'll destroy the world and fail. Shinji needs to learn to look at the bigger picture. People say Shinji is realistic because he represents real teens, but does he really? I think we get Shinji in order to show people how the most pathetic person in existence finally gets the balls to do the right thing in the end and the whole trip it takes for him to get to that point (killing billions of people, effing up the earth). Hell this shows that if Shinji finally manages to save the world, it means EVERY SINGLE OTHER PERSON THAT EVER LIVED COULDVE DONE IT

Shinji, I love you kid, you make humanity proud

ScudFace · 2013-04-28, 01:30

Anyone else notice Mari singing in the background during the space rescue operation? I thought it was some reference to Macross with songs and space battles but then Asuka told Mari to stfu with the annoying singing and I knew anno was dissin Kawamori.

Reckoner · 2013-04-28, 01:50

Lol. So 2.0 was crap, and 3.0 somehow turned into even worse crap from what I hear... Oh boy. This is going to be fun

.

brocko · 2013-04-28, 02:23

Saw 3.33 and I think the main problem is just the lack of context given. The setting for the film is so far removed from anything Eva we've ever experienced before and there's relatively little to no explanation that you just can't help but scratch your head by the end of it.

Spoiler:

You just can't help but be thrown back by all of it, and go wait... this isn't the Eva that I've grown accustomed to all these years.

I'm a little hesitant to say that it's jumped the shark, especially since there's the last and final movie on the way so I might withhold until then. But if there's ever a point where the series has gotten the closest to jumping the shark, then this 3rd film is it.

I couldn't help but laugh at the opening fight scene with Mari singing in the background lol I don't think that was included in the original preview they released a few months ago.

Vegard Aune · 2013-04-28, 02:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polarpew

Hey kiddo, here's a lesson for you. Trying to save a girl is good and all, but more likely than not, you'll destroy the world and fail. Shinji needs to learn to look at the bigger picture.

...Say what now? I can agree that his actions in this movie were kind of retarded, ("What's that? The one person I actually trust suddenly telling me that our plan won't work and that it's a trap and that I need to stop what I'm doing right now? MEH. I'LL DO IT ANYWAY!") but the "trying to save the girl and instead almost destroying the world", that was last movie. And the only way he could have known it would end with the friggin' apocalypse breaking out is if he suddenly could see through the Fourth Wall and realize that he was in an Evangelion-movie. And even then, it was an Evangelion-movie which just an hour earlier had seemed to be moving in an uncharacteristically positive direction.

Yot-chan · 2013-04-28, 03:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by EmagEvil

Finally! Just watched it, the first minutes are like the previous video months agao, and...

Spoiler:

Yep...

Spoiler for Nadia:

Quote:

Originally Posted by ars89

This has become more confusing than the original series.

Quote:

Originally Posted by creb

lol.

I loved 2.0. I thought 3.0 was incredibly boring, much like the original Eva.

That said, I do try to keep in mind that judging 3.0 in a vacuum is pointless, since it's just a chapter in the full story, and it was probably inevitable we'd have a stretch in the story where Shinji reclaims the crown for most emo anime lead ever.

These are my two favorite reviews here. And I'm NOT being sarcastic.

Yot-chan · 2013-04-28, 03:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by brocko

Saw 3.33 and I think the main problem is just the lack of context given. The setting for the film is so far removed from anything Eva we've ever experienced before and there's relatively little to no explanation that you just can't help but scratch your head by the end of it.

Why is that a bad thing?

brocko · 2013-04-28, 03:41

^
I'm not saying it's a bad thing. It's just different. And I mean way different. It catches people off guard and as a result many are going to be at a loss for words and thought because of it. People generally don't like being confused, so I don't blame em for harping on the film in that aspect.

----------------------------------
On Shinji and the spears.

To be fair to Shinji, his partner in crime didn't really offer any real persuasion to stop him from taking the spears either. Instead, he just sat there mumbling to himself in deep thought telling him to stop maybe twice or thrice. To Shinji, it probably came off as last minute jitters. Shinji's already piloting EVA despite numerous people warning him not to, he's pretty much a man on a mission by this point. He's doing all this because he really believes that it'll fix everything, not just for himself but everyone else too as he mentions whilst he's climbing towards the spears. Although I do find it foolish of him for not even trying to understand the mission objective and consequences.

Yot-chan · 2013-04-28, 04:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by brocko

^
I'm not saying it's a bad thing. It's just different. And I mean way different. It catches people off guard and as a result many are going to be at a loss for words and thought because of it. People generally don't like being confused, so I don't blame em for harping on the film in that aspect.

I hear ya. But, speaking for myself ONLY (and ALL of this post refers ONLY to my view of Eva), the reason that *I* got fascinated by Eva and have STAYED fascinated by it for (OH... MY... GOD...

) nearly TWENTY YEARS now is BECAUSE of that sense of disorientation and confusion (along with other things, like strong characterization, fukkinamazin' battles, 'n' WOO-WOO Kabbalah 'n' shit).

When I first saw Episode 19, my jaw (VERY literally) dropped. I had NO IDEA where the story would go after that, and that was exciting. EoE, the first time I saw it, was baffling as all hell, but again, I had never in my life seen ANYTHING like that before, and loved it.

And while I really, REALLY enjoyed 1.0 and 2.0, they seemed to... how can I say it...? They played it a little too safe. There were small shocks and surprises, some more successful than others (Ramiel in 1.0 and the last thirty minutes of 2.0 were the most successful, I thought), but nothing on the scope of the last six episodes of the series or EoE.

I honestly didn't think, before I saw 3.0, that Eva had THAT kind of surprise in store for me. But seven minutes into 3.0, I suddenly had no idea what was going on any more. It was frustrating (not made easier by less-than-perfect Japanese) and baffling, but also exciting. Eva, for me, has always, first and foremost been a story that resists easy analysis and simple answers. To make 3.0 "fit," as it were, they had to raise the bar higher than ANYONE was expecting... and they succeeded.

The shock and surprise in 3.0 surpasses anything done in Eva before (again, I inisist repeatedly, IMO), and I get why it's too much for many. And yeah, there are MANY reasons why people like Eva, and the aspects that I like the most are often things that others like the least.

But for me, at least, this was exactly what I wanted, without knowing it. Shock, surprise, uncountable unknowables, and Shinji facing the darkest night of the soul possible.

I guess I'm in the minority. But to me, they took the title "You can (not) redo" as their maxim, and made it work. Yes, it's confusing as all hell, but so was the series, the first time I watched it. Yes, Shinji falls apart, but he always manages to pull himself (more or less) back together. Yes, I'm completely clueless as to what kind of finale is mounting, but I enjoy that.

So that's MY rant. My question for all of you is, what do YOU like Eva for?

Solafighter · 2013-04-28, 05:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by EmagEvil

Well duh, i just inversed the name of their organisation with their ship, i didn't pay attention...

... And since no ones know what i'm talking about the music(it's already 25 years old, some members wasn't even born yet...), here's the links :

... It's an hommage from Gainax!

The music...The ship... It's the same... I feel so trolled, right now.. What the hell is going on!

Myssa Rei · 2013-04-28, 05:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reckoner

Lol. So 2.0 was crap, and 3.0 somehow turned into even worse crap from what I hear...

Problem this is jumping on the negatives, though if you're looking ONLY at the negatives then you have some ammo. I can't say I like this way of watching it though.

And yes, the movie was a blast, but by Haruhi it left a whole lot of questions than answers, especially with how the audience is left with as little info as Shinji to what happened before he woke up. Its a strange thematic choice to take for sure, especially with a story with supposedly massive scope as Rebuild.

RRW · 2013-04-28, 05:38

IMO the movie is fun. You guys are just pessimistic

Korps! · 2013-04-28, 05:49

The ten minutes of screen time Kaworu had in episode 24 managed to flesh him out more than an hour-and-a-half film did.

Myssa Rei · 2013-04-28, 05:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Korps!

The ten minutes of screen time Kaworu had in episode 24 managed to flesh him out more than an hour-and-a-half film did.

Really? I thought it was kind of the opposite. There was always something off with Kaworu in the original (the word I usually go for is "predatory" but even then that's not quite accurate), while here he's genuinely helpful and, when he learns that he's been used as much as Shinji is, tries to be the voice of reason too.

brocko · 2013-04-28, 06:46

Does anyone else find it funny that Kaworu had to wait an extra 14 years before meeting Shinji? Who knows how much longer he was waiting on the moon for before the events of Rebuild even took place

Wait, speaking of which, wouldn't this whole thing be all Kaworu's fault? The dude did spear Unit 01 in third impact mode, causing this whole aftermath thing anyway. It he hadn't done anything, everyone would've just turned to goo like in EoE and no one would've gotten the chance to be pissed off at Shinji anymore

2013-04-27, 21:26	Link #661
Myssa Rei Moderate Haruhiist Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Metro Manila, Philippines Age: 42	Makes me want to see the what was behind the decision to change the focus of this movie. Was there an interview already regarding that? Because it really did seem that the content of the preview at the end of 2.00 WAS the movie, then they scrapped it. As a result, it seems like we're actually missing a movie's worth of information we really need. __________________

2013-04-27, 23:07	Link #663
Sackett Cross Game - I need more Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: I've moved around the American West. I've lived in Oregon, Washington, Utah, and Oklahoma Age: 44	Sigh... Well I agree with most of the complaints here. At least it was better than Rebuild 2. I've decided the only way for all the plot holes and out of character moments to make sense is that the entire Rebuild series is a dream that Shinji is having during 3rd Impact. The 3rd impact in the original TV series! Think how much that makes sense: Didn't you notice the extra-intensity and brightness compared to the TV Series? The detailed and choreographed action scenes? It's almost surreal. And think about the characters: Asuka being both nicer and more awesome? Kawrou saving him? Ayanami opening up to him? We get to see Toji's sister and she's all okay? Shinji being more assertive and confident? Clearly Rebuild 1 was Shinji replaying his past history, but with him as a cooler and better hero, and connecting more with Ayanami. Rebuild 2 was full blown fantasy with Asuka being awesomely cool, dressing in sexy plugsuits, and then being nice to him. But Shinji's mind started to reject this, he couldn't accept a happy ending because Shinji knows he's worthless, and so things begin to go wrong. Asuka got into Unit 3 and Shinji had to attack her (shades of other images from the TV series third impact!) Rei got caught up in a 3rd Impact Scenario. No! Shinji resists this ending! He'll make it better, he'll fix it. This time he won't fail! Kaworu will help! Rebuild 3: Shinji can't keep the fantasy going. He's a failure. He knows he's a failure. He knows he caused 3rd Impact (in End Of Evangelion not just Rebuild 3), and he's slowly coming to accept it. It hurts. It hurts so bad. Misato is so cold and distant. Rei is different somehow (an exaggerated effect compared to what Rei III was really like). All the character actions that are out of character is just Shinji projecting his fear about how they'd react knowing he failed to prevent 3rd Impact. Kaworu is his friend though. Kaworu will help him. Kaworu will love him. Kaworu has a plan that will fix everything, save everyone, and put it all right again. Then Kaworu dies. Shinji killed him. Because Shinji was a coward, and so Kaworu had to die for him. And the world is a horrible horrible place. Because I, Shinji, am a horrible person and I have destroyed the world. I hate myself. Oh look, Asuka has to look out for me again. Asuka! Maybe Asuka will save me! And Asuka's comment to him- wasn't that a direct quote from Asuka during 3rd Impact in the TV series? You know, sort of an extended visual depiction of the internal conflict that we saw take place on a folding chair and ended in Congratulations? The point is that Shinji has to accept he screwed up and caused third impact. Only then can he move forward in life and get to return to the desolate world with Asuka on that damn beach. __________________ Cross Game - A Story of Love, Life, Death - and Baseball. What more could you want?

2013-04-28, 00:06	Link #665
creb Hiding Under Your Bed Join Date: May 2008	lol. I loved 2.0. I thought 3.0 was incredibly boring, much like the original Eva. That said, I do try to keep in mind that judging 3.0 in a vacuum is pointless, since it's just a chapter in the full story, and it was probably inevitable we'd have a stretch in the story where Shinji reclaims the crown for most emo anime lead ever. I just wish it wasn't so long between movies. If I hadn't re-watched 1 and 2 I'd have been completely lost. On the plus side, it was good to hear some of the grand 'ol dames of voice acting, many of whom have had drastically reduced numbers of roles over recent years. It's hard to remember when Kotono Mitsuishi was in everything. __________________ http://myanimelist.net/animelist/creb http://myanimelist.net/mangalist/creb It feels like years since they've been updated, btw. Also, cake. Last edited by creb; 2013-04-28 at 00:34.

2013-04-28, 00:56	Link #666
Polarpew Bash'a no falor talah Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: New York USA Age: 33	Okay, I wanna say first thing, this movie was ... absolutely terrible, besides the animation ofc. What in the world happened to the plot? Now it just goes all over the place and us viewers are left out of the loop with absolutely no hope of understanding what just happened. The ONLY thing that makes sense to me in this movie is Shinji Ikari BEING Shinji Ikari. That kid never changes does he? I'd say he got worse, next time? Listen when your buddy says "lets abort, DONT pull the freakin spears out". Hey kiddo, here's a lesson for you. Trying to save a girl is good and all, but more likely than not, you'll destroy the world and fail. Shinji needs to learn to look at the bigger picture. People say Shinji is realistic because he represents real teens, but does he really? I think we get Shinji in order to show people how the most pathetic person in existence finally gets the balls to do the right thing in the end and the whole trip it takes for him to get to that point (killing billions of people, effing up the earth). Hell this shows that if Shinji finally manages to save the world, it means EVERY SINGLE OTHER PERSON THAT EVER LIVED COULDVE DONE IT Shinji, I love you kid, you make humanity proud __________________ Epicness Last edited by Polarpew; 2013-04-28 at 01:06.

2013-04-28, 02:23	Link #669
brocko Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ¯\(º_o)/¯	Saw 3.33 and I think the main problem is just the lack of context given. The setting for the film is so far removed from anything Eva we've ever experienced before and there's relatively little to no explanation that you just can't help but scratch your head by the end of it. Spoiler: I mean just from the first 30 minutes alone, you're exposed to a quasi space battle, a flying pirate ship and then an EVA that grows (and I shit you not) a rocket jet pack, despite getting it's headblown off through numerous headshots. You just can't help but be thrown back by all of it, and go wait... this isn't the Eva that I've grown accustomed to all these years. I'm a little hesitant to say that it's jumped the shark, especially since there's the last and final movie on the way so I might withhold until then. But if there's ever a point where the series has gotten the closest to jumping the shark, then this 3rd film is it. I couldn't help but laugh at the opening fight scene with Mari singing in the background lol I don't think that was included in the original preview they released a few months ago. __________________ http://www.freerice.com/ - For each word you get right, 10 grains of rice is donated through the UN to help end world hunger. Last edited by brocko; 2013-04-28 at 02:34.

2013-04-27, 23:22	Link #664
dnab anime berkeley Join Date: Apr 2007	There are sufficient materials for a transitional, Shinji-less Eva arc between 2.x and 3.x. To add: the origins of the Wunder crew (which considerable character designs went into what little movie screen times they (will) have), and what happened to the old Nerv staffers. And how the Legend of the Youth (aka near-3I) panned out. Seele, the Moon, Rei 4-8, missing Angels. In fact everything the fans feel shortchanged in movies become marketable materials for the intermediate story. I would be surprised if nothing came of this setup.

2013-04-28, 01:30	Link #667
ScudFace Member Join Date: Jul 2008	Anyone else notice Mari singing in the background during the space rescue operation? I thought it was some reference to Macross with songs and space battles but then Asuka told Mari to stfu with the annoying singing and I knew anno was dissin Kawamori.

2013-04-28, 03:41	Link #673
brocko Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ¯\(º_o)/¯	^ I'm not saying it's a bad thing. It's just different. And I mean way different. It catches people off guard and as a result many are going to be at a loss for words and thought because of it. People generally don't like being confused, so I don't blame em for harping on the film in that aspect. ---------------------------------- On Shinji and the spears. To be fair to Shinji, his partner in crime didn't really offer any real persuasion to stop him from taking the spears either. Instead, he just sat there mumbling to himself in deep thought telling him to stop maybe twice or thrice. To Shinji, it probably came off as last minute jitters. Shinji's already piloting EVA despite numerous people warning him not to, he's pretty much a man on a mission by this point. He's doing all this because he really believes that it'll fix everything, not just for himself but everyone else too as he mentions whilst he's climbing towards the spears. Although I do find it foolish of him for not even trying to understand the mission objective and consequences. __________________ http://www.freerice.com/ - For each word you get right, 10 grains of rice is donated through the UN to help end world hunger. Last edited by brocko; 2013-04-28 at 06:46.

2013-04-28, 05:49	Link #678
Korps! Ikarechimattaze! Join Date: Mar 2012	The ten minutes of screen time Kaworu had in episode 24 managed to flesh him out more than an hour-and-a-half film did. __________________

2013-04-28, 06:46	Link #680
brocko Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ¯\(º_o)/¯	Does anyone else find it funny that Kaworu had to wait an extra 14 years before meeting Shinji? Who knows how much longer he was waiting on the moon for before the events of Rebuild even took place Wait, speaking of which, wouldn't this whole thing be all Kaworu's fault? The dude did spear Unit 01 in third impact mode, causing this whole aftermath thing anyway. It he hadn't done anything, everyone would've just turned to goo like in EoE and no one would've gotten the chance to be pissed off at Shinji anymore __________________ http://www.freerice.com/ - For each word you get right, 10 grains of rice is donated through the UN to help end world hunger.