Valvrave the Liberator - Episode 11 Discussion / Poll

[Destined_Fate]

Originally Posted by ~BC~

She was fiddling with her skirt at one point, yes. But she had the phone in her hands when L-Elf looked at her and cocked his gun (which he was merely holding beforehand).

I liked the way they directed this scene because it showed that while Shoko never actually said "let my father die" she did in fact choose to do just that.

Of course but she didn't attempt to call anyone with her phone because he understands her responsibilities thus he ruled out using her phone rather quickly for that method. Thus she turned to skirt tugging as she tried to think of another way but the only way she could come up with was that her father couldn't be saved hence why she cried.

Shoko realizing that she cannot save everyone really developed her as a character and may cause her to mature nicely into her role as PM.

[FiveOVER]

Originally Posted by Destined_Fate

He takes more chances by killing her than just ending the transmission or knocking her out.

Informing everyone where he's going with Shoko and being caught on Cameras implies that he never intended to kill her in the first place.

L-Elf wanted to savor a victory over Shoko because she's a wild card that has puzzled him multiple times but her refusing to submit to the enemies demands and her crying afterward because she realized she could do nothing ruined L-Elf's "win" over her and made him look as though he sympathized with her.

I don't think the thought of winning or losing has ever crossed his mind where Shoko is concerned. I think he just wanted Shoko to "open her eyes" to the reality of the situation they are in. My observation is that during the election last ep, he was staring real hard her. He might be thinking that she can't continue acting this way if she were to be the PM. In fact, I think he's disgusted by the Dorssians' ways and wanted to change that. And perhaps to allow Shoko to learn more about Dorssia and how they do things

To me, L-11 has always been the type of character to act based on his goals and objectives and never let his emotions affect his judgements.

Haruto with his half-willed statement --> disagree with him strongly --> finds him useful --> make a contract with him.
Nutrient > taste --> give ration recipe to Shoko.
Among few example of how he thinks.

The only time when I felt he acted based on emotion is when he stabbed Haruto out of spite.

[Destined_Fate]

The signs were there and we know that L-Elf has a huge desire to "win" and how he flipped out when Shoko first one upped his plans. He also smiled when he heard the hailing and had Shoko escorted elsewhere where it was just the two of them together. He may have been testing her but there's no way I don't see him not wanting to savor a first real victory against the girl that constantly defied his expectations. Only like before she still defied what he expected and made his victory over her bitter sweet as she learned the cruel reality of the world all on her own and didn't give in.

[FiveOVER]

We can't really reach an absolute conclusion about what's going through L-11's head since only Okuchi knows. There might be signs, but it could easily be interpreted differently, so we'll just make of it what we will until we get direct confirmation from Okuchi or L-11.

[Fjoergyn]

L-elf had no more choice than connvertirse in that ruthless soldier, his parents were murdered and he had no option to choose your destination. His childhood was taken away and forced to be useful as a tool to kill.

[KleenexGhost]

Originally Posted by ~BC~

Toss up between Saki and Raizo. Both are the brashest of the pilots. It also doesn't help that both have clashed quite badly with L-Elf. Raizo maybe a little more than Saki, considering his beef with Dorssia seems more pronounced than the others. I also don't see him using the jacking ability with quite the same finesse. Imagine him jacking someone like X-Eins for example.

Machine-wise all I can say is that no. 1 would be the least expendable. I can see how they might be able to make due without Saki's but they really work best as a team, IMO.

That's the same way I see it. Raizo is the most headstrong, therefore the most likely to not follow orders and possibly get himself killed. Saki's cockiness has bitten her in the ass before, not to mention Carmilla doesn't have the same ease of use as Nobu Lightning or Kyuma's.

Valvrave I is the most versatile. Plus it has the Hara-Kiri Blade. Then Kyuma's would be second, due to the shield and beam spam. Then Nobu Lightning and then Carmilla.

[Arya]

Even if it did surprise me, to me it's clear that L-11 would have killed Shoko if she had tried to contact Haruto. Apparently depending what's at stake nobody is essential, but Haruto. And that has is logic, they are at war, not at a festival. Prove is how he is sacrificing the students to lure Cain in his trap, supposed trap.

I was thinking that what is missing to Shoko to really break apart (more than the Haruto's and Haruto/Saki's revelations) could be seeing Haruto dying before her eyes like his father. Yes, it's a bit repetitive, but it could be really happening, because it is not a big deal for him, since he is immortal, but it would be really effective for Shoko who doesn't know that he is a vampire. A repetition of episode one just with inverted roles? Mmm, no, I can't really see Shoko as a pilot.

Taking about haruto's proposal to Saki, I'm wondering how would they explain it to the others (ok, if someone actually will survive) if Saki'd accept. It would be too much out of the blue.

[DevilHighDxD]

Originally Posted by Arya

I was thinking that what is missing to Shoko to really break apart (more than the Haruto's and Haruto/Saki's revelations) could be seeing Haruto dying before her eyes like his father.

I think it will be Saki the one who will snap if she saw Haruto's suppose-death. Shoko has her turn in episode 11 and now I want Saki's turn for a break down. Because what better of a way to snap is by seeing your future husband dying in front of you.

[~BC~]

Even if it did surprise me, to me it's clear that L-11 would have killed Shoko if she had tried to contact Haruto. Apparently depending what's at stake nobody is essential, but Haruto. And that has is logic, they are at war, not at a festival. Prove is how he is sacrificing the students to lure Cain in his trap, supposed trap.

If only Haruto is essential in L-Elf's eyes then that's all the more reason killing Shoko wouldn't make sense. They've shown us that Haruto remains suspicious of L-Elf. And we have yet to know for sure if L-Elf really took Cain into consideration.

[MisaoFan]

Originally Posted by Arya

Taking about haruto's proposal to Saki, I'm wondering how would they explain it to the others (ok, if someone actually will survive) if Saki'd accept. It would be too much out of the blue.

There is one anon from /a/ who suggests that if we wanted an ending with Haruto ending together with Shoko, Saki should accept the proposal and because of that, I'm too hesitated to choose between either choices.

[Destined_Fate]

I still disagree. Killing Shoko accomplishing nothing and destroys everything he has worked towards so far. That and it's unneccesary as he could knock out Shoko before she finished a word if need be and he could shoot the transmission out as well. Shoko's life was never in any danger, L-Elf was in complete control but she wanted to see how she would act as she's a wild card. His preparations to end the talks or silence Shoko were unneeded as she defied his expectations again.

Originally Posted by FiveOVER

We can't really reach an absolute conclusion about what's going through L-11's head since only Okuchi knows. There might be signs, but it could easily be interpreted differently, so we'll just make of it what we will until we get direct confirmation from Okuchi or L-11.

It's far more likely he wanted to one up Shoko than not to due to all the hints thrown in and wev'e seen earlier in the series how much he loves winning. He even gloats about one upping the mysterious Princess when she wasn't even around at the start of the series.

L-Elf is extremely competitive and enjoys winning, he didn't take losing to Shoko all that well in the past and her constantly defying him has him interested. Than there's his smile before the hailing and how he convinces Shoko to be alone with him to take the call.

This was supposed to be L-Elf's victory but Shoko refusing to surrender and her crying after realizing on her own that she couldn't do anything made L-Elf's victory bitter sweet as gloating than would be like kicking a sleeping puppy that and he seemed to sympathize with her understanding loss and powerless.

That and Shoko losing her father may have reminded L-Elf of when he lost everything in his youth.

Originally Posted by DevilHighDxD

I think it will be Saki the one who will snap if she saw Haruto's suppose-death. Shoko has her turn in episode 11 and now I want Saki's turn for a break down. Because what better of a way to snap is by seeing your future husband dying in front of you.

Pointless as Saki already knows that Haruto is immortal thus she wouldn't freak out as she would know he isn't dead. Shoko doesn't know so his death would actually effect her a great deal.

[DevilHighDxD]

Originally Posted by Destined_Fate

Pointless as Saki already knows that Haruto is immortal thus she wouldn't freak out as she would know he isn't dead. Shoko doesn't know so his death would actually effect her a great deal.

Not if Valvrave 1 and Haruto get blow up together to pieces and make it seem like Haruto die, also she doesn't know that they are immortal only us the viewer know because of the future scene. Remember they are trying to do some testing with their bodies to see the change so they don't know everything yet. Shoko has enough for episode 11 and it not fair she the only one getting it.

[Arya]

Originally Posted by DevilHighDxD

I think it will be Saki the one who will snap if she saw Haruto's suppose-death. Shoko has her turn in episode 11 and now I want Saki's turn for a break down. Because what better of a way to snap is by seeing your future husband dying in front of you.

That wouldn't work with Saki, she already know Haruto is immortal, so I can't see her snap, unless maybe in case his VVV exploded, but that's really something impossible.
Edit: you ninja'd me

Originally Posted by ~BC~

If only Haruto is essential in L-Elf's eyes then that's all the more reason killing Shoko wouldn't make sense. They've shown us that Haruto remains suspicious of L-Elf. And we have yet to know for sure if L-Elf really took Cain into consideration.

I agree about Cain. About L-11 killing intentions, as I said, I got surprised. I wrote before how I considered Shoko as the king of L-11's chessboard, meaning that I was expecting him defending her at any costs. In fact he, chess-wise, performed a perfect castling move with Shoko. For that reason I got surprised when he acted like he did, demonstating that she was worth the annihilation of the 70% of dorssian army. That doesn't means that she is expendable, but less essential than we thought. And consequentially even Haruto. And about Haruto, well, L-11 basically can pilot the entire defence and offence of module 77 just by his smartphone. I don't see how anyone could have known that he killed her.

Originally Posted by MisaoFan

There is one anon from /a/ who suggests that if we wanted an ending with Haruto ending together with Shoko, Saki should accept the proposal and because of that, I'm too hesitated to choose between either choices.

Basically, even if on opposite ships I understand that, even if to me she has to say no in any case, it's a matter of pride
In any case what I like about that is the unpredictability of Saki's answer. I mean Haruto and Shoko so far have been quite your typical by-the-book characters, we all knew how Haruto would have taken responsibility about Saki's or that Shoko would have been the PM and what not. I can't say the same about Saki.
In any case I guess that things will go in a way that she would not have the chance to give a proper answer at least for this season. If we count that Haruto in inside the module I think even that Saki wouldn't have much time screen for this finale.

[Destined_Fate]

Which again, Shoko doesn't have to die even if she didn't pass as she's still his King chess piece with Haruto being his Queen chess piece. He only need to stop her from telling Haruto to stop which he could easily do. However Shoko didn't even try to forward a call to Haruto even as L-Elf counted down how much time she had left.

Originally Posted by DevilHighDxD

Not if Valvrave 1 and Haruto get blow up together to pieces and make it seem like Haruto die, also she doesn't know that they are immortal only us the viewer know because of the future scene. Remember they are trying to do some testing with their bodies to see the change so they don't know everything yet. Shoko has enough for episode 11 and it not fair she the only one getting it.

I don't see how they will accomplish that as the Dorssian's have no mecha that can even hurt the Valvraves unless Cain hyjacks Valvrave 6 and Haruto sacrifices himself to save the Module.

[Bern-san]

I don't think he planned on killing Shouko, maybe warn her that if she makes the wrong choice he will kill her or something. Everybody saw L-Elf going alone with Shouko so they would know that he was the one who killed her and he would have the whole school + enraged Haruto against him, which I don't think would fit his plans.
For someone as calculating as him it would be too reckless to kill the recently elected PM.

I'm still unsure if she'll make it alive to season 2 or not.

[Destined_Fate]

We have next episode to determine that. I'm going with alive due to this big event recently that has affected Shoko a great deal.

[DevilHighDxD]

Originally Posted by Destined_Fate

I don't see how they will accomplish that as the Dorssian's have no mecha that can even hurt the Valvraves unless Cain hyjacks Valvrave 6 and Haruto sacrifices himself to save the Module.

It Valvrave and they will pull something out of their ass making it happened.

[Nvis]

I always see VVV6 as a support Valvrave, so I can't see Cain or any Antagonist piloting it against the other VVVs.

Antagonist VVV should be a master in all areas(melee, short->long range), which would make a good final boss.

[shadow1296]

i find it quite possible that cain doesn't even care for unit 6 the only 2 he cares for are unit 1 and unit 2 which is probably where he is heading right now

[Nayrael]

Shouko will survive next ep. When you get an ep where your parent leaves the future to you, you live for few more episodes at least.

But survival by itself doesn't necessarily equal luck.