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Comrade · 2012-01-27, 11:09

I've decided to change my mouse, since the old one is not working properly and I need a bit of advice on what kind of mouse should I pick.

So far, I have narrowed my choices down to these:

1. Logitech G400 Optical Gaming Mouse

2. Sharkoon Fireglider Laser Mouse

3. Logitech MX518 Optical Gaming Mouse

Out of these three, the Logitech G400 looks like the best one, so if anyone can share their opinions it would be appreciated. The Fireglider looks interesting and could be a possible alternative to the G400.

The last one MX518 looks absolutely badass, but it costs way too much, so if someone could suggest something similar, but slightly cheaper, that would be nice.

By the way, I've been using the Defender Opera 880 and there are very few, if any complaints about it. I especially liked it because it felt very comfortable, almost as if it was custom made for me. I do have rather big hands, so a small mouse won't do.

Any advice?

-KarumA- · 2012-01-27, 11:28

G400 is basically the modern updated version of the MX518.
There is little difference except look and material. I own the G400, it's pretty light, fits well in my hand and does the job well.
The MX518 is pretty popular with gamers, it has been around a while to gain the reputation. But there isn't that much of a difference.

aah here we go, found the bugger;

I've never heard anyone recommending the Sharkoon.
Anyway the two logitech's you listed should certainly fit your hand.

Dist · 2012-01-28, 07:12

If G400 is updated version of MX518, how is it that the thread starter claims MX518 is too expensive? In fact, how can it even be expensive when it is so old?

I've had my MX518 since it's release, and though worn out, still works. Thus, I would recommend it.

Comrade · 2012-01-28, 15:08

Perhaps part of the reason why MX518 is more expensive because of it's reputation. After all, you're buying a proven and well tested product, so it's no surprise that the price might be higher.

I'll probably be going with the G400.

Dist · 2012-01-28, 19:46

Yes, but you still didn't answer how it can be expensive. Is 30€ considered expensive? In what standards? 30€ for a gaming mouse is o.O cheap

Ledgem · 2012-01-28, 21:15

It looks like the three mice you're considering are wired mice. Have you ever tried a wireless mouse? I know some people complain about latency, but I honestly can't say that I ever noticed any problems even back when I was playing FPS games heavily. (Maybe I just never got good enough to notice latency issues.)

Once I got my first wireless mouse I never looked back. I was very sensitive to the presence of the wire, and felt that it restricted my motions. Going wireless was such a wonderful sensation by comparison... I can highly recommend ditching wired mice for wireless.

Comrade · 2012-01-29, 04:29

Dist,

What I was saying is that the MX518 is noticeably more expensive than the other two mice (according to prices at amazon).

Ledgem,

Yes, there is the possibility of switching over to a wireless mouse, however, I don't want to have to deal with the charging crap a wireless mouse requires. Yes, yes, I know there are at least a hundred easy ways to recharge the thing and so on, but the fact remains, you have to recharge it.

In addition, there's also personal preference to consider. I don't know why, but a wireless mouse doesn't feel like a "real" mouse to me. There's just something off.

Besides, there's also no way I will ever lose a wired mouse.

sa547 · 2012-01-29, 06:21

^
My beef with wireless mice is, apart from the hassle of getting new batteries and the possibility of losing it, is that some of them are too heavy on the hand; I tried a Logitech wireless mouse (the older home-use versions) once, but felt heavier than the wired A4Tech that I'm using right now.

TheFluff · 2012-01-29, 11:11

I have used a MX500 (the predecessor of the MX518) for the last 9 (nine) years, and while it is extremely worn and losing its colors it still works perfectly. Get a MX518 or get out.

Wireless peripherals are a terrible gimmick and unless you are the kind of person who wants to implement a Final Solution to all wire troubles you should never ever get one. They're worse than their wired counterparts in pretty much every significant way except for the "doesn't have a wire" part.

Ledgem · 2012-01-29, 14:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Comrade

Yes, there is the possibility of switching over to a wireless mouse, however, I don't want to have to deal with the charging crap a wireless mouse requires. Yes, yes, I know there are at least a hundred easy ways to recharge the thing and so on, but the fact remains, you have to recharge it.

There are a variety of wireless mice out there, with different power needs and power solutions. My earliest wireless mouse was one with an internal battery pack and a dock charger; you just put the mouse on the dock at night and you're good to go. Even without frequent recharging, the mouse would last about a month with heavy usage. My last two mice use two AA batteries, and I've only had to recharge the batteries maybe 3-4 times per year. I guess if you don't have any rechargeable batteries or chargers around then this may be a hassle, but I have a "fleet" of AA batteries so it's no big deal to swap between batteries and charge a used pair.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Comrade

In addition, there's also personal preference to consider. I don't know why, but a wireless mouse doesn't feel like a "real" mouse to me. There's just something off.

Personal preference is personal preference, and does count for a lot... the weight and size of many wireless mice matches wired mice (excluding travel mice), but if the cord means a lot to you, then of course that's a consideration.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Comrade

Besides, there's also no way I will ever lose a wired mouse.

My mouse always sits on my mousepad, so I've never really considered that it would even be possible to lose a wireless mouse

I suppose this might be a valid concern for some people, though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sa547

^
My beef with wireless mice is, apart from the hassle of getting new batteries and the possibility of losing it, is that some of them are too heavy on the hand; I tried a Logitech wireless mouse (the older home-use versions) once, but felt heavier than the wired A4Tech that I'm using right now.

It's true that the batteries can add some weight. I think that it's something you just get used to... to ease the transition, some mice allow you to use only a single battery to run the mouse. You could use a single battery for a few weeks, then add in a second one.

I think that wireless keyboards aren't overly necessary - I had one, then found a wired keyboard that I really liked and used that for a few years, and now I'm back to wireless due to a crappy desk design that made running cables a mess. I'll never go back to wired mice, though. I find the cord to be really restrictive to motions that I make. Clearly not everyone feels the same, though, or else there wouldn't be the wide selection of wired mice that there currently are!

Bonta Kun · 2012-02-11, 21:44

Randomly wandering the forums I saw this thread and took a peek as recently I got myself a new mouse.

I got the Sharkoon Fireglider and it's a mouse I'd recommend(friend recommended it to me)
Before I had and still have a G5(not exactly broken but it was playing up so decied to ge a new one anyway) and it was a great one, almost perfect in fact.
But reason I got Fireglider is cause it was a lot cheaper than the other logitechs, was in fact gonna get the G500, didn't really want to bother with the G400.

Now don't know how the more recent logitechs fare but one thing that was a bit of a annoyance is the fact I've got big hands and I'd overreach the buttons alot, you don't get that with the Fireglider as it has indented buttons(which all new mouses should have really)
Great fit for my big hands.
The weight tuning is incased which I like compared to the logitech's one, sure it's easier to access but I never really changed it once I got my right weight, was more annoyed at the slider falling out which you won't get with the Fireglider.

Don't regret buiying it and saved myself a pretty penny at it, still like my logitech mice(still got a my MX1000 wireless and still working a treat

)

Also on the note about KB you really shouldn't bother with wireless ones unless you want for say like your PS3 but even then some cheap as chips one would do.
I go with the notion microsoft KB logitech mouse(even tho I don't use a logitech mouse atm

)

Dhomochevsky · 2012-02-12, 09:22

It really depends on how you hold the mouse.

Some people place their hand flat on the mouse, touching the back of the mouse with their palm. I guess in that case the positioning of buttons in relation to the rest of the mouse really matters.

But I hold the mouse with just my finger tips, forming something like a claw around it. No other part of my hand touches the mouse, so I really don't care where my fingers would end up if I placed my hand flat on it.
For someone like me, shorter mice, like the Logitech gaming ones are much better. A long mouse that I could completely put my hand on and still have all the buttons in the right place, is really useless then. The longer chassis just gets in the way.

So first figure out what kind of mouse user you are, then go for a form that matches your style.

creb · 2012-02-16, 03:56

The G500 is an abomination, and a stain on Logitech's generally exemplary record with their gaming mice. You did yourself a big favor by not getting it.

The best Logitech mice are still the oldies. I realize the company has to come out with new products to drive their sales, and that it's about impossible to improve on the near perfection of their older mice (MX518 or G400), but they are really ruining their once proud name with some of their recent products, imo.

The button placement is just all sorts of wrong on the G500.

And, yes, as much as I love my Logitech mice, I admit that the weight cartridge slides out entirely too easily.

Also, I would never buy a wireless mouse. Recharging/changing batteries is simply not worth the hassle. Maybe when they're nuclear powered or something, it'll be worth switching over.

demonix · 2012-02-16, 05:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by creb

Also, I would never buy a wireless mouse. Recharging/changing batteries is simply not worth the hassle. Maybe when they're nuclear powered or something, it'll be worth switching over.

It really depends on how long it'll be used each time since battery life for current wireless mice can be as much as 10 months (depending on usage obviously) and also where the mouse would call "home" might not be suitable for a wired mouse like what happened with me as I'd gotten fed up of the trackpad on my laptop and the cable of the only wired mouse I had left didn't work well with the surface it was being used on (the cable kept catching on the edge) so I got a £10 wireless mouse and it has made things miles better.

Ledgem · 2012-02-16, 13:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by creb

Also, I would never buy a wireless mouse. Recharging/changing batteries is simply not worth the hassle. Maybe when they're nuclear powered or something, it'll be worth switching over.

As I wrote before, I suppose it depends on the individual. I have a lot of AA and AAA batteries for my photography stuff, as well as a few chargers. When my mouse starts showing the low battery indicator, it's a quick process to pop the batteries out, get a spare, and charge the spent ones. If you don't already have a reserve of batteries or even a charger, it would be more of a hassle.

Mice with a built-in battery that charge on something like a cradle (if they still make those) are a bit easier in that regard. But there, too, I could imagine that it would be a hassle to some people. Dropping the mouse on the cradle each night, or at some random time once a week, doesn't seem like a very big deal to me. Still, compared to a wired mouse, it's something extra to do.

Dhomochevsky · 2012-02-16, 18:46

Gaming == wired mouse.
A wireless mouse for gaming... that's like a sports car with automatic transmission.
It's possible, but inferior... and a noob won't know the difference.

Sorry but the gamer in me has to make a clear statement on this.

Spectacular_Insanity · 2012-02-16, 18:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dhomochevsky

Gaming == wired mouse.
A wireless mouse for gaming... that's like a sports car with automatic transmission.
It's possible, but inferior... and a noob won't know the difference.

Sorry but the gamer in me has to make a clear statement on this.

So true. Nothing worse than playing a clan match and having your mouse run out of batteries in the middle of it. Happened to a clan member, and it's not like a mouse cord takes up that much space to begin with. Most wired mice (mouses?) come USB standard that I've seen.

Dist · 2012-02-17, 07:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dhomochevsky

Gaming == wired mouse.
A wireless mouse for gaming... that's like a sports car with automatic transmission.
It's possible, but inferior... and a noob won't know the difference.

Sorry but the gamer in me has to make a clear statement on this.

Wrong.. oh so wrong. Some gamers still seem to insist that wireless will always be inferior. However, there actually ARE good wireless mouse out there, that are NOT inferior to wired. Those are though, indeed, quite expensive.

A good gaming wireless mouse would be the RAT5 for example. If you don't have experience on the RAT5, then you can't claim it's inferior, cause it isn't.

Dhomochevsky · 2012-02-17, 08:00

It is still inferior to a good gaming wired mouse.

This is inherent to how the radio tranmission (usually bluetooth) works and no matter how good your mouse design is, you can't get around this.
In radio technology, you share a common transfer medium with everything else that uses the same channel. Even though there are standards that dictate how long a single device may transmit in one go, there are constallations in which you reach latencies that are just unaccaptable for gaming. And this problem obviously gets worse, the more radio devices are in the proximity.

As an engineer, in an application where latency is my primary concern I would never, ever opt for radio transmission if cable is also an option.

The only downside to a cable mouse is, that cats like to attack the cable:

Ledgem · 2012-02-17, 09:57

My major gaming days are behind me, but I've done a few FPS games with wireless mice and I didn't feel that it was any different compared to when I was using a wired mouse. I've heard gamers often remarking on the lag, but I get the feel that it's similar to how audiophiles rant and rave about how things sound terrible and oh-so-noticeable if you're using anything less than high-end speakers, headphones, connectors, etc. There probably is a difference, but it's unlikely to be perceptible to the majority of people. Any perceived differences are psychological.

Doesn't really matter, though - if someone is happier using a wired mouse, then more power to them. The companies still produce wired and wireless mice, after all!

2012-01-27, 11:09	Link #1
Comrade A fuckin' genius! Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Here, there ... EVERYWHERE! Age: 36	Advice on a mouse I've decided to change my mouse, since the old one is not working properly and I need a bit of advice on what kind of mouse should I pick. So far, I have narrowed my choices down to these: 1. Logitech G400 Optical Gaming Mouse 2. Sharkoon Fireglider Laser Mouse 3. Logitech MX518 Optical Gaming Mouse Out of these three, the Logitech G400 looks like the best one, so if anyone can share their opinions it would be appreciated. The Fireglider looks interesting and could be a possible alternative to the G400. The last one MX518 looks absolutely badass, but it costs way too much, so if someone could suggest something similar, but slightly cheaper, that would be nice. By the way, I've been using the Defender Opera 880 and there are very few, if any complaints about it. I especially liked it because it felt very comfortable, almost as if it was custom made for me. I do have rather big hands, so a small mouse won't do. Any advice? __________________ If vegetarians care about the animals, then why are they eating all their food?

2012-01-28, 07:12	Link #3
Dist Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Finland Age: 33	If G400 is updated version of MX518, how is it that the thread starter claims MX518 is too expensive? In fact, how can it even be expensive when it is so old? I've had my MX518 since it's release, and though worn out, still works. Thus, I would recommend it. __________________

2012-01-28, 15:08	Link #4
Comrade A fuckin' genius! Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Here, there ... EVERYWHERE! Age: 36	Perhaps part of the reason why MX518 is more expensive because of it's reputation. After all, you're buying a proven and well tested product, so it's no surprise that the price might be higher. I'll probably be going with the G400. __________________ If vegetarians care about the animals, then why are they eating all their food?

2012-01-28, 19:46	Link #5
Dist Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Finland Age: 33	Yes, but you still didn't answer how it can be expensive. Is 30€ considered expensive? In what standards? 30€ for a gaming mouse is o.O cheap __________________

2012-01-28, 21:15	Link #6
Ledgem Love Yourself Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Northeast USA Age: 38	It looks like the three mice you're considering are wired mice. Have you ever tried a wireless mouse? I know some people complain about latency, but I honestly can't say that I ever noticed any problems even back when I was playing FPS games heavily. (Maybe I just never got good enough to notice latency issues.) Once I got my first wireless mouse I never looked back. I was very sensitive to the presence of the wire, and felt that it restricted my motions. Going wireless was such a wonderful sensation by comparison... I can highly recommend ditching wired mice for wireless. __________________

2012-01-27, 11:28	Link #2
-KarumA- (｡☉౪ ⊙｡) Author Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: In Maya world, where all is 3D and everything crashes Age: 36	G400 is basically the modern updated version of the MX518. There is little difference except look and material. I own the G400, it's pretty light, fits well in my hand and does the job well. The MX518 is pretty popular with gamers, it has been around a while to gain the reputation. But there isn't that much of a difference. aah here we go, found the bugger; I've never heard anyone recommending the Sharkoon. Anyway the two logitech's you listed should certainly fit your hand.

2012-01-29, 04:29	Link #7
Comrade A fuckin' genius! Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Here, there ... EVERYWHERE! Age: 36	Dist, What I was saying is that the MX518 is noticeably more expensive than the other two mice (according to prices at amazon). Ledgem, Yes, there is the possibility of switching over to a wireless mouse, however, I don't want to have to deal with the charging crap a wireless mouse requires. Yes, yes, I know there are at least a hundred easy ways to recharge the thing and so on, but the fact remains, you have to recharge it. In addition, there's also personal preference to consider. I don't know why, but a wireless mouse doesn't feel like a "real" mouse to me. There's just something off. Besides, there's also no way I will ever lose a wired mouse. __________________ If vegetarians care about the animals, then why are they eating all their food?

2012-01-29, 06:21	Link #8
sa547 Senior Member Author Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Philippines Age: 47	^ My beef with wireless mice is, apart from the hassle of getting new batteries and the possibility of losing it, is that some of them are too heavy on the hand; I tried a Logitech wireless mouse (the older home-use versions) once, but felt heavier than the wired A4Tech that I'm using right now. __________________

2012-01-29, 11:11	Link #9
TheFluff Excessively jovial fellow Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: ISDB-T Age: 37	I have used a MX500 (the predecessor of the MX518) for the last 9 (nine) years, and while it is extremely worn and losing its colors it still works perfectly. Get a MX518 or get out. Wireless peripherals are a terrible gimmick and unless you are the kind of person who wants to implement a Final Solution to all wire troubles you should never ever get one. They're worse than their wired counterparts in pretty much every significant way except for the "doesn't have a wire" part. __________________ \| ffmpegsource 17:43:13 <~deculture> Also, TheFluff, you are so fucking slowpoke.jpg that people think we dropped the DVD's. 17:43:16 <~deculture> nice job, fag! 01:04:41 < Plorkyeran> it was annoying to typeset so it should be annoying to read

2012-02-11, 21:44	Link #11
Bonta Kun Know who you are Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Resides within the depths of Ned infested Glasgow	Randomly wandering the forums I saw this thread and took a peek as recently I got myself a new mouse. I got the Sharkoon Fireglider and it's a mouse I'd recommend(friend recommended it to me) Before I had and still have a G5(not exactly broken but it was playing up so decied to ge a new one anyway) and it was a great one, almost perfect in fact. But reason I got Fireglider is cause it was a lot cheaper than the other logitechs, was in fact gonna get the G500, didn't really want to bother with the G400. Now don't know how the more recent logitechs fare but one thing that was a bit of a annoyance is the fact I've got big hands and I'd overreach the buttons alot, you don't get that with the Fireglider as it has indented buttons(which all new mouses should have really) Great fit for my big hands. The weight tuning is incased which I like compared to the logitech's one, sure it's easier to access but I never really changed it once I got my right weight, was more annoyed at the slider falling out which you won't get with the Fireglider. Don't regret buiying it and saved myself a pretty penny at it, still like my logitech mice(still got a my MX1000 wireless and still working a treat) Also on the note about KB you really shouldn't bother with wireless ones unless you want for say like your PS3 but even then some cheap as chips one would do. I go with the notion microsoft KB logitech mouse(even tho I don't use a logitech mouse atm) __________________

2012-02-12, 09:22	Link #12
Dhomochevsky temporary safeguard Join Date: May 2004 Location: Germany	It really depends on how you hold the mouse. Some people place their hand flat on the mouse, touching the back of the mouse with their palm. I guess in that case the positioning of buttons in relation to the rest of the mouse really matters. But I hold the mouse with just my finger tips, forming something like a claw around it. No other part of my hand touches the mouse, so I really don't care where my fingers would end up if I placed my hand flat on it. For someone like me, shorter mice, like the Logitech gaming ones are much better. A long mouse that I could completely put my hand on and still have all the buttons in the right place, is really useless then. The longer chassis just gets in the way. So first figure out what kind of mouse user you are, then go for a form that matches your style.

2012-02-16, 03:56	Link #13
creb Hiding Under Your Bed Join Date: May 2008	The G500 is an abomination, and a stain on Logitech's generally exemplary record with their gaming mice. You did yourself a big favor by not getting it. The best Logitech mice are still the oldies. I realize the company has to come out with new products to drive their sales, and that it's about impossible to improve on the near perfection of their older mice (MX518 or G400), but they are really ruining their once proud name with some of their recent products, imo. The button placement is just all sorts of wrong on the G500. And, yes, as much as I love my Logitech mice, I admit that the weight cartridge slides out entirely too easily. Also, I would never buy a wireless mouse. Recharging/changing batteries is simply not worth the hassle. Maybe when they're nuclear powered or something, it'll be worth switching over. __________________ http://myanimelist.net/animelist/creb http://myanimelist.net/mangalist/creb It feels like years since they've been updated, btw. Also, cake.

2012-02-16, 18:46	Link #16
Dhomochevsky temporary safeguard Join Date: May 2004 Location: Germany	Gaming == wired mouse. A wireless mouse for gaming... that's like a sports car with automatic transmission. It's possible, but inferior... and a noob won't know the difference. Sorry but the gamer in me has to make a clear statement on this.

2012-02-17, 08:00	Link #19
Dhomochevsky temporary safeguard Join Date: May 2004 Location: Germany	It is still inferior to a good gaming wired mouse. This is inherent to how the radio tranmission (usually bluetooth) works and no matter how good your mouse design is, you can't get around this. In radio technology, you share a common transfer medium with everything else that uses the same channel. Even though there are standards that dictate how long a single device may transmit in one go, there are constallations in which you reach latencies that are just unaccaptable for gaming. And this problem obviously gets worse, the more radio devices are in the proximity. As an engineer, in an application where latency is my primary concern I would never, ever opt for radio transmission if cable is also an option. The only downside to a cable mouse is, that cats like to attack the cable: Last edited by Dhomochevsky; 2012-02-17 at 08:44.

2012-02-17, 09:57	Link #20
Ledgem Love Yourself Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Northeast USA Age: 38	My major gaming days are behind me, but I've done a few FPS games with wireless mice and I didn't feel that it was any different compared to when I was using a wired mouse. I've heard gamers often remarking on the lag, but I get the feel that it's similar to how audiophiles rant and rave about how things sound terrible and oh-so-noticeable if you're using anything less than high-end speakers, headphones, connectors, etc. There probably is a difference, but it's unlikely to be perceptible to the majority of people. Any perceived differences are psychological. Doesn't really matter, though - if someone is happier using a wired mouse, then more power to them. The companies still produce wired and wireless mice, after all! __________________