Valvrave the Liberator 2 - Episode 12 [END] Discussion / Poll

[VTHokiePride]

After watching the finale, I initially expected Haruto to die, which was true. However, I would've rather had him die telling Shoko that he loved her, but it looks like he never got his chance. The Magius were never the real bad guys, they took up arms against the Valvraves because if they were exposed, they would be hunted and killed again.

Another thing, what if Haruto fed on L-Elf right there before he died? Could he have been saved?

[KleenexGhost]

Ok, now that the final episode is in the books so to speak.

Not so much a review as it thoughts/musings on the episode

Overall, the finale is what I expected.

I liked the fight between Cain and Haruto/L-Elf. I got where Cain was coming from. He and the other Magius were doing what they felt was necessary to keep themselves safe since previous attempts to openly co-exist ended badly. Overall, Cain was awesome this episode and was easily favorite character out of the cast. Kyuuma takes 2nd, Haruto 3rd.

The final moment between Haruto and L-Elf was touching. X-Eins and Q-Vier's death were also pretty sad and handled well.

The monologue Saki had to herself concerning having a shot at Haruto due to him losing his memories of Shoko was pretty sad as well. I'm gonna come back to that at a later time because I don't like it, yet I appreciate the insight.

The ARUS President got off easy in my opinion. I was at least expecting him to get his comeuppance.

Now for the timeskip. It raises questions. In general we still have questions as to what is going on. But I'm trying to focus on the positive at the moment.

This majority of the episode was solid to me. I just feel like there were things unresolved.

As a whole, Valvrave was a roller coaster to me. It was fun. It had it's up's and it had it's down's. Did the ride start to peter out towards the end for me? I'm not gonna lie, it did. It did feel like it relied too much on plot-twists. YMMV on that because some people would say that's part of the charm of the series.

Overall, if you can keep your expectations in check and want a fun, crazy and sometimes silly series to watch, then check out Valvrave. Does it have problems? Most certainly. But I guarantee it'll give you something to talk about.

A good guilty-pleasure.

[Twi]

The Magius can claim to be victims, but Cain was just spoon-feeding his version of things. True enough, humans are a**holes to everything, including one another, but they're no better. They can't claim to make the world peaceful when they stay out of human affairs, they're just sitting on the sidelines. And they were the ones who thought to use their invisible food ship and expose Saki and the others, so they shot themselves in the foot.

Let's be honest here, everyone was simply looking out for themselves. It just so happens that most of us root for the kids since we've seen the extremes both of the other factions, humans and Magius would go.

[KiritoIsaboss]

i honestly loved this show since i was watching it since it all first came out that ending made me sad because even haruto sacrificed himself just to save all of those people and L elf finally said he was his friend i wonder what ever happened to L elf but i guess i cant complain i do hope that they plan to at least make a spin off or even a OVA or movie that can go a little more further than what they showed at the end. i actually want to see if they made more valvraves and to see what the other aliens actually can do. This honestly had to been one of the saddest but hey it may not have been the best but i loved this series and i thought it was awesome and full of action all the way through. i hope to see all of you guys in the next mecha anime and hopefully a discussion on the next season or spin off so in the end this anime gets a ten out of ten from me and i hope you guys judge it well cause i honestly thought it was one of the best animes this year and one of the most story driven/action packed mecha shows so tally ho!!!! RIP haruto and all the other valvraves that lost there lives to protect the module and all of the students i wont forget this anime at all

[Netto Azure]

Well this is quite the powerful ending.
The Council tried to cover up the fact that Dorassian Fuhrer is a "Bakemono" by saying that the attempted assasination was covered up. Bye bye crazy Shota QVer.

That battle with Cain was quite engaging. Using L-Elf's training through his body. Noice. Poor Plu and Haruto tho. ;_;

Wow, Haruto's voice went into L-Elf. I usually find that annoying with this type of power. xP

Damn that Arus President and Dorassian royalists was quite opportunistic. Launching a mass sweep of high ranking members of society in ARUS while launching Coup's in Dorasia.

LOL all Shoko wanted was to have the same chance as the childhood friend. Hahaha.
Damn that ending, Haruto became L-Elf's real friend. But still that wedding...

Well it seems this is what you call "Effed up mixed feelings" XD
You can't smile and you cant put on a sad face XP

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by DevilHighDxD

After watching the sub, I guess they ain't that much of a asshole compared to human. I wronged about them, but they picked the wrong person for Kamitsuki's exposing. I guess coexistence is possible after all but oh well suck for them. Had they negotiate, maybe Haruto can lived and Cain won't died such a pathetic dead also lived. Why can they brought this up sooner?

Well, I don't think Cain had a pathetic death persay, he had a pretty good death scene. I'm actually mad that nothing happened to the ARUS president. Not only was he as much if not more at fault here, but then he just decides to toss out a bunch of names of important people out an hope they're Magius? Talk about starting the witch hunt of the century.

And sure the kids "revealed the truth" but they also ended up starting a full scale global war and massacre that probably cost thousands of live both human and alien.

Originally Posted by ~BC~

The sash is not limited to military rank or royalty though. I think it's the plainness of his attire (I will admit the cut of his suit doesn't look like a priest) and the context in which it was shown that makes people think priest. It also doesn't help that we never see L-Elf being an emperor in any capacity. Though from what Akira said, and the prologue we hear all throughout the series, there's nothing saying he didn't become one later.

Well, I know that sashes can be used for other things, but I can't see any other reason that L-elf himself would be wearing one? He's the only founder left and he's a shoe-in for the leader especially since Shoko went into depression and Satomi really follows L-elf's lead. "Emperor" was the first thing that came to my mind when I saw him.

Originally Posted by Twi

The Magius can claim to be victims, but Cain was just spoon-feeding his version of things. True enough, humans are a**holes to everything, including one another, but they're no better. They can't claim to make the world peaceful when they stay out of human affairs, they're just sitting on the sidelines. And they were the ones who thought to use their invisible food ship and expose Saki and the others, so they shot themselves in the foot.

Let's be honest here, everyone was simply looking out for themselves. It just so happens that most of us root for the kids since we've seen the extremes both of the other factions, humans and Magius would go.

Sure everyone is around to protect themselves, even Haruto and company decided to reveal the truth to the world even knowing it would cause war and death across the world and a worldwide manhunt for the Magius both innocent and guilty.

The Magius came to our planet by accident and tried to coexist with humanity. However, that way only ended in pain and suffering for their people so they stuck to the shadows. They made alliances with influential humans to protect themselves by helping out humanity here and there and in return the human government leaders gave them an allotted amount of humans to supply the Magius with the runes they needed to survive. They believed that in keeping their people separate they could avoid war with the humans. I think that's what Cain was talking about with keeping the peace.

[DevilHighDxD]

Cain's death for me is pathetic, it a last minute pity that they want from us to him. Cain who consistently outwitted L-elf died such a sorry little death is just so stupid that I keep thinking is Okouchi high or on something when he wrote this episode?

[darkchibi07]

So what are the chance the main girls will have their own series now they're pilots and immortal?

[DevilHighDxD]

Originally Posted by darkchibi07

So what are the chance the main girls will have their own series now they're pilots and immortal?

Saki already had her own manga and the chance Shoko getting one is the same chance that Haruto will come back alive...

[Erufu]

Originally Posted by KleenexGhost

The ARUS President got off easy in my opinion. I was at least expecting him to get his comeuppance.

Now for the timeskip. It raises questions. In general we still have questions as to what is going on. But I'm trying to focus on the positive at the moment.


As a whole, Valvrave was a roller coaster to me. It was fun.

A good guilty-pleasure.

Agree to your points, overall good but something frustrates me in particular.

(1) Felt so injust when the opportunistic Arus President got a "good ending" while Shet hit the fans for the Magius and Fuhrer. The fat dude was the one who ordered the massacre on the module 77, even tho it was Dorrasia 's plan.

(2) And in the End, the Timeskip scenes were never justified why those cut scenes even existed. The purpose of having it should help give us more information to bridge the gap, not asking more questions. It only works to have loose ends when you have more seasons. Seeing how the bad guys are all dead it's never happening.

Doesnt say what happen to Arus and Dorrsia. And If the Royalist took over, why were they fighting Saki 200 years later ? Whats/whos the Golden 7 ? Who was the kid ? How did they expand to other Galaxy ? Was L-Elf the defacto Ruler /King? Was Shouko still the PM or did she resign to became a Pilot ?

When you deliberately have a Amuro-Char counter attack ending where you don't show their fate that's understandable. But here its just WAY TOO MANY loose ends, this is just simply Bad writing. Judging from the higher quality of the previous episodes and Code Geass, this is surprisingly disappointing because it could had been easily made so much better.

[darkchibi07]

Originally Posted by DevilHighDxD

Saki already had her own manga and the chance Shoko getting one is the same chance that Haruto will come back alive...

I'm mostly referring to them having their own anime series as a group.

[DevilHighDxD]

Originally Posted by darkchibi07

I'm mostly referring to them having their own anime series as a group.

Saki's popularity might get her the highest chance out of the main heroines, but it still very unlikely.

[xl_Legit_lx]

I thought the last few fighting scenes were great, but took up a lot of the episode. I'm glad they put in that filler monologue (or dialogue) at the end to straighten some loose ends, and overall I thought it was enjoyable but I can see why people might be disappointed. Some of the best mech fights I've seen in a long while though, and the music was fitting.

[zerriet]

Originally Posted by DevilHighDxD

Saki's popularity might get her the highest chance out of the main heroines, but it still very unlikely.

powerpuff girls in battle armor much? :P

but yeah it would do them justice to have a continuation. I want to point out something funny which is users on MAL judging the whole series poorly because shoko did not die.....

[Key Board]

Yeah, how they solved the magius issue was predictable but twisted
It was ruthless how fear was used to wipe out the magius

I'm pretty sure what happened does in no way follow the spirit of Lieselotte's will
but I guess you can't stop mass hysteria?

I think the students were way too depressed and maybe also resentful, so they let this happen
but I think overtime they grew remorse
Hence the ending

[zerriet]

Originally Posted by Key Board

Yeah, how they solved the magius issue was predictable but twisted
It was ruthless how fear was used to wipe out the magius

I'm pretty sure what happened does in no way follow the spirit of Lieselotte's will

that may be debatable, the original council of 101 had already given up on co-existing in the open so to wipe them out in order to prevent further trouble might have been the best solution. As for L-Elf, he created the utopia that Liselotte visioned so yeah

[xl_Legit_lx]

Originally Posted by Key Board

Yeah, how they solved the magius issue was predictable but twisted
It was ruthless how fear was used to wipe out the magius

I'm pretty sure what happened does in no way follow the spirit of Lieselotte's will
but I guess you can't stop mass hysteria?

I think the students were way too depressed and maybe also resentful, so they let this happen
but I think overtime they grew remorse
Hence the ending

To be fair, Liselotte probably understood the rules of war and the actions came to full circle at the end anyway when Shoko wanted to go halfsies with the aliens lol

Her will was carried on, although maybe not the best way since she was not into all that bloodshed stuff, but sometimes it takes matyrs to accomplish things.

[Key Board]

Originally Posted by zerriet

that may be debatable, the original council of 101 had already given up on co-existing in the open so to wipe them out in order to prevent further trouble might have been the best solution. As for L-Elf, he created the utopia that Liselotte visioned so yeah

Did he really? I mean co-existing with 2~3 kamitsuki, which btw, are under his command, aren't really co-existence

I guess they opened the future for possible Kamitsuki, but if you're a Magius, you're so screwed.

[Wandering Soul]

Originally Posted by KleenexGhost

Ok, now that the final episode is in the books so to speak.

Not so much a review as it thoughts/musings on the episode

Overall, the finale is what I expected.

I liked the fight between Cain and Haruto/L-Elf. I got where Cain was coming from. He and the other Magius were doing what they felt was necessary to keep themselves safe since previous attempts to openly co-exist ended badly. Overall, Cain was awesome this episode and was easily favorite character out of the cast. Kyuuma takes 2nd, Haruto 3rd.

The final moment between Haruto and L-Elf was touching. X-Eins and Q-Vier's death were also pretty sad and handled well.

The monologue Saki had to herself concerning having a shot at Haruto due to him losing his memories of Shoko was pretty sad as well. I'm gonna come back to that at a later time because I don't like it, yet I appreciate the insight.

The ARUS President got off easy in my opinion. I was at least expecting him to get his comeuppance.

Now for the timeskip. It raises questions. In general we still have questions as to what is going on. But I'm trying to focus on the positive at the moment.

This majority of the episode was solid to me. I just feel like there were things unresolved.

As a whole, Valvrave was a roller coaster to me. It was fun. It had it's up's and it had it's down's. Did the ride start to peter out towards the end for me? I'm not gonna lie, it did. It did feel like it relied too much on plot-twists. YMMV on that because some people would say that's part of the charm of the series.

Overall, if you can keep your expectations in check and want a fun, crazy and sometimes silly series to watch, then check out Valvrave. Does it have problems? Most certainly. But I guarantee it'll give you something to talk about.

A good guilty-pleasure.

I pretty much agree with everything in this post but just like someone else brought up earlier it's sorta messed up that Prue and Pino are still stuck inside the engines. I'm also still upset that episode 10 turned to be nothing but shock value but overall Valvrave is an enjoyable series as long as your expectations aren't too high and you sorta turn your brain off.

[DragoonKain3]

I'd say awesome finale. Where is that 'your tears are delicious' picture when you want it?

Seriously speaking, though, there are a lot of unanswered questions, but they are more or less not really important. Like what does it matter if they label Pino the bride or whatever, or what cause the Magius to crash into Earth, or how Jior imprisoned two Magius to use as engines, or what the Jior gov't was thinking of using 'advanced humans', or whatever else.

I mean it is nice to know whether that Renbokouji is really Satomi or his descendant, or who the prince is related to, or why Dorssia is still fighting the 'Empire', but to me all these questions are PURPOSELY left open ended just in case of a sequel. They're really not relevant to what VVV was really trying to tell: the birth of a new race and the nation they have built from the ground up. And considering people here are clamoring of a VVV with Shoko, Saki, and Akari as the main pilots, who is to say there won't be a sequel? XD

For the time being, the finale really touched me in that the Magius themselves were only looking out for themselves when they made the council. Even Cain was just fulfilling his promise to that guy Prue of 'liberating' Pino, since you can't deny the fact that the two were imprisoned to be used as the engine for weapons of war. So in the end, I can't fault the alien race when all they're thinking of is their species' survival, and they had good reason for their actions considering what happened after.

But I think the most 'disturbing' revelation is that Shoko uses the term 'hanbunko'... a term most used by the late Lieselotte. So Shoko gets possessed by Liz? I might be overthinking this considering that L-Elf did say Haruto says the same things Liz does, but how does Shoko know that phrase?

Most interesting implication? A-drei catching the bouquet. What caught my eye is not him catching it, but them showing the 5 girls after. Methinks they're hinting at who the 'first queen' is going to be... Saki seems to be most prominent, but all clues point that the prince is not related to her, and of course Akira can't be since she's the godmother. So Kriemhild is my bet since I think they look good together and she is a royalist after all, but one can make a case that Shoko makes more sense politically.

And at the very least, one of my ships sailed! Been shipping Takahi and Satomi ever since I've heard the two on a first name basis (friends since middle school or even maybe since elementary? I can only hope lol), but considering we don't know that Renbokouji is really Satomi, their happiness would be short lived since Takahi will die if Satomi becomes a Kamitsuki (oh how it reminds me of the bittersweet human-elf romances lol). So until Valverave 2nd season comes out, I will just think that its his descendant considering future Renbokouji doesn't seem to be as attached to Akira as Satomi was.

Sadly, it seems that the future is very bleak. Co-existence doesn't seem to be in grasp even 200 years later, since for one the Magius were literally hunted to extinction, and the remnants of anti-kamitsuki (Dorssia) seems to be still at war with the Kamitsuki even when 'humanity' has expanded their domain all over the galaxy. Now we also have another bunch of aliens invading the memorial core, and still fighting goes on. So yeah, very unfortunate that Haruto died for nothing, but I actually like that aspect because it doesn't paint a fairy tale ending (oh how do I hate some of the Gundam endings which are just to idealogical, just to give something to compare it to). After all, as a famous video game aptly puts it, "War... War never changes."

Is Valvrave anime of the year? For me, not by a long shot (not even it's the best anime in their respective cours), but it was a very fun ride. Certainly more fun and entertaining than say, Kyoukai no Kanata or whatever. I loved its story (sans the rape part) and the message it tells about conflict in terms of racism, war, and that the path to making those disappear might be futile, but in the end we should NOT give up in trying to do so.

So in the end, I'm not going to lie and I admit I'm very butthurt that ShokoXHaruto or L-elfXLiz didn't end up together (I dunno why I had my hopes up when writer doesn't pair childhood friends together lol), but I still can't give VVV anything less than a 9/10. Maybe if I weren't such a big shipper I would have given it perfect, but alas, I'm so biased. XD



Phrase of the series: "I mean, WHO can compete with a childhood friend?" -Saki
And truer words have never been spoken... at least here the two sets couldn't be together not because they didn't like each other, but because of external forces.

Originally Posted by finalfury

One issue that I think people might have with this is how Shoko went from "not accepting monsters due to her position" to becoming "the leader of the monsters that she once rejected for reasons." Kinda eh on meh imo.

I thought Shoko's main problem is not that they were 'monsters', but that Haruto lied to her. I mean, her entire spiel was not that Haruto was a monster, but that everything he told her was a lie. And she only went on that tirade because Haruto does not remember their past, of which she assumed that something 'possessed' Haruto or that the Haruto in front of her is just someone else using his face ("You are not the Haruto that I know!").