Macross Frontier - Episode 23 Discussion / Poll

[Haninozuka]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

Ex-cuse me? We had far more ammunition this week. The last thing is a not-very-unobvious red herring to stretch the du-angle, sorry, triangle out two more weeks.

Maybe so, but try reasoning that to the hardcore Ranka x Alto fans there on RC, who are totally convinced Alto has already confessed his love to Ranka. ^^; I don't think even Alto's "I'll kill Ranka" line will faze them.

As you can see from one good example of that kind of fan here, it is pretty hard trying to talk sense or reason through the Ranka goggles. >_>

I'm still hopeful it's a fake-out and what we're getting now is a bushel of stinky red herrings.

[FLCL]

Power Check
Neuro Synch Check
Super Eurobeat Check
YF-22 Double check
Death Star Turbo lasers Quadruple Check

ready to firebomb (ER XXXD) kawamoris place tak?

grrrrrr rawr! dog ears ending isnt allowed

[Teletha]

Originally Posted by Seifall

OK, always the same same chorus....
I didn't understand anything if that's you want
Nothing happenned ? what are you talking about ? The kiss or Alto's revelation ?
I think you're talking about the kiss scene.
If they clearly showed Alto 's true feelings about Ranka, I don't know for you, but the kiss, logically didn't happen.
I told people " true beginning " ... they said I'm talking nonsense...

They showed he wanted to protect her (we knew that already), but other then that they did not say he loved her. There are also different types of love. You are just concluding that all on your own.

You have no logic at all. If he realized he "loved" Ranka at the end of 23, how did that stop the kiss at the end of episode 22? It doesn't work that way. The beginning of 23 clearly shows Alto and Sheryl are basically living together happily and Alto is comfortable enough to carry her to bed when she tells him too. There is nothing in 23 at all that says they didn't kiss, probably quite the opposite.

To add, the kiss is not a big deal and has never been a big deal to me. I think they did (as do most people), but how Alto reacted to her is more the story then anything.

[TwilightHack]

Sheryl doesn't know how to use chopsticks properly... she speared the thing!

I thought the whole dinner scene was awesome.

[FLCL]

in hindsight, i really wish kawamori didnt do the SC copout, the whole hivemend bee network thing is cliched to hell. oh well.

what happened to boob grabbing grace flight suit...she was wearing her stupid suit again

The dinner scene reaffirmed my love for sheryl

[Key Board]

they didn't outright say it but there's multiple grace bodies piloting multiple valkyries it seems

I think the woman called Grace is no longer a human but more of a consciousness in the information network.
Not unlike Vajra, actually.

As someone said before, this has a strong Ender game flavor.
The vajra don't consider individuals casualties because hey, the network itself is the Vajra.

And they assume the same applies to us.

[ippus]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

List them, or kindly don´t do accusations in ours and my general direction.

You guys talk a lot. I'm not going to purposely go through those ridiculous amounts of pages just to look for a quote where you placed your preference over reasonable judgment. I don't intend to pick a fight, but you tend to get touchy very easily and start to dismiss what other people say at the drop of the hat.

And you aren't honestly going to tell me that your arguments are perfect are you =_=

Originally Posted by Seifall

View Post
Sheryl didn't misinterpret anything since they showed the paperplane she throw at the sky falling.

And Let's remember Ranka's plane was torn to shreds by Ai-kun. Clearly this means Alto is going to die by Ai-kun's evil hands.

[magnuskn]

Originally Posted by Teletha

They showed he wanted to protect her (we knew that already), but other then that they did not say he loved her. There are also different types of love. You are just concluding that all on your own.

You have no logic at all. If he realized he "loved" Ranka at the end of 23, how did that stop the kiss at the end of episode 22? It doesn't work that way. The beginning of 23 clearly shows Alto and Sheryl are basically living together happily and Alto is comfortable enough to carry her to bed when she tells him too. There is nothing in 23 at all that says they didn't kiss, probably quite the opposite.

To add, the kiss is not a big deal and has never been a big deal to me. I think they did (as do most people), but how Alto reacted to her is more the story then anything.

I think it is quite telling that he was comfortable enough to just carry her to bed... it suggests they have been doing that for some time now.

Originally Posted by FLCL

what happened to boob grabbing grace flight suit...she was wearing her stupid suit again

She was in her cyberspace-suite... I think she simply likes to picture herself in that suit.

[glyph]

Originally Posted by FLCL

in hindsight, i really wish kawamori didnt do the SC copout, the whole hivemend bee network thing is cliched to hell. oh well.

SC? Whazzat?

[bkg9990]

StarCraft

10chars

[Mughi]

WOW! The shipper wars are really heating up now! Not much of a surprise really. Every Macross series goes this way. It really IS like the Pirates of the Caribbean ride... I'm sitting in a boat watching the cannonballs fly. ONE side is going to get their city burned and the other may end up dead skeletons sitting on their worthless prize...

In the end, everyone is whining about Sheryl, or Ranka or arguing about Alto this or that, but Alto is the MAN... He's own'd you all by never answering the key questions... and now he's done it again! I think that Alto might just BE Kawamori, and he's trolling ALL of you shippers!

[golthin]

Originally Posted by TwilightHack

Funny thing is, the only time love is mentioned is when Klan asks him... and in my belief when she said it she wasn't referring to as Ranka is the one Alto loves.

Honestly that's a red herring if I've ever seen one.

well, when klan thought Alto was in love with sheryl nobody thought she was wrong. this time after EVERYTHING she heard from Alto she realized how he feels about Ranka! the thing is that Ranka and Alto are over, but he did loved her! Ranka removed herself from the competiton. I don't get why so many people are opposed to Alto having feelings for Ranka! Alto will stay with sheryl till the end, that is the kind of guy he is!Kawamori wanted us to know that if Ranka had not left, she would have won, but now it is too late and Alto is too involved with Sheryl!

[ReddyRedWolf]

Originally Posted by ippus

And Let's remember Ranka's plane was torn to shreds by Ai-kun. Clearly this means Alto is going to die by Ai-kun's evil hands.

That's Alto's paper plane actually.

Ranka's flew

Sheryl's drops

and Alto's got torn by a larva.

[zeiram]

Um. Sorry, I haven't see the episode, but based on the dialog---

Klan said "sore ga omae no koi "?

It's simply 'So *that's* your idea of love??'

Japanese gets really figurative when they start talking about possession of ideals, like patriotism [aikoku] or love [ai / koi] or...

I now return you folks back to who's love how where what when.. just one thing::

Kawamori-san has demonstrated that he's a troll-fu master... he's certainly got all you guys talking.. I knew something was up when he killed the "Max Genius" of the this series, Michel. And didn't kill Ozma. I'd say he's having fun tugging heartstrings. But that's just me.

[ippus]

Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf

That's Alto's paper plane actually.

Ranka's flew

Sheryl's drops

and Alto's got torn by a larva.

That's my point. Alto's plane (I said it's hers cause she owned it by then >_>) got crushed by her Vajira. Under the same theory it must definitely mean that Ranka's pet is going to kill Alto, if Sheryl's possibility in the relationship is nil from a plane that cannot fly.

Ranka's plane didn't fly, she gave it to Alto who adjusted it and it to make it fly.

[TwilightHack]

Originally Posted by leoofborg

Um. Sorry, I haven't see the episode, but based on the dialog---

Klan said "sore ga omae no koi "?

It's simply 'So *that's* your idea of love??'

Japanese gets really figurative when they start talking about possession of ideals, like patriotism [aikoku] or love [ai / koi] or...

Actually she said "ai".

But its exactly as you said, his "idea" of love as opposed to "loving".

I now return you folks back to who's love how where what when.. just one thing::

Kawamori-san has demonstrated that he's a troll-fu master... he's certainly got all you guys talking.. I knew something was up when he killed the "Max Genius" of the this series, Michel. And didn't kill Ozma. I'd say he's having fun tugging heartstrings. But that's just me.

Yes to that, he's a master.

[lone_wolf]

Originally Posted by Ja-Y-Ce

curious about the Jap fandom over this episode - anyone with any idea?

I was just over at 2chan for my lunch break so here are some comments:


On 2chan:

- A few posters are making comparisons with "Do you Remember Love"
- A few are also mentioning how merciless this series is.
- LOL, I think there was a comment where a poster wants Ranka to fall of a cliff. ^_^;;
- Some people are upset over there because Kawamori is making Sheryl suffer once again.

There are more Sheryl supporters over there this time around

Someone commented:
"Please stop with the death flags" (More of an indirect message to Kawamori)



Other Funny reactions....
-----------------------------
"Sheryl is my wife"


"Will Luca die?"


Regarding kitchen scene with Sheryl and Alto:
"Naked Apron, Naked Apron, Naked Apron!" (Yeah someone wants that badly LOL)


"Can the hime cook?"

-------------------------------




I'll head over to the Macross F BBS during my next break (hopefully) so catch ya later!


--Lone Wolf
一匹狼

[ippus]

Originally Posted by Mughi

WOW! The shipper wars are really heating up now! Not much of a surprise really. Every Macross series goes this way. It really IS like the Pirates of the Caribbean ride... I'm sitting in a boat watching the cannonballs fly. ONE side is going to get their city burned and the other may end up dead skeletons sitting on their worthless prize...

In the end, everyone is whining about Sheryl, or Ranka or arguing about Alto this or that, but Alto is the MAN... He's own'd you all by never answering the key questions... and now he's done it again! I think that Alto might just BE Kawamori, and he's trolling ALL of you shippers!

Kawamori, a ex-Kabuki bishounen with a boobies and loli fetish.

PFu.


KuFuahahahhahaha;;;;;;;
Oh if only.

[magnuskn]

Originally Posted by ippus

You guys talk a lot. I'm not going to purposely go through those ridiculous amounts of pages just to look for a quote where you placed your preference over reasonable judgment. I don't intend to pick a fight, but you tend to get touchy very easily and start to dismiss what other people say at the drop of the hat.

And you aren't honestly going to tell me that your arguments are perfect are you =_=

There´s a big difference to when others and I go "SHERYL GANBATTE!" with fanboyish ( or -girlish ) squees, and when we try to argue rationally.

I, at least, try to build my arguments with the things in mind which have happened before in the show, the characterizations of the main characters, foreshadowing and the general storytelling techniques which I´ve picked up in my many years of reading and watching stories ( long storylines, if I can ) and my being a DM for several RPG groups.

Are my arguments perfect? Assuredly not, I get schooled often enough by others here on the forum. Almost always by fellow Sheryl shippers like Swampstorm and Justin, though, because they have just as much experience in reading stories and are more familiar with the anime conventions than I.

But I think I am generally writing solid stuff, not only wishful thinking, when it comes to real arguments.

As for now....

SHERYL GANBATTE!

*edit* I am disappointed that I hit refresh and there weren´t five new posts since I posted. ^^

[forgottendiary]

Originally Posted by FLCL

Power Check
Neuro Synch Check
Super Eurobeat Check
YF-22 Double check
Death Star Turbo lasers Quadruple Check

ready to firebomb (ER XXXD) kawamoris place tak?

grrrrrr rawr! dog ears ending isnt allowed

I'm behind you mate!