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View Poll Results: High School DxD [LN/M] - Slashdog 2 Rating
Perfect 10 0 0%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 0 0%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 2 50.00%
7 out of 10 : Good 2 50.00%
6 out of 10 : Average 0 0%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
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Old 2018-02-27, 20:52   Link #41
Lucidrago
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Well DxD doesn't really go into everything so the latter could be true as well.
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Old 2018-02-28, 05:23   Link #42
DragonOsman
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Originally Posted by Ariel_Saeba View Post
That, or he only detected Issei having similar aura to a Twice Critical user and gave Raynare that exact same info.

On a different note, the preview mentions of "Team Abyss" led by Satanael. When I read it again, I presume it's either a completely new Grigori team with Tobio as its center or an old task force going as far as the Great War. Though given that it was not mentioned at all in DxD, I tend to gravitate to the former.
Rather than Azazel not realizing it, I think it's likelier that Raynare was just incompetent. And she was also acting on her own outside of Azazel's plans, just to gain favor with him. And it did seem like Raynare was the one who thought it was Twice Critical when she first saw it. At that time it didn't have the mark of the red dragon on it, so you can't probably can't blame her. But when Ise used its power to defeat her, that mark had already appeared. Rias saw it and understood why Ise won. When she told Raynare about it, Raynare was completely surprised. So she either didn't see the mark of the red dragon on it, or she didn't realize what it means even after seeing it.

The reason I think Raynare was the one who, herself, thought it was Twice Critical when she saw it is because the information she was given from the higher-ups of Grigori was about Ise having a potentially dangerous Sacred Gear that might even be a Longinus. Twice Critical is not a Longinus, so the fact that that warning was given out means that Azazel was thinking it's a Longinus, and that it's possibly the Boosted Gear.

@Lucidrago: Yeah, it's possible. Let's wait and see for now.

Azazel might have detected aura similar to a Twice Critical user when Ise first activated his Sacred Gear and Raynare could've heard that at that point. Which could be why she was convinced it's Twice Critical. But Azazel at first may already have guessed that it might be the Boosted Gear. And Raynare didn't realize it at all even when she saw what it can do and she may even have seen the mark appear on it. So even if the information she got regarding the aura signature was misleading, she herself was also incompetent.

Did we read about whether or not Azazel was sure from the beginning that Ise has the Boosted Gear? I don't remember.

Anyway, yeah, Azazel was probably talking about Lavinia, Tobio and Vali's Sacred Gears when talking about "God-killing Tools", since the kanji is the same as those used for "Longinus". That makes sense. And it also makes more sense for the preview to be saying that Ise awakened the Boosted Gear 4 years after the events of this Volume.
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Old 2018-02-28, 06:02   Link #43
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Given that Satanael's betrayed Grigori, "Abyss Team" is another traitorous group, and, probably, someone from Grigori (maybe Azazel?) warns Tobio and the others about their danger.
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Old 2018-02-28, 06:35   Link #44
DragonOsman
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I don't remember that. When did that happen? If it was in Slash/Dog, I might really need to reread it.
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Old 2018-02-28, 07:25   Link #45
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Well, yeah. Haven't read a web novel, so can't say if it was mentioned there or not, but it was clearly stated in the light novel-version.
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Old 2018-02-28, 09:05   Link #46
Lucidrago
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There was nothing indicating that Azazel thought it was Twice Critical. Azazel didn't appear in the series until Volume 4. Raynare was the one who thought it was Twice Critical upon seeing it. Nothing indicated she knew of what Sacred Gear Issei had when she killed him.

My guess is that Azazel had a hunch that Issei had a potentially dangerous and powerful Sacred Gear, maybe even a Longinus. And he sent Raynare to monitor Issei and he left what to do with Issei at Raynare's discretion.

Nothing indicated in Volume 4 that he didn't want Raynare to kill Issei. Nothing indicated that he wanted Raynare to kill Issei. He just commented about how dangerous Sacred Gear possessors were a threat. We might not want to believe that Azazel would sanction such a thing but this is the guy who hired Freed.

And remember that Raynare monitoring Issei and the Asia incident were two separate things.
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Old 2018-02-28, 09:44   Link #47
DragonOsman
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I know Azazel wanting or not wanting Ise killed isn't known. He was having him monitored, so if Ise had been killed because his Sacred Gear was deemed as dangerous, Azazel probably would've been fine with that. Because he'd just think of it as a potential threat having been snipped at the bud. Though I remember Raynare saying she was allowed to kill him for having a potentially dangerous Sacred Gear. Wouldn't that mean Azazel said to kill him if she felt the need to?
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Old 2018-02-28, 10:49   Link #48
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a question, where satanael comes out and what were its characteristics ?. well I do not remember having read that name in the first slash dog
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Old 2018-02-28, 11:02   Link #49
Ariel_Saeba
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Ah, I think I've read about Satanael's line in the WN as well but not as clear as in the LN version (I think), so it's more to the latter with a twist (an old task force turning rogue).

Either Azazel or Baraqiel warned them, considering that the latter would train Tobio's group.

Here are the lines from the WN:

Spoiler for WN Quote:
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Old 2018-02-28, 11:06   Link #50
DragonOsman
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I've only read the WN for Slash Dog. If I want to read the LN for Volume 1, where should I look for it?
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Old 2018-02-28, 11:12   Link #51
CCPDarkraiRules
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JeruTz who translated the web novel is updating the translation to the light novel so check his site.
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Old 2018-02-28, 11:17   Link #52
Ariel_Saeba
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jeruTz's doing the WN-LN conversion (or rather, comparison. Not that much difference I say, he said that in the first few parts the noticable changes are just streamlined narrative and omission of some points from the WN, such as the mention of Tobio's parents).

One thing for pre-DxD Azazel though: I think that he at first wanted to take the neutral stance and see where Issei would go (Raynare scandal made that moot) Considering that later on he basically did something with Issei like what he had done with Vali, he later took a more drastic steps and decided to interfere personally.
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Old 2018-02-28, 11:24   Link #53
DragonOsman
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So you're saying he possibly doesn't endorse what Raynare did? Even though he may have been fine if Ise had been killed for being deemed dangerous? Did I understand correctly?

But yeah, him disguising himself as one of Ise's clients to get close to him may also have been him trying to make amends for Raynare's actions. Not saying he wouldn't kill Ise if he thought he's dangerous. Just wondering.
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Old 2018-02-28, 11:47   Link #54
Ariel_Saeba
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Azazel did give his remorse to Issei later on, seeing that he only sent Raynare to investigate and probably talk Issei out to join the Grigori, and killing was out of his initial plan (again, as we see with Lavinia, Tobio and Vali, man's got a point to not kill Longinus possessors unless they have malicious intents like Augusta, later Walburga, even then, the latter's Holy Cross only got stripped and later given to Lint). It's not like he's out to kill, seeing that finding the next possessor/wielder after killing the current one is a pain in a cow's arse.
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Old 2018-02-28, 12:11   Link #55
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Originally Posted by Ariel_Saeba View Post
jeruTz's doing the WN-LN conversion (or rather, comparison. Not that much difference I say, he said that in the first few parts the noticable changes are just streamlined narrative and omission of some points from the WN, such as the mention of Tobio's parents).
At least, there is an extra chapter in the LN-version about Freed and his teacher (but it's an awfully short one), and a slight addition to the epilogue chapter about Tobio and the others transferring to "Nephilim" (the illustration with Natsume posing in something resembling a school uniform is from this part).
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Old 2018-02-28, 12:38   Link #56
Lucidrago
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But you would have to realize that Issei is one of the Two Heavenly Dragons. Azazel bringing him into the organization with Vali in it could bring about a disaster.

And plus he wasn't sure what Sacred Gear Issei had. So bringing a Sacred Gear possessor into his organization who might not be worth it in the long run would be stupid.
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Old 2018-02-28, 13:01   Link #57
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Originally Posted by Ariel_Saeba View Post
Ah, I think I've read about Satanael's line in the WN as well but not as clear as in the LN version (I think), so it's more to the latter with a twist (an old task force turning rogue).

Either Azazel or Baraqiel warned them, considering that the latter would train Tobio's group.

Here are the lines from the WN:

Spoiler for WN Quote:
Oh, apparently Kokabiel was not the only leader against the orders of Azazel.
not to mention that some grigori books put satanael in the same leagues as azazel and shemhazai.
satanael will remain alive or at liberty in the current time ?, for my part I hope that if it would be good to have a fallen powerful antagonist for the end.
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Old 2018-02-28, 13:06   Link #58
Ariel_Saeba
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@Le Fay, yeah, the Freed extra is only in the LN.

Hmm, a convenient plot point. I guess Nephilim is basically a Grigori-founded academy for future fallen angels ("Nephilim" is the name given to descendants of the Grigori/Watchers with their human mate/spouse, at least in the book of Enoch. Akeno is a prime example in DxD).

@Lucidrago From what I can get, before DxD, Azazel had predicted that Issei's Sacred Gear could develop to a certain level of power. Yet, he was not exactly sure if it's on the level of Longinus, at least initially, hence him sending Raynare and not a leader-class like Baraqiel or Shariel to check. And Azazel being Azazel, he may have already figured out Issei's external personality and not really consider him as a major threat, again this was before the Boosted Gear being included in of the equation.

PS. @godz Kokabiel was only out there because Azazel basically dotted him out and being forced to work in a peaceful condition, which he did not accept that much.
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Old 2018-02-28, 13:17   Link #59
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It was said that "Nephilim" is Grigori's facility for SC possessors.
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Old 2018-02-28, 14:21   Link #60
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ah, now we're getting somewhere. Seems similar to the one Issei and Gasper visited in one of the Volume 13 SS.
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