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Old 2018-06-19, 13:34   Link #21
Parry999
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Other than the fact his a former terrorist. Anyway Bael made their bed when they thought messing with Belial was a good idea.
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Old 2018-06-19, 13:41   Link #22
Lucidrago
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As long as he wasn't the leader of Khaos Brigade(AKA Ophis) he's fine.

Ophis can't be forgiven for being the leader of the terrorist organization. Would Hitler be forgiven? And remember that the supernatural world at large still believes that Ophis is the one at top. Why do you think her existence is a secret?

But getting back on topic, looks like Euclid is going full-out siscon. Guess that's where Sirzechs and Serafall got it from.
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Old 2018-06-19, 13:46   Link #23
Parry999
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She probably got drunk and spoiled him to much.
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Old 2018-06-19, 13:50   Link #24
DragonOsman
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Euclid's sister obsession is too much.

And yeah, I hope Ophis' name can be cleared somehow. Poor dragon was just misunderstood. T_T
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Old 2018-06-19, 13:53   Link #25
Parry999
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I have no idea why Ishi made fake dragon emperor such a freak. He was so excited to introduce him. Hyped by Azazel inspired Risevim and cloned the boosted gear. Nah his just a loser who wants to fuck his sister.
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Old 2018-06-19, 14:06   Link #26
Sauron12561
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Issei will probably have a hand in clearing Ophis' name. I just refuse to believe her name wont be cleared during the series in some way (Vali will probably help too, possbily by revealing how Ophis was used by Chaos Brigade for her snakes, with Cao Cao also giving them a hand).

its just that all the necessary people to clear her name are still around (aside from the old Satan faction) and most of them are probably willing to help in clearing her name is Issei asked them too (or forced them too somehow).

edit: Sorry for going off tpoic there, i know it belongs more in the Volume 25 thread
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Old 2018-06-19, 14:12   Link #27
Royalknightftw
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Originally Posted by Sauron12561 View Post
Issei will probably have a hand in clearing Ophis' name. I just refuse to believe her name wont be cleared during the series in some way (Vali will probably help too, possbily by revealing how Ophis was used by Chaos Brigade for her snakes, with Cao Cao also giving them a hand).

its just that all the necessary people to clear her name are still around (aside from the old Satan faction) and most of them are probably willing to help in clearing her name is Issei asked them too (or forced them too somehow).

edit: Sorry for going off tpoic there, i know it belongs more in the Volume 25 thread
Is it really necessary to clear her name? I mean she's already got a big family, a home to live for, a friend to talk to, and etc. I doubt what people think about her truly matters for her
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Old 2018-06-19, 14:50   Link #28
Palmito
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Originally Posted by Lucidrago View Post
It should be well-established in this series that Power>Whatever you have.

Vali isn't some typical half-blood devil. He's the great-grandsib of Lucifer and has one of the 13 Longinus. Being a half-blood would be pretty insignificant compared to the other two points.

In the devils' world, no matter your lineage, they can't ignore extraordinary power like that. And they can't ignore someone with the blood of the original Lucifer whether he's a half-blood or not.

Believe it or not, there would be little to no argument brought up against Vali. That is how much of an advantage he would have.
I'm not saying he would be unable to become a Maou for being a half-blood devil. What I am saying is that many devils would be against him for that reason, and this is something that will not change no matter if he has a longinus or if he has Lucifer's blood.

And Power> Whatever you have, is not always the case (especially when you do not want to go to war against your own kind). If the underworld nobles do not want Issei and Vali to become Maou they will not be no matter how strong they become (unless these two try to force the nobles to accept them which I doubt they would do).

After Diehauser exposed the old devils, they lost a lot of influence so now they do not have much authority to prevent Vali and Issei from becoming Maou, but before that was not the case.

Last edited by Palmito; 2018-06-19 at 15:34.
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Old 2018-06-19, 18:31   Link #29
DragonOsman
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@Palmito: The thing you just said about the Old Devils' influence is also something Lucidrago and the rest of us have already been saying as well.

@Royalknightftw: Even if she doesn't need it or care about it, it's just sad if a completely innocent and pure dragon like her is mistaken as the leader of a terrorist group. That's the main and really the only reason.

Also, what do you think about her, Ise, and the others having to lie to Kunou about "Phis" and "Lith" all time? Ophis and Kunou are best friends, and yet Ophis can't even tell her the truth. Are you really okay with this status quo?
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Old 2018-06-19, 21:53   Link #30
Lucidrago
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Originally Posted by Palmito View Post
I'm not saying he would be unable to become a Maou for being a half-blood devil. What I am saying is that many devils would be against him for that reason, and this is something that will not change no matter if he has a longinus or if he has Lucifer's blood.

And Power> Whatever you have, is not always the case (especially when you do not want to go to war against your own kind). If the underworld nobles do not want Issei and Vali to become Maou they will not be no matter how strong they become (unless these two try to force the nobles to accept them which I doubt they would do).

After Diehauser exposed the old devils, they lost a lot of influence so now they do not have much authority to prevent Vali and Issei from becoming Maou, but before that was not the case.
The ones that would be do that would be so few and would be pushed back so far by the ones that support Vali. Again he has the name of Lucifer, he isn't just some average half-blood devil. And he has extraordinary demonic powers and one of the Longinus.

' But he's not a pureblood.' But he easily has power that could rival or surpass the Maou. And he has the lineage to boot.
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Old 2018-06-19, 22:41   Link #31
Palmito
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The ones that would be do that would be so few and would be pushed back so far by the ones that support Vali. Again he has the name of Lucifer, he isn't just some average half-blood devil. And he has extraordinary demonic powers and one of the Longinus.

' But he's not a pureblood.' But he easily has power that could rival or surpass the Maou. And he has the lineage to boot.
I do not think there would be just a few. Most pureblood devils are purists. No matter how strong he is he will always be despised by these devils. And as I said, after what Diehauser did these guys lost much of the political power they had, but before they could easily prevent Vali from becoming a Maou.
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Old 2018-06-19, 22:57   Link #32
Lucidrago
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Well what devils are we referring to?

And if they valued pureblood so much then they would have no problem concerning low-class and mid-class pureblood devils.
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Old 2018-06-19, 23:16   Link #33
Palmito
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Well what devils are we referring to?

And if they valued pureblood so much then they would have no problem concerning low-class and mid-class pureblood devils.
Old pure blood devils, and many if not most high-class devils of pure blood. And I do not understand what you mean. They do not care about any devil who is not a pure blood high-class noble.

Vol 19 Zekram Bael to Issei: "The real Devils refer to kins of High-class Devils that have been foretold since ancient times. Others besides that are servants and not real Devils. The "commoners" and "reincarnated ones". Being evil or not will change by the perspectives of humans and other forces. I do not see the need to become evil. To keep the society of nobles continuing for eternity is what "Devil" should do. "

...... It certainly does feel like a word coming from the man standing at the top of the House of Great King who takes importance of old teachings. I see. So Devil only refers to pureblood nobles. So he's denying the existence of us and normal Devils that live in the Underworld."
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Old 2018-06-20, 05:21   Link #34
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Just saying that most think pureblood only refers to the nobles. Lirenkus is a pureblood devil, he just isn't a commoner.

There's a certain order to what things are important. There's power which people are going to be more focused on than where you cane from. If you're a Super Devil with a Longinus, what would arguing about him being a half-blood do? The half-blood argument would assume that being a half-blood is being inferior to pureblood, so with Vali already being stronger than the majority of pureblood nobles, there would be little argument in the way of Vali becoming a Maou.

Then there's heritage and bloodlines. Due to the Underworld being an aristocratic society they highly value those things. So while Sirzechs, Ajuka, Serafall, and Falbium became Maou based purely on merit, they would never be able to be fully recognized as the leaders of the Underworld due to not possessing the blood of the original Maou.

Vali has both. He would run into little opposition if he decided to become a Maou. He has the name of Lucifer and he has the power. Why do you think the Old Maou Faction asked Vali to be their leader after their leaders were killed?

Power is valued the highest in the Underworld. Having extraordinary power can basically take you past what you are. Diehauser was just a poor noble. But he was born with immense demonic powers and now is as famous a devil as the Maou themselves. Issei is a reincarnated devil but has become a high-class devil in less than a year. While Ruval Phenex, a pureblood high-class devil who's a top tanker and was even a former ranker in the Top 10 was only just then about to be promoted to Ultimate-class in Volume 12.
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Old 2018-06-20, 06:29   Link #35
DragonOsman
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Ise was promoted to a High-class Devil a year after he became a devil. Not less than a year. Rias was already graduating from the Kuou Academy high school division when Ise got that promotion.

@Lucidrago: I think you're underestimating the severity of how much purists value pureblood more than anything else. The purist devils would still have a problem with Vali no matter how powerful he got. There's an SS called "Mad Tea Party". It hasn't been translated yet, but I heard that in it, Rias and Ise go to a party of High-class or above Devils and Ise has to pretend to be her fiancÚ (and he calls her his girlfriend, so it's after Volume 10 and maybe also after Volume 18 or so); Rias says in this SS that Devils from the Houses ranked in the single digits among the 72 Pillars are the most conservative and purist of all Devils. There was someone from one of those single digit Houses at the party and he was ridiculing Ise despite all of his power and achievements.

And I think that seeing how powerful Vali is despite not being a pureblood devil would just make the purists hate him more. That's just how they are.
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Old 2018-06-20, 08:14   Link #36
Palmito
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Originally Posted by Lucidrago View Post
Just saying that most think pureblood only refers to the nobles. Lirenkus is a pureblood devil, he just isn't a commoner.

There's a certain order to what things are important. There's power which people are going to be more focused on than where you cane from. If you're a Super Devil with a Longinus, what would arguing about him being a half-blood do? The half-blood argument would assume that being a half-blood is being inferior to pureblood, so with Vali already being stronger than the majority of pureblood nobles, there would be little argument in the way of Vali becoming a Maou.

Then there's heritage and bloodlines. Due to the Underworld being an aristocratic society they highly value those things. So while Sirzechs, Ajuka, Serafall, and Falbium became Maou based purely on merit, they would never be able to be fully recognized as the leaders of the Underworld due to not possessing the blood of the original Maou.

Vali has both. He would run into little opposition if he decided to become a Maou. He has the name of Lucifer and he has the power. Why do you think the Old Maou Faction asked Vali to be their leader after their leaders were killed?

Power is valued the highest in the Underworld. Having extraordinary power can basically take you past what you are. Diehauser was just a poor noble. But he was born with immense demonic powers and now is as famous a devil as the Maou themselves. Issei is a reincarnated devil but has become a high-class devil in less than a year. While Ruval Phenex, a pureblood high-class devil who's a top tanker and was even a former ranker in the Top 10 was only just then about to be promoted to Ultimate-class in Volume 12.
Wow, now you're going to deny even the cannon huh. You should just admit that you're wrong, man.
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Old 2018-06-20, 08:14   Link #37
Lucidrago
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Issei was reincarnated as a devil in April. He became a high-class devil in March, a few days before Rias and Akeno graduated.

That counts as less than a year. The beginning of Volume 22 was set at the end of February.
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Old 2018-06-21, 15:32   Link #38
kiiro94
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Seems that for the original maou, only rizviem surpassed the power of the originals, while the others even with ophis snakes could not
The other with the snakes did have equal power to the old Yondai Maou.

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Well the Underworld was most likely a monarchy when the original Maou were still alive. After they died, that was Zekram's chance to gain the power he never truly had when the original Maou were alive.

While they're well-suited to be Maou, Zekram knows that in the Underworld that highly values bloodlines and heritage, that they would never have the influence or authority the original Maou did. They would have the power but not the bloodline. That's a really important fact to consider. In an Underworld that highly values bloodlines and heritage, Sirzechs and the others would never be fully recognized as Maou. It was the perfect opportunity for Zekram to shape the Underworld in his own way and create the perfect balance of power between the Maou and the Great King.

That's why someone like Vali would be a threat. Think about how many devils would gather under him because of his name and power. He has the two most important things for ruling the Underworld. His power could easily surpass Sirzechs' in the future.

What if Vali had the same fanatical ideas as the Old Satan Faction? That would be very scary. Descendant of Lucifer, huge reserves of demonic powers, and Divine Dividing. Yeah I would kill him before he properly matures if I was Zekram just to prevent him from possibly claiming his birthright in the future.

Or Issei who has become a hero like no other in the Underworld. But he would have run into the same problems Sirzechs and the others did. Until Diehauser screwed everything up.
Well remember that the war of the 3 factions was 2000 years ago and Sirzechs is barely 800 years. So there is a gap of 1200 years where the underworld did not have a ruler and that is when Zekram made his move, the problem he said was that the descendants did not help the underworld in those 1200 years and it was the Bael House that helped everyone already.
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Old 2018-06-22, 09:41   Link #39
Lucidrago
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Euclid is going to catch Sirzechs and Grayfia making sweet love and It's going to be awkward.
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Old 2018-06-22, 10:44   Link #40
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I would like this special to end at the birth of mills or at least have a sexual scene between sirzchez and grayfia, this will not only show us some sex in dxd but that it will prepare us for when the issei's turn comes.
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