Learning Japanese

[WanderingKnight]

Japanese guy-talk is a bit more... actually, its a lot less ... with more growls.

てめえ...夜の癖に「おはよう」って言ったりしあがって...うっせんだよ、このクソ野郎が ！

[Vexx]

I don't know the onomatopoeia for <coffeespew> ...

[Kyuusai]

Originally Posted by WanderingKnight

てめえ...夜の癖に「おはよう」って言ったりしあがって...うっせんだよ、このクソ野郎が ！

*nearly chokes*

Beautiful!

[boggart]

Okay, so I'm roughly 15 lessons into Pimsleur's audio lessons and realise, "Crap, I'm not going to be able to read!" I know my two kana systems, and with my background in Chinese, I can make out what some Kanji are and figure out what it is in Japanese... but my question is this:

Is it easier to learn how to read and write after learning to converse and understand?

[Risaa]

Originally Posted by boggart

Is it easier to learn how to read and write after learning to converse and understand?

I'm probably not the best one to answer, but here are my two cents:

Yes, it is easier to learn to read and write after learning to speak *because it's easier learning to speak and comprehend*, not because speaking will aid you in writing. Being used to speaking may also cause you to automatically assume spellings of certain words which are wrong (nato for natto, satou or sato?). The only benefits I see would've come regardless whether you started with speaking or with writing - you've got some grammar and vocabulary.

I guess it's more about what your priorities are. Having no one to practice with, I chose to focus my time and energy into learning how to read and write... So while I'm OK at school work here, I'm the total baka gaijin when I have to go out and interact with the locals. If your goal is to read manga and converse in Japanese via e-mail, I recommend starting with reading and writing. And if your goal is to talk in Japanese with people, keep going with speaking. Eventually you should be able to reach both goals.

[Ledgem]

That's a difficult question. I started studying Japanese with some basic conversation knowledge, but I feel like much of it led me astray. That is, the way things sound would occasionally be taken for granted, but when you see it in writing, it suddenly made sense. As Risaa mentioned, it may mess up some of your spelling, but that's relatively easily fixable.

You're not doomed if you did it one way or the other, either way. I think it helps if you do both at the same time. I tried studying Japanese without the writing segment for a while, and my retention was very low. For me, at least, the writing reinforces the verbal in a very strong manner. But we are all different

[FatPianoBoy]

Originally Posted by Risaa

I guess it's more about what your priorities are. Having no one to practice with, I chose to focus my time and energy into learning how to read and write... So while I'm OK at school work here, I'm the total baka gaijin when I have to go out and interact with the locals.

Sounds similar to me. When conversing, I usually have to mull over it for a second, but things click almost instantly when I see it in writing. I guess it's just a matter of which your studies focus on more.

[boggart]

Yeah, because when I studied Mandarin Chinese, I was learning everything as I went along... so there'd be dictation, conversation practice, calligraphy, character recognition etc etc. That's why now when I am doing these audio lessons, it seems a bit weird to me because I don't have the actual texts in front of me to practice with.

My main aim is to be able to speak and comprehend, so I guess this way is the best for me. However, I too don't have someone to practice with so it's a bit harder that way.

[poptart]

Originally Posted by boggart

Yeah, because when I studied Mandarin Chinese, I was learning everything as I went along... so there'd be dictation, conversation practice, calligraphy, character recognition etc etc. That's why now when I am doing these audio lessons, it seems a bit weird to me because I don't have the actual texts in front of me to practice with.

My main aim is to be able to speak and comprehend, so I guess this way is the best for me. However, I too don't have someone to practice with so it's a bit harder that way.

maybe you could try to take the audio and make your own script.

it would strengthen your word recognition and increase vocabulary. plus it will help you to find context and object markers.

[Pell14]

I have this similar problem as well. I couldnt speak as well as i could write, read and listen =) There are times where i know the proper pronunication in my brain but somehow brain signals doesnt send well to my mouth output haha
Well that was pretty expected since i dont have anyone to talk to
I usually read light novels to boast my pola but furigana is kind of spoiling me hehe

[AnimeIsAwesome]

Im learning japanese but i cant seem to find where ur able to write japanese on the computer. so if anyone knos how do plz show or tell me.

[Autumn Demon]

Originally Posted by AnimeIsAwesome

Im learning japanese but i cant seem to find where ur able to write japanese on the computer. so if anyone knos how do plz show or tell me.

if you're on a pc:
control panel > regional and language options

[Risaa]

On a mac:

Apple > System Preferences > International > Input Menu > scroll down and tell it to install Japanese.

[WanderingKnight]

if you're on a pc:
control panel > regional and language options

This is just a minor correction, but I couldn't resist to add that PC != Windows. You should have said, "If you are on Windows...". It's minor, but it's important to understand the difference between OS and PC

[Marina]

Originally Posted by Risaa

On a mac:

Apple > System Preferences > International > Input Menu > scroll down and tell it to install Japanese.

Ahhh, thanks! This is useful since I just started my first year in Japanese.

[zetsumei]

Originally Posted by FatPianoBoy

Sounds similar to me. When conversing, I usually have to mull over it for a second, but things click almost instantly when I see it in writing. I guess it's just a matter of which your studies focus on more.

Speaking and listening is definitely the two hardest things to try to pick IMO, if you don't use it daily. I've been self-learning Japanese for about 4 months now and has picked up about 400 something Kanji, and can pick up and understand a little bit of the how things got translated now. So many words that have the same pronunciation but all have different meanings, hard for the brain to pick up right away if not use in daily conversation. Watching anime is a great way to pick up new stuff for me, especially from the OP/ED.

Irregular reading and meanings of combined Kanji is another problem. Some combined Kanji meanings just got me saying "How...what the..."

I saw the first episode of Bamboo Blade today and when the title and I saw 味「Ｔａｓｔｅ；　Ｅｘｐｅｒｉｅｎｃｅ」　+　方「Ｗａｙ　ｏｆ；　Ｐｅｒｓｏｎ；　Ｄｉｒｅｃｔｉｏｎ 」　and would have never guess 味方　was ally/friend. Unless those two Kanji has more definition I don't know about...

[i8o]

Originally Posted by zetsumei

I saw the first episode of Bamboo Blade today and when the title and I saw 味「Ｔａｓｔｅ；　Ｅｘｐｅｒｉｅｎｃｅ」　+　方「Ｗａｙ　ｏｆ；　Ｐｅｒｓｏｎ；　Ｄｉｒｅｃｔｉｏｎ 」　and would have never guess 味方　was ally/friend. Unless those two Kanji has more definition I don't know about...

味方 is replaced Kanji that was not considered of meaning.
味方 is 御方 originally.

味方 = 御方 = mikata = mi(prefix of respect) + kata(side)

[SSJiffy]

いわう = to celebrate

iwatte okimasu = to celebrate in advance.

Am I right?

As in, Atashi wa hatachi ni narimasu, iwatte okimasu.

[shadow-of-sin]

いわう = to celebrate

iwatte okimasu = to celebrate in advance.

Am I right?

As in, Atashi wa hatachi ni narimasu, iwatte okimasu.

Yes that's right.

Just a small tip: if you want to see if some sentence is right (especially to see if the context is correct) try searching google with the phrase (remember the inverted commas). So for example when you search for ”祝っておく”,”誕生日”, one of the sentences that comes up is:
相方が誕生日なので祝っておく
(this is one of the times where Rikaichan is very useful)

[Onakra]

Originally Posted by SSJiffy

Atashi wa hatachi ni narimasu, iwatte okimasu.

Just noting that "atashi" is only used by females.

And it might be just me, but this seems to "flow" a bit better.
"watashi ha hatachi ni naru no de iwatte okimasu"