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Randrak42 · 2012-12-31, 09:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shikijin

Exactly. Maybe there will be even an extra book or two about side-stories, but the series will officially end with Zokuowari.

Alright then, looking forward to the next books even though I can only really read the spoilers, they alone are enough to get me interested in the plot xD

Thank you again for all the info!!!

Marcus H. · 2012-12-31, 10:03

Quote:

She is the one Araragi would want to have beside when dying on the battlefield.

So Shinobu is more of a "worthy opponent-turned greatest ally"?
Well, from what I have watched in Nise (just watched 06), their interactions are more suited for a battle fantasy series like Shana or similar things like that (i.e. they sound a bit chuuni when seen in the perspective of a normal person).

Shikijin · 2012-12-31, 10:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcus H.

So Shinobu is more of a "worthy opponent-turned greatest ally"?

That would be Kanbaru. I'm not joking, it was written in Nise that Kanbaru is like the early enemy that turns into an ally.

Malkuth · 2012-12-31, 10:38

I disagree about Tsubasa, first of all her relationship with Koyomi has developed a lot throughout the series (more than any other characters' even counting in Kissshot and Hitagi). In series one (for which I can have a more definitive opinion), Koyomi worships Tsubasa, but is afraid to make a move and lose his only friend (until Mayoi). On the other hand, Tsubasa appreciates Koyomi, but does not think of him romantically until the end of Kizu, and realizes her feelings with the start of series two (Black Hanekawa, the cat-spirit, figured it out a lot earlier, of course).

Shikijin · 2012-12-31, 11:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malkuth

I disagree about Tsubasa, first of all her relationship with Koyomi has developed a lot throughout the series (more than any other characters' even counting in Kissshot and Hitagi). In series one (for which I can have a more definitive opinion), Koyomi worships Tsubasa, but is afraid to make a move and lose his only friend (until Mayoi). On the other hand, Tsubasa appreciates Koyomi, but does not think of him romantically until the end of Kizu, and realizes her feelings with the start of series two (Black Hanekawa, the cat-spirit, figured it out a lot earlier, of course).

I am not sure about what you mean with series one and series two.

Malkuth · 2012-12-31, 11:14

series one -> Bake/Kizu/Nise/Neko-Kuro
series two -> Neko-Shiro until Koi (which I have not read, but been mildy spoiled about their content)

Shikijin · 2012-12-31, 11:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malkuth

series one -> Bake/Kizu/Nise/Neko-Kuro
series two -> Neko-Shiro until Koi (which I have not read, but been mildy spoiled about their content)

Ah. Then I will say that Araragi was willing to make a move in Kuro, but it didn't end well because Hanekawa never asked for his help. He didn't know what Hanekawa's feelings were back then, but he was going to make a move. Right after Kuro, Bake started and Senjougahara came around. At this point it was too late for Hanekawa, who got also handicapped by the fact that she had lost her memories at the end of Kuro.

Malkuth · 2012-12-31, 12:31

@Shikijin: Tsubasa was willing since Kizu-

The problem was Koyomi being too intimidated by her, unlike with Hitagi. With Tsubasa Koyomi always feels inferior, while with Hitagi he pretends to be.

Otherwise, I agree

Shikijin · 2012-12-31, 15:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malkuth

@Shikijin:The problem was Koyomi being too intimidated by her, unlike with Hitagi. With Tsubasa Koyomi always feels inferior, while with Hitagi he pretends to be.

The dialogue with Tsukihi in Neko Kuro proves that Araragi was willing to face his own feelings.

I think that more than being intimidated (which he was), Araragi is socially inept, so he had problems taking the initiative. He had the same issues with Senjougahara, but in that case it was Senjougahara who took the initiative for him.

Randrak42 · 2012-12-31, 16:35

Hanekawa lost because she wasn't aggressive, like Hitagi was. Hanekawa started the race first but Hitagi was faster.
Simple as that...plus Koyomi is a self-proclaimed M from what I've heard.

Shikijin · 2012-12-31, 16:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Randrak42

plus Koyomi is a self-proclaimed M from what I've heard.

There are limits even to that. He commented Senjougahara was scary a lot in Bake and in Nise. He seems to like being trampled, but no more than that.

Randrak42 · 2012-12-31, 17:33

He can't be a very mild M either if he can still love Hitagi whole-heartedly even after her verbal abuses...or should I call them beatdowns? xD

sky black swordman · 2012-12-31, 18:30

Ok , I just watch teaser for Zenmonogatari, that whole "I hate you, Koyomi onii-chan!!" came out of nowhere for me.

Please someone explain this for me in detail if possible.

I have only watched the anime and read Bakemonogatari on BT.

Marcus H. · 2012-12-31, 19:49

^ It's best if we didn't tell you much about that.

Malkuth · 2012-12-31, 21:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shikijin

The dialogue with Tsukihi in Neko Kuro proves that Araragi was willing to face his own feelings.

But eventually failed... it was not the first time too, plus Tsubasa is not making things easier, and with the rest of the Bake- harem forming things got even more complicated.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shikijin

I think that more than being intimidated (which he was), Araragi is socially inept, so he had problems taking the initiative. He had the same issues with Senjougahara, but in that case it was Senjougahara who took the initiative for him.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Randrak42

Hanekawa lost because she wasn't aggressive, like Hitagi was. Hanekawa started the race first but Hitagi was faster.
Simple as that...plus Koyomi is a self-proclaimed M from what I've heard.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shikijin

There are limits even to that. He commented Senjougahara was scary a lot in Bake and in Nise. He seems to like being trampled, but no more than that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Randrak42

He can't be a very mild M either if he can still love Hitagi whole-heartedly even after her verbal abuses...or should I call them beatdowns? xD

But they both know that at any point Koyomi stops enjoying how obsessed Hitagi is with him, he can stop her (as he did in Nise-)... What I don't like about their relationship is that neither of them was interested in eachother like (Koyomi and Tsubasa), but it was convenient to be together, and requires less effort... of course, they have progressed a lot as a couple as the story proceeded.

Tempest35 · 2013-01-01, 15:43

I see that Malkuth is pretty pro-Tsubasa, and I can't fault that.

Just had to add my two-cents on what was Hanekawa's biggest regret in her life - not taking the lead with Araragai Koyomi.

It seems that Hanekawa was waiting for Araragi to 'sweep her off her feet' like a fantasy prince in her own fairy tail. He was the one with the vampirism and could do all the really cool things - so of course, him asking her out shouldn't be too hard, right? She even had the distinction of helping him during his crisis and has his eternal gratitude. So why didn't anything happen? She forgot that her wanna-be 'Prince Charming' was the same age she was and was very NOT ready to take the lead in a relationship. If only she had called him out on the 'eternal gratitude' thing for a date, but Hanekawa is too nice for that. She didn't want to 'trap' Araragai like that - 'ideal Japanese maiden' that she tried to project herself as.

Shikijin · 2013-01-01, 16:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tempest35

I see that Malkuth is pretty pro-Tsubasa, and I can't fault that.

Just had to add my two-cents on what was Hanekawa's biggest regret in her life - not taking the lead with Araragai Koyomi.

If you don't have read the novels you may not know certain things, but basically Hanekawa made Araragi be appointed vice class representative exactly to stay close to him. Also, Hanekawa was stealthily administering Araragi a "strengthening program". It's not like she wasn't doing anything.

sky black swordman · 2013-01-01, 17:42

Question, is the anime going in order? If not then, what is the order?

zeando · 2013-01-01, 18:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by sky black swordman

Question, is the anime going in order? If not then, what is the order?

if you're meaning the series order, it should be:
Kizumonogatari
Nekomonogatari(black)
Bakemonogatari
Nisemonogatari
for the "first season" novels, then there should be the "second season"

Malkuth · 2013-01-01, 18:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tempest35

I see that Malkuth is pretty pro-Tsubasa, and I can't fault that.

Just had to add my two-cents on what was Hanekawa's biggest regret in her life - not taking the lead with Araragai Koyomi.

It seems that Hanekawa was waiting for Araragi to 'sweep her off her feet' like a fantasy prince in her own fairy tail. He was the one with the vampirism and could do all the really cool things - so of course, him asking her out shouldn't be too hard, right? She even had the distinction of helping him during his crisis and has his eternal gratitude. So why didn't anything happen? She forgot that her wanna-be 'Prince Charming' was the same age she was and was very NOT ready to take the lead in a relationship. If only she had called him out on the 'eternal gratitude' thing for a date, but Hanekawa is too nice for that. She didn't want to 'trap' Araragai like that - 'ideal Japanese maiden' that she tried to project herself as.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shikijin

If you don't have read the novels you may not know certain things, but basically Hanekawa made Araragi be appointed vice class representative exactly to stay close to him. Also, Hanekawa was stealthily administering Araragi a "strengthening program". It's not like she wasn't doing anything.

I indeed like Tsubasa (not shipping her to Koyomi, but since he is the protagonist, well ends up working that way)... As for her not trying, she did try... a lot before Hitagi entered their life, it's just that she behaves more as an adult than either Koyomi or Hitagi do... they are more like teenagers understanding themselves through their relationships, while Tsubasa (because of her background) has figured a lot of things, tries to change, but is trapped partly in denial and partly in expectations.

Anyway, on another topic, there was a very spoilerish doujinshi in C83 about Nadeko Medusa

another character that tries a lot, but is obsessing over the wrong person

2012-12-31, 18:30	Link #2113
sky black swordman Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: California	Ok , I just watch teaser for Zenmonogatari, that whole "I hate you, Koyomi onii-chan!!" came out of nowhere for me. Please someone explain this for me in detail if possible. I have only watched the anime and read Bakemonogatari on BT. __________________

2012-12-31, 19:49	Link #2114
Marcus H. Princess or Plunderer? Join Date: May 2009 Location: the Philippines	^ It's best if we didn't tell you much about that. __________________ Continuing: White Sand Aquatope (6/24) and Vanitas S2 (0/12), The Vampire Dies in No Time S2 and Bofuri S2 (3/12). 2021: Restaurant to Another World S2 (3/12), takt Op. Destiny (1/12) and Taisho Maiden Fairy Tale (1/12). 2022: Yuusha Yamemasu (1/12), Kaguya-sama S3, Mob Psycho 100 III (Oct06), Bleach: 1000 Year Blood War (2/13) and Chainsaw Man (6/12). Spring 2023: Yamada-kun to Lv999 no Koi wo Suru, Kuma Kuma Kuma Bear Punch! (4/12), Skip to Loafer, Tonikaku Kawaii S2 (1/12), Otonari ni Ginga (5/12) and Kimi wa Houkago Insomnia (3/13). Contact me on Wikia and MyAnimeList. Anime List Status ~ Watching: 33. Completed: 468. Plan to watch: 39.

2013-01-01, 15:43	Link #2116
Tempest35 Awe of She Author Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Orlando	I see that Malkuth is pretty pro-Tsubasa, and I can't fault that. Just had to add my two-cents on what was Hanekawa's biggest regret in her life - not taking the lead with Araragai Koyomi. It seems that Hanekawa was waiting for Araragi to 'sweep her off her feet' like a fantasy prince in her own fairy tail. He was the one with the vampirism and could do all the really cool things - so of course, him asking her out shouldn't be too hard, right? She even had the distinction of helping him during his crisis and has his eternal gratitude. So why didn't anything happen? She forgot that her wanna-be 'Prince Charming' was the same age she was and was very NOT ready to take the lead in a relationship. If only she had called him out on the 'eternal gratitude' thing for a date, but Hanekawa is too nice for that. She didn't want to 'trap' Araragai like that - 'ideal Japanese maiden' that she tried to project herself as. __________________ "Focus entirely on me, you ordinary soldier."

2013-01-01, 17:42	Link #2118
sky black swordman Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: California	Question, is the anime going in order? If not then, what is the order? __________________

2012-12-31, 10:38	Link #2104
Malkuth Banned Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: London Age: 43	I disagree about Tsubasa, first of all her relationship with Koyomi has developed a lot throughout the series (more than any other characters' even counting in Kissshot and Hitagi). In series one (for which I can have a more definitive opinion), Koyomi worships Tsubasa, but is afraid to make a move and lose his only friend (until Mayoi). On the other hand, Tsubasa appreciates Koyomi, but does not think of him romantically until the end of Kizu, and realizes her feelings with the start of series two (Black Hanekawa, the cat-spirit, figured it out a lot earlier, of course).

2012-12-31, 11:14	Link #2106
Malkuth Banned Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: London Age: 43	series one -> Bake/Kizu/Nise/Neko-Kuro series two -> Neko-Shiro until Koi (which I have not read, but been mildy spoiled about their content)

2012-12-31, 12:31	Link #2108
Malkuth Banned Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: London Age: 43	@Shikijin: Tsubasa was willing since Kizu- The problem was Koyomi being too intimidated by her, unlike with Hitagi. With Tsubasa Koyomi always feels inferior, while with Hitagi he pretends to be. Otherwise, I agree

2012-12-31, 16:35	Link #2110
Randrak42 ANEGO Worshiper Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: By the vending machine, drinking tea.	Hanekawa lost because she wasn't aggressive, like Hitagi was. Hanekawa started the race first but Hitagi was faster. Simple as that...plus Koyomi is a self-proclaimed M from what I've heard.

2012-12-31, 17:33	Link #2112
Randrak42 ANEGO Worshiper Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: By the vending machine, drinking tea.	He can't be a very mild M either if he can still love Hitagi whole-heartedly even after her verbal abuses...or should I call them beatdowns? xD