Code Geass R2 - Episode 21 Discussion / Poll

[gabbytay]

Originally Posted by morbosfist

My point is that jumping from "cut off negotiations" to "allies" is quite premature.

They had a month to do that.

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by gabbytay

They had a month to do that.

Or they had a month to get nowhere and leave Japan in Britannian hands, which it obviously is.

[Methuselah]

Originally Posted by Ramong

Charles changed Nunnalys memories to keep her safe.. If she was alive and could remember what happened Charles was afraid that V.V might decide to kill Nunnaly. But when Charles made her forget everything and made her fake the blindness he fooled V.V to think that she wasn't a threat. Charles did explain this

The only flaw about that is that he crippled her as well, leaving her completely vulnerble of being raped while he dumped her and Lelouch in Japan. Good thing Lelouch took all the blows from the villagers and protected her. (According to the Drama CD) I don't know if the writers lack imagination or that the Emperor forsaw the event that will happen if he blinded AND crippled her. It's kind of stupid... Oh I have to cripple you as well to be sure, because my vision said so.

how would they lure C.C by occupying japan, C.C could just walk away, actually if kallen didnt steal her(thinking of her as a gas capsule) kallen wouldnt be involved in this seris, then how can they lure her, even if they capture her, they cant force her to agree with their plan, then what is the use of luring her ? (unless they grant her wish) (but if thats right, then why would C.C escape from the beginning ?!, wouldnt she just gave her life for V.V OR latter to Charles) and in the end charles started the Ragnarok without her approval, then why the bother ?!!]

The other thing is why let the Black Rebellion continue. Unless it serves as some sacraficial ritual to enhance the progression of the Ragnorock. If it doesn't, then that fact serves no freaken point.

5) Bismark believed that there would be a world to be ruled by schnizel, how is that ? (would not all humans be merged into one consciousness, then what is the need of schnizel)

Yea, that was what I was thinking too. And IF all live won't merge into one, what would happen to Charles? Wouldn't he want to continue his rule instead of his son?

[Traece]

..................................................
o_o....

This episode.. Was quite easily... The BEST Code Geass episode I have EVER seen...

Probably the most ironic episode I've seen in my time watching anime as well. Lelouch kills his mother and Charles, becomes the Emperor, takes Suzaku as his night and loyal ally, and beings his fight against Schneizel.

I have to say, I'm amazed that Lelouch's siblings were so against his rise to Emperor. After all, either Lelouch or Schneizel was destined to become the 99th Emperor through succession correct? So I suppose their rebellious comments was a bit out of line. All things considered though, they were never in a position to argue it. They should've been smart enough to know that if Lelouch was going to pop up on the throne all of the sudden on Live TV, he was going to be acknowledged whether they liked it or not.

I guess the royalty of Britannia isn't as smart as Lelouch and Schneizel are. Even I saw that Geass coming.

It's amazing just how much Lelouch has progressed in terms of power now. Getting his second Geass eye and destroying the Thought Elevator and then eliminating his parents, with Suzaku and C.C. backing him up (well, mostly Suzaku) was definitely unexpected.

Having 10/10 as the highest option is criminal.

[SoldierOfDarkness]

It's kind of stupid... Oh I have to cripple you as well to be sure, because my vision said so.

Hmmm no he just blinded her.

If I recall correctly it was even stated back in S1 that she couldn't walk because of the gun wounds (I mean there were large bullet holes in her legs) and THAT was caused by VV.

Yea, that was what I was thinking too. And IF all live won't merge into one, what would happen to Charles? Wouldn't he want to continue his rule instead of his son?

If Bismarck is truly Charles' Knight of One, then he should be fully aware of what is happening.

He smirked when he talked about Schenzeil ruling the world, it may be a last "hahaha" this is what's coming to you.

[El_Lazy_Mexican]

O....m....f...g....

This just pulled the biggest twist ever.

I had to rewatch it several times to sink in because so much when on in such short time.

The end bothered me to some extent due to the Evangalion vibes with the Gods and then quickly move to Lelouch geassing everyone at his reappearance in Britannia as the new Emperor.

Did anyone find it odd when Suzaku randomly came out from the ceiling and spinzaku'd everyone and even then no one took them both seriously?


Preview: Kalulu fans rejoice for the moment you all been waiting for will arrive and no doubt be interrupted yet again!

I personally hope Kallen gets a Slap at Lelouch so she can brag for getting away with hurting the Emperor.

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by Traece

I have to say, I'm amazed that Lelouch's siblings were so against his rise to Emperor. After all, either Lelouch or Schneizel was destined to become the 99th Emperor through succession correct? So I suppose their rebellious comments was a bit out of line. All things considered though, they were never in a position to argue it. They should've been smart enough to know that if Lelouch was going to pop up on the throne all of the sudden on Live TV, he was going to be acknowledged whether they liked it or not.

Succession dictates that Odysseus and Guinevere are ahead of Schneizel, and way ahead of Lelouch. They were actually a lot more tolerant than I would have thought.

Originally Posted by Traece

I guess the royalty of Britannia isn't as smart as Lelouch and Schneizel are. Even I saw that Geass coming.

Ignorance isn't always bliss.

[Methuselah]

[QUOTE=SoldierOfDarkness;1855180]Hmmm no he just blinded her.

If I recall correctly it was even stated back in S1 that she couldn't walk because of the gun wounds (I mean there were large bullet holes in her legs) and THAT was caused by VV.
QUOTE]

...So V.V. covered it up by shooting her in the leg, whereas Charles, in addition to his fatherly love, blinded her. That's quite uneccessary. Why don't he deafen her as well so she won't "hear" the information. XD Heck.. Why not just kill her.

I personally hope Kallen gets a Slap at Lelouch so she can brag for getting away with hurting the Emperor.

I would much prefer Kallen banging Lelouch inside the Academy buliding and live to "brag" about it.

[calvinguy]

So that's why they choose the planet Jupiter... so that in the end Lelouch could geass the Gods by staring into the planets eye (the storm spot).

Well I'm glad to see that Suzaku is back on Lelouch's side. I guessed he changed his mind in the end when he realized that Lelouch is fighting for what Nunally believes in which is also what Euphie believes in.

[superzombie23]

Originally Posted by Klashikari

We have the world of C that is under the effect of geass, which was considered as god...
Okay, so the power of the kings, which was shown as able to have an effect of human brain... suddenly was able to enslave a god. And now, the biggest fun is that jupiter is no longer in available and whatnot...

And the most interesting part: the execution. Not only everything was poured in not even half the episode, but the characters were simply like stakes. Charles knew what Lelouch was trying to do, yet he is leaving him using all of his speech about whatever he could do etc?
What about Suzaku barging in the fray while Lelouch seems to understand his point here? They skipped a lot of things and dragged also meaningless points... Let's also add the fact that they again used a time skip instead of settle things between Suzaku and Lelouch.

Finally, we have got schneizel having fun on his side as well...

I honestly cannot see that as "good writing" at all: they abused their ability to surprise the watchers, and broke their own scope of the stories. R2 suffered a lot of its pace and themes issues but episode 21 was the pinnacle.
They piled up too much twists to the point it just disjointed the story into... "before" and "now".
Basically we have "before R2 episode 21" and "after". Certainly great in continuity... not.

This was the point I was trying to make a few hours ago. He GEASS'd the freaking GOD. I knew it. I can't believe a lot of people are missing this point, and just looking at the nonsensical things of this episode. The fact he took off his contact is even more proof he did geass it. Since we're talking about Lelouch's new power and how he obtained it, this is all very important.

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by calvinguy

So that's why they choose the planet Jupiter... so that in the end Lelouch could geass the Gods by staring into the planets eye (the storm spot).

lol.

Well I'm glad to see that Suzaku is back on Lelouch's side. I guessed he changed his mind in the end when he realized that Lelouch is fighting for what Nunally believes in which is also what Euphie believes in.

I wonder about that. What they want to do may be what they wanted, but not how they are doing it. Both Nunnally and Euphemia wanted to change the world for the better, but you see, they did NOT bend peoples wills to get that world of theirs. What Lelouch is doing is just that. He is still using Geass to get what he thinks is right, and that is just not how it should work. It isn't how Euphie or Nunnally would want them to do things at all.

[Traece]

Originally Posted by Methuselah

I would much prefer Kallen banging Lelouch inside the Academy buliding and live to "brag" about it.

Well we know what happens when Kallen gets angry. We've all seen the YouTube videos... Lelouch has probably been slapped several hundred-billion times already if we use their counts. =D

Though I don't think she'll beat him up like she did Suzaku. Suzaku can take it, Lelouch will snap in half and they'll need a new Emperor!

As for 'banging'... Well... Empress Kallen needs to mother herself some children.

[BookOfMages]

Best.Episode.Ever.

[Quen]

I greatly enjoyed that ep, one of the best r2 episodes thus far IMO.

I knew I wasn't the only thinking "Human Instrumentality Project" while Charles was explaining his plans


Totally at a loss as to how the hell they're going to wrap this series up now.


Long Live Lelouch

[brandon279]

Originally Posted by miroku2192

what were ur 9, 10 and 11th points? And honestly, there's still plot armor, it's not perfect, but it's still somewhat plausible. But by witnessed the setup, they could just mean putting her under marianne, hell she could've stil thought that marianne was killed. Charles said "to stop her from coming CLOSE to uncovering the truth", in other words, she probably wasn't 100% sure whath appened, thats the only thing i can assume ot make the whole thing seem more plausible...

but please show me points 9 10 and 11 since you seem so set on saying code geass sucks now

actually, it is just this episode, the show is 25 episode, when they suck at one, it wont render the whole as "sucks"

9) the whole motto of Charles was "survival for fittest", so now he wants to creat the kind world?, talk about out of character.

10) how did lelouch geass the whole consciousness, that consciousness belongs to the whole humans, and there are humans immune to geass, like V.V, C.C, Charles, Suzaka, Villita, Germiah, lelouch himself ....etc, so how would he be able to geass it all, how can he geass without eye contact or with the target saying "yes" (anything along that word), it seemed to as bad plot.

11) lelouch blown the entry so he can seal the emperor in, (not the emperor has code same as c.c), then why was c.c able to enter ?

or lelouch was just idiot, and blowing the door had no effects, then why Charles said "you have sealed the door", how would the door be sealed while everyone did just go in and out as they like.

12) why would Bismark cover for the emperor death, why would he tell people that the emperor will make broadcast while he knows that the emperor is DEAD.

13) why would Schnizel wait for a month without taking the thrown while he was so eager to take it while emperor was alive, and when he didnt any KoR except suzaka, in real world thinking, he will crown himself as emperor in just hours.

may they left the thrown empty because lelouch needed a travel to the capital, and that travel too him a month .

14) why would the BK help in subduing a rebellion ?!, why should they care ?!

15) how did lelouch and Suzaka escape that island while it was covered by all these knightmares, may be thats why the time line jumped one month forward


the best were the first 8, but since you asked, i talked.


i think now you know why i dont love this episode (i still love the series).

[ryuukazi]

Originally Posted by El_Lazy_Mexican

Did anyone find it odd when Suzaku randomly came out from the ceiling and spinzaku'd everyone and even then no one took them both seriously?

I couldnt do anything but "ROFL" but how he came from the ceiling then ninja kicked some spears.... alittle over the top but was funny.

So many people were wrong about how Suzaku was gonna fight against Lelouch... but will still got 4 more eps

[scifijimmy]

So, I wonder what Jeremiah has been up to in the intervening month.

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by brandon279

9) the whole motto of Charles was "survival for fittest", so now he wants to creat the kind world?, talk about out of character.

He put on the mask of an Emperor.

10) how did lelouch geass the whole consciousness, that consciousness belongs to the whole humans, and there are humans immune to geass, like V.V, C.C, Charles, Suzaka, Villita, Germiah, lelouch himself ....etc, so how would he be able to geass it all, how can he geass without eye contact or with the target saying "yes" (anything along that word), it seemed to as bad plot.

Actually, didn't he say he was making a wish or something? Perhaps his double Geass and his will overpowered the Emperor's single Code (he said he needed two in order to make sure it works 100%.) It is a little confusing, but he really didn't Geass the "god." At least from what I got out of it.

11) lelouch blown the entry so he can seal the emperor in, (not the emperor has code same as c.c), then why was c.c able to enter ?

Marianne was fiddling with it before they entered. So perhaps it was still usable and not fully destroyed like Lelouch thought.

12) why would Bismark cover for the emperor death, why would he tell people that the emperor will make broadcast while he knows that the emperor is DEAD.

Because he might be following Schneizel now and Schneizel told him to keep it quite till Lelouch made his move.

13) why would Schnizel wait for a month without taking the thrown while he was so eager to take it while emperor was alive, and when he didnt any KoR except suzaka, in real world thinking, he will crown himself as emperor in just hours.

He needed lelouch to make his appearance before he did anything. He even said as much.

14) why would the BK help in subduing a rebellion ?!, why should they care ?!

Because they were about to make a deal with Schneizel? And because kaguya offered to go too?

15) how did lelouch and Suzaka escape that island while it was covered by all these knightmares, may be thats why the time line jumped one month forward

How hard is it to wait for people to leave?

Does that work?

[El_Lazy_Mexican]

Originally Posted by Traece

As for 'banging'... Well... Empress Kallen needs to mother herself some children.

Charles and Marriane Plot Round 2 anyone?

With Suzaku in place of V.V. killing Kallen

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by brandon279

9) the whole motto of Charles was "survival for fittest", so now he wants to creat the kind world?, talk about out of character.

He was telling the truth, but wanted to change that truth because he didn't like it.

Originally Posted by brandon279

10) how did lelouch geass the whole consciousness, that consciousness belongs to the whole humans, and there are humans immune to geass, like V.V, C.C, Charles, Suzaka, Villita, Germiah, lelouch himself ....etc, so how would he be able to geass it all, how can he geass without eye contact or with the target saying "yes" (anything along that word), it seemed to as bad plot.

He didn't so much as Geass it as spur it into action. Lelouch's Geass doesn't imprint big Geass symbols into people's eyes.

Originally Posted by brandon279

11) lelouch blown the entry so he can seal the emperor in, (not the emperor has code same as c.c), then why was c.c able to enter ?

or lelouch was just idiot, and blowing the door had no effects, then why Charles said "you have sealed the door", how would the door be sealed while everyone did just go in and out as they like.

She had the door to work with, he did not. Plus, they were gone for a month. Escaping was likely not an easy task.

Originally Posted by brandon279

12) why would Bismark cover for the emperor death, why would he tell people that the emperor will make broadcast while he knows that the emperor is DEAD.

Schneizel might have talked him into it, and its not like he had proof anyway. It's a timeskip. They'll cover the reasons next time.

Originally Posted by brandon279

13) why would Schnizel wait for a month without taking the thrown while he was so eager to take it while emperor was alive, and when he didnt any KoR except suzaka, in real world thinking, he will crown himself as emperor in just hours.

may they left the thrown empty because lelouch needed a travel to the capital, and that travel too him a month .

He had no claim to the throne. Odysseus is next in line. As for Lelouch, it may have taken him a month to escape, but reaching the capital wouldn't have taken him more than a day.

Originally Posted by brandon279

14) why would the BK help in subduing a rebellion ?!, why should they care ?!

Because Zero was there. Kaguya made the offer.

Originally Posted by brandon279

15) how did lelouch and Suzaka escape that island while it was covered by all these knightmares, may be thats why the time line jumped one month forward

They'll explain it next time probably.