Xbox One

[Dirty_Harry]

More about used games

http://www.gamespot.com/news/publish...-sales-6409463

[Urzu 7]

Something I wrote on another board...

---------------------------


I'm really hoping that Sony doesn't pull the same stuff MS will. There is some hope they won't because maybe they are really taking note of the huge backlash against MS. Maybe they are thinking "there are definitely ways we can create advantages for ourselves over MS (as in, don't go down the same path as MS and XBO)".

However, why it is a very real possibility that Sony will more or less pull the shit is that Sony might be too afraid not to follow Microsoft's lead. They don't wanna scare away the publishers, especially big ones like EA and Activision. They want to please them and kiss up to them. No doubt that publishers, especially the big ones, have been trying really hard to talk both MS and Sony into restrictive DRM that the publishers think will benefit them. And that is the thing, the publishers are probably wrong in this. Big restrictions on used games/trade-ins/lending games...might not pay off. I read some things about it. The gist of it is things like gamers will buy less new games (due to some reasons), and that a lot of gamers fund the purchase of new games by trading in/selling old games.

[Newprimus]

There's an insider rumor saying that Sony had a DRM solution in the works and was debating on whether to use it for months, but the recent xbox one fiasco convinced them to dump the idea.

EDIT: Sony might want to kiss up to publishers, but publishers like all big businesses, always follow where the money is. There's a good chance that if sony goes without drm, gamers will pick the ps4 over the xbox one en masse. If that happens, the publishers have no choice but to work with and publish games on the ps4.

[Destined_Fate]

Don't forget that Sony has a pretty strong worldwide presence while Microsoft is far stronger in the West while all but dead in the East in comparison. So they don't really have to bow to Western Devs and if the PS4 sells more than the XBox One than the Pubs will make games for them anyway.

[Urzu 7]

Originally Posted by 4Tran

From the looks of things, the push for Microsoft to impose all of these policies on the Xbox One comes from Microsoft itself, and not the publishers. I think that it all stems from Microsoft trying to reach non-gamers, and that a big key to that was to make the game-playing experience as accessible as possible. The idea was to make loading up a game as easy as saying "Xbox play Halo 15".

The problem is that to get that to work, you'd have to allow a game to play without putting a disc in the drive. And that brings up all sorts of piracy concerns; concerns that all of these policies are designed to deal with. The publishers don't really factor into Microsoft's decision until the very end - that's probably why there's such a Frankenstein's monster of unclear mechanisms and incomplete information.

I really doubt this. All these restrictions on the game discs you buy just so gamers can play a game by saying "XBox play Halo 15"? It is like turning off a lamp by blowing up a house.

I would say there is no doubt that publishers, especially big ones like EA and Activision, have been clear to MS and Sony that used game restrictions is something they want. They have been working with them to have restrictive DRM that benefits publishers (or so they think it will). Now Microsoft probably got on board with this because they were hoping "If we can please the publishers more than Sony, just think of all exclusives we'll nab, the timed exclusives, the better DLC content; the best developer support and a guarantee of XBox One being the lead platform". Think about it, if publishers overall favored one over the other (Sony or MS), all those things would line up. I think MS wanted to do the bidding of the publishers in the hopes that being subservient to their wishes would pay off for them tremendously.

[Chase]

Originally Posted by kenjiharima

YouTube

https://youtu.be/Y4kKvrA3S-Y

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

long rant

[saravis]

I have to wonder, if there's a "two use" policy on a game and a gamer installs that game and finds that its defective would a store be able to accept a return or even a replacement on the game? I'm guessing not, unless that store is buddy buddy with MS. In other words this "two use" policy doesn't just screw over used game sellers, it'll screw new game sellers by screwing with their return policy.

[Frailty]

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Micro...t-359264.shtml (Rumor has it that Microsoft's paying third party publishers to not show their ps4 games at E3)

oh how the might have fallen
to think that they'd stoop so low

well, it's not like this would affect the buyers to buy PS4. lol

[Vajra]

Originally Posted by Frailty

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Micro...t-359264.shtml (Rumor has it that Microsoft's paying third party publishers to not show their ps4 games at E3)

oh how the might have fallen
to think that they'd stoop so low

well, it's not like this would affect the buyers to buy PS4. lol

Doesn't surprise me. Microsoft overstepped its boundary by leaps and bounds and now they are reduced to attempt damage control (if you can call it that) by resorting to underhanded tactics. Microsoft knows that they screwed up big, and their only hope in hell now is to pray that the remaining fans leftover from the 360 base will be careless enough to buy into MS' anti-consumer oriented "entertainment" (because it is not video game oriented anymore) TV/skype/box/thing.

[kenjiharima]

Originally Posted by Chase

long rant

But with alot of substance and info.

[FlareKnight]

Originally Posted by kenjiharima

YouTube

https://youtu.be/Y4kKvrA3S-Y

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

A damn fine rant . I say the more noise people make about this the better.

[Destined_Fate]

http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertco...rtner=yahootix

Even Forbes seems iffy about the XBone One.

[kenjiharima]

AngryJoe

YouTube

https://youtu.be/ryB-hdtpQRw

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

[Urzu 7]

Originally Posted by Frailty

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Micro...t-359264.shtml (Rumor has it that Microsoft's paying third party publishers to not show their ps4 games at E3)

oh how the might have fallen
to think that they'd stoop so low

well, it's not like this would affect the buyers to buy PS4. lol

Fuck Microsoft, if this is true. Fuck Microsoft, regardless.

[Chase]

Microsoft Has Hired People To Make Positive Comments About Xbox One On Reddit, Contractor Says

Microsoft is doing something on Reddit that is a big no-no, according to a Redditor that goes by the name "mistysilver."
Representatives of Microsoft may be hanging out on the social news site voting up positive comments about the Xbox One, voting down negative comments and adding pro-Xbox comments of their own, Misty Silver says.
Misty Silver didn't reveal his/her real identity, except to say. "I work for a marketing firm in Redmond that has a contract with Microsoft. I can't say specifically which division, but suffice to say we are not involved with the Xbox."
The story goes: While at Microsoft for a meeting, Misty Silver saw and overheard some employees on Reddit. She looked at one of the employee's screens:
"I noticed he was mass-downvoting a ton of posts and comments, and he kept switching to other tabs to make posts and comments of his own. I couldn't make out exactly what he was posting, but I presumed he was doing RM (reputation management) and asked my boss about it later. According to my boss, MS have[sic] just brought in a huge sweep of SMM managers to handle reputation management for the Xbox One," Silver reported.
"Reputation management" is the term social media marketers use to "pose as happy customers" on social media sites. They upvote/downvote and make comments.
In the last year or so, Reddit has become a prime target for reputation management, Misty Silver says.
Reddit says its ok for people to submit their own info to Reddit within reason. But it's strictly against the rules to either "pretend to be someone else" or to "create mass downvote or upvote campaigns."
In extreme cases it can get an entire company completely banned from Reddit.
That's probably impossible with Microsoft. Legit Redditors are going to want to discuss the company and its products. But this kind of stuff still really irks Redditors. One of them even outed a Reddit account they thought belonged to a Microsoft marketer.
Obviously, we can't confirm this story. We asked Microsoft for comment on if they have people on their payroll using Reddit.
This is what Microsoft told us: "There is no coordinated or sanctioned effort by Microsoft employees, or anyone paid by Microsoft, to unduly influence Reddit or other online forums."

http://www.businessinsider.com/micro...omments-2013-6

[Destined_Fate]

I was just going to post that. >_>

Crazy stuff, huh? Is Microsoft really that desperate now?

[Urzu 7]

Originally Posted by Chase

Microsoft Has Hired People To Make Positive Comments About Xbox One On Reddit, Contractor Says



http://www.businessinsider.com/micro...omments-2013-6

They have also done it to other social networking sites and to major gaming forums, including neogaf. GAF moderators had to do a bunch of banning of new members because MS employees were joining and pretending to be gamers enthused about XBox One and were defending XBox One and everything bad about it.

Microsoft is so shitty. I can't get an XBox One after all this shit. The XBox One reveal and their disc based game restrictions and the forced Kinect requirements and all the PR blunders they made since then and things like paying publishers to not showcase PS4 games at E3. All of this massive train wreck. I just can't buy an XBox One.

Originally Posted by Destined_Fate

I was just going to post that. >_>

Crazy stuff, huh? Is Microsoft really that desperate now?

Really, what is much worse than that (and that is pretty bad) is the other thing posted on that thread page; about how MS might be paying publishers lots of money to not showcase PS4 games at E3.

[FlareKnight]

At this point I'll believe anything. Microsoft just seems to be going insane at this point. First with all this nonsense and now actually going around battling against the negative reputation they are getting. I really wouldn't be surprised if they are trying to pay publishers not to showcase PS4 games. Talk about falling hard and in a hurry.

[Endless Soul]

Originally Posted by Chase

Microsoft Has Hired People To Make Positive Comments About Xbox One On Reddit, Contractor Says



http://www.businessinsider.com/micro...omments-2013-6

Holy shit! I thought some of those comments I've read in other places were a bit too positive.

The more I read about XBONE, the more outraged I get, and I'm not even a console gamer! (I haven't bought a console since SEGA Genesis) But these latest shenanigans by Microsoft....ARGH!

Endless "Outraged" Soul

[4Tran]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Video game companies have occasionally done some questionable things from a consumer rights perspective. But they were either mild annoyances, or things you just shake your head at, or things that only affect a particular game or two.

This is much wider in scope, and larger in scale.

Like Vallen said, this isn't a background issue anymore. It's not like, say, same-day DLC.

No, this effects every aspect of the console, and the games you play on it. It is a dramatic shift.

While the Xbone's restrictions are more pervasive than anything before, Microsoft is only following on the footsteps of lots of other anti-consumer situations such as:

- The universal price increase to $60 for retail titles
- The same price for retail and digital titles
- Gamestop's terrible used games pricing
- Payment for Xbox Live Gold
- Red Ring of Death
- Pre-order DLC (especially retailer specific ones)
- Season Passes
- DLC to begin with
- Sony's poor PSN security & response to the hack
- Microsoft's poor Xbox live security & response to the FIFA hack

The list of issues that gamers have put up with is pretty darned long. I figured more of us would have shrugged, and went on to pick up a Xbone without complaint. And really, there's still a chance that it'll see good initial sales. But it's good to see a lot of push-back on this - maybe it'll lead to meaningful chance in the industry.

Originally Posted by Urzu 7

However, why it is a very real possibility that Sony will more or less pull the shit is that Sony might be too afraid not to follow Microsoft's lead.

The publishers themselves seem to be scared by the response Microsoft has received - I think that they'll let MS eat all of the blame. Sony should have a pretty clear road to a less restrictive PS4. Heck, I don't think that Microsoft themselves expected such universal condemnation; but it's too late to change course without a complete redesign. The Xbone may well go down to being one of the most poorly designed major console ever.

Originally Posted by Urzu 7

I really doubt this. All these restrictions on the game discs you buy just so gamers can play a game by saying "XBox play Halo 15"? It is like turning off a lamp by blowing up a house.

That's precisely it. The idea is to garner as big a non-gamer audience as possible, and using voice commands to start up a new game as easy as it is to change the channel could make the Xbone seemed like the next Wiimote or iPad. The problem is that Microsoft likely committed to that idea from the very get go, and everything else about the Xbone was built around this functionality. Almost every aspect of the console seems to be wedded to Kinect. And that's probably because its main goal is to push the functionality of Kinect, and differentiate it from all its competitors. These competitors being as much Apple and Google as it is Sony.

Originally Posted by Urzu 7

I would say there is no doubt that publishers, especially big ones like EA and Activision, have been clear to MS and Sony that used game restrictions is something they want. They have been working with them to have restrictive DRM that benefits publishers (or so they think it will). Now Microsoft probably got on board with this because they were hoping "If we can please the publishers more than Sony, just think of all exclusives we'll nab, the timed exclusives, the better DLC content; the best developer support and a guarantee of XBox One being the lead platform". Think about it, if publishers overall favored one over the other (Sony or MS), all those things would line up. I think MS wanted to do the bidding of the publishers in the hopes that being subservient to their wishes would pay off for them tremendously.

Publishers aren't as powerful as console manufacturers, so it's unlikely for the former to push the latter around. They're certainly not going to risk antagonizing a business partner that they make ~40% of their revenues from. A threat to strongly support one company over the other isn't something that the weaker party would try to pull off. Any closer relationships wouldn't be built until the consoles launch in case they end up backing the wrong horse.

Originally Posted by Destined_Fate

I was just going to post that. >_>

Crazy stuff, huh? Is Microsoft really that desperate now?

Sadly, the article isn't news. Most major companies have been employing shills for about a decade now.

Originally Posted by FlareKnight

At this point I'll believe anything. Microsoft just seems to be going insane at this point. First with all this nonsense and now actually going around battling against the negative reputation they are getting. I really wouldn't be surprised if they are trying to pay publishers not to showcase PS4 games. Talk about falling hard and in a hurry.

Microsoft is reeling right now. All of their business partners except for Gamestop have abandoned them, they've lost all of the news outlets, and every message they've relayed has made things worse. Every dollar they've spent on communication has gone towards improving Sony's image for crying out loud! I think that Microsoft has done a worse job controlling the message than freaking BP after the Gulf of Mexico spill!