2006-02-14, 00:27 | Link #82 |
Nyaaan~~
Join Date: Feb 2006
Age: 40
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Well, I posted this elsewhere when confronted with my opinions about Rin, so here it is again!
- Mm.. The best I can say is, that I don't think its fair that people compare Rin from the anime to the "Rin" in the game, since inactuality, there really isn't a "Rin" in the game at all.. just a psuedo "Rin" that we take control of.. As for all the protests that he was indecisive about love, they addressed that at the beginning of the anime, when Midoriba said: "What are you gonna do, unofficially declare that you want everyone to stay together? No one will accept that kind of irresponsible attitude.." - What Midoriba said is true. But it is also very wrong. All of these girls loved Rin. Does that mean he has a responsibility to all of them? Not at all. A person can only live for their own happiness, if they push him for an answer, then he should give one, but a person only has so much power.. Does that mean Sia should've kept chasing Rin on? Maybe, but the problem with her was she was never true to herself, maybe her two selves.. but nonetheless.. He did his best to try to make everyone happy, I like him alot more than other male lead characters, unlike them, he's not a wimp.. In the end, no apologies needed to be made.. he had no obligation to love anyone but the one whom he chose to love. And he loved Asa-sempai, more than anything, more than his own life, more than the pain that he would bring upon himself and all the girls he would have to leave behind. |
2006-02-14, 01:00 | Link #83 |
Obey the Darkly Cute ...
Author
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ...
Age: 66
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I think most people would have more okay with Rin if the last few episodes had been more effectively written. The character motivations were just kind of broken WHEN compared to the character behaviors established earlier in the series. My comment was it was as if Rin and Asa had had their brains extracted and replaced with oatmeal.... just poor writing made more obvious by the really strong writing during the Kaede arc (until they had her just whimper off under the bridge with Asa).
Asa was a spiffy character and I'm surprised more Asa fans aren't pissed by the way the writers treated her motivations for the choices she made. Rin started the series off being highly articulate and witty... as the series progressed, it seemed like sometimes his main dialog was to utter the name of whatever female was in the area. Then came his and Asa's neglect of Kaede during her arc, a friend they had both cared for for so long... *this* was potentially good Shakespearean drama (sometimes good people do bad things) but then you could hear the brakes squealing as they ended Kaede's arc.... I congratulate the VAs for Asa and Kaede for doing reasonably well with their scene with Asa admitting she was a monster for being the "other woman" while Kaede just collapsed. Then Asa's reasoning for not using magic just reeked lameness .. this was not the Asa they had developed "I won't use magic and die so I won't have to see my mother cry"??????? And everyone telling Rin - "you're the only one who can save Asa" ... we'll hope they meant talk some sense into her because otherwise Kareha and Ama were suggesting he suicide to get Asa's attention. I can think of 10 lines of dialog and no change to animation that would have fixed virtually all these problems -- so I have to blame writer ineptitude. The last ep last half ...... I sense some vain attempt to re-establish a "status quo" for future OVAs ... to chase Rin more???? Unless Kareha can convince Asa that polygamy is cool ... it really is unfair to all the characters.
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2006-02-14, 07:17 | Link #84 | |||
Nyaaan~~
Join Date: Feb 2006
Age: 40
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If you analyse every single one of the characters, they each present dramatic character flaws and in fact, all of them act in ways that contradict what their intentions are seemingly trying to accomplish. And to make Asa not completely perfect, which she would be otherwise, they gave her a character flaw. A traumatic incident that has been burned into her psyche. I mean, Kaede is in utter denial about her own situation, and utters "I live for X" as a mantra. Sia has multiple personalities in her body, which she should really go to a psych for or take some meds. And Nerine doesn't even actually know Rin, and pretended to be someone she's not. All flawed individuals, and that is what makes them "human" Quote:
A: Sorry Rin, love ya lots, always been there for you in the background, always picked you up when you needed it and pushed you to move forward.. but.. I can't be with you R: Why, why.. I finally realize and finally chose by myself.. the person I love more than anything, and want to be with more than anyone.. I'm being true to myself A: Well.. cause I know Kaede loves you, I can't get into the middle of that.. R: Wait a minute.. what am I? A potato.. You can't just pass me onto someone, you can't make me love someone else.. And so on and so forth in perpetuity, the rest of the series might as well have been changed to revolve around that conflict, and eventually have Kaede withdraw due to interference, which is if I recall some other love drama plots go. As for Kaede, if you watch her through the first few episodes, appears to depict the classic love interest IE. Aoi from Ai Yori Aoishi, but the anime plows a hole right through it. Living your life for someone else is impossible. And as all flawed structures eventually do, she crumbles. This theme about the impossibility of living for others happiness appears again and again, thrust into Rin's face when Kaede goes berserk. As the series progressed, the way the writers wrote her, it was obvious Kaede was an unstable human being reeking of denial and incapable of a close personal relationship. Now I don't say this to anger anyone, but to bring this back on topic is it not unfair to resent a character for acting "normally" and "selfishly" as all humans do, because they upset a character that is written to be emotionally unbalanced? Quote:
And also, as a simple creative writing statement, there really wouldn't have been any backstory for Asa, if it played out like this: A: "I'm gonna die if I don't use magic." R: "So use it! For me! I can't live without you!" and she simply went: "Oh, okay. *ZAPO!*" As for criticizing the rest of the cast about telling Rin to save her.. it's the same as telling him to "reach" her, as she (her heart) is untouchable to the rest of them. Not too many people complained when Rin went to see Rimu-chan, even though realistically she could've died the second she saw him due to emotional overload. And finally.. As for the last episode, yes, the writers did something that was simply akin to fanservice. Blame the writers but it has nothing to do with Rin, in fact he acts all awkward when Kaede says Asa gave her permission to continue loving him. PS: As for the last episode being "unfair" to the remaining single female cast.. Well, uhh.. Rin has no obligation to return feelings to anyone. If they choose to continue loving him, then they can do so. He made it clear when he made his choice to be with Asa. His responsibility is finished. If there's anyone to blame, blame the girls themselves for not being able to move on. But doing so, would simply be blaming them for being too human.. PPS: I initially intended to give my 2 cents, but it seems like I have thrown a gold brick into the mix instead. If Vexx wants to discuss it more, or anyone else for this matter, feel free to PM me, I will likely not respond at length again due to fear of spamming the board |
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2006-02-14, 07:34 | Link #85 |
Kozukuri Shimasho
Join Date: Dec 2005
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well ... IMO Kareha allready pretty much convinced her ... in ep 22 (i think it was ... where Kareha let out that it was Rin she loved as well) Asa was like "no way ... never going to happen" ... whereas in the end of ep 24 she is like "hmm ... maybe it shouldn't be a no-no anyway"
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2006-02-14, 08:51 | Link #86 | ||
I desire Tomorrow!
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: As far away from reality as possible
Age: 41
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Second, you don't do much by calling a character unstable. Since you've registerd all characters flaws as having the same weight (apparently), I can call Asa equally mentally unstable, no? And if you say that Asa's flaw is the least of evils, I say that her flaw is too weak in its core to even be considered realistic. For why I blame Rin and Asa (and I can do it rightly so) for acting like they did towards Kaede ("normally" and selfishly" as all humans do), you are free to re-read the above post. For why I blame Rin for everything and not the girls, you are free to re-read the above post. I never said anywhere that his actions were not believable or realistic. I said that he is selfish, inconsiderate, thick as brick, a liar, a hypocrite, hiding behind his self-imposed martyrdom and his self-delusion that he is nice to everyone and will help everyone, when in reality he helps just himself every time. About the magic part, climax-wise, it had to have SOME sort of drama, but as my friend, Vexx said, the reasoning behind Asa's denial to use magic was weak, her "flaw", as you call it, was not deeply rooted or of the same psychological magnitude as Kaede's was and it failed miserably against this too-apparent-to-be-ignored truth : If indeed Ama would be sad if Asa used magic, Ama would be also sad if Asa died, so in essence, Ama would have cried no matter the outcome. Even in Asa's head, that should be fairly obvious. So, let's say that she feels so guilty that she willingly denies to use magic to save her life because she believes she did something horrible to Ama. If her guilt were so great, shouldn't she be mad at Rin for forcing her to use magic? He denied her the chance to be free from this huge guilt of hers by choosing death, and now she's safe and she won't die, so he has effectively magnified her guilt. If this WERE Asa's irrational flaw, she should have jumped off the cliff the next minute. The fact that EVERYTHING is ok after Asa saves Rin damns her "flaw" as being superficial and weak, because the REASON for its appearance is STILL THERE, and is weighs heavier now that she is no longer in danger. I believe that's all, yet again.
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2006-02-14, 11:39 | Link #87 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
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I think that the phrase "self-imposed martyrdom" is far more applicable to Kaede than to Rin. Or, for that matter, to Nerine in the first half of the series before the truth about Lycoris came out. And as for "he helps just himself every time", I think that the current version of Primula - the one who has emotions and isn't back in Makai being experimented upon - might disagree with you. |
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2006-02-14, 11:59 | Link #88 | |
I desire Tomorrow!
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: As far away from reality as possible
Age: 41
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I don't understand the comment about Nerine. I will need some clarification. The current version of Primula is a product of Asa, Lycoris and Kaede. Lycoris for telling Primula about Rin and everything that followed, Asa for pushing Rin to go and get Primula back when he himself sent her there (even if the cause was right) and Kaede for always tending to her as if she were her daughter. Rin is just, what, her love interest? Which is still mainly Lycoris' influence on Primula. The only good thing Rin did on his own was get her a nekodoll. Other than that, he did nothing good for any of the girls (excluding Asa). Primula escaping from Makai is ASA'S victory (when she was still a lovable character) and Primula gaining emotions and a family was KAEDE'S victory. Nothing regarding Primula is Rin's to claim.
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2006-02-14, 15:34 | Link #89 | |
Senior Member
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Regarding my inclusion of Nerine, the entire reason she came to the human realm to be with Rin in the first place was because of the debt she felt that she owed to Lycoris. She decided that because of that debt she would put aside her own dreams so that she could try to make Lycoris' dream come true in her stead. Was that a noble thing to do? I think so. But Nerine was not compelled to do this by another person or an external force; the choice was entirely hers to make. Thus the link with Kaede and "self-imposed martyrdom". Nerine and Kaede both made their choices of their own free will. And I am no more damning Nerine for it than I was Kaede. As for nothing about Primula being Rin's to claim, I suggest you go back and watch episode #15 again. Rin was the one that Primula responded to, much to the amazement of the two kings and the head researcher. He broke the promise he made to stand aside and let them reset Primula's emotions immediately if she lost control (note that I never tried to refute your earlier statement calling Rin a "liar"). He then risked his life (and everyone else's too - note that I am not arguing that he shows wisdom here) to keep reaching out to her. And afterward, it was Rin who confronted the head researcher when he wanted to keep Primula in the lab for experimentation. He was the one who immediately cut the man off and said he was taking Primula home. Nerine, Sia and Kaede then moved in behind Rin to show the two kings that they supported him. So yes, if for no other reason than that I do think that Rin deserves a little credit for the Primula we see in the second half of episode #24. |
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2006-02-14, 16:19 | Link #90 |
Obey the Darkly Cute ...
Author
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ...
Age: 66
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There are a lot of words up there from willx ... but the fundamental problem fo me is that Asa's motivation for not using magic was just paper thin and, I believe, the result of massively poor writing. Compared with, say, Sia, Nerine's or Kaede's better defined motivations it looked like they'd brought in a hack to write the most important arc of the story.
I'm not as extreme about Rin as npal is but if you compare Rin's dialog in the first half of the series to the last half, there's a serious degradation ... also pointing to poor writing skills .... You have to understand there isn't just one writer involved in a series. There are a team of writers under an overall story arc manager. Small writer groups get assigned a set of episodes ... in this case (and this has gotten press in Japan), the Kaede arc got handed to a rather skillful writer who took the story in a lot more powerful direction (some miscommunications between him and the manager). The brakes applied in ep 21 are pretty clear. Whomever got assigned the arc of ep 22-end was not a premier writer.... don't get me wrong, I *like* Asa, but her "character flaw" was poorly implemented. You can't get past how stupid "I won't use magic because my mother cried" but I guess its alright if I die because I won't have to see my mother cry again ... sounds. Thats so "not-Asa" as to be ludicrous. The other girl's flaws were all compatible with their personalities. Furu explained them adequately so I won't be redundant. A more "Asa-like" flaw would have been her refusing to use magic because of some incident where she tried to use it once as a young child to help her mother and almost killed her mother because she couldn't control it. As a result, she's in total denial about having any demon roots and refuses to even admit she's a magic bomb. That would require zero change to animation.. just new dialog. I think Asa and Rin's neglect of Kaede in their hot-puppy-love could have made for very powerful story telling (and did for a while) but having the buildup whimper off into nothingness under the bridge and the interactions between Rin, Kaede, and Asa afterwards really undermined the whole arc and frankly left Kaede with no closure. Plus... I find the *level* of neglect pretty extreme for Asa (I can see why Rin might get overfocused and forget to mitigate Kaede's feelings... lots of baggage between them ... but I found it out-of-character for Asa not to even be concerned about Kaede). And the last half of the last ep.... was so disconnected from all the other arcs I think the writers might have been better off leaving the whole series as a lighthearted comedy. The most important thing writers must do is to be true to their characters once they define them. Characters can evolve but the changes must have continuity or rationale the reader can follow, or the "suspension of disbelief" required for fiction is broken. Writing 101.
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Last edited by Vexx; 2006-02-14 at 16:32. |
2006-02-14, 16:47 | Link #91 |
I desire Tomorrow!
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: As far away from reality as possible
Age: 41
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OK, let's see.
About the first part : I think it's in one's best interests, if he feels he has wronged someone to try everything in his power and try to make up for it. Plus, if we go too far, that core defining trait of Rin's forced Kaede into a certain character development. I can as well take all responsibility for her actions and her character development by putting the blame on Rin. Rin was the one to shape Kaede's character the way he did, and if Kaede ever did something wrong, that's Rin's fault. The whole issue was forced on Kaede by Rin's actions. Then, of course, it comes down to the question : "Who is responsible, the one who acts or the one who reacts?" And it is my belief that the one who acts should be held responsible for the reaction he causes. If people think otherwise, they can as well condemn their children whenever they fail. I can understand Nerine's issue, as you've put it. The only difference I see is the following : I don't think Nerine thinks any less of Lycoris than before. It is my belief that Nerine really liked Lycoris and chose to make Lycoris' dreams come true instead of her own. Meaning that, Nerine doesn't seem to despise Lycoris' for the whole Rin deal, even if it she may suffer for that. On the other hand, Rin did what he did, suffered for it, and when his former torturer became his caretaker, he didn't credit her. Ever. And we have the total negligence near the end of the series, which makes me believe that Rin never forgave Kaede for what she did, even if he was the one to bring this whole thing on his head. The crap that Rin tells Kaede in ep 21 is as farfetched as it can be. To me, that's a fundamental difference between Nerine and Rin. Rin seems to think that what he done is enough, so he is pleased with how he handled the situation and owes Kaede nothing (or maybe her rightful share of misery for what he did to him). At least, that's what I get from his attitude towards her. It's like he just puts up with her, which nullifies whatever noble he may have done (which is doubtful anyway). About ep 15, my memory is still good, I'm still young, I can recall what happened. And I still support my argument that in reality it was Asa who saves Primula, in essence, using Rin's influence, which is based on Lycoris, as a handy tool to pull that. It was Asa who made Rin make up his mind, it was Asa who made Rin break his promise and risk his life for Primula. And in the end, Lycoris/Nerine saved the day by using her power. The way I see Rin in the particular situation is in the form of a tool. It could have been ANYONE else, as long as i) Lycoris told Primula about X and ii) X sent Primula to be cured and iii) Asa managed to make X go get Primula back. Put whoever who want in that equation, the result is the same. X (Rin), in this case, is just a TOOL in the hands of a wiser individual, that was Asa (before episode 19). The situation would have been completely different if X had decided to get Primula without Asa's intervention OR chose to keep Primula at home in the first place. And this sticks again to my belief that it's the one that acts that must be held responsible for the outcome, good or bad. Of course, if someone thinks that the reaction is the important part, then of course Rin is such a nice individual...But I still think it was one of Asa's finest moments. Too bad they corrupted her character afterwards. Edit : Oh yeah, and I agree with the above post. Mine took to long to write so I didn't see the above.
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2006-02-14, 18:19 | Link #92 | |||
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And I have to go pick up my kids from school, so that is probably it for today. |
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2006-02-14, 18:52 | Link #93 | |
I desire Tomorrow!
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: As far away from reality as possible
Age: 41
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2: Well, I was comparing them. Nerine's and Kaede's comparison don't match that well, for reasons I've detailed. Rin was free to decide, even more free than Nerine. Kaede had severe guilt issues, Nerine had probably guilt issues to regarding Lycoris' death but Rin... Rin had no guilt for anything, he was totally free to do whatever he wanted. If there's anyone that can be blame wholeheartedly for his actions, it's Rin. 3: Well, you know... Rin can LIE (see Kaede). Did he ever keep a promise? His promises are as empty as his head. He just promised that so he would be allowed to see Primula. After all, Asa was pretty clear to me, she was telling him to go get her back. Rin just used his innate lying ability to that end. And of course, he defended that end. After all, Asa was pretty convincing. Why should I credit Rin for Primula's rescue then? No reason at all. And there's no evidence that can support that Rin didn't lie in this situation. After all, he lied for a very serious matter in the past to attain a goal (keep Kaede alive or whatever). He just did it again.
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2006-02-15, 00:01 | Link #95 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
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I agree that Rin is very generic, and suffers from the usual male harem lead symptoms -
*confused or oblivious about things going on around him until after something big happens. *has girls popping out of nowhere, he met during childhood *often overlooks the female desperately most in love with him, right under his nose. *indecisive but when he does finally make a choice, it only affects the currect situation (short term, very vague future) but i've only seen a couple harem and harem'ish type series (including Elfen Lied, Mahoraba, Ai Yori Oshi). they are most evident in those Overall rin is a good guy. Cares about everyone, is friendly, and well balanced. as for Rin picking Asa... I really dont believe in a relationship based on puppylove & playfulness. Will & devotion is so much more valuable, which is which I want to kick Rin in the mouth for turning away Kaede |
2006-02-15, 14:46 | Link #96 | ||
Nyaaan~~
Join Date: Feb 2006
Age: 40
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1. A theory that ALWAYS applies, is not a theory at all. It lacks any reasonable value as it is not open to being disproved. It can always be possible to alter auxilary hypotheses to make the main hypothesis true. See Popper and critiques by the logical positivists. 2. As for individuals not being responsible for their actions, see Kantz's theory of justice. To take away an individual's "responsibility" for their actions, is to take away a person's free will. If a dog does something bad, you "train" it to do otherwise, because it is not human, it is something sub-human, it is a creature of pure habit. 3. As for your specific example, firstly, you altered Furundanuki's scenario into one where the person is considered a lunatic. Which suggests they are mentally unstable and are afflicted by some sort of psychosis and are unable to control their actions, then you imply that someone caused this to occur on them. Okay.. Firstly, you don't "make" lunatics. Secondly, your example about children is flawed due to the nature of children's mental developmental stages. Going back to a Kantz theory, for example, if a man was beaten as a child then as he becomes an adult, goes on a killing spree, is he completely held to be unresponsible for his actions period? Think carefully on that answer and your own views on free-will and human nature. Quote:
This is the problem with absolutes, and this is the problem I stated earlier with your "belief" -- A belief is not something that is necessarily based upon logic. I can give you any example that will contradict your "action/reaction" theory, and you will simply twist it and add onto it to make your theory true. |
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2006-02-15, 16:51 | Link #97 | |
Daemon Mortis
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Btw Rin sux...recycled male lead...nuttin too special about him... Last edited by Crimen Scythe; 2006-02-15 at 17:57. |
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2006-02-15, 17:26 | Link #98 | |||||
I desire Tomorrow!
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: As far away from reality as possible
Age: 41
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Ok, let's call him normal if you like. That doesn't change the fact that the responsibility action comes from the attacking person's background and neither from the attacking person himself nor from Furundanuki. Instead of taking one route to search for that action, you take another, how's that wrong? I hate to break it to you but you do create mentally unstable individuals. Most of them are not like that from birth, they have a certain psychological profile that makes it easier for specific events to influence and change their behavior. That's why SOME people get major depression and others don't. But just because others don't doesn't me it's the former people's fault that they suffer from depression. About the flawed example, it's only flawed because you do not choose to acknowledge that the adult aggressive person is no more free from his background than the children are free from their developmental stages. To me, they are the same and should the blame should be placed elsewhere. It is your right to think otherwise. PLUS, when I was talking about children, I wasn't actually referring to 5 yr olds only. If your children are 30, aren't they still your children? Weren't you responsible for their upbringing? Quote:
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And to support my human nature counterargument, I will use something of my post above. A human errs. The first step is to actually SPOT the mistake by witnessing its reaction/result/outcome which must stimulate further analysis (meaning either the human himself OR someone else tells him that this is a indeed an error). Next, the human must trace the chain of actions back to the source. The chain of actions obviously passes through him at some point. In moving up the chain of actions he can also find answers for his own self. Once he finds an accceptable action to hold responsible for the chain, a human NOW has the free will to a) alter the chain, e.g. if his father abused him and that drove him eventually to error X, he will alter the chain by not abusing his child and b) if he can, correct the error. And to return to my human nature counterargument, yes, to start the action/reaction search a human must have understood that a) he DOES err and b) Error is not his right. The other part of free will is whether someone WANTS to go through the above process, even if someone else informs him of his error. And yes, according to this post, someone who doesn't go through this process even when he is informed is a slave to his chain of action and his free will is a nice fairytale. And now, I'm awaiting the counterarguments of course.
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2006-02-17, 07:15 | Link #99 | |||
Nyaaan~~
Join Date: Feb 2006
Age: 40
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Hm, after reading over my preceeding response and your post carefully, as careful can be due to what time it is over here, and my lack of sleep.. I have come to realize that this is an argument stemming from our fundamental beliefs of human nature, society and what is humanity & free-will. Since we cannot agree on a set of premises, then arguing the details is rather meaningless.
In the end, we can only agree to disagree, and then place our beliefs before the judge that is society, and those which are deemed more acceptable or appropriate will be deemed "more correct" So, as I state again a bit further on, despite probably mounting fallacies within my statements, and increasing incomprehensibility this shall be my last post about this matter! I shall enjoy the sighs of relief henceforth! Quote:
Now, my query is what is the difference between Rin's humanity that you can criticize and Kaede's humanity that doesn't exist. More to the point, since you've stated that Kaede has no free-will and is not responsible for her actions, which is what makes Rin responsible for her actions, then _what_ is Kaede really? What if anything has she actually been doing for the past 8 years or so? Maybe I'm confused, but it seems that you're saying that she had no free-will until episode 19 or so in the series when she blinked and said: "Hey, I've been a bit delusional.." So what happens with the chain when she realizes that and wants to make changes, your theory doesn't seem to allow for her to be retroactively responsible for her actions..? And, I had typed something that may've angered people, so I deleted it, but.. Between the first episode and the 18th, when Kaede lacked free-will, and was even by npal's own statements, lacking of what I identify to be humanity.. what is the solution? Rehabilitation? Should she have been somehow removed out of society after blame was placed on Rin for turning her into this being? Quote:
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If a person willfully chooses to rob a store, and believes that he is entitled to a share of society's wealth, as he believes society has certain particular responsibilities to the underprivledged. Regardless of whether it is or not, he believes it to be. Therefore, he "errs", but does not see it/believes he is entitled to it. Therefore he has no free-will. Therefore, no responsibility falls upon him for robbing the store. Perhaps this is exactly what you were trying to point out, but I fail to accept the validity of a statement that suggests to me that anyone that believes or accepts principles outside of society's generally accepted ones, laws or precedents, must always lack free will. Furthermore, perhaps it is due to my lack of imagination or maybe it's 4:10am in the morning, but according to your theory, I am unable to come up with an example where a person willfully commits a "wrong" deed, lacks remorse and is deemed to have free-will and therefore responsibility for their deed. |
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2006-02-17, 08:17 | Link #100 | |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Age: 37
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Still going npal ^^ Well I can't be bother reading anymore arguments, but I sure your having a hell of a time ^^ to bad that this thread is the active one though the Kill Kill Rin!!! Club!!! isn't active anymore, the post difference is still big
Well I started watching a few harem (non ero-game based) anime the other day, since I've been a little disspointed in alot of other anime that I thought would be good this season or I've lost interest in other shows (which happens often ^^;; ), so I thought why not try a few harem shows out, they most likey are going to be crap but mabye a little interesting in some ways and so if you want to see an different type male harem lead with a interesting personality watch Kage Kara Mamoru its hilarious, banana banana banana banana banana banana banana well he looks kinda crappy with the glasses on but, other then that is a nice change. -> Its not the best show but so far I like it ^^ Quote:
Last edited by evil-samurai; 2006-02-17 at 10:12. |
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