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bio9205 · 2012-08-25, 20:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by GN0010 Nosferatu

So Gundam wiki has an article on a new EXA-LOG Vagan MS. Not sure where that info came from, but it appears that part of it is from the AGE PSP game.

http://gundam.wikia.com/wiki/Wiegel

Was it that Khronos-like MS that Flit encountered in his Razor? I remember seeing some new Vagan MS from the anime clips of the PSP game, and Flit muttered "That's a X-Rounder..." or something.

GN0010 Nosferatu · 2012-08-25, 21:14

Yep, same one.

monster · 2012-10-08, 13:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by AHT

*1.7%(*2.9%) 07/22 (Sun) 5:00pm-5:30pm TBS Gundam AGE
*2.0%(*1.7%) 07/29 (Sun) 5:00pm-5:30pm TBS Gundam AGE
*1.6%(*2.0%) 08/05 (Sun) 5:00pm-5:30pm TBS Gundam AGE
*2.5%(*1.6%) 08/19 (Sun) 5:00pm-5:30pm TBS Gundam AGE
*1.5%(*2.5%) 08/26 (Sun) 5:00pm-5:30pm TBS Gundam AGE
*3.5%(*1.5%) 09/02 (Sun) 5:00pm-5:30pm TBS Gundam AGE
*2.3%(*3.5%) 09/09 (Sun) 5:00pm-5:30pm TBS Gundam AGE
*2.9%(*2.3%) 09/16 (Sun) 5:00pm-5:30pm TBS Gundam AGE
*1.4%(*2.9%) 09/23 (Sun) 5:00pm-5:30pm TBS Gundam AGE (End)

世帯個人 KID TEN　M1　M2　M3　F1　F2　F3
*2.56　*1.14　*1.01　*0.95　*2.33　*2.06　*0.72　*0.85　*1 .17　*0.75 　2011　機動戦士ガンダムAGE
*3.22　*1.44　*0.97　*1.15　*2.69　*2.85　*0.88　*1.04　*1 .31　*1.08 　2011　機動戦士ガンダムAGE フリット編（01-15）
*2.33　*1.00　*0.85　*0.83　*2.03　*1.78　*0.68　*0.72　*1 .10　*0.63 　2012　機動戦士ガンダムAGE アセム編.（16-28）
*2.25　*1.01　*1.07　*0.92　*1.66　*1.76　*0.60　*0.81　*1 .30　*0.63 　2012　機動戦士ガンダムAGE キオ編　 .（29-39）
*2.23　*1.04　*1.23　*0.84　*2.90　*1.56　*0.65　*0.77　*0 .90　*0.56 　2012　機動戦士ガンダムAGE 三世代編（40-49）

40話　*2.9 *1.3 *1.6 *0.9 *4.9 *2.0 *0.4 *3.1 *0.6 *0.1　07/15 TBS 17:00-17:30
41話　*1.7 *0.8 *1.1 *0.1 *1.2 *1.4 *0.2 *0.7 *1.0 *0.9　07/22 TBS 17:00-17:30
42話　*2.0 *0.7 *0.0 *0.0 *2.6 *1.3 *0.3 *0.7 *0.5 *0.8　07/29 TBS 17:00-17:30
43話　*1.6 *0.6 *0.1 *0.3 *2.6 *1.5 *0.2 *0.0 *0.9 *0.2　08/05 TBS 17:30-18:00
44話　*2.5 *1.4 *1.8 *0.7 *1.2 *2.8 *1.3 *0.4 *0.9 *1.5　08/19 TBS 17:00-17:30
45話　*1.5 *0.7 *0.0 *0.8 *2.5 *0.3 *1.1 *0.5 *0.1 *0.6　08/26 TBS 17:00-17:30
46話　*3.5 *1.7 *2.2 *2.6 *5.9 *1.6 *0.9 *0.2 *2.4 *0.5　09/02 TBS 17:00-17:30
47話　*2.3 *1.0 *1.4 *0.7 *2.6 *1.1 *0.8 *0.8 *1.2 *0.4　09/09 TBS 17:00-17:30
48話　*2.9 *1.5 *3.7 *1.4 *3.0 *2.5 *0.9 *0.7 *1.4 *0.4　09/16 TBS 17:30-18:00
49話　*1.4 *0.7 *0.4 *0.9 *2.5 *1.1 *0.4 *0.6 *0.0 *0.2　09/23 TBS 17:00-17:30

So, apparently AGE has the lowest overall TV series rating yet, replacing X.

On the bright side, this makes me even more interested in seeing what the next Gundam TV series will look like as a response to AGE's low rating, whether they will try something new again or take a more conservative approach.

janipani · 2012-10-08, 13:33

Was the next show conservative or not, that doesn't help if story and characters aren't deep enough. AGE's biggest problem wasn't the idea it was the way it was executed. It's was too mainstream and too light for hardcore fans.

Rising Dragon · 2012-10-08, 13:35

Gundam can't keep relying on hardcore fans though, it'll wither if they do--they'll need to get new fans somewhere if they want to keep using the name to make money. Add in how damn unpleasable the fanbase has gotten, it's a wonder that SEED did as well as it did in the first place, and little wonder why AGE didn't.

monster · 2012-10-08, 13:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by janipani

Was the next show conservative or not, that doesn't help if story and characters aren't deep enough. AGE's biggest problem wasn't the idea it was the way it was executed. It's was too mainstream and too light for hardcore fans.

I was under the impression they wanted to go mainstream.

janipani · 2012-10-08, 13:40

^ That is why they fail.

monster · 2012-10-08, 13:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by janipani

^ That is why they fail.

They failed at gaining mainstream success by being too mainstream?

brightman · 2012-10-08, 13:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by monster

They failed at gaining mainstream success by being too mainstream?

Appealing to the lowest common denominator doesn't necessarily generate mainstream success. Focus on one demographic from a creative standpoint and let the marketing bring in other audiences instead of deliberately trying to appeal to everybody with the show at the same time and sacrificing quality, which turns everybody off.

monster · 2012-10-08, 14:01

Ah, well, the early marketing certainly wasn't received too well. (Of course, this is based only on my limited exposure of the response here at AnimeSuki.)

Obelisk ze Tormentor · 2012-10-08, 14:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by monster

They failed at gaining mainstream success by being too mainstream?

No. I think they failed at gaining mainstream success by being poorly written & poorly executed

.

wingdarkness · 2012-10-08, 16:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Gundam can't keep relying on hardcore fans though, it'll wither if they do--they'll need to get new fans somewhere if they want to keep using the name to make money...

I don’t know, isn’t it the hardcores that have helped make Unicorn a smash and Gundam’s current cash cow?

I mean how did I find Gundam? I didn’t start off a hardcore until I watch a couple of series, series that existed way before my interest level was created…You just gotta do something good and the people will come…

In all seriousness we’ve had 4 straight AU’s in a row with 1 being a smash (SEED), 1 being a critical and commercial moderate hit (GundamOO) and the other 2 falling somewhere between botched open-heart surgery on film and calamitous trainwreck (Granted GSD’s commercial success made the critical problems more acceptable than AGE which has been panned critically and commercially)…So with this I say maybe IT IS TIME to cater to the hardcores, and make something that’s truly in the mole of UC Gundam (That doesn't take 5 years to air like Unicorn ><) and bet your chips on that? Make it more stylish or whatever, aslong as the script and character developments are on-point I think you got a chance at aleast more interest than OO which was basically an above bar show…

UC has a lot of gaps and good content that can be leveled off (Hello Gaia Gear^^)…10 years ago it would have been true to say they’re exhausting UC, but now you’ve pretty much destroyed all of the universes from the AU worlds with no room to expand them based on how Bandai went about closing these tales. UC, despite the throat-choking from each side, is a proven winner, and maybe it’s time to give those who’ve stuck with and cherished Gundam the most what they want….Real recognize Real...

Personally I’d love to see S. Watanabe (Cowboy Bebop, SamCham), do a Gundam series with the same artistic bend found in the recent Mina Fujiko Lupin series…Something that can capture new and old, but whatever, it’s time to stop treating the UC as the bastard child after giving birth to atleast 2 worthless kids…It’s funny, but because they can’t escape the tropes of the UC, it is the AU’s that are ironically becoming stale in it’s representation of Gundam (Certainly in 3 of the 4 shows)…

monster · 2012-10-08, 17:23

Taken from Mecha Talk:

Quote:

Originally Posted by DuelGundam2099

http://randal.blog91.fc2.com/blog-entry-2014.html

Quote:

Interview with Hino from Newtype November 2012

-Now that the show is over, tell us what you feel about it.
Hino: Well, honestly I think we could've used more episodes. For example it would've been nice if there were say another ten episodes for Asem's school part. In the project phase we were originally going to broadcast Age for a year and a half (6 cours = 78 episodes), so the whole show would've been better if we just had more time.

-Each generation was unique in its own way
Hino: Flit's a stubborn old man, Asem's a regular guy, and Kio is a child striving for his ideals, and each of them has their own different volume of emotions. I took Flit's "stubborn old man you can't understand" character from an old drama series with Kobayashi Asei.

-What is your image of the three main characters?
Hino: Flit's a father. He's stubborn and has his way, but you can rely on him. I think Asem is the one the fans can relate to the best, being jealous of his best friend and facing his barriers and limits he's pretty much a normal person. Kio's desire to stop the war and get everyone together is a valid way of thinking, I believe, but is a type of fantasy.

-Did you think of changing the balance of having one cours for each generation?
Hino: As it's a family drama, having the last cours star all three characters was necessary. Also necessary to link up to the three of them joining forces was the theme of Kio, at first fighting the enemy as if playing a video game, meeting Izelcant and eventually growing to disavowal war. As a result Kio required more episodes and we had to compress Asem's story a bit.

-Looking back, are there any particular episodes you liked?
Hino: I liked them all, but the one I liked the most would be Wolf's death. He left the words "Super Pilot" to Asem, but if you think about it those words are kind of ridiculous and compared to X rounders have no substance to them at all. But Asem took those meaningless words and turned them into a status, and used them to become strong. The visuals in that episode were great too so it left a really strong impression on me. I think it was a mistake to have Wolf die so early though, I really wanted to have an episode where the older Asem visited him.

-What do you think of the conclusion?
Hino: It was great because we managed to tie up the endings of all three generations. There was the feeling that we had to settle things between Asem and Zeheart once and for all. Also, the story of two forces fighting and eventually coming to accept one another is pretty standard for Gundam, I believe.

-How Flit who had spent his entire life wanting to destroy the Vegans stopped at the very last moment left an extremely strong impression on us.
Hino: The opinion that it wasn't that good to have him leave the final decision to a woman who isn't even his wife. I mean, he married Emily, has kids, yet in the end it's Yurin. But you have to remember that he didn't just part with her, he lost her at a stage of growth when he was at his most sensitive. Even though he's married he can't forget her. This kind of stuff happens in real life too, not just cartoons. The female staff on the team didn't understand at all, but I personally feel it was extremely realistic.

-Was bringing new elements into Gundam such as the three part format done for the sake of bringing new elements in?
Hino: The personality of the show I wanted to display the most was family drama with the passing of time. Aside from that we strove to keep a Gundam-like image. At the base of the whole thing is the history of Gundam, and we wanted to show that to the children. The designs of the Gundams evolving as if tracing the history of Gundam was done on purpose.

-Was that done to keep the "Gundam-like" image?
Hino: While we wanted to keep in line for the most part, there were also parts where we wanted to step out of line. We wanted to go crazy and put in really interesting stuff. But with Gundam you have to think about a lot of other factors, including the merchandise, so we couldn't really do everything we wanted. In exchange we at least managed to keep the balance in the games.

-In what way did you feel Age was "Gundam-like"?
Hino: I always had that feeling of "Gundam-like"ness even before I started creating Age. Basically it's the concept of humans pitting their thoughts and emotions against each other through the medium of Mobile Suits. What was difficult was whether to depict the Gundam as a hero or a weapon. The tuning there is what determines Gundam, I think. For example in one of the scenario meetings we discussed how the weapons and war need to be depicted more realistically, while in another meeting the opinion of how it should be a more crazy super robot thing turned up. This stuff changed every week. Everyone, even among the stuff and fans, has different experiences with Gundam, so not everyone has the same image.

-That's the difficulty of working with something that's been going on for 30 years, yes?
Hino: There are many different groups of Gundam fans, and I found that it's extremely difficult to please all of them at the same time. I never actually thought about that before we started creating Age, and now that it's over I'm not sure if that was for better or for worse. "What is Gundam?" is going to be the eternal theme for all future creators of Gundam as well as myself from now on. If you have a chance to discuss Gundam, I'd be happy if Age would be the subject of the conversation.

-What is your straight opinion on working with Gundam?
Hino: Gundam has strong influencing power, and I received a lot of advice and criticism from the fans. But even so I really enjoyed myself each time. I think the reason I managed to find this to be so much fun even though it was really difficult is because the DNA inside me received the influence of Gundam as a child.

-Finally, a message for your fans please.
Hino: I really love Gundam and was truly glad to be able to stay with the project to the end. I feel that we managed to achieve the concept of depicting protagonists of different generations, and that Age can be lined up alongside the other past Gundams. While I'm not sure if it managed to fulfil everyone's expectations, I created Age with the opinion that this is one way that Gundam can be great. Also working in the field let me feel the power of Gundam, and interacting with the fans showed me how big Gundam is. I will definitely use this experience to better whatever I work on from now on, and if I have a chance to work with Gundam again, I would love to.

Well, I'm glad he enjoyed it and I agree about how Gundam can mean different things to different people. The part about the female staff not understanding the ending with Yurin amuses me.

Obelisk ze Tormentor · 2012-10-08, 22:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by monster

The part about the female staff not understanding the ending with Yurin amuses me.

Same here

.

Still, I somewhat feel sorry that Hino was kinda restricted from telling his story. I bet it’ll be more fun to see him go “crazier” with AGE than what we have now. From that interview above, I think Hino is a smart person who actually know all the flaws of AGE that he created. If I were Sunrise/Bandai, I would give him total freedom to tell his own story as long as there’s a Gundam in it. Restricting the story to follow certain tropes of previous Gundam series is really ridiculous. If their target was to create new fans, they need to give them something new and fresh (other than the 3 Gen gimmick), not the same Gundam-cliches again and again.

monster · 2012-10-08, 23:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor

Still, I somewhat feel sorry that Hino was kinda restricted from telling his story. I bet it’ll be more fun to see him go “crazier” with AGE than what we have now. From that interview above, I think Hino is a smart person who actually know all the flaws of AGE that he created. If I were Sunrise/Bandai, I would give him total freedom to tell his own story as long as there’s a Gundam in it. Restricting the story to follow certain tropes of previous Gundam series is really ridiculous. If their target was to create new fans, they need to give them something new and fresh (other than the 3 Gen gimmick), not the same Gundam-cliches again and again.

I guess it depends on what he meant. He said that he were able to do it in the games, but as far as I know without having played any of them, the games aren't too different from the series. If he's referring to mecha designs, I guess a crazy design could be a problem for models, but it's not like they're forced to build every models in the show.

wingdarkness · 2012-10-08, 23:07

Quote:

If their target was to create new fans, need to give them something new and fresh (other than the 3 Gen gimmick), not the same Gundam-cliches again and again.

Again, if it is done GOOD this doesn't really matter...Cliches are cliches because they have been proven to be effective...You can execute masked-man, Newtype-ish powers, over-powered Gundam good, just like you can do that terribly...The examples are out there no doubt, but my point here is what's working right now in Gundam? What has worked? What can still be expanded upon?

Age (as a premise atleast) couldn't be that expansion, so maybe expand on what you've neglected a bit to attract new viewers if 4 straight AU's didn't, hasn't, ultimately lead there...

monster · 2012-10-08, 23:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

Age (as a premise atleast) couldn't be that expansion, so maybe expand on what you've neglected a bit to attract new viewers if 4 straight AU's didn't, hasn't, ultimately lead there...

Out of curiosity, why do you keep saying 4 straight AUs? Don't you mean 8? (SD excluded)

And yes, I agree that clichés don't matter. After all, new viewers wouldn't know they're Gundam clichés. It's the old fans who complain about clichés.

Obelisk ze Tormentor · 2012-10-08, 23:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by wingdarkness

Again, if it is done GOOD this doesn't really matter...Cliches are cliches because they have been proven to be effective...You can execute masked-man, Newtype-ish powers, over-powered Gundam good, just like you can do that terribly...The examples are out there no doubt, but my point here is what's working right now in Gundam? What has worked? What can still be expanded upon?

Age (as a premise atleast) couldn't be that expansion, so maybe expand on what you've neglected a bit to attract new viewers if 4 straight AU's didn't, hasn't, ultimately lead there...

Quote:

Originally Posted by monster

And yes, I agree that clichés don't matter. After all, new viewers wouldn't know they're Gundam clichés. It's the old fans who complain about clichés.

Yes, I agree that execution matters (I thought my first reply to monster clearly stated it). But, I think in this case (considering AGE’s goal to attract new fans), if the usual cliches could restrict the actual story (in any way), I think it’s better to leave them altogether. I see it like this, the first viewers who’ll come and see AGE are the old fans. If they see a well-executed and fresh story, it will give the show some positive words-of-mouth that will help attract the newbies. I believe if a storyteller given total freedom to tell his story as he wanted, his enthusiasm will be transferred to the story which can also produce a more “smart" writing & execution. I know it’s only my opinion, but I didn’t see/feel that much “enthusiasm” from AGE (especially during most of Kio’s arc) because many prominent characters felt more like plot-devices than characters and some of them just waitin’ to be killed off. It’s like the writer doesn’t care anymore about them or the story in general.

wingdarkness · 2012-10-08, 23:54

Quote:

Out of curiosity, why do you keep saying 4 straight AUs? Don't you mean 8? (SD excluded)

The 3 big universe franchises are what I'm talking about obviously...SEED,OO,AGE...So after seeing this latest setback, maybe, logically, comeback to what has been proven to attract viewers (Since you've exhausted the alternate worlds and not seen the expected results...It's like essentially you've tried the other side...

Quote:

It's the old fans who complain about clichés

Exactly...When it's not good...This is looping but true...

Westlo · 2012-10-09, 00:03

Unicorn aside UC hasn't exactly attracted viewers, TAG and Victory had abysmal sales and ratings, intended or otherwise. Destiny, SEED, 00, 00pt2, Wing where much bigger hit series than those 2. G, X and AGE weren't, the numbers still favor the AU stuff, ignoring Unicorn of course.Origin is on the way for the hardcore anyway, maybe they'll give the next Gundam Series to Goro, he did give Sunrise Code Geass after all! Oh wait they changed his second half on him and he's so pissed he went off to make a cosplay anime for some no name company...

Lets see Sunrise got Seiji because they wanted FMA ratings, they got Hino because they wanted Inzuma Eleven multimedia performance, maybe they can give the next Gundam series to whoever is producing Capcom's Monster Hunter series, sounds good.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Add in how damn unpleasable the fanbase has gotten, it's a wonder that SEED did as well as it did in the first place, and little wonder why AGE didn't.

SEED and Destiny (which outsold SEED easily) appealed to new fans as well as fujoshis. It certainly wasn't aimed at the hardcore crowd, why do you think the first 20 episodes of SEED was basically MSG 2.0.

2012-10-08, 13:33	Link #3424
janipani Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Europe	Was the next show conservative or not, that doesn't help if story and characters aren't deep enough. AGE's biggest problem wasn't the idea it was the way it was executed. It's was too mainstream and too light for hardcore fans. __________________ The man of million typos The master of confusing sentence structure -Best anime was made in 80s-

2012-10-08, 13:35	Link #3425
Rising Dragon Goat Herder Author Join Date: Jun 2008 Age: 36	Gundam can't keep relying on hardcore fans though, it'll wither if they do--they'll need to get new fans somewhere if they want to keep using the name to make money. Add in how damn unpleasable the fanbase has gotten, it's a wonder that SEED did as well as it did in the first place, and little wonder why AGE didn't. __________________

2012-10-08, 13:40	Link #3427
janipani Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Europe	^ That is why they fail. __________________ The man of million typos The master of confusing sentence structure -Best anime was made in 80s-

2012-08-25, 21:14	Link #3422
GN0010 Nosferatu Where's the monoeye? Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Hargenteen Age: 35	Yep, same one.

2012-10-08, 14:01	Link #3430
monster Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2005	Ah, well, the early marketing certainly wasn't received too well. (Of course, this is based only on my limited exposure of the response here at AnimeSuki.)