Valvrave the Liberator 2 - Episode 8 Discussion / Poll

[ChainLegacy]

Am I the only one who feels like the immortality of the Valvrave pilots is being a little bit overblown here? I'm not saying that it shouldn't elicit some confused reactions, but the way Dorssia is playing it, they seem to be betting on this revelation to ruin the deal with ARUS. Couldn't they explain the condition and move on? Haruto, for instance, is feeding only on L-Elf and essentially not hurting anyone… Speaking of which, I wonder how he's getting his fix with L-Elf in loner mode?

[Kurohane]

They are simply using human fear to demonize JIOR, by creating "monsters".

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by ChainLegacy

Am I the only one who feels like the immortality of the Valvrave pilots is being a little bit overblown here? I'm not saying that it shouldn't elicit some confused reactions, but the way Dorssia is playing it, they seem to be betting on this revelation to ruin the deal with ARUS. Couldn't they explain the condition and move on? Haruto, for instance, is feeding only on L-Elf and essentially not hurting anyone… Speaking of which, I wonder how he's getting his fix with L-Elf in loner mode?

Well, remember that Amadeus is a pretty charismatic speaker (he is the handsome, nicely-dressed version of Hitler in this show, ya know) and of course Mirko has to act just like him. I'm betting the guy can demonize these kids pretty well especially since he has more clout in the media and politically then they do. They are new at this, he's a veteran.

And unfortunately Haruto is not known for being the smartest guy in the bunch, or being able to keep his cool. If this was L-elf, A-drei, or even Shoko in this position, they could easily spin this to their advantage and change the whole dynamic of the situation. However, L-elf is out of it, Shoko's as shocked as the rest of them, Haruto's gaping like a fish out of water. By the time they think of something to say, it will be too late.

Originally Posted by ~BC~

It's said during Cain and Kriem's conversation. But yes, they could give an asspull and have her come back due to "magic" and render all the exposition on runes and how they kill meaningless. I really don't doubt this possibility at all given Shoko's miraculous survival.

Well, Kriem really doesn't know of the Magius so she can't make a well-informed judgement, and I take anything Cain says with a large grain of salt. Really what he was doing there was mentally playing with Kriem since I'll bet you anything he knows she's a royalist, and he was just saying that to get a reaction out of her. Not that he really cares about her being a royalist or anything since, Magius business is his primary agenda.

I'm thinking Lise's body is of course dead, but that the Magius being "Lise", survived somehow and perhaps entered a new body or something of that nature.

[ChainLegacy]

Good point, but you'd think cooler heads would prevail in the ARUS leadership and they'd want to get sensible explanations first before jumping to conclusions… or at least have some level of restraint.

[Kurohane]

They will get information. Miirc is just getting started. Also, people will freak out over something like this. To the people at the assembly and in the world, this isn't fiction. It's real. Of course, people are going to react out of fear. I know some of us here say that this is no big deal, immortality is cool, or whatnot, but we all know this is fiction, and have no idea how we would react if this actually happened to us in reality. We can always say how we would react, but you never truly know unless it happens and out the comfort zone of being an viewer.

Also, I have to join the group who speculate Eileen, the reporter lady is a magius. Come on, she disappears along with all the scientists. She is in the perfect position to act without suspicion, being a reporter. I understand thinking things through, but not for a sub-plot like this one. Also, the capsule doesn't contain Saki. It still looks to small to hold a person, to me anyway. Also, considering one Kirschbaum is holding up a gun in the next few seconds, I wouldn't be surprised if it was special ammo.

Edit: Yeah, I'm almost positive the two are the same one. The one holding the capsule isn't shown with it's left arm, and the second one with the rifle has the gun attached to the same arm. Plus, that rifle looks specialized as well.

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by Kurohane

Also, I have to join the group who speculate Eileen, the reporter lady is a magius. Come on, she disappears along with all the scientists. She is in the perfect position to act without suspicion, being a reporter. I understand thinking things through, but not for a sub-plot like this one. Also, the capsule doesn't contain Saki. It still looks to small to hold a person, to me anyway. Also, considering one Kirschbaum is holding up a gun in the next few seconds, I wouldn't be surprised if it was special ammo.

Edit: Yeah, I'm almost positive the two are the same one. The holding the capsule doesn't show it's left arm, and the second one looks like the gun is attached to the same arm. Plus, that rifle looks specialized as well.

Also, isn't one of those kirschbaums also modified with that same drill that Cain used in episode 12? Are they going to try digging a hole through the module again?

I also think Eileen is a magius and I'm quite interested in what they're going to do with her. Is she the only one, or was the whole reporting team, Magius? Who gave Barnett that tip? And why?

[LightDragonman]

Again, can you post the picture of the mech with the capsule again?

[Kurohane]

Originally Posted by LightDragonman

Again, can you post the picture of the mech with the capsule again?

Images

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

[LightDragonman]

Are we sure that's a gun he has on his other arm? It doesn't look like he is equipped with any weapons. If that is his weapon, than it must be some sort of nuclear device or something.

And let's not forget that L-Elf and Shoko were able to fit into the palm of Unit 1. If this mech is of a similar size, then it isn't out of the question that the capsule (which seems to have a door/hatch on it) could contain someone.

[Kurohane]

^ That's the thing, we don't see f it has a weapon on it's left arm. It's possible it does, or has special equipment for that capsule.

Irenesharda mentioned the custom with the drill in the preview. It's possible the orbit Dorssian forces intend to drill into the module again. If so, why hold a hostage exchange, when they are just going to attack and seize the module anyway?

Edit:
Before the next episode, I want to bring up one last thing:

Images

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

Does it look like there are some marks on Saki's back?

[LightDragonman]

I'm not really seeing it.

[MK-95-]

Originally Posted by Kurohane

Before the next episode, I want to bring up one last thing:

Images

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

Does it look like there are some marks on Saki's back?

Nah, her back is clean. The only mark there is the wound she got from being impaled, which cured right after the snapshot was taken.

The only other marks on her back is the blood that was smudged when Cain wiped her back to show the wound healing.

[Guido]

Aw, somebody would please explain the plot with the Phantoms because that's the only bit that I didn't understand?

The rest of the episode quite more or less I grasped what the Council 101 did. They exposed Saki in front of the whole world to see in order to dissacredit Module 77, because that's what the Council 101 meant with making those kids to fade from the world stage.
Certainly, exposing the kamitsuki to the whole of humanity will generate ostracism onto Module 77, as well as provoking internal divisions amongst the teen population regarding their treatment towards Haruto and the other Valvrave pilots. This wouldn't affect the Magius at all since they using the Valvrave pilots true identities as scape goats in order to continue concealing their existence away from humanity, and they are directing humanity's natural fear of the unknown against Module 77.

Honestly, right now Haruto and the other must first organize their priorities on what they should do next, and the best outcome would be fleeing from the world stage for the time being as the first move. Again, L-Elf must come in handy too, but let's not forget that besides the Council 101 they also have Cain on their side.
However, internal struggles are surfacing within Dorssia.

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by Guido

Aw, somebody would please explain the plot with the Phantoms because that's the only bit that I didn't understand?

The Phantom ships whether they are spacecraft or submarine, are crafts that are made by the Magius to be a more efficient way to gather runes in large amounts in order to feed their people. Because Humans are the only beings on Earth that have the sufficient amount of runes in order to survive, they capture humans and drain them of runes on these ships.

Haruto, L-elf, Takumi, and the pilots were the only ones who knew the full truth about the Phantoms. The rest of the Earth force assumed them to be a type of Dorssian vessel.

However, because the Phantom doesn't have a crest that's on record with the Dorssians, the Magius could easily pin the ships on JIOR. They do so by secretly parking a Phantom ship in Module 77's unprotected hanger, keeping it cloaked, and then some Magius agents, either within the ARUS or the students themselves, captured the scientists, the reporter girl, and several others who were there for the summit and hooked them up to the ship. This was well planned by Cain, who made sure they specifically got key figures that would make the most impact, such as the head reporters' own producer. Cain then had sent a tip to the reporter that was specifically timed for the right moment to find the ship and of course he had access to all the media stations so they could splice the reporter's "discovery" right in with it.

When the time was right, they uncloaked the ship, and turned on the rune draining machinery and of course made sure everything was unlocked for the reporter to walk right in.

All of this implicated that the students were feeding off humans and killing them. Making them enemies of humanity. This also works for the Magius, because if every one of their ships are found again, they can simply blame it on Neo Jior. Also, it works out for the Magius in that after the students are killed and the module overtaken, they can simply move the Phantom ship back out and it will conveniently "disappear", and the Magius will have a whole new set of runes, which is what they wanted in the first place.

[Kurohane]

^ Wasn't that Phantom the one Haruto and co. seized?

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by Kurohane

^ Wasn't that Phantom the one Haruto and co. seized?

The thing is, that was what I was asking. We never see them take the ship with them, and it was too big to fit into their shuttle. Plus how did they put it in the module's hanger without anybody seeing it? All the students including Shoko, were waiting at the hanger for the shuttle's arrival, someone would have seen it. Yet, none of the other students had ever seen that ship before.

I'm thinking that the Magius had to have moved it into the hanger incognito, while the security was down for the summit. Also, since people float in the hanger, they would have had a hard time getting all the scientists inside and everything, if the student had been watching the ship.

[Kurohane]

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

The thing is, that was what I was asking. We never see them take the ship with them, and it was too big to fit into their shuttle. Plus how did they put it in the module's hanger without anybody seeing it? All the students including Shoko, were waiting at the hanger for the shuttle's arrival, someone would have seen it. Yet, none of the other students had ever seen that ship before.

I'm thinking that the Magius had to have moved it into the hanger incognito, while the security was down for the summit. Also, since people float in the hanger, they would have had a hard time getting all the scientists inside and everything, if the student had been watching the ship.

They could have brought it later when no one was around. I say that, because I don't see them actually destroying the thing with all those people in there. L-elf wasn't directing the mission after all.

[Guido]

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

The Phantom ships whether they are spacecraft or submarine, are crafts that are made by the Magius to be a more efficient way to gather runes in large amounts in order to feed their people. Because Humans are the only beings on Earth that have the sufficient amount of runes in order to survive, they capture humans and drain them of runes on these ships.

Haruto, L-elf, Takumi, and the pilots were the only ones who knew the full truth about the Phantoms. The rest of the Earth force assumed them to be a type of Dorssian vessel.

However, because the Phantom doesn't have a crest that's on record with the Dorssians, the Magius could easily pin the ships on JIOR. They do so by secretly parking a Phantom ship in Module 77's unprotected hanger, keeping it cloaked, and then some Magius agents, either within the ARUS or the students themselves, captured the scientists, the reporter girl, and several others who were there for the summit and hooked them up to the ship. This was well planned by Cain, who made sure they specifically got key figures that would make the most impact, such as the head reporters' own producer. Cain then had sent a tip to the reporter that was specifically timed for the right moment to find the ship and of course he had access to all the media stations so they could splice the reporter's "discovery" right in with it.

When the time was right, they uncloaked the ship, and turned on the rune draining machinery and of course made sure everything was unlocked for the reporter to walk right in.

All of this implicated that the students were feeding off humans and killing them. Making them enemies of humanity. This also works for the Magius, because if every one of their ships are found again, they can simply blame it on Neo Jior. Also, it works out for the Magius in that after the students are killed and the module overtaken, they can simply move the Phantom ship back out and it will conveniently "disappear", and the Magius will have a whole new set of runes, which is what they wanted in the first place.

Thank you. See, I really lack attention span at observing the scenes and reading properly the dialogue.

The only thing I speculated at first were that the reporter girl and a few of the scientist were undercover Magius of sorts waiting for the right timing after Dorssia broadcasted on live to the whole world.

Cain's strategy pretty much set Module 77 leaping from the frying pan into the cooking boiler. Hypothetically asking, had L-Elf mentally recovered would he had come up with a strategy to minimize the damage or preventing the pilots from being exposed to the whole world? I'm hypothetically asking.

[~BC~]

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

The thing is, that was what I was asking. We never see them take the ship with them, and it was too big to fit into their shuttle. Plus how did they put it in the module's hanger without anybody seeing it? All the students including Shoko, were waiting at the hanger for the shuttle's arrival, someone would have seen it. Yet, none of the other students had ever seen that ship before.

I'm pretty sure they showed the Phantom being brought in just after the OP. There's a part where we view the modules from above then a brief shot of something purple moving towards an opening in the module. There seems to be a boxed off yellow area that comes before the actual hangar; perhaps that's where they kept it since it looks completely different from where the students greet them.