Mobile Suit Gundam: Iron-Blooded Orphans Episode 2 Discussion / Poll

[monster]

Originally Posted by bigdeath

This I don't get. Kudelia was trying to say she regreated the lives lost because of her and Mika barked like a dog at her. If anything, Mika was being an irrational jerk to her. In what way was showing sympathy insulting?

While the attack was due to Kudelia being there, Mikazuki doesn't feel that his comrades died just for her sake. My guess is that he doesn't want to acknowledge the idea that her one life is worth the deaths of his comrades. That's why he doesn't need her thanks because he's not fighting just for her. Her safety is simply a bonus.

[bigdeath]

Originally Posted by Iron Maw

Pretty standard bridge episode, which not to say it was bad or anything. Just not huge amount talk about.



I actually cringed at that. So what, are their parents named Flour and Sugar? :/



I think has mostly has to do with her reminding a lot of fans about Relena Peacecraft who was quite disliked among the fandom.

Considering how often people are bring up Relena, yes I think that is the main factor in the hate of poor Kudelia.

Also, I'd love it if Biscuits parents were named Flour and Sugar. It would make my day.

Originally Posted by monster

While the attack was due to Kudelia being there, Mikazuki doesn't feel that his comrades died just for her sake. My guess is that he doesn't want to acknowledge the idea that her one life is worth the deaths of his comrades. That's why he doesn't need her thanks because he's not fighting just for her. Her safety is simply a bonus.

That........makes a lot of sense. Mika, stop talking in such a clip fashion. lol Though I'm not quite sure if Mika cares at all about Kudelia's safety at all. If Orga told him to kill her, I wonder if Mika would even hesitate.

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by monster

This is why I don't think they were malnourished at all, like some were thinking last episode. They clearly were not living in luxury, but they got enough nutrition to build their body up for the work. In fact, it makes CGS the place to be even with everything else that is wrong with it, compared to actually starving on the street.

Oh, I don't think they're starving by any means, but they're not as well fed as they should be. You can be muscular and wiry, and also malnourished. An example I remember somebody gave was Kyle Reese and the future soldiers of the Terminator franchise. (and I'm talking Michael Biehn not the other ones), but they are all muscular, but they're thin. They don't eat regularly or much at all, but they work out what muscle they do have, and so they're wiry.

I didn't notice they we're eating well either at first until I watched the episode again and saw that the Third Group doesn't eat the same as the First Group. While the First Group were all eating tacos and burgers and large meals, the Third Group were eating stew or some kind of mush. The eat regularly, but they don't eat as much as they should, especially considering their still kids.

Originally Posted by Twi

I'm kinda surprised by how many people seem to enjoy Kudelia being told off a lot. She hasn't been overly pushy about her agenda to them and has either been wanting to help or knowing why they do what they do. Naive, maybe, but I don't see what the thrill is from watching her get chewed out over it.

I think it's just that we're glad to see her kind of character get a reality check so early on. Princess-types can be awfully annoying, especially those peace-loving "never wrong" ones that MCs fall in love with.

Kudelia is not exactly that way, but she's in that same vein.

Originally Posted by creb

Servant-wearing-glasses-lady is awfully suspicious. I wouldn't be surprised if she answers to the father, and intentionally left the princess alone during the attack. I don't trust her for a second.

She's pretty suspicious to me too. I don't like how she wasn't seen for most of the fight and then only showed up after with only a flesh wound.

[Kaoru Chujo]

Originally Posted by bigdeath

"You told me you wanted to die smothered in breasts". A true mans dream. lol.... Also, biscuit's sisters.........loli moe overload. lol....

Something for everyone. All this with mechas, too. Probably one of the reasons they brought in Nagai Tatsuyuki (Railgun, etc.) to direct and Okada Mari (Ano Natsu, etc.) to be lead writer. To appeal to more tastes, and to make the emotional landscape a bit broader. Suits me. I'm enjoying this Gundam. But waiting for some of the "human trash" and the princess to find a way out of this hell-hole.

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by bigdeath

This I don't get. Kudelia was trying to say she regretted the lives lost because of her and Mika barked like a dog at her. If anything, Mika was being an irrational jerk to her. In what way was showing sympathy insulting?

I wonder why Kudelia even bothers trying to understand and help the childern of mars if they are all going to act like Mika. Don't want any sympathy or help? Fine, good bye, enjoy your certain death.

I don't think Mika cares for or wants her sympathy. It basically goes into that unintentional arrogance that she has, comes from her sheltered life and her position. Mika was basically telling her not to dare to think that all of his comrades died because of some chick they didn't know. They died protecting themselves and their comrades. To say anything less would be cheapening their sacrifice. Her saying that it was all because of her, is insulting.

True, Kudelia meant well, but it came out as an insult to Mika, who thinks about things in a different way than she does. To him this is his life and he and his comrades are only about each other. For her to think that all of his brothers died because of her, doesn't compute to him.

[Rising Dragon]

Overall it's traditional Gundam poor communication.

[monster]

Originally Posted by bigdeath

Though I'm not quite sure if Mika cares at all about Kudelia's safety at all. If Orga told him to kill her, I wonder if Mika would even hesitate.

Well, at the very least he's not actually antagonistic toward her, just outspoken. At this moment, he may not hesitate to kill her, but fortunately for her, Orga doesn't seem to dislike her either.

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

Oh, I don't think they're starving by any means, but they're not as well fed as they should be. You can be muscular and wiry, and also malnourished. An example I remember somebody gave was Kyle Reese and the future soldiers of the Terminator franchise. (and I'm talking Michael Biehn not the other ones), but they are all muscular, but they're thin. They don't eat regularly or much at all, but they work out what muscle they do have, and so they're wiry.

I didn't notice they we're eating well either at first until I watched the episode again and saw that the Third Group doesn't eat the same as the First Group. While the First Group were all eating tacos and burgers and large meals, the Third Group were eating stew or some kind of mush. The eat regularly, but they don't eat as much as they should, especially considering their still kids.

Well, I do think they could eat better food. It's just that, when I think of malnourishment, I more often associate it more severe problems than being thin and wiry. At the very least, they would suffer from lack of energy, which would limit their ability to work out or work. And depending on the nutrients they're lacking, there would be even more physical, physiological, or psychological problems.

We also have an overweight guy on their team. (Sure, that's also a form of malnourishment, but I think we meant specifically undernourishment.)

So, I think, even with the quality of the food not being as good or tasty as it could be, they are still getting the required nutrition to live and do their job.

[Asuras]

Originally Posted by monster

While the attack was due to Kudelia being there, Mikazuki doesn't feel that his comrades died just for her sake. My guess is that he doesn't want to acknowledge the idea that her one life is worth the deaths of his comrades. That's why he doesn't need her thanks because he's not fighting just for her. Her safety is simply a bonus.

I'd say that's exactly what Mikazuki was insinuating. Literally rebuking Kudelia for her line of thinking. She might not have been feeling necessarily "worthwhile," she was probably thinking that the battle had been fought to keep her safe.

Mikazuki however understands that the reason they fought, and the reason they died, was for one another. They were attacked by Gjallerhorn and fought back to preserve each other's lives, simple as that. It had nothing to do with Kudelia.

[bigdeath]

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

I don't think Mika cares for or wants her sympathy. It basically goes into that unintentional arrogance that she has, comes from her sheltered life and her position. Mika was basically telling her not to dare to think that all of his comrades died because of some chick they didn't know. They died protecting themselves and their comrades. To say anything less would be cheapening their sacrifice. Her saying that it was all because of her, is insulting.

True, Kudelia meant well, but it came out as an insult to Mika, who thinks about things in a different way than she does. To him this is his life and he and his comrades are only about each other. For her to think that all of his brothers died because of her, doesn't compute to him.

Someone needs to slap some sense into Mika because his comrades did die for her safety, regardless if that was their intention or not. If his comarades aren't going to bother with being aware of why they are fighting then their lives and deaths will continue to be out of their own hands.

If anyone is being a fool here, its Mika. Sigh, I want Kudelia to yell at him. Forgot that, I want to do that myself. lol Don't be so willing to push away someone whos trying to help. Lord knows, you luckless orphans need all the allies you can get. If all these orphans do is aimlessly wonder from battle to battle, they are all going to get killed. Thankfully, Orga seems well aware of this and is planning a coup.

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Overall it's traditional Gundam poor communication.

LOL, your absolutly right. It is sort of like Kudelia and Mika talking past one another.

[monster]

Originally Posted by bigdeath

If his comarades aren't going to bother with being aware of why they are fighting then they will continue have their lives and death out of their own hands.

Well, for now, they're fighting because it's their job and they were attacked. In this battle, it doesn't really matter why they were attacked, just that they need to survive the attack.

Now, if they are going on the offensive (such as whatever Orga is planning), then they should know the reason, but that's a different issue than the one Mikazuki and Kudelia are discussing in this episode.

[Skye629]

Originally Posted by bigdeath

Or you can just go directly to Daisuki and watch the video here:

http://www.daisuki.net/anime/watch/M...DEDORPHANS/vqd

Its free to watch with limited commercials (much less than crunchroll)

Are the commercials only at the end and start? I hate ads cutting off a show/movie partway through

Originally Posted by B214

I don't think the producers will pull a pun with the opening song, Raise Your (Death) Flag, or they actually will.

O god hhahahah

Originally Posted by Fireminer

But seriously, Orga and Mikazuki's relationship isn't one bit healthy. The former seems like he has a light case of superiority complex that needs to be satisfied by making the latter forever under Orga's wings.

Unhealthy? Yes for the most part. However, where are you getting this superiority complex thing? He seems to hate that attitude more than anything (especially given how the first group treats them)

He looks out for Mika and the others more than anything else. He's willing to stage a coup for them to live, but yet he's willing to call it off entirely and continue to suffer on the off chance that Mika refuses. And even though he knows Mika would probably go along with it, he's still surprised when Mika just takes the gun from him, no-questions-asked

Originally Posted by QSTraderDG86

The gundam's thrusters require fuel?!

And this is something new?

Wow...machines in this gundamverse are weaksauce...

And yet the Gundams were a huge factor is the disaster prior to the shows events

Makes me wonder how weak the mid-series upgrade (assuming one arrives) will be. Sheesh. The mechas here definitely leave something to be desired for those of us who like the gundams like God Gundam, Wing Zero, Epyon, S. Freedom, and I. Justice.

Its probably gonna be like G-Reco, with the main suit constantly getting more upgrades and gear change-outs through the show

Also, whoever thought of the whole neural uplink system was some sort of idiot (heck, both in-universe, and from a logical perspective, at Sunrise). War machines that can only be piloted by children that are still growing? For real? What happens when they stop growing? Oops, you grew up, you can't pilot a gundam anymore, even though you have massive amounts of combat experience!

I believe some ppl already addressed it. To add on to it though, this was implemented during the disaster period. Given how far they went with the system, it just adds to how grim times were then

Kudelia (not calling her Aina anymore! Like hell is she worthy of that one!) so far just seems to be a cheap Relena knockoff, and maybe not even. At least Relena had pull with her brother (the most badass pilot in that universe), his waifu, Une, and others. Kudelia just seems to be along for the ride, her father's a wuss, at this point she's basically just walking around without much in the way of capabilities...so much for being the epic pink songstress that rocks mecha shows (whether Lacus or Salamandinay!).

Seriously?

Honestly, this show seems to be shaping up to be very low-key as far as Gundam-type shows go. No epic princess, no Gundam inspiring terror just by its presence alone, no masked rival...

Here's to hoping this show picks up the Gundam charm eventually.

We're only 2 episodes in.....the princess have time to grow, Gundams seem to be relatively unknown/forgotten, masked rivals if any still have time to appear.....

See in comment

Originally Posted by Yan3242

Iam more afraid if she going to pull lacus as in at the end of the series all orga group will belong to her as her private mercenary band.

No...just no.......(Also they wont be mercenaries anymore if they become her private force)

Originally Posted by monster

While the attack was due to Kudelia being there, Mikazuki doesn't feel that his comrades died just for her sake. My guess is that he doesn't want to acknowledge the idea that her one life is worth the deaths of his comrades. That's why he doesn't need her thanks because he's not fighting just for her. Her safety is simply a bonus.

This

Also its more or less in the 3rd Groups job contract to look after her. If they die then so be it, thats what they were taking on when they got that contract

[mweloo]

Originally Posted by Iron Maw

I actually cringed at that. So what, are their parents named Flour and Sugar? :/

I think Shortbread and Gingersnap are more likely.

And, yeah, count me among those those who don't understand the poor reception to Kudelia's character (not specific to this thread, but in general). The girl's not perfect, certainly, but can you at least acknowledge that she's genuinely trying her best? It's still early in the series, so it's only natural that she stumble along the way. From people suggesting that she's been doing this purely for the sake of bolstering her own confidence to people being annoyed when tried to apologise for what she believed was her fault, the poor girl doesn't really get a break. You can't expect her to properly understand the boys when she's known them for- what, a few days?

(PS:I had to blow off a little steam. I'm sorry if I came off as rude.)

[bigdeath]

Originally Posted by Skye629

Are the commercials only at the end and start? I hate ads cutting off a show/movie partway through

Trust me, I hate commerials too however this site has very brief commercials. I think I saw only 2 30 sec commerials at midway points. Its much less than what you get on crunchroll and the quality of the stream is pretty good. I recommend the site, its better than watching on youtube, if you can even access it. Plus its anime with official English subs online for free. Totally legal. Its something to support.

[Galaxian]

Originally Posted by mweloo

I think Shortbread and Gingersnap are more likely.

And, yeah, count me among those those who don't understand the poor reception to Kudelia's character (not specific to this thread, but in general). The girl's not perfect, certainly, but can you at least acknowledge that she's genuinely trying her best? It's still early in the series, so it's only natural that she stumble along the way. From people suggesting that she's been doing this purely for the sake of bolstering her own confidence to people being annoyed when tried to apologise for what she believed was her fault, the poor girl doesn't really get a break. You can't expect her to properly understand the boys when she's known them for- what, a few days?

(PS:I had to blow off a little steam. I'm sorry if I came off as rude.)

I agree. Kudelia has not acted rude, snobbish, or bitchy in this two episodes to deserve so much complaints.

Has she been naive and idealistic? Yes, but those are hardly reason to hate her, plus she is actually aware for her flaws and has been trying to change it even before meeting Mika and the others. Also she already show signs of actually having a brain, that's really progressive for this type of things.

[Esclair]

Really great episode. Loved how gritty the fight was, with dust being kicked up everywhere.

Orga and Mika are the best Gundam protagonists I've seen. Orga is just the right mix of charismatic, ambitious, and empathetic to make you root for him and love him, but you can feel that somewhere down the line he's going to make a mistake and choose the wrong path. Mika is your Heero/Setsuna done right. Stoic, but not completely inhuman. He's seen a lot of shit and has found his reason to live and fight. However, I'm sure his reasons will change once he gains more perspective.

I'm eagerly anticipating the Coup d'état storyline we're getting set up for.

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by bigdeath

Someone needs to slap some sense into Mika because his comrades did die for her safety, regardless if that was their intention or not. If his comarades aren't going to bother with being aware of why they are fighting then their lives and deaths will continue to be out of their own hands.

If anyone is being a fool here, its Mika. Sigh, I want Kudelia to yell at him. Forgot that, I want to do that myself. lol Don't be so willing to push away someone whos trying to help. Lord knows, you luckless orphans need all the allies you can get. If all these orphans do is aimlessly wonder from battle to battle, they are all going to get killed. Thankfully, Orga seems well aware of this and is planning a coup.

Well, you're entitled to your opinion, but I have to respectfully disagree. I think Mika is completely right and that Kudelia even realized that and that was why she was rethinking her way of thinking.

It's completely okay that Mika and his group of orphans are simply fighting for their own lives and for a better life for themselves. They don't have to have some huge noble goal of "saving the world" or even "saving the princess", they can be fighting for themselves and their brothers. I don't think there is anything wrong with that.

You have to realize that Mika and his friends have had no one to lean on but themselves, and they're not about to change that mindset because some princess kindheart comes in their midst, especially one as naive has her. And her making a comment like that that for them is an insult, doesn't do anything to make them want to like her more, much less trust her.

[Twi]

Kudelia isn't just on their side, she's advocating for all the poverty stricken children as well. The CGS kids are abused and have a short-life expectancy, but they know they'll get food, water, and shelter. Others aren't that fortunate, as was shown.

She knows how bad things are, but also knows she only has one viewpoint and chose them because she was hoping to get their viewpoint. Never once did she express that what they were doing was wrong, only that she wanted to know why for her own curiosity so she could understand them better. She blames herself directly because they were attacking to kill her (her father being a coward), but Mika sums it up that they were attacked and attacked back for the sake of those who were killed and so they weren't killed as well.

It could have been communicated better, but Mika just lost over 30 people he considered family with and more injured in the attack on their home. He doesn't want to hear apologies for that.

On another note: Why were Biscuit's two prepubescent sisters on a long stretch of road heading to a PMC base on their own? Leaving aside the fact that Atra could drive, because this is the type of show where children get shafted into a lot of mature roles to survive, but how did they even get that far without so much as a backpack on them? Did they tell their parents?

[Skye629]

Originally Posted by bigdeath

Trust me, I hate commerials too however this site has very brief commercials. I think I saw only 2 30 sec commerials at midway points. Its much less than what you get on crunchroll and the quality of the stream is pretty good. I recommend the site, its better than watching on youtube, if you can even access it. Plus its anime with official English subs online for free. Totally legal. Its something to support.

IIRC this is one of the sites that stream the show when it airs right?

If so Ill check it out, beats waiting around several hours before I can watch it on other anime sites

[bigdeath]

Originally Posted by Irenesharda

And her making a comment like that that for them is an insult, doesn't do anything to make them want to like her more, much less trust her.

Actually, this is just Mika opnion. We don't know how other members of the group would have responded to what Kurdelia said. Mika is certainly far from a social guy so I suppose hes not really the best one to talk to. I find it hard to believe Busicut or even Orga would react the same way. I'm not even sure if Mika was insulted or just stating a fact to correct Kurdelia. He says things so matter of fact that it can sound like hes angry when hes not.

Kurdelia however is still right. Gilhorn only attacked because she was at the base. Mika's comrades wouldn't have had to fight and die (at least in this battle) if she wasn't there. So even if indirectly, she feels partly responsibly for their deaths.

Originally Posted by Twi

On another note: Why were Biscuit's two prepubescent sisters on a long stretch of road heading to a PMC base on their own? Leaving aside the fact that Atra could drive, because this is the type of show where children get shafted into a lot of mature roles to survive, but how did they even get that far without so much as a backpack on them? Did they tell their parents?

Do they even have parents? This is a show about orphans, right?

[monster]

masked rivals if any still have time to appear.....

I hope not.