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Old 2008-10-13, 05:18   Link #161
Frenchie
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There's more to Shiro-chan than what meets the eye, but I don't expect him to win his fight. It won't be slaughter though.

Am I the only one that remembers Ichimaru vs Toushirou? The kid can give an excellent fight if he's got the motivation and they were both just using shikai's. Granted, Ichimaru outwitted him, but I'm pretty sure that's what the kid is capable of, and not what everyone seems to remember him by: The fight with the Arrancar and his doomsday against Aizen. (Which was really more of a plot device than a fight, just showing how hax Aizen was)

He may not win but it won't be an imbalanced fight. I'm not expecting new abilities, I'm just expecting some crazy levels of reiatsu coming out from the kid. Raw power that will be outwitted yet again by battle experience.
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Old 2008-10-13, 06:46   Link #162
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Originally Posted by Utsukushii Hono'o View Post
He's called a prodigy but doesn't fight like one...
I'd place some of the blame on the writer
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Old 2008-10-13, 08:36   Link #163
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Originally Posted by El_Frenchie View Post
There's more to Shiro-chan than what meets the eye, but I don't expect him to win his fight. It won't be slaughter though.

Am I the only one that remembers Ichimaru vs Toushirou? The kid can give an excellent fight if he's got the motivation and they were both just using shikai's. Granted, Ichimaru outwitted him, but I'm pretty sure that's what the kid is capable of, and not what everyone seems to remember him by: The fight with the Arrancar and his doomsday against Aizen. (Which was really more of a plot device than a fight, just showing how hax Aizen was)

He may not win but it won't be an imbalanced fight. I'm not expecting new abilities, I'm just expecting some crazy levels of reiatsu coming out from the kid. Raw power that will be outwitted yet again by battle experience.
In my opinion. He was serious and going at Gin with everything he had. While Gin played with him. Gin didn't use everything he had. Hitsu even released to fight.

He's the strongest weak guy...
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Old 2008-10-13, 09:11   Link #164
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Originally Posted by Utsukushii Hono'o View Post
He's the strongest weak guy...
I'd more say that he's the weakest strong guy.

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Anyone think Barrigan is # 1?
No.
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Old 2008-10-13, 09:31   Link #165
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Originally Posted by Salamandra View Post
I'd more say that he's the weakest strong guy.
Whatever works...

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No.

I like you!
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Old 2008-10-13, 10:00   Link #166
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Huh? Gin released Shinsou too, as did Toushirou with Hyourinmaru. Nothing that we've seen of the fight has shown that either of them had an upper hand on the other. The end of the fight was a sly trick of Ichimaru, but otherwise the fight was even.

Saying that Ichimaru played around with Toushirou is pure speculation until we get a clear level of power for either characters. Ichimaru because we only saw one fight out of him, and Toushirou because that one fight was overshadowed by plotkai Aizen and Arrancar/limiter fight.

In short, I'm convinced Toushirou will pull out something. Probably not win the fight, but definitely impress somehow. If he looks bad, it's going to make Ichimaru look bad and we can't have that. After all, they both are the youngest appointed captains of their generations.
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Old 2008-10-13, 10:13   Link #167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Salamandra View Post
I'd more say that he's the weakest strong guy.
This.

He's a Captain for crying out loud.
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Old 2008-10-13, 10:15   Link #168
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Originally Posted by El_Frenchie View Post
Huh? Gin released Shinsou too, as did Toushirou with Hyourinmaru. .
He released at the last moment and I really don't believe he had to. He just did that because it was a part of his mind-raping of Hitsu.

So you think Barrigan is #3?
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Old 2008-10-13, 12:26   Link #169
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Originally Posted by The Phenomenol View Post
Also, I like the battle setups.
Shunsui vs Stark: Very good match up, two players are alike but Shunsui will win.
Halibel vs Hitsuguya: Hitsuguya should display something new here.
Soi-Fong vs a Fraccion?: Soi-fong should vaporize whoever is in front of her. I am ready to see her Bankai!!

Ukitake isn't fighting anyone. I am guessing he might fight Barragan once these people are finished and Yama will fight Aizen or this whole scenario could get messed up with the Vaizards coming in.
I see no reason for the Vaizards helping Aizen out. Yes they are in debt to Aizen but the only thing they owe Aizen is an ass whooping, ROYALLY. The Vaizards will fight against Aizen and company but they will not do it for Soul Society.
Im really eager to see the Stark vs. Shunsui fight, but I dont think Shunsui will win.
At least I can see Stark as someone who has the right personality to defeat his opponent. Probably Ukitake is going to help Shunsui when he´s in trouble.
Also Ichigo and Kenpachi are still in Hueco Mundo. I doubt that the fight will be over when they arrive.
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Old 2008-10-13, 13:27   Link #170
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Anyone think Barrigan is # 1?
Yeah!

At least, that's what the evidence points at so far, though it's anyone's game at this point.
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Old 2008-10-13, 14:19   Link #171
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With all the bickering over Hitsu thats been going on for the last 4-5 pages, I'm highly surprised that no one has pointed out that Yama's sword is sealed when he yelled "Get Them". Now how exactly is he trapping Aizen and Co. when he sealed his sword?
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Old 2008-10-13, 14:19   Link #172
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yup, the throne, the crown etc. it shows mmmmmm

but i still go for Stark because of these reasons:

> The order they are called by Aizen in ch 315 (Stark, Barragan, and Halibel respectively)
> The way/order they were shown in the manga(right to left, top to bottom it always starts with Stark ch315 and 316)


@lequory
Good observation, it's discussed at other forums too heh..
my bet is that the fire prison does not need continuous control.
its like i cast it there and leave it. and ill remove it when i want to.

or that move consumes a lot of reiatsu and Yamaji needs to recover ^,,..,,^
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Old 2008-10-13, 14:48   Link #173
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Originally Posted by Utsukushii Hono'o View Post
He's called a prodigy but doesn't fight like one...
Anyone think Barrigan is # 1?
Personally I do. He sure throws around his authority like he is. Not to mention he's old. Old guys tend to be super-strong in shounen manga.
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Old 2008-10-13, 14:54   Link #174
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Its just hinting at baragan being number one to much for him to actually be number one
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Old 2008-10-13, 15:01   Link #175
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I somewhat suspect that Aizen could get out anyway, he's just choosing to stay there, give the illusion that he's trapped, and watch what happens.

Also, it does seem to me that Barragan's talking far too much and such to be #1. I also seem to remember, but can't find where it is, him saying "Don't underestimate me" to Halibel, suggesting he's not as highly ranked.
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Old 2008-10-13, 16:57   Link #176
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Outside of anime filler, how exactly has she been crap? She saved Hianmori's life from Gin (something Captain Hitsu didn't accomplish). She kicked Kira's butt and easily defeated the Grimmjow fraccion she faced in Arrancar arc. She even held his foot while she was discussing the limit release on her phone. Against Luppi too, it could be speculated she deliberately distracted him until her captain could recover.

True, she's a VC, so she's not going to be pawning any espada anytime soon. But as far as VCs go, she's been very successful. I can't recall her ever being taken out...
Exactly my thoughts. She has easily been the most competent of the VC's we've seen extensively. Maybe that is to make up for the incompetency of her captain?!
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Old 2008-10-13, 17:01   Link #177
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Originally Posted by epyon96 View Post
Kubotite thus far has shown he is unable to show characters beyond one fight without inconsistencies exploding in your face.

The discussion of Hitsugaya Toshiro does not need to extend any further than that. Say all you want about him but don't forget that Byakuya and Kenpachi has shown huge inconsistencies with their power in light of their recent Espada fights. How can Ichigo match Kenpachi in power back without bankai but Kenpachi can so easily overpower (through sheer force alone, no tricks) a 5th espada. Ichigo with Vizard power clearly shown that he was about just a bit stronger than 6th espada, Grimjaww. I don't buy how Kenpachi can be stronger than Vizard Ichigo in that short period of time.

It is a huge disappointment seeing as Bleach used to be a favorite manga/anime but has degraded to this level this far into the manga.
The common denominator in those inconsistencies is Ichigo. Byakuya and Kenpachi both had to face him and no matter when it was they faced him - they both had to lose for the sake of the development of Ichigo. I think this is the common problem when people compare the powers in relation to the main character. Byakuya and Kenpachi would pretty much pwn just about everyone else but they were both chosen to strengthen Ichigo's image. Another common misconception is that they both lost that fight, in my eye's it is still debatable to say either lost at all.
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Old 2008-10-14, 01:02   Link #178
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The common denominator in those inconsistencies is Ichigo. Byakuya and Kenpachi both had to face him and no matter when it was they faced him - they both had to lose for the sake of the development of Ichigo. I think this is the common problem when people compare the powers in relation to the main character. Byakuya and Kenpachi would pretty much pwn just about everyone else but they were both chosen to strengthen Ichigo's image. Another common misconception is that they both lost that fight, in my eye's it is still debatable to say either lost at all.
I agree, neither lost. Kenpachi fights at the level of his opponent. Noi's armor was hard, so Kenpachi just kept hitting harder and harder until he cut his skin, with the eyepatch on. With the power of his blows it's obvious he was stronger with the eyepatch than when he just took it off against Ichigo--Ken-chan never really warmed up at all.

Byakuya just sort of yawned for most of the fight, and his 2nd level bankai is way beyond Ichigo's bankai. He dropped one of his 10,000 swords onto Ichigo's foot and pinned him down.

Hitsugaya has released his bankai immediately during every fight. This is a classic shounen sign of weakness--and since he's had so much screentime, he's one of the main characters and in clear need for a powerup. Ichigo also releases right off the bat--he's just to sad without his bankai, which isn't that impressive regardless. Of course, Hitsugaya's bankai is supposed to be the strongest ice type, which means he eventually may be in the same class as Yamamoto. The problem right now of course, he isn't very good at using his zanpaktoh, and he hasn't really displayed any captain-like abilities.

If Barragan is not number one, and number #3 instead, then we have 2 possibilities.

1) Shunsui is screwed and Ukitake needs to join in the fight, and both will have to release their bankais.

[1b) Shunsui doesn't release bankai, and Stark never releases their zanpaktohs, and the battle ends before either really exerts themselves...]

2) Shunsui wins, the espada are pitiful, Aizen, Tousen, & Gin escape from the fire cage, and own everyone without much effort, like they took down 4 captains and 3 VCs with little effort in the flashback arc.

If #2, the vizards will have to come in to save the day; the Seireitei captains have very little chance against Aizen & Tousen + Gin combo. The only guy who has a chance against Tousen is (surprise!) in Heuco Mundo (Kenpachi).

Gin I think is the overrated one in the group, his shikai appears very lame, which (may) be an indication of his power level. The main thing I see is, Gin's shikai melds VERY WELL with Aizen & Tosen's zanpaktoh abilities. Aizen & Tosen can control all senses, while Gin can selectively snipe at opponents.

Last edited by astrallionheart; 2008-10-14 at 01:15.
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Old 2008-10-14, 01:19   Link #179
Utsukushii Hono'o
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Originally Posted by astrallionheart View Post

[1b) Shunsui doesn't release bankai, and Stark never releases their zanpaktohs, and the battle ends before either really exerts themselves...]

.
say no...

I chose option #1a !
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Old 2008-10-14, 07:18   Link #180
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Exclamation ummmm..

Alright I'm wondering where the list of "People who got sodomized by Aizen backhandedly" are in this fight. Those people are: The incredibly powerful captain level+ Vizards- these guys could mop the floor with the espada if a shikai captain like Zaraki can beat #5. Next on the list is Urahara- straight up beast of a captain who had to learn to fight bare handed just to keep his prisoners locked up (not to mention incredibly smart). Finally Tessai- Death dealer in his own right this man was the captain of the Kido corps and should know the highest of the high kido with mastery of that way above Aizen. So why Aizen and his squad are still among the living while making this list of enemies other than the Gotei 13 and coming to them is beyond me. Seriously at least the Vizards should be there. Speaking of which since Aizen is after the King's key why hasn't any of the Zero division shown up and just "neutralized the threat".
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