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View Poll Results: Hyouka - Episode 11 Rating | |||
Perfect 10 | 20 | 28.99% | |
9 out of 10 : Excellent | 25 | 36.23% | |
8 out of 10 : Very Good | 17 | 24.64% | |
7 out of 10 : Good | 3 | 4.35% | |
6 out of 10 : Average | 4 | 5.80% | |
5 out of 10 : Below Average | 0 | 0% | |
4 out of 10 : Poor | 0 | 0% | |
3 out of 10 : Bad | 0 | 0% | |
2 out of 10 : Very Bad | 0 | 0% | |
1 out of 10 : Painful | 0 | 0% | |
Voters: 69. You may not vote on this poll |
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2012-07-02, 05:26 | Link #41 |
Eaten by goats
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Rokkenjima
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This episode was interesting. It did a lot with Houtarou's character and also had some good stuff from Chitanda, plus some more info about Houtarou's sister who is the best puppet master of them all. I liked Chitanda better after this ep. She wasn't so over the top in the "I'm curious!" department, and she seemed to gain more depth. Anyway, in the end, this story arc was about building Houtarou up and knocking him down. The way he was left alone without the others to formulate the flawed theory is proof of that, because if any of them had been there, they would clearly have corrected that solution.
I found it odd the way that all of the characters were so serious about the mystery. Well, maybe not so much Mayaka, but Satoshi, Chitanda to a degree, and especially Houtarou were just silly over it. Even though to Houtarou there was a lot riding on it (with him having believed Irisu when she said he was special and all and then being crushed by his mistakes and all the others rubbing it in) it just didn't seem quite right. He ought to have been aware that Irisu was only looking for an ending she could present as a result. There was never any indication that she cared about solving the true mystery. Heck, if I remember right, Houtarou already declined to write an ending for them, so he knew it was a possibility. Still, that manipulation of him was harsh. All that fuss just to get a script ending. Calling them in, then puffing up Houtarou's ego to get him to deliver a solution. It seems ridiculous that she couldn't think up an acceptable script solution off her own bat. I like the theories people came up with here better than the true one. |
2012-07-02, 05:29 | Link #42 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: ¯\(º_o)/¯
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Jokes aside, wasn't there suppose to be an over-arching theme/mystery that ties all these little mystery arcs together anyway? Perhaps his sister is the big connection here
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2012-07-02, 06:24 | Link #43 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2011
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It seems people are just focusing on one aspect of this episode; the part where Oreki lost his composure when the three disagreed with his theory.
This had a lot of things going on. Irisu's motive, what happened to Houngou, the proper theory to Houngou's intentions for the film, etc. If you look at it, the whole mystery part with the movie wasn't the biggest issue to Oreki. Sure it was quite a bit over the top in terms of portrayal but here we really see the emphasis of how proud he was about his personal achievement. If Oreki was beating his head for messing up the conclusion we'd see something worse when he was at his room during his alone time. Alas no, it's just the natural fidgety feeling when something's bothering you. The most he lost his composure was when he uncovered the reality of Irisu's motives. I dunno, some are kinda being too harsh about that particular scene and seemingly discredits the merit of the situation. This is somewhat ignoring the depiction of Oreki's personality and injecting our own opinions or views on how this particular character should be. |
2012-07-02, 07:13 | Link #44 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
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But heh, while I suspected the "locked room murder" wasn't the true mystery I didn't expect that Hongou's "illness" was faked.
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2012-07-02, 08:48 | Link #45 |
Kana Hanazawa ♥
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: France
Age: 37
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As we suspected, the key to the mystery lied in the metal clues and not in the video. In fact, the video was completely misleading since it was different from what Hongou intended. I'm very pleased with the resolution of the mystery -they provided a satisfying answer to every single question we had-, and this arc as a whole. All of the main characters received quite a bit of development in this arc, Houtarou first and foremost. I fully understand why Irisu's deception got him so riled up. I don't like my feeling being played with either.
Irisu was actually a lot more manipulative than I thought. I never would have guess she had also manipulated Hongou into stepping down because she found her script boring. I'm impressed Houtarou's sister managed to see through her so easily. Seems like these detective skills run in the family.
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2012-07-02, 09:23 | Link #46 |
Not an expert on things
Join Date: Jun 2007
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I agree with the people who sympathize with Houtarou and see the somber tone of the episode as justified. It's not the movie that's important, it's how Irisu was leading him and Hongou on with fake complements to try and work things to her own end.
Like how Chitanda feels like she understands Hongou better, I feel like I understand the author a lot more with this episode. It definitely shows that he cares more about character development than about a gripping mystery, which I don't mind at all. Hongou has never appeared on screen and Eba got minor speaking roles, yet I feel as if I understand them more than I do a lot of other extras in other anime. What really sealed the episode for me as an enjoyable one and really gave me appreciation for Irisu as a character was the final scene with Oreki's sister, where Oreki's sister confronts her with the real reason why she scrapped Hongou's script. Irisu is quick to defend herself and justify why she did what she did. She has a tendency to push fault away from herself, as we have also seen when she was talking with Oreki. But it also shows that she doesn't want to think of herself as a selfish person. She wants to believe that she's manipulating people for the good of the whole, and that what she's doing is objectively good. |
2012-07-02, 09:30 | Link #47 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
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The mysterious rope problem.
Looks like Oreki got tricked by that girl. It's interesting how he overlooked a major inconsistency. Oreki's in-depth analysis of the club members' behavior and movie was amazing. So it looks like he was set up to fail from the start. They sure complicated the hell out of this one and if you don't pay attention you could get lost easily.
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2012-07-02, 13:21 | Link #48 |
Delicious Can of Chips
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Wow, this was a very nice episode. The best so far.
Spoiler for Episode 11:
All in all, I'm really loving Hyouka! All the mysteries (even the more boring ones) feel extremely real and something you'd expect high school kids to solve, instead of a show where you see high school students solving murder cases or outwordly mysteries. Oh, and... Spoiler for DON'T OPEN THIS!:
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2012-07-02, 15:01 | Link #49 | |||
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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If really his sister is the instigator, and she did it because she knows her brother, then it was damn cruel. Maybe to be kind, but cruel all the same. Quote:
But you're right - that kind of behavior doesn't inspire loyalty. Though it sounded like she was in a corner too, for some undisclosed reason, so maybe she behaves differently when she isn't pressured. |
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2012-07-02, 23:14 | Link #53 | |
Irregular Hunter
Join Date: Oct 2010
Age: 37
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Reading around the web, I'm quite surprised by how many people think Satoshi was overly dramatic. That he was jealous, or tried to get back at Houtarou for once. In my opinion, neither are true. My impression is he made it pretty clear that he cannot except the cameraman trick as Hougou's because he is confident in his database. There is no narrative trick in Holmes' stories. So unless Hougou is a second Agatha Christy, there is no way she'd think of that. That knowledge about such trivial information is his forte, and something he take pride in. He won't back down from that. |
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2012-07-03, 00:35 | Link #54 |
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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I'm not sure about being constitutionally unable to honestly ask for help. It's possible she was trying to spare everyone's feelings, the way she protected Hongou's. It backfired because Houtarou figured it out, but what if he hadn't?
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2012-07-03, 00:46 | Link #55 |
Portable Dude Mk. II
Artist
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: All ghillied up spying on someone ~2,000 yards away using telescope sights.
Age: 35
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This, and seems there's a lot of underestimation of how one can get really mad over what they think is petty. And not just here, but everywhere else I see discussion of this episode.
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2012-07-03, 01:24 | Link #56 | |
Irregular Hunter
Join Date: Oct 2010
Age: 37
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I said before that I'd like to see Houtarou flat out reject her last episode because the way she ask for help is not honest. If this is not the last of her in this series, however, I'd love to see Houtarou say yes to Irisu who, for once, honestly asking for help. That is what I'd call a mature person. |
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2012-07-03, 01:30 | Link #57 | |
User of the "Fast Draw"
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I can take that one. For whatever reason I got almost if not more upset than Houtarou himself about all of this . Maybe because I could see myself falling for that damn trickery and feeling like an idiot afterwards.
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2012-07-03, 01:39 | Link #58 |
mechaii
Join Date: Jul 2009
Age: 44
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Is it possible that the real reason Chitanda and the other members of the classics club were wary of fully expressing their doubts about Houtaro's solution and thereby upsetting him was not because it was "wrong" but because they all knew that he had been played like a fiddle by Irisu? In other words, what they had been struggling to gently or in a roundabout way tell him was not that his ending was wrong, but that he had been strung along like a fool. If we view things that way, then all the hushed and ominous tones as well as Houtaro's fury at the teahouse suddenly makes perfect sense.
Houtaro's solution was not "wrong" any way you slice it. It made the most sense of all the available options, was extremely clever and creative, and it was a hit with the audience, as acknowledged by all the other three members of the club even as they were trying to tell Houtaro that something seemed "off." And if the solution demonstrates that Houtaro has real genius as a mystery writer, why would he be angry about that, even if he had to be tricked into realizing this hidden talent? It should have been a source of gratitude instead. I think what really pissed him off was that, for all his vaunted deductive abilities, Houtaro was the last person in the club to figure out that Irisu had played him for a sucker, an irony that could not have been lost him. All his friends suspected as much, but none of them had the heart to tell him outright. As if being the last to find this out was not humiliating enough, Irisu rubbed salt into the wound by refusing to acknowledge what she had done to Houtaro, much less offer an apology. He had to lay everything out in her face to make it clear that he had busted her, and even after all that all he got out of her was a non-denial, the most tacit of admissions, and absolutely zero sympathy. What was translated as "that makes me happy" would probably have been better understood as "that will have to do." Viewed in this light, I feel the reactions and behavior Houtaro and the others displayed appear perfectly appropriate and not all overwrought. |
2012-07-03, 01:52 | Link #59 | |
I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Exactly. And instead of letting Hongou and everyone know it's boring, and maybe precipitate a confrontation when they find out nobody dies, she contrived that situation where everyone can back off gracefully - and they didn't even realize it. |
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2012-07-03, 03:13 | Link #60 | |
mechaii
Join Date: Jul 2009
Age: 44
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So what? Well, you can paraphrase what all three of his club mates were tactfully trying to tell him, each in their own way, as "do you realize that you wrote the whole ending of their movie and are getting zero credit for authorship?" When you look at it that way, doesn't it suddenly seem obvious that he's been ripped off? And by who else? |
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