Game of Thrones

[CJ_Walker]

*Walks into thread about Game of Thrones, an adventure fantasy story set in the feudal/middle ages*

*Sees discussion about the U.S. CIVIL WAR. . .*

*Quickly leaves thread*

And not a single thing was lost on this day.

[Roger Rambo]

Originally Posted by ArchmageXin

I find it humorous all of you are still debating International legality to a 13 years old girl who had Genghis Khan for a husband.

Life's funny that way, huh?

Originally Posted by CJ_Walker

*Quickly leaves thread*

And not a single thing was lost on this day.

I am inclined to agree with you.

[GDB]

Wow, Sam was pretty stupid there at the end.

"Yeah, this thing auto-kills the monster that just shattered my sword by touching it. I think I'm gonna just leave it there on the ground and run."

[creb]

I was totally expecting him to turn around and pick it up, but guess not.

Anyways, isn't it amazing how Arya never seems to get anywhere, but news of her uncle's wedding has made it even to the ears of the Dog in the bum-**** middle of nowhere?

Spoiler for Spoilers if you've never read the books:

Was glad to see Gendry still alive. Perhaps he still has a real role to play in the books if he hasn't been sacrificed yet in the tv show. Presumably this is going to be where Stannis sees that he needs to move on to the Wall, rather than on King's Landing. Be interesting to see what Gendry's fate ends up being. I can possibly see Stannis deciding to keep him alive to fuel more visions as a compromise between his conscience and drive for the throne.

[james0246]

Decent episode. Still in a trasitional period, with characters still moving around on the board waiting to get someplace important. Tyrion was great though. Dinkladge hasn't had much to do this season, many times just moving in place, but the entire wedding sequence and all the scenes that followed were just great. 80/100.

[ArchmageXin]

Originally Posted by creb

I was totally expecting him to turn around and pick it up, but guess not.

Anyways, isn't it amazing how Arya never seems to get anywhere, but news of her uncle's wedding has made it even to the ears of the Dog in the bum-**** middle of nowhere?

Spoiler for Spoilers if you've never read the books:

Was glad to see Gendry still alive. Perhaps he still has a real role to play in the books if he hasn't been sacrificed yet in the tv show. Presumably this is going to be where Stannis sees that he needs to move on to the Wall, rather than on King's Landing. Be interesting to see what Gendry's fate ends up being. I can possibly see Stannis deciding to keep him alive to fuel more visions as a compromise between his conscience and drive for the throne.

I think Gendry will take Edric storm's place, so he would....

Spoiler for Don't click if u dont want see book spoilers:

Edric's blood was used (via leeches) to fuel a "curse", that ironically, resulted in the death of Joffery, Robb and Balon Greyjoy. Therefore, the Red lady probably wanted to gut Gendry eventually as well. Edric was later smuggled out to the free cities by Davos before that can happen....I wonder, would this mean Gendry might meet Ayra when she make her way over there? Or worse, Ayra get the assignment to kill Gendry...

[MrTerrorist]

A lot has happen since i was away, better catch up now. BTW:

Game of Thrones will end with season 7, according to producer

If your worried about the series ending, the producers D.B. Weiss and David Benioff were told how the novels would end by the author Martin himself.

[Owlman]

Cersei is such a jerk to everyone, even the people who had nothing to do with her arranged marriage. I was surprised she threatened Margory like that as well. If she doesn't want Joffrey to marry her, why doesn't she direct that to the person who arranged the damn thing? The same with Loras, shes mad at him like he's the one who wanted to marry her... With all the horrible things shes done, she has the nerve to have a perpetual chip on her shoulder and treat everyone like crap. She's "the most beautiful woman in the realm", part of the richest family, and still finds a reason to be a complete bitch to everyone and stay in a foul mood.

[james0246]

^That's a little simplistic. She's a highly intelligent woman who managed to rise to the rank of Queen only by being forced into a form of perpetual servitude to a drunken buffoon who rarely had a kind word for her and never treated her well. And now, even after she has become Queen, she's still considered so unimportant that she is being sold as a brood mare once again, and this time to a gay man. Cersei, unlike Dany, has never been able to break free of the societal chains that bind her. And even now, while Queen, she still has to obey her father and whatever new husband is forced upon her.

Cersei is not a happy character, in fact she is downright evil, but she is also quite pitiful and tragic (especially the television adaptation of the character). We are never supposed to condone or forget her actions, but I doubt we are supposed to outright vilify her like Joffery, Tywin, the Mountain or dozens of other monstrous characters who not only lack humanity but were seemingly never born with it.

[ArchmageXin]

There is also the fact Cersei is finally freed of her cheating awful husband and ready for moment in the sun....then Tyrion showed up, then Tywin, then a damn 16 years old "whore" named Margery.

Also, have you also noticed how Margery took power? Sansa is doing her hair following Margery, and even Cerei, who once pretty much wear plate mail dress, suddenly decide to show her boobs Margery style @ Tyrion's wedding. Tyrions.

[Midnight Commander]

Originally Posted by james0246

^That's a little simplistic. She's a highly intelligent woman who managed to rise to the rank of Queen only by being forced into a form of perpetual servitude to a drunken buffoon who rarely had a kind word for her and never treated her well. And now, even after she has become Queen, she's still considered so unimportant that she is being sold as a brood mare once again, and this time to a gay man. Cersei, unlike Dany, has never been able to break free of the societal chains that bind her. And even now, while Queen, she still has to obey her father and whatever new husband is forced upon her.

I only watch the show and never read the books, but yes, thats what I got from it as well. It seems she's disgruntled all the time because no matter how smart or talented she is, she constantly finds herself subjugated to the will of men: Tywin, Tyrion (on occasion, when he was the King's Hand), Stannis(had his siege been successful), Robert, and now even her son Joffrey. She expressed her disdain of Men ruling the world with sarcasm during Stannis' siege of the castle to Sansa, and also to Margery's mother. Her feelings also came out during her conversation with Tywin regarding the Tyrells; and he responded with "You're not as clever as you think you are" --which I imagine only fueled her contempt.

a drunken buffoon who rarely had a kind word for her and never treated her well.

Again, I never read the books, but it seems like he became that way only after his first wife (Ned's sister) died? I remember him and Ned reminiscing on earlier times when he was in "good shape", and he confessed that he never got over her death. Cersei also mentioned him calling out her name while drunk and/or asleep. But yeah, I never saw him as the perfect fit for the "protector of the realm" either. Ned really should have grabbed it when he had the chance, as Cersei said : /

[Owlman]

Originally Posted by james0246

^That's a little simplistic. She's a highly intelligent woman who managed to rise to the rank of Queen only by being forced into a form of perpetual servitude to a drunken buffoon who rarely had a kind word for her and never treated her well. And now, even after she has become Queen, she's still considered so unimportant that she is being sold as a brood mare once again, and this time to a gay man. Cersei, unlike Dany, has never been able to break free of the societal chains that bind her. And even now, while Queen, she still has to obey her father and whatever new husband is forced upon her.

Okay, thats true. But why does she seem to hate Margory so much? She is as much bound to the societal chains as she is. She's metioned that she has her hooks in him, but what is she so afraid of happening? Joffery is already out of her control, and she has no real say in the affairs of the kingdom any longer with Twyin's arrival.

Cersei is not a happy character, in fact she is downright evil, but she is also quite pitiful and tragic (especially the television adaptation of the character). We are never supposed to condone or forget her actions, but I doubt we are supposed to outright vilify her like Joffery, Tywin, the Mountain or dozens of other monstrous characters who not only lack humanity but were seemingly never born with it.

I agree but I don't see her very pitiful... Can you elaborate? (sorry, I recently started watching the show and haven't read the books either)

[Roger Rambo]

Originally Posted by GDB

Wow, Sam was pretty stupid there at the end.

"Yeah, this thing auto-kills the monster that just shattered my sword by touching it. I think I'm gonna just leave it there on the ground and run."

That's because Sam is a physically uncoordinated fat nervous wreck whose prone to panic and losing his cool.

And that's why he managed to survive, and kill a White Walker.


Perhaps because you imagine yourself more physically fit and less cowardly than Sam you can imagine yourself not spazzing out, and remembering to get that Dragonglass blade. And you probably would have. But you wouldn't have gotten the chance. Cause since you're not a cowardly little pig, you look like just enough of a threat to warrant the White Walker cutting you down or snapping you in half like a twig. You'd probably not get the chance to be merely knocked aside, and to stab it in the back.


A physically strong and mentally seasoned warrior like Sandor would have recognized the value in retrieving the Dragonglass. But a warrior like Sandor would be threat enough to be killed immediately. Not to mention that a warrior like Sandor probably wouldn't do anything daft or geeky enough to collect and carry around something as useless as an obsidian knife.

[james0246]

Originally Posted by GDB

Wow, Sam was pretty stupid there at the end.

"Yeah, this thing auto-kills the monster that just shattered my sword by touching it. I think I'm gonna just leave it there on the ground and run."

It's weird, because in the books he uses the Dragonglass and it breaks off in the White Walkers body. That is why he left the remains of the dagger behind (he was also running for his life at the time). But in the television show, he leaves a perfectly good dagger behind out of fear (I guess).

I've forgotten by now, but how did Jon defeat the White Walker in Season 1/Book 1? Was it just by using fire?

Originally Posted by Midnight Commander

Again, I never read the books, but it seems like he became that way only after his first wife (Ned's sister) died?

He was never married to Ned's sister (I think they were intended for each other), but he did seemingly love her...at least enough to overthrow the former ruling family after one of their members raped and killed her (or something like that).

Originally Posted by Owlman

Okay, thats true. But why does she seem to hate Margory so much? She is as much bound to the societal chains as she is. She's metioned that she has her hooks in him, but what is she so afraid of happening? Joffery is already out of her control, and she has no real say in the affairs of the kingdom any longer with Twyin's arrival.

Cersei is miserable and bitter at this point, and now she’s lashing out. I personally think she hates Margaery, not only because she is taking/being given what little power Cersei does have (when Margaery becomes Queen, Cersei will be nothing), but also because Margaery is so much better at controlling her future husband than Cersei ever was (truthfully, I doubt anyone can really control Joffery). So not only is she being replaced, but she's being replaced with seemingly a better model.

Originally Posted by Owlman

I agree but I don't see her very pitiful... Can you elaborate? (sorry, I recently started watching the show and haven't read the books either)

I was using pity to describe my own feelings of sadness and sorrow for Cersei's lot in life and how she attempts to better herself/bring down those that surround her.

Everything Cersei does is rooted in her lack of power or her quest for some semblance of personal power. She has little to no choice in her life, and any pleasures she does have have to be secreted away and denied in public. The only real difference between her and the whores in Littlefinger's brothel is the name she is associated with. She is a sad and bitter character that I can't help but pity (even as I wish for her death along with so many others ).

[Roger Rambo]

Originally Posted by james0246

I've forgotten by now, but how did Jon defeat the White Walker in Season 1/Book 1? Was it just by using fire?

Technically what Jon killed was a Wight. And yeah. He set him on fire, since stabbing him a half dozen times with a dagger, then running him through with a swrod didn't seem to do much.

[ArchmageXin]

It's weird, because in the books he uses the Dragonglass and it breaks off in the White Walkers body. That is why he left the remains of the dagger behind (he was also running for his life at the time). But in the television show, he leaves a perfectly good dagger behind out of fear (I guess).

That was a wight.

[TooPurePureBoy]

Originally Posted by james0246

He was never married to Ned's sister (I think they were intended for each other), but he did seemingly love her...at least enough to overthrow the former ruling family after one of their members raped and killed her (or something like that).

The show didn't really explain all that well but it goes like this. You have Robert who loved Lyanna Stark to the point of obsession. You have Lyanna who loved Rhaegar (who was already in a political marriage with Elia of Dorne) Targaryen. We think Rhaegar loved her back but that part we don't know yet. Robert made it up in his mind that there is no way his love (Lyanna) could love a Targaryen (because Robert hated the Targaryens with almost as much obsession as he loved Lyanna) especially when the mad King boiled Lyanna's brother and father alive in their own armor. So he sees Lyanna off with Rhaegar and suddenly starts a Rebellion saying she must have been kidnapped.

This whole political mess in westeros goes back to the fact that Ned had a sister that was too hot and Roberts obsessions.

[ArchmageXin]

Originally Posted by TooPurePureBoy

The show didn't really explain all that well but it goes like this. You have Robert who loved Lyanna Stark to the point of obsession. You have Lyanna who loved Rhaegar (who was already in a political marriage with Elia of Dorne) Targaryen. We think Rhaegar loved her back but that part we don't know yet. Robert made it up in his mind that there is no way his love (Lyanna) could love a Targaryen (because Robert hated the Targaryens with almost as much obsession as he loved Lyanna) especially when the mad King boiled Lyanna's brother and father alive in their own armor. So he sees Lyanna off with Rhaegar and suddenly starts a Rebellion saying she must have been kidnapped.

This whole political mess in westeros goes back to the fact that Ned had a sister that was too hot and Roberts obsessions.

The question is did Lyanna ever knew Daddy and brother were being cooked?

[james0246]

Has Dorne been mentioned yet in the television series? Is that were Cersei's daughter was sent off to last season? I remember Dorne being of significance in the third book (for reasons that will not be mentioned until next season), but I do not recall if they have any relevance in the current television show.

Thanks for the history lesson TooPurePureBoy. Some of the details I recalled (specifically about Rhaegar), but I clearly did not remember Ned's sister that well.

[Roger Rambo]

Originally Posted by ArchmageXin

The question is did Lyanna ever knew Daddy and brother were being cooked?

Actually the real big question is did Rheagar know it at the time?


There's actually no cited evidence that Rhaegar actually kidnapped Lyanna. It just seemed to be something that everyone assumed after the Mad King went and burned the top two men of House Stark to death when they showed up to complain about it.


If Lyanna had willingly gone with Rhaegar...well it certainly would have put some shit between the Starks and the Baratheons and the crown. But it likely wouldn't have been sufficient pretext to start a general rebellion. NOBODY in the 7 kingdoms was shaking in fear of the prospect of the most powerful ascendant lord coming to romance and wed their daughters. They were terrified of the implication that Aerys could burn any lord alive for any reason he saw fit.