2008-06-16, 10:40 | Link #1001 | |
Gregory House
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2008-06-16, 11:36 | Link #1002 |
Obey the Darkly Cute ...
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ...
Age: 66
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The New Testament is full of its own issues, though the interpretation of God in it is great deal more palatable to modern brains. The debates over the proper translations alone fill many research forums, much less how one should take the inputs from Paul or the meaning of that last book: Revelations.
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2008-06-17, 02:19 | Link #1004 |
Obey the Darkly Cute ...
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: On the whole, I'd rather be in Kyoto ...
Age: 66
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Hopefully, you read back a few pages before so that you haven't misidentified those of us who aren't Christian. Not being a Christian (or a Muslim or whatever) doesn't mean one hasn't studied the religion thoroughly. Frankly, I wish more people would study religion not their own --- except that many don't appear to have actually studied their own religion O.o
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2008-06-17, 07:05 | Link #1005 | |
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There really isn't any conflict between the Old and New Testaments unless one interprets the New Testament according to assumptions made about Christianity. Jesus wasn't saying anything new. But mainline Christianity has been busy for so long (almost the entirety of its existence) trying to justify its deviations that even many incredibly learned theologians have no idea what their own religion teaches, because they've been spending so much time learning it according to incorrect assumptions and their own cultural perspective. I've spent a lot of time trying to shed myself of such, and I still have a long way to go. Still, it saddens and frustrates me that there's so much of it elsewhere. The only way I've been able to get through discussing religion with the religious and non-religious alike without blowing a blood vessel is to remind myself that religious beliefs are secondary to relationship. So many atheists...................*shudder* So many Muslims...................*shudder* So many Buddhists...................*shudder* So many Sikh...................*shudder* So many--OK, I think I've made my point. The world is full of all sorts. In any given group, there are a few good, a few more fanatics, and a whole bunch of people who are ignorant, apathetic, ambivalent, or some combination. If you're disturbed personally by proximity to people who belong to a particular group, well... I'd say you have a problem that needs much more of your attention than any problem you perceive in them. "How can you say to your brother, 'Brother, let me pull the splinter out of your eye' when you don't see the beam in your own eye"--oh, nevermind.
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Last edited by Kyuusai; 2008-06-17 at 07:17. |
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2008-06-17, 07:17 | Link #1006 |
Banned
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Trinidad.....anyone get me out of here !
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People should just forget about religion because it causes too many violenece. Let's work as one unified group of no religion rather what we've already been called, Humans. Let's be humans and work together as humans.
Religion causes too many discrimination and conflict. |
2008-06-17, 11:58 | Link #1009 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Hellhole, Louisiana
Age: 35
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You're both right. The human race is one of jealousy and selfishness, so to justify what they do, they say that it's for God. I'm talking about the human race and referring to it as "they" because there are people that aren't like that.
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2008-06-17, 12:22 | Link #1010 | |
Lord Chairman God King
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Due to said-conflict, Paul leaves Antioch and goes on a journey to Jerusalem and meets with the elders about the issue circumcision of Gentile Christians and whether or not Christians should follow Mosaic Law. An agreement was eventually reached, but it didn't stop the conflict in the area. It was one of the first major steps separating Christianity from Judaism, which is a little more complicated than some guys thinking that Jesus was the Messiah and others that didn't. |
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2008-06-17, 13:00 | Link #1011 | |
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The "hijack" I was referring to, though (and I confess that I didn't specify), was not the non-adherence to Mosaic Law (which was a weirder issue--just how converted WERE these folks?), but the folding in of Greco-Roman cultural and religious philosophies and beliefs and an ironic rejection of certain Jewish practices and beliefs. The Jews, of course, responded in kind, and the general Jewish schools of thought and belief shifted a bit to separate themselves from these folks who claimed to share their religion.
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2008-06-17, 14:56 | Link #1013 |
Gregory House
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@Kyuusai:
The "Christianity" I was talking about was the one the Roman Empire embraced. Which is, in the end, the one that finally evolved into what we know today as Christianity. That's what I meant by "taking advantage of (certain) Jewish traditions". Of course they were selective in what they did, and they knew why they were doing it--for them, it was an instrument of power. Yes, truthfully enough, Jesus was a Jew, but the image of Christianity that was built decades after his death was probably very different from the one he had intended (and that's IF he had intended such a thing).
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2008-06-17, 16:45 | Link #1014 | |
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I think this sort of corruption happened organically. Just the effects of human idiocy and incompetence (the perils of group-think and individuals in power). But while the theology may be not be the primary point, bad theology can be harmful. In the worst cases, people die and are oppressed. In the best cases, it is intellectually indefensible. I always find it amazing that people look to "the church fathers" as interpretive authorities when we have historical evidence that large groups were getting things drastically wrong so early in the process. But whether it's politics or religion, the voice calmly stating "The truth is subtly different, but has drastic implications, and will require you put away emotional rationalization and cultural bias" will almost always be drowned out by the shouts advocating emotionally-charged, personally gratifying beliefs. I can't blame any one for rejecting Christianity on an intellectual basis any more than I could blame some one for disliking American Coca-Cola. The ingredients are similar, it all looks the same, but it's slightly different... and people could easily go forever without knowing that it was not what the original formulator intended. But the theology really is secondary. Or, rather... it's supposed to be. Christians even manage to miss the primary point of their religion, too. But again, that's just a universal trail of dealing with human beings.
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2008-06-19, 02:17 | Link #1015 | |
Nani ?
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Emerald Forest ( yes its a real place. )
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Ironically enough, religion has much in common with recreational drugs. Drugs are nothing but a temporary relief from reality to those who use them responsibly and seldom, but very dangerous in the hands of those who depend on them. |
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not a debate, philosophy, religion |
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