Macross Frontier - Episode 21 Discussion / Poll

[sekidousai]

Originally Posted by indr0008

the sad thing is ranka did not think that way........................................

that is FACT that ranka DID NOT think that way.

she refused to song because her song was not interpreted as a love sign by ALTO

......i hope people are not putting me on their ignore list

Well when Ranka was being rescued from the mothership Vajra she screamed to everyone to stop, or i think it was Alto she screamed at. So i don't know why it is an established FACT that she did not feel any sympathy towards the Vajra.

And when she sees that the Vajra became more fierce and started swarming at her would'nt she think that it would be best not to sing with a broken heart and go away before the people start to realize that it was her fault that they became more violent, well im not sure if she heard it when Klan shouted that "they became more violent" but Ranka definitely stopped singing and sat in a corner with Nanase and Luca comforting her. So i don't know how would you disprove that Ranka did not think that she was just a fish bait.

Also after that she was forced to sing again and this time the military made clear that definitely she is the fishbait and then drop the nuke on island 3 together with Ai-Kun's brethrens. (hmmm now that i think about it how the hell did Ranka and Alto got away from that swarm.)

[kilroy0097]

^^^
If you want to take the ED song by it's lyrics then yes she realized Alto doesn't love her. As those lyrics say loosely she sang her song for you and you didn't hear.

[indr0008]

Originally Posted by sekidousai

Well when Ranka was being rescued from the mothership Vajra she screamed to everyone to stop, or i think it was Alto she screamed at. So i don't know why it is an established FACT that she did not feel any sympathy towards the Vajra.

she did sympathize with the vajra, even more than with human

Originally Posted by sekidousai

And when she sees that the Vajra became more fierce and started swarming at her would'nt she think that it would be best not to sing with a broken heart and go away before the people start to realize that it was you're fault that they became more violent, well im not sure if she heard it when Klan shouted that "they became more violent" but Ranka definitely stopped singing and sat in a corner with Nanase and Luca comforting her. So i don't know how would you disprove that Ranka did not think that she was just a fish bait.

well i did see her crying the..."why me.." " why does when i sing the vajra gets....."
the impression that i get from that is that she still think that her song was a mere weapon, i doubt she had it in her to relate all those stuffs about personal feelings and the effectiveness of song


wait...we are getting off topic here........i sure don't want to be put into ignore or even worse, ban

[kilroy0097]

Originally Posted by CaptGloval

Speaking of those fold drives, before I was under the impression that Brera was a last-minute replacement when Alto refused to go with Ranka. But then the VF-27 had a fold drive with it, so I guess there's some little planning between Brera and Ranka--and Grace?

You make a very good point there. Since Brera normally does not have that big pink long range fold drive on top of his VF-27, it would be safe to assume that this was planned before hand and he was ready to go when Ranka wanted to. Hence why his VF was also hidden in the woods right next to the hill. Also this means that Ranka "knew" that Alto would not go with her because she knew he did not love her. Hence also why she said, "I loved you." past tense. It all comes together.

[sekidousai]

I think Alto would be a little bit conceited if he starts thinking that Ranka's song was for him. After all he is friends with another singer (Sheryl) too, and it would be too conceited to think that a singer is singing a song only for you. Ranka was just too naive, Brera started putting some thoughts on Ranka's head about her singing. Brera might have meant about her singing the Aimo song. He knows that Ranka is singing the Aimo song long before she met Alto...

---and whoa, don't jump the gun just yet...

As you can see the park layout, there shoud be a great distance between the parks edge and the parks center circle...

Spoiler for Park:

And i don't know what woods or hill that you are talking about... unless you are talking about that bush and that anthill... then that would be too small to hide the VF would'nt it.

You see, the VF-27 popped up like it came underneath the ground. Unless Grace or Brera is a descendant of Nostradamus they could'nt have predicted that far and dug up a huge hole before hand.
It could just be one of those Hollywood convenient things that happens all the time ^^.

Also the past few episodes shows that Brera is being more closer to Ranka. And also there was a scene where Brera was being a rebel to Grace and had his will almost taken away by Grace. So i will not be surprised if this is not what Grace had planned.
... but oh well we will see everything in the next following final episodes.
........................~~~~ (-________-) i'm too tired too argue now. haha . its seems everyone is against me here.... well i'll just wait and see what'll happen for now in the following episodes. and just to remind everyone that i'm not really a Ranka fan, you don't see me giving any bad remarks about Sheryl do you ^^... I just don't want everyone in my "PoV" bashing a character for all the wrong reasons ^^.. and people establishing their own facts when the series have'nt fully revealed all the mysteries yet. maybe im just giving people another way to think of things so that the story don't get too one sided, also it makes things a little bit interesting.. (im annoying i know so im going to rest for now)

[kilroy0097]

The only logical thing I can think of is that the animator messed up because as you can see from the flat ground just below that rise there is a steep drop off. Those huge number of stairs that Alto-hime ran up like a season from Rocky minus the mumbled speech (Only a mumbled brain). My guess was that the VF should have come up from there somewhere and that it should have been drawn further away then coming closer. Eh. We will certainly figure out more of what the hell is going on next episode. I hope.

Oh and I'm not surprised at all that Alto didn't view Ranka singing as singing for him. No it took Michael before his death to tell Alto that. Episode 18 ( I think) right before Sheryl appears in the flight deck.

[squaresphere]

My feeling was that once Brera said "you don't have to sing" he knew that she would react this way. Especially since he knew Ai-kun was a vajra this whole time.

[Izayoi]

I like Brera so much better than Alto, who look like some protagonist out of some annoying eroge in my opinions. Yea really never get sick of those mains[/sarcasm] In the end, he realize he hurt one of them and then he start feeling conceited, but the fact feeling conceited doesn't change a thing is really amusing.

[magnuskn]

Contrary to a lot of other people, I think Brera might have gone against Graces wishes with Ranka. Indications are to me:

- Grace forced him last episode to leave Ranka in the hands of the others.
- His focus seems to have completely shifted to protecting Ranka.
- This may well be due to her treating him like a normal person during episode nineteen.
- It seems to me that taking Ranka away from Frontier would be against Graces wishes... the next Vajra attack could well finish Frontier off, in the weakened state they are now.
- It is quite possible that Grace cannot affect Brera a few folds away.

Of course it still can turn out to be a plot of Graces faction, but I see strong hints that Brera wanted to assert his independence.

Eh, in any case his character development was pretty nil during the series, and the design of his character sucks terribly.

[sekidousai]

As you can see in the last scene Brera was smiling when he asked Ranka about what she wanted to do. That is quite a change from his regular robotic expression. He was quite happy about it.... i hope......

[golthin]

I am so happy that I am not shipping for either girl! this's one of those rares anime where I don't have a favorite! I go through the whole show thinking one will win and then the other.
The only part that interest me right now is whether they will kill sheryl or not! They have yet to kill a main character in this show. Micheal and the president were the closer to a main character, but they were still supporting character. I was amazed Osma didn't die after the awesome speach he gave about protecting his sister and the woman he loves.

[squaresphere]

^cause he's a devout follower of Basara-sama. Nothing short of a protodevilin can kill him :3

[anyme]

I don't think Brera can go against Grace. Grace always make "as planned" face.

If it beyond her planned, I think about Ranka bring Varja to destroy Frontier and others Macross ships.

[MaiHikari]

Originally Posted by kilroy0097

^^^
If you want to take the ED song by it's lyrics then yes she realized Alto doesn't love her. As those lyrics say loosely she sang her song for you and you didn't hear.

Kawamori and Kanno said in their interview that they wrote MF like it was a musical. So sometimes they modify the plot to fit the songs and I think this is one of the case. Ranka never realized that Alto didn't love her before, even when she saw him and Sheryl dating and kissing. All of a sudden, a hug on the rooftop became a rejection notice? Seems a little forced to me so they can introduce Azure Ether.

[Wesley84]

Originally Posted by MaiHikari

Kawamori and Kanno said in their interview that they wrote MF like it was a musical. So sometimes they modify the plot to fit the songs and I think this is one of the case. Ranka never realized that Alto didn't love her before, even when she saw him and Sheryl dating and kissing. All of a sudden, a hug on the rooftop became a rejection notice? Seems a little forced to me so they can introduce Azure Ether.

I haven't been paying attention to the lyrics at all.

[grss1982]

Originally Posted by anyme

Ai-kun teared hime's paper plane in EP 1x. Even I cannot forgive it.

If this series end peacefully, I think somebody has to marry a bug.
Which gonna bring you the new story Macross F 1 plus 6?

Brera is under Grace's plan, I'm very sure.

Marrying a BUG indeed.

Don't forget the second time Alto & Ai-Kun meet, Ai-Kun did'nt tear the paper plane apart. Although I must point out that I think Ai-kun did'nt tear it a part because it was made by Ranka?

ALSO.....

....I'm surprised no one pointed this out earlier:



Need a light? <<== Star Craft Reference. :

[ickem]

Originally Posted by grss1982

Marrying a bud indeed.

Don't forget the second time Alto & Ai-Kun meet, Ai-Kun did'nt tear the paper plane apart. Although I must point out that I think Ai-kun did'nt tear it a part because it was made by Ranka?

ALSO.....

....I'm surprised no one pointed this out earlier:



Need a light? <<== Star Craft Reference. :

That was Ranka's plane though. I'm sure that had it been Alto's, Ai-kun would have torn it apart and devoured it like usual.

[sekidousai]

Originally Posted by ickem

That was Ranka's plane though. I'm sure that had it been Alto's, Ai-kun would have torn it apart and devoured it like usual.

lols it was Ranka's plane alright ^^ .... but then again here we go another with the Hate and Racism comments. Didn't anyone here learn anything from the Macross series.

Well now I'm back again !!!!!!!!!!! and fully charged~~~~
:::::::::::::::::
And im here to present you actual FACTS that Ranka is not really as weak and selfish as people think she is ^^.....


I think when people watched ep 21 they where so stuck up on how bad-ass Klan was^^(i know, i was also going GO! Klan beat up their arses!) and failed to realize other things.
And damn, i was forced to rewatch the whole ep21 again... well at least I got to prove that I'm on the correct path....
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Note: These scenes all taken from ep 21. and of course the subs are from gg ^^ i didn't just made up those words ok.

Well First here is a scene where Alto was screaming at Luca.

Spoiler for pic01:

Then here is what Ranka said after that. Well it wasn't possible to screencap what she said fully but this is what she said:
"I'll sing." "For Everyone." <<----!!!!!

Spoiler for pic02:

Now this is the scene with Brera. Well again it's not possible to screencap the sub with Brera along the scene, so here is what
Brera said:
"You don't have to sing if you don't want to, Ranka"

Spoiler for pic03:

And again here is Ranka's reply:

Spoiler for pic04:

here is a "I said I'm fine, when i'm really not" pose.

Spoiler for pic05:

Now here is a scene where Grace said she is now different with a happy smile.
***now you can take this one with a grain of salt, but i think she was thinking that Ranka can still show results despite going
through a recent heartache. Grace might have disposed of Ranka when she stopped back then responding when she was still her guinea
pig or something like that***

Spoiler for pic06:

And here finally is the realization of the true horror her power could bring. For people who said that realization was impossible for Ranka.This was a scene where Mushroomhead tells Ranka to sing in the cemetery in front of the coffins of dead people and their surviving relatives.*** Okay this is quite vague. but really in my honest and best opinion. Ranka is not really the type to say, GO to HELL everyone(miina jigokou kaeru~~something)! Despite how spoiled and whishy washy she is, her character could not be that harsh. I think people are stuffing words that are not supposed to come out of her mouth. ***

Spoiler for pic07:

Now fill in the blanks

I believe Ranka did not go to the Cemetery just to tell people that she won't sing anymore. I think she just thought of it when Leon asked him to, after all it was the military who asked her to become bait. It was still fresh in her mind of the things that happened yesterday. What if the same thing would happen like yesterday and this time to these poor people who are already in pain;;;, would you pour salt in their wounds and then rub it even more?;;;;;; I mean she could not be that sadistic. Do you think Kawamori would make her character like that.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Okay here are some more things i have realized...
Ozma was angry, no I mean furious when he discovered they are going to use Ranka.
--- Did Ranka turn down their offer? no.

Alto was furious and grabbed Luca's collar and was ready to asrape Luca when he told him about the military plan.
--- What did Ranka do. She said she would sing for "everyone".

Now here, right when Alto left from the stage what did Brera say? You don't have to sing if you don't want to.
--- and what was Ranka's reply? right! "Brera you are so cruel." "I'm fine."

Now everyone, These 3, THREE! people who said these words are the 3 top pilots of their class. Top pilots who everyday served, risked their lives and fight for the Frontier's safety now telling Ranka that she does'nt have to sing if she does'nt want to.
Now go ask yourself what the hell are we missing here?!!!

People here are saying Ranka is selfish here, this and that with their sticks and pitch forks. Guess what, if people really start to attack Ranka who would be the first 3 persons you will be facing??? that's right! Ozma, Alto and Brera. 3 people who really knows what war and death is really like... Okay so i hope that this could be a good point of view that i could share with everyone.

(....Oh and haha! and another thing since there has been some Macross 7 comparisons here... It's about Basara, as great singer as he was but in my honest opinion was also a great Jerk. He never missed the oppurtunity to offend the military everytime they approach him. He was really being a complete Royal ass-hole in front of them. Selfish, self-centered ,self-absorbed. always sets off on his own ^^... but he never got the bad-arse treatment of Minmei and Ranka from the so called Macross fans... well.. then again m7 is not really to be taken seriously....)

whew... Iv'e written such long posts like in such a short interval, haha.I think my fingers are getting cramps...

[Wesley84]

Only Ozma and Bresra ever asked her, and were supportive one way or another. Alto said things because he's...self-righteous and a dramaqueen.

[ickem]

Originally Posted by sekidousai

lols it was Ranka's plane alright ^^ .... but then again here we go another with the Hate and Racism comments. Didn't anyone here learn anything from the Macross series.

I don't know if that was directed at me or not, so I'll assume it was. The comment was somewhat tongue-in-cheek, although I do think that the airplane wouldn't have been nearly as cherished had Ranka's smell not been on it. I said that Ai-kun would likely have eaten it because it is what he does. The only people that Ai-kun seems to have affection for are Brera and Ranka, and maybe Nanase. He has shown that he seems less than fond of Alto as per the ep when Alto first encounters him and Ai-kun attacks his face. I don't hate the Vajra at all since I've always thought the Vajra were being set up by someone else. I'm actually rather sympathetic towards the Vajra, but I'm looking at ep 21, and Ranka's actions in particular, through the point of view of Alto and others who have lost loved ones. The giddy smile that she has as she asks Alto to go with her to take a Vajra home really leaves a sour impression on me because she seems totally oblivious of the fact that Alto had just lost his best friend to something that looks exactly like Ai-kun. Anyways, I seem to have ventured away from my original intent. The Vajra are the bad guys to Alto and the Frontier inhabitants right now so the hatred for them is justified as they have no idea that someone else is causing the Vajra to attack.